CSWBiggs

Looking Good Matt...

I hate cars

Wow, how's it going Jason? Long time. Eggy has missed you lol.

rockstar143

iTrader: (6)

So...your thread inspired me to clean things up this weekend. Cleaned up my power/ground wiring...then cleaned up speaker wires, moved my capacitor to in that foam thing in the spare tire. Installed my new Q 150.4 MB Quart amp (wow, talk about waking those massive audio and image dynamic speakers up!)...also, this amp was good enough to get signal directly from the headunit (via the patch cords I had soldered on) without the need for the line driver. Also, I was using the oem amp to give signal to the sub amp (for control of subwoofer) but I ended up just daisy chaining it from the new amp and boy am I happy. I always felt there was a disconnect between the bass and mid/highs because of separate sources providing signal.

Overall, super happy. IB is probably in my future at some point. Just wanted to check in and thank you again for the speakers and inspiration.

CSWBiggs

LOL...life is too busy...haha...but what else is new....are u ever gonna finish? (Sounds familiar??)

I hate cars

I remember something about a pot and a kettle lol. What's new with you and your system? Last i heard you had some pretty neat employment opportunities.

I said I was done when I got my Dyn 3 way set and even though I was perfectly happy i'm upgrading again. It's paying off, very accurate and very close to live music. I've even started attending live unamplified shows to learn exactly what music and each instrument should sound like and trying to reproduce it with my limited tuning skills. Its become an obsession.

I've been planning to consolidate to under the seat HD power for a while. I love these amps.

niebur3

Did you hear mine at the Acurazine meet in KC? I won best sound and have pretty much the same components at Matt. That should give you some idea anyway!

swoosh

iTrader: (5)

^^^ bro ur system sounded bad freaking ass....

clear mids and highs....the low's very so pronounced.....no rattle....damn...

I hate cars

That's good to know since our front stage is nearly identical. Although I think the MS8 gives me the tuning edge over Jerry.

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Update to this thread, the 430s came in today... Very beautiful speakers. Can't wait to install them tomorrow.

Trunk Monkey

iTrader: (1)

Man I wish all us audio guys lived closer! I'd love to hear all the different setups. There's a G2G for some Oklahoma guys on Saturday (from DIYMA) so hopefully I'll get some advise and tuning help. One of the guys has 2 AE ib15's too!

I hate cars

Is it "fish"?

niebur3

Nice

I hate cars

Going to install the 430s right now. After going off of 4 hours of sleep for the entire month I slept right through my 9am alarm this morning. 11hrs ftw lol. Oh well, I should be able to finish it today.

I hate cars

Done! I started with 20/80/300/5000 as my crossover points. So the mids are covering 300 to 5khz and they're mounted infinite baffle for now. Going to do a small enclosure soon.

The midbass were changed from 90hz to 80hz at 12db. It seems like the greatest differences between the Dyn 162 and the 650 are at the extreme ends of the frequencies. It has quite a bit more pop in the low end and as a two way better midrange. They surprised me with the amount of low end especially considering I was already impressed with the 162.

These mids have no visible excursion right now. I don't know how you could ever use up their 21mm peak to peak excursion. I would feel totally comfortable dropping the highpass to 200hz.

First impressions are the best vocals and snare drum I've ever heard. Theres a peak somewhere in the 2khz range, probably thanks to the MS8. Ran out of time today but I'm sure a retune will cure it.

It's a little surprising but i heard a few details I had never heard before in music i was very familiar with. That was unexpected since the previous setup was so good.

Staging is improved even over the previous 3-way. Not sure how or why but its more focused and higher and you can pick out the individual instruments and their location better. Not sure if its the mid by itself or the different crossover points.

The only issue right now is the tweeter level is kind of low. They're being run by the MS8 with less than 16w. As soon as the 900/5 shows up that will no longer be a problem.

Trunk Monkey

iTrader: (1)

Yeah. Know him?


Good to hear! Glad you like them. Get some pics up soon. Are you using the 130 tweeter now?

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I only know him from DIYMA. Seems like a nice guy.

Still using the 102s. They're so nice in a 3-way. Such a smooth and detailed tweeter. I just checked the specs of the MS8 and at 8ohms my tweeters are only seeing 10w right now. It's a good thing they're high passed at 5khz. That's the only problem right now, the volume is acceptable but there's no dynamics with so little power. Once the amp gets here the system will be complete.

These mids have brought the realism to an entirely new level. I'm trying to give everything some time to settle so I don't exaggerate in my description but right now I would have to say the difference is just as great after installing these mids as it was going from my CTX65s to the Dyn 3-way set. It's a retarded amount of money for a pair of 3.5" mids but I think once I get a good tune on them, they're going to be worth the money.

rockstar143

iTrader: (6)

it's so funny how everything can be relative!
because I would write the same statement as above except I'd be saying going from my infinity mids to the ctx's from you made such a huge difference. my new MB quart amp also helped "wake them up" quite a bit...I guess 150 rms per channel will tend to do that.

glad to read of your progress, Matt.

