Tripnbeats

nice good shit still!!...i didnt have time to touch the car yesterday but u took out the strut towerr bar and slid the rear mount out from what side drivers from the top ??? all the wires had to be shifted correct??? you feel vibrations when vtec starts to feel engagement....at least thats what i felt.

t0talacuratl

iTrader: (3)

For the guys that switch these out already, does the IM feel lighter than the stock mounts? If so, that would be a big plus!

stillhere153

iTrader: (1)

Trip there weren't anywires to move out of the way.. Just the coolant hose that routes to the throttle body and another coolant hose near the fuse box... It came right up

Just remember there's a vaccuum hose attached to the bottom

Total: they are lighter, but made of solid

Inaccurate

stillhere153,

Did you need to support or slightly lift the engine while swapping the front or rear mount ? If so, what method did you use to lift it ? THANKS

Fulani has a TL

iTrader: (1)

I still havent opened my box yet, but question for Al, what did you do to the Vacuum line you pulled off the stock rear mount?

Inaccurate

I plan to cut-off the vacuum at the source. The source is indicated by the red arrow (hose approx 3/8 OD). Just put a rubber plug over the nipple coming out of the manifold.

Make sure you do NOT remove that bigger hose (approx 3/4 inch OD) next to it. That bigger hose is for the brake booster.

stillhere153

iTrader: (1)

I didn't do anything with the hose.... Gonna plug it (bend in half and zip tie at the bend tightly) next time I see wanderer's car infront of me...

As for supporting the motor... I raised the car from the passenger side with a low profile jack so I could get my low profile jack (which didn't fit under wanderer's car go figure)... I jacked up till the jack was on the oil pan, lowered the side a little till the tires were on the ground but suspension unloaded then lowered the front a little, lowered the side all the way so the frame was down...

Honestly, if you do this install do it in this order

A. Side
B. Front
C. Rear

Because you don't want to leave the side for last, and you should do the front before the rear so you know exactly where the bolts and what size they are after all it is a mirror image...

On v6 p by the way someone pointed out its a 19mm to tighten the screw thru the bushing.. I used a 3/4... Same thing so I've heard

Other tools required 14mm 15mm 16mm (might not need 16) and 17mm

Get at that rear mount from above.. Doggystyle ontop of the motor

Tripnbeats

such a simple install i cant believe i avoided it til today....but it worked, good stuff bro.

mrlunecy

iTrader: (1)

Three-quarter!!!! What are we driving!?!?....mustangs!?!?! hahaha...just kidding, man.

Hey, thanks a lot guys, with ALL your inputs, this install should go really smooth for those of us who do this next!

stillhere153

iTrader: (1)

glad you installed it... guys made the rear sound harder than it is for some reason... not hard at all once you grab 2 wrenches and put them together that center 14mm pops right out

Tripnbeats

bro i ripped that thing out in 2 secs. i was like whooaaa SOB at acura was like nah man i have to charge 300 for it im like get the f*** outta heeerreeee lol good lookin bro....im off to canada time to load the ipod!!

dan.....k

iTrader: (1)

For those that have installed these, how bad is the vibration when the A/C is on?

stillhere153

iTrader: (1)

^ worry about the vibration at COLD START, rather than the vibration w/ ac on

t0talacuratl

iTrader: (3)

I just had my side and front mounts installed. Didn't have time to do the rear. The stock side ones were worn. The fronts were ok. After test driving the car, shifts smoother. Can't really tell if the car is more responsive or not, but there is no vibration what so ever. At idle, a/c on, or normal driving; there is nothing. Just as quiet. Maybe the rear mount is the ones that cause the vibrations that other people are reporting. I guess I will find out later.

kjelly

If we didn't want the vibrations, do you all think we could just install the front and side mounts and still have the innovative mounts be effective?

Tripnbeats

I think the install pattern would have to be... rear then front then side. i dunno i did it like that and it made sense with the way the motor was sitting being prepped for the side.

they all have to be installed as a set, the stiffness would blow the stock mounts to hell....as soon as i installed the side n front i felt a huge difference--the rear was taking a beating. so when i did the rear it was such a drastic improvement.....vibrations not so much.....honestly id prefer a motor that has the slightest vibrations over shit mounts that blow 99% of the time.
i just got done driving the car 9 hours to toronto and i have to say....it felt amazing with the mounts no bad pull offs out of service areas no lag....just straight pull.
i also did the unorthodox stock lightweight stock sized pulley....thanks to josh.... and holy shit does the car feel better than it did when it was new. the pulley makes the gears pull like an animal. 6th feels like 5th at 60-90mph

stillhere153

iTrader: (1)

I dunno i didnt even lift the car for the side... i just put it on with the car sitting there...

so i would say def doesn't matter what order you do them in

Tripnbeats

well the reason im saying that is because when i went to do the rear... i had to release the side so the rear mount shifts and the motor has some play to it to get it to sit into place. because i was like "wtf man y isnt the motor shifting away from the rear mount?" so as soon i unscrewed the bolts on the side it popped right off the mount... and i loosened the front slightly as well....but that made no diff.....so i figure if u do the rear first get it out of the way front second the side is aligned and ready to just be slid in. if it was a new install. if it was a 2 part install like we did then it doesnt matter lol

stillhere153

iTrader: (1)

^ huh? dude I jacked the car up and had the motor supported on a jack, the rear mount never once had a struggle in coming out, if there is no wait on it (ie. the motor) once you remove that blasted 14mm center bolt which is enternally long and you can't fit an air rachet in there ... the mount came right out, honestly I think it helps having precat deletes... because the vision is not obstructed....

meh... I still think side to front to rear is better

guess I should've taken some pics

t0talacuratl

iTrader: (3)

Well further reviews with the mounts, I'm started getting a slight bit of vibration now. After whomping on a modded WRX and 04 Stang GT last night, I ended up busting the stock rear one (clumping sounds between first and second gear). So now I got to put that one in sooner than expected. I guess having the stiffer front and side was too much for the stock one.

stillhere153

iTrader: (1)

rofl... dude dont stall on this.... autozone has all the tools you need, you can combine 2 extensions with a swivel end to get at those 4 bolts onto the chassis on that rear mount... then use a 14mm (for that pesky center bolt) and combine it with a 16mm to create leverage to unscrew, don't even try to use a rachet on that center 14mm pretty pointless... do it do it... no more me giving away how I installed it so quickly rofl

Inaccurate

IM mounts (all combined) are just 2.5 lbs lighter than oem mounts. Weight is given to the nearest 0.5 lb.

Oem mounts (3 mounts plus vacuum solenoid and vac hoses) = 17.5
IM = 15.0

Inaccurate

Here are some pics from my install today. Not saying that I did it the best way, but it worked for me. Took me 5 hours.


In the pic below, the LONG extension is highlighted with a red line. The extension is a 20" Craftsman 3/8" drive. Reaching the bolts were the easiest part of the job. Note the strut bar is removed.



To remove the rear and front mount, the engine needed to be raised to take the weight off of the mounts. I lifted the engine via 2x4 against some beefy bosses on the block. I am NOT a fan of apply pressure to the oil pan (weak cast metal?...I don't want to find out...I do know it would be a major screw-up if it cracked).




In the pic below, this illustrates how I wiggled the rear mount out of the car. Keep the mount upside down because it is easier to unsnag the mount when it hangs up on wires and hoses. Use a lot of pateince and take your time to wiggle the mount through the maze of wires and hoses.



I was able to remove the front mount without removing either radiator fan. I was able to remove the side mount without lifting the engine.

Inaccurate

I been thinking for the past few days since my IM install on how to best describe my feelings.

Please keep in mind that my mounts are the stiffer 75A (Black).

To me, the vibration itself is okay. I like the tactile feel (aka, vibration). I have OMP racing seats bolted directly into the floor of the body, and the vibration comes straight thru the seats... and I like it. I love feeling the vibrations coming thru the steering wheel (Tim Allen manly grunt).