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Got the 900/5 in the mail today. The wires are already there so all I have to do is remove the seat and hook it up. Note, you can install without removing the driver's seat but I stick it as far forward so the seat has to come out to remove it to prevent theft.

I had another revelation with the MS8 lol. I've never had my sub blend so well, it just disappeared. Midbass is back so strong that I need to pull the door panels and make sure I'm not pushing the 650s too hard. With this additional midbass, these things have thoroughly impressed me, I never would have imagined a 6.5" could put out that kind of bass. It has 21mm peak to peak excursion, I'm interested to see how much of that I'm using.

In the beginning I used to run calibration with the engine off. After reading though the "big MS8 thread" on DIYMA I started doing calibration with the engine on since it was said that should not present any issues. I have to call BS because all of problems like the sub hitting way too late, all sub bass coming from the rear, lack of midbass and weird midrange peaks are all gone after running a couple calibrations with the engine off.

I drove the car the 45 minutes into work instead of riding the van so I could get some more listening time. Life-like is the only word I can use to describe it. It's completely amazing how real this system sounds. Forget harsh or dull, it's just real from the lowest notes to the highest notes and everything in between. Forget what people say about road and wind noise making it not worth the good equipment. It sounds great with the windows down at 65mph.

I'm almost afraid to put the 900/5 in, everything is so perfect right now I don't want to disturb it. But it will be nice to have a fully functioning stock appearing trunk with the spare tire and jack in place and giving the tweeters more than the MS8's 10w might liven them up a little. I might sell the Infinity Beta 300 if anyone wants a 1,000w@4ohm amp very cheap.

I hate cars

Going to install the 900/5 tomorrow. I'm going to try and get away without recalibrating the MS8 and just matching the levels by hand. After more listening time with the new setup, the tweeters are the obvious weak link. I'm not blaming the tweeters just yet since they're only getting 10w from the MS8's internal amp. I'm going to install the amp and see if dynamics improve. For those that claim they're pushing 200w to their tweeters (I've seen it on DIYMA) I have to call BS. While 10w isn't enough, it still gets pretty loud. 100w would make you deaf. Then again, isn't the difference from 10w to 100w just a little over twice the perceived loudness?

jda123

I have my TBe on a 75W channel and the gains are pretty low. I think that the full 75W would cause perm hearing damage for me. ...maybe 40w. I have the TN53k on about the same power - maybe just a bit more. Both are inverted domes, however, so they are oranges to your apples.

niebur3

Why? Just because a car has a 650hp engine doesn't mean it is giving you 650hp all the time. Most people are using a mere fraction of the amplifier power they have available. But massive head room gives you a warm fuzzy inside...lol

xxx_busa

the difference between 100 watts & 200 watts is 3 db, I doubt anyone is using more than 15 watts on a tweeter under normal conditions.

Trunk Monkey

iTrader: (1)

I dunno. My q4.150 is 150 per channel and I had gains on tweeter about 2/3's of the way and it would SCREAM at volume 30. No distortion, just pure loudness and clean actually. I haven't heard a ton of setups to compare with but for the price, I'm actually surprised at what the Massive set can do for $160. It'd be awesome if it didn't send DC to the tweeter though..ugh. I might have found some Alpine SPX-PRO ring radiator tweets for a decent price so we'll see. I hear those are awesome


Matt, have you decided what you're going to do with processing? Keeping the MS8 or going with Audison? I think you're due for pics of those sweet amps just sitting pretty under the seats too. And maybe those AE's

niebur3

Agreed. The high frequency information tweeters play doesn't take much power at all to amplify and get very loud!

I hate cars

Finally got around to installing the 900/5. What a little powerhouse. I had planned on losing a little headroom on the sub channel but I gained power. Don't know how that happened but I like it. Obviously it powers the tweeters just fine and the center if/when I decide to run it. I'm finally down to only 2 class D amps for the whole system. I can actually listen to the system with the engine off even with the crappy Optima for more than 2 minutes. I played it at normal volume for 20 minutes last night and it started fine. Once upon a time with the JL6450, the McIntosh, stock amp, and the old sub amp 5 minutes of listening would usually mean a no start.

Trunk Monkey

iTrader: (1)

Pick up the Interstate MTP-24f. Specs are darn good for only $120

rockstar143

iTrader: (6)

Wow...you guys are trucking along quite nicely...
I'm still very happy with my setup...the Q150 like TM...powering my massives up front and IHC's old idq's rear. No outside processor and was able to lose the line driver...
Rear is a Q1500D to my 2 12's in a small sealed enclosure. Very little space taken up...but don't have as much left as you, IHC. I'm down to probably 70% of my trunk space.

Trunk Monkey

iTrader: (1)

^ pray that any channel on that Q doesn't make your speaker blow the magic white smoke. Seems to be pretty common. Hope the Onyx line doesn't have that problem

rockstar143

iTrader: (6)

Really? I don't have the Onyx, I specifically bought the "Q"...it fried your set of massives?