My problem is with the low-frequency shockwave/harmonics/drone that is generated when the car is in Drive and not moving. I suppose this is the "cabin noise" that people talk about with these mounts. This is a feeling like someone has a boombox with the Bass turned way up, and the speaker is producing a constant booooom at low volume. It is not loud. It is more like a constant percussion wave constantly pushing against my ear drums.

Please keep in mind that my mounts are the stiffer 75A (Black).

It was really bad when I first started the car after the install. During the install, I had my battery unplugged. So, my ECU had to relearn how to idle the engine. For the first hour of driving, the ECU kept allowing the idle to drop too low to 500 and 600 RPM while in gear while stopped. MASSIVE ROARING while the ecu allowed the engine to lug down to 500-600 rpm.

Now that my ecu has relearned, the idle speed stays above 800 RPM (just using my oem tach). And, I get no further massive roaring from the low idle speed lugging the engine. But, I still get a minimal amount of roaring in Drive and the car not rolling.

In general, it is this minimal roaring like a boombox with too much Bass that bugs me. This is ONLY while stopped at red lights with the trans in Drive. Very little difference when the A/C compressor kicks-in. Once I release the brake and start rolling, I have zero roaring and near zero vibration.

Please keep in mind that my mounts are the stiffer 75A (Black).

Here is an interesting observation. The TL is designed with rubber isolators (donuts) between the engine cradle (that aluminum front subframe) and the unibody. These oem rubber isolators WORK !!!! With my car sitting in Park and idling, I can touch the hood and front fenders and I feel moderate vibration. When I touch the roof and doors, there is nearly zero vibration. It is funny to feel along the body seam between the front fender (quarter panel) and the front door. Within an inch apart, one side of the seam has vibration and on the other side of the seam there is nearly zero vibration.

It is still too early for me to comment on performance improvements. I need some real-life time with these mounts. I do Not believe in test drives. Test drives prove nothing to me. Just real life commuting will tell the tale.

But, I will share some off-the-cuff impressions. I have done several WOT thru 1st and 2nd gears. I think that I felt less torque steer. It is hard for me to tell because I am immune to torque steer.

The car is handling much better. But, I took out my sunroof at the same time as I installed the mounts. The sunroof deletion removed 37 lbs from the roof of the car. So, I don't know to give credit to the mounts or the weight reduction. People say that the mounts should improve handling because the mounts help to tighten the car structurally.

I think traction is improved. Before the mounts, I would always get the VSA light flickering or hear light tire squeal anywhere in 1st gear. With the IM, I have yet to see the VSA light flicker or hear light tire squeal. I am very happy about the improved traction. This was my primary reason to get these mounts. I never had wheel hop, but I'm game for improved traction. And, all of my researching stated that traction would improve a lot with these mounts in front wheel drive cars. So, I am pleased with the results I have seen thus far.

I know that everything that I said is "I think, but not sure". And, that is true. I am just trying to offer feedback because I know that readers are eager for feedback.

I feel fairly sure that I will be keeping these 75A (Black) mounts ! They are growing on me with each daily commute.

I can for sure say that I do NOT recommend these 75A (Black) mounts to any TL owner except for a few hardcore guys such as Lookinco, AccurateIN, Stillhere153, Ussi, and a few others. This is based on these guy's temperament to make compromises for the sake of improved performance. All others need not to apply (for the stiffer 75A Black mounts).

paliknight

lol i have my mounts just sitting in my room. i would install them, but i dont know how or where to start :-(

stillhere153

iTrader: (1)

yup I am going for the black when I finally decide to get these, or when I need them... I am quite happy with the stock motor mounts... altho I only expect them to be good for another 10k lol

Inaccurate

UPDATE


SHORT VERSION
----------------
I am more sure that I have vastly improved traction. This morning I had a race with a motorcycle. From 0 to 50 mph, I had more than a car length on him. And, my tires never spinned once. Improved traction is what people say about these mounts in front-wheel drive cars and it is the reason I got them. Seems to be paying-off. AWESOME... thanks IM !!!


FULL VERSION
----------------
I am more sure that I have vastly improved traction. This morning I had a race with a motorcycle. This was one of those louder thumper style motorcycles. We were lined-up side-by-side at the red light (the classic situation) on a concrete surface waiting for the green.

My usual style, as it was this morning too, is to quickly roll the pedal to about half throttle until the car gets rolling (coming out of the hole) then just floor-it and let VSA traction control take over from there. Before the IM mounts, I would usually see the VSA light flickering and hear the VSA modulating the throttle through all of first gear.

As you can imagine, against a motorcycle, I was damn sure to not leave anything "sitting on the table" when it came time to launch. I made sure that I got to WOT very quickly and let VSA handle the rest.

Even with this aggressive application of WOT, the VSA light didn't flicker (or I didn't see it) and I could not hear/feel the VSA modulating the throttle. And in the past before the IM mounts, I would ALWAYS hear/feel the VSA doing it's modulation during real-life races.

From the first test drive with the new mounts, the car felt like it had a huge increase in traction. This is what people say about these mounts in front-wheel drive cars and it is the reason I got them. Seems to be paying-off.

By the way, if your are curious... I owned the motorcycle from the instant the light turned green. And, he was trying from the instant we took off because I could hear his loud exhaust hammering away. At no point, even rolling out of the hole, did he ever have a chance. He was dead, and he knew it. I heard him get out of the throttle when I was at approx 50 MPH. So, from 0 to 50 mph, I had more than a car length on him. And, my tires never spinned once. AWESOME... thanks IM !!!

paliknight

yah traction improved greatly for me too, and i still have one more mount left to install lol.

I hate cars

Is it safe to assume that everyone with the exception of Inaccurate has a MT?

One of my mounts is getting soft, putting it in reverse after a cold start will make the glovebox rattle. I was thinking of doing just one of these mounts. This is the way I've always done it, the side that torques up from acceleration (in the GN it's just the passenger side) so you get less vibration than all of the mounts but most of the benefits. I'm just a bit worried that even the softest mounts they offer might be worse than my worn OEM mount as far as vibration goes.

paliknight

check my sig. i have an auto also. i feel vibration, much more than before, but i didnt feel any difference when i changed gears (from drive to reverse, or etc...). however, i only have 2 on right now. the back one is going to be installed next week.

stillhere153

iTrader: (1)

^ update ur signature
should say Progress Rear Sway Bar, AEM Intake, P2R Spacer, RV6 Jpipe, Innovative Mounts

BLACKURA_NY

iTrader: (6)

^ i still havent installed my front & rear

ive been SOOO busy lately! maybe this weekend

ussi

iTrader: (1)

any other S/c'd guys install these??

stillhere153

iTrader: (1)

I have time tonight, you got my number

ek9hatch

Interesting, I have almost no vibration at cold start or when warm. The only time it vibrates more than usual is when the A/C is on and it's really noticeable when that compressor cycles on. Everyone seems to have a slightly different experience with these mounts. Anyone else running into this one?

t0talacuratl

iTrader: (3)

Yeah, my car vibrates bad at cold start now. I think it's a combination of that and rough starts that I get from my procats.

Excelerate

iTrader: (1)

I have noticed that sometimes vibration can be related to how hard the bolt was torqued and someone else posted on this. The one member commented that 30 ft lbs of tq was a good setting where vibration was minimized. I would put loctite on the end too to make sure the nut doesn't vibrate off.

stillhere153

iTrader: (1)

imo vibration is a good thing, I didnt torque the center bolts, I just made sure they were tight

ek9hatch

heh, that was me, over on the v 6 perf boards. No matter what torque I tried, I can't seem to get the a/c vibe to go away though...

Excelerate

iTrader: (1)

First, thanks for that post. It was informative. Maybe you could make that post over here so the AZ guys can benefit from it too.

In terms of the A/C vibration that may just be an inherent issue you will have to deal with b/c the bushings are polyurethane. Part of the sacrifice of having better traction, less wheel hop, and firmer mounts is some more vibration. It might be hard to supress that. There are some on here too who have said they have no vibration so you might want to try re-torquing the bolts while there isn't as much load from the engine, meaning support the engine so the bolt centers rather than pushes against the bushing. Also, the bushings do "break in" over time. They will get a little softer.