I hate cars

And once again I'm pissed at the MS8. Decided to go ahead and do a tune with the new amp. Lost the midbass and have a whole system hiss that goes away with mute on the MS8. Typical of this thing. I decided to walk away tonight.

I've got a TON of clean up to do. Everything is just kind of all over the place. I have every component I've ever wanted, the purchasing is done well maybe the Dyn 110 or 130 tweeter but 99% done anyway. I never put the finishing touches on the car because I knew at some point I would change it. Now I can get to work optimizing things like the midrange enclosure, tuning, and making it look pretty. And finally I will be able to take pictures of the whole thing internet worthy. The goal is next weekend but who knows.

Trunk Monkey

iTrader: (1)

It fried my tweeter yes. It was making my right mid pop every once in awhile on when I shut my car off also.

All you can do is smile, laugh, and walk away. I know exactly how you're feeling. I'm hoping that all these troubles and weird instances we all have will one day yield a lot of car audio knowledge and a perfect (to us) system. I think you setup is pretty solid right now so I'd try to optimize it as best you can before up'ing the tweeter or anything else.

Do you use an RTA?? I need to figure out how these things work and what I can do to make my tuning easier. I was just going to play test tones at all different freq. and listen by ear and the relative loudness (cut/boost from there). Probably not the correct way to do it but if I can get an RTA working..that'd be great

I hate cars

Doing it that way is definitely better than nothing but using pink noise and an RTA is much better. If you have an iPhone or Droid, there are $5 RTA downloads that will put you in the ballpark. Tuning with an already flat curve is so much easier. You won't believe the peaks and dips you have now. It points you in the right direction and gives you an idea of which way to go. In the TL I have to boost the heck out of 800hz, I think it's a natural null in this car.

geekybiker

I'm sure that's heavily dependent on your speaker placement, and even seat placement. You have kick panel speakers too IIRC.

jda123

Put the mids in the pillar next to the tweeters. Compare that sound. ...probably the next place that you will go.

Trunk Monkey

iTrader: (1)

I'll have to look into the Iphone RTA also. If the Room EQ Wizard that Geeky linked is free though...pretty solid to be able to work on a nice sized screen like a laptop while doing it. I'll definitely have to check that out. Thanks for the info about the fake mics btw Geeky

I want to do that so bad...but I'd have no clue how to go about it. Never worked with fiberglass or done anything like that. Maybe I'll take a stab at it over X-mas break and if it turns out nicely then I'll be able to build them for members

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Everything I've read points to mids in the pillars being harder to fine tune. More TA required and a narrower stage. I've never tried it myself but I've heard a few setups like that. I'm trying to hide everything anyway and so far it looks stock from the outside and the inside. I would be willing to experiment with locations if it weren't for the visibility of pillar mounted mids.

rockstar143

iTrader: (6)

I would like pics...
when you do post them, it will be glorious.

I hate cars

Right now I'm driving around with no side trim by the driver's seat with a ton of wires hanging out onto the floor, the amp remote wire strung across the center console and going under the seat, the kicks flapping around not secured, and the carpet halfway removed still. The inside of the car looks like some thieves ripped it off. There are ground wires and old unused power wires all over the trunk, half the carpet missing, rags stuffed in the gaps in the baffle that I had to remove to run new signal wire from the MS8 and I have a slight hum because I ran out of time to run the new signal opposite the power wire. I even left most of the tools in the car knowing I have to redo most of it and they clang around every time I brake, accelerate, and turn. I'm super OCD when it comes to the car, I've replaced a ton of interior components because even a small scratch will drive me crazy, I keep it looking like brand new and having it like this bothers me even when I'm not in it. To top it off, one of our engineers at work decided to let himself in and sit down. He's pretty sarcastic when it comes to my abilities as it is and once he saw the inside he said "oh" and got out without saying anything else.

Basically I ran out of sunlight on Sunday and had to throw it back together good enough to drive. Since it's almost dark when I get home from work everyday, I have to drive it around like this until Saturday. It's driving me crazy. The driver's seat has to come back out, wiring re-run correctly, and the interior and trunk reinstalled. Luckily I only drive it a mile each way for work.

The great thing now is I can install everything perfectly knowing it won't have to come out ever again unless I have a component failure. Going to make some grills for the 430s as well this weekend. They're completely exposed and I nearly kicked one today. That would've been an $800 mistake.

I'm looking forward to taking final pictures, maybe this weekend. I've put them off for a long time because there has always been something not finished. Going to put my false "back seat" back in and I'll get pictures of that looking like the back of a stock TL seat when you pop the trunk.

I'll dig around for the pictures of my Esotars when they arrived, not sure if I've even uploaded them yet.

swoosh

iTrader: (5)

J....forget pix....i wanna hear it....

when IHC's install is complete and if I ever make a trip to Calif....IHC i need to hear ur setup....dont want NO for an answer....

I hate cars

If you ever make it out to Ca, you have a place to stay and you're always welcome to hear it.