prozzi

I have been talking to the internet salesman on buying a 6speed with Nav TL, we discussed price, trade in, everything. The Dealer is 2 1/2 hours away, so I wanted to make sure that before I drove down that everything was pretty set. I told him what I wanted off the car and he said that that could be done and I told him what I wanted for my trade in, I gave him an amount between a low and a high and told him that I would take something in between for my car, he said that they would be in right in the ballpark, but would do anything he could to do better when I got down there. Well after 2 weeks of going back and fort with him, telling him that I didn't want to waste his time or mine, I finally drove down tonight with my wife. I told him I would be coming down so he said he would be expecting me. When I got there he asked me were I was coming from, wich ofcourse I told him about 5 times in the e-mail. Then I had asked him how many miles on the car he tells me 19 just today, the car had over 70 miles. Then when the deal comes to do, they low ball me 5,000 less then what we had talked about my trade in, and tells me that they are only giving me 1000 off the vehicle when we talked about 2000. When he looked at my trade in he couldn't believe how great it looked and how clean it was, but when they did the numbers for the trade in, they checked the vehicle as average. Well so I wasted 7 hours of driving and sitting there for nothing. I have never seen a dealer so unorganized before. They told me to keep my car and buy the TL and in the meen time sell my car outright. We walked. The point is, please don't lie to people so you can get them in the door.

Nickerz

You should tell us which dealer this is. Don't let them get away with bad treatment and then not share with everyone who they are.

HacksawHilliard

Bait and switch:argue:

silveraccord

Prozzi,

Most people don't have the gumption to drive that far and then walk, that was what he was banking on. Please post the dealer name and location so that we can avoid someone who would pull these kinds of despicable low rent tactics.

At least you did the right thing and walked.

greenseed

Same thing happend to me, but not to that degree. I'm closer to my dealers, howerver you'd think that you'd be treated with a little more respect @ a certian level of car purchase.

Problem is that we went through a purchase for my wife back in July of last year, and overall the experience was good. So far, my dealing with the local Acura dealer are less than that. My car will be delivered next Thursday, so we'll see how it pans out then.

Z Factor

Sorry to hear about your experience.

May I suggest that you speak to a manager and at least let them know how poorly you felt you were treated. It might be that management doesn't know how some of their salesman are behaving, then again, it could be from the top down. It doesn't hurt to tell them though so I encourage you to say something.

Personally, I never trade in my car because it gives them more ways to play with the numbers and you always come out on the loosing end. Sell your car through your local auto trader (you will usually get much more money) then go to a dealer and make a straight up deal.

I could refer you to an honest internet sales manger that I got mine through, but he is in S. Florida.
Since it is freezing where you are, you can fly down here, soak up some sun, then drive your new TL back if you like

prozzi

The Dealer was Acura of Libertyville in Illinois. The sales manager is the one that took over while we were doing the deal, my salesman just stood by. I can tell you one thing I am pretty tired today. Driving down after work and getting back at 12:30.

Tripp11

I would call the dealership back and find out who owns that particular dealership and send him/her a letter voicing your displeasure. Hell, just get his/her name and then google.com his a** and find out his home address. Everyone who is in that dealership will look out for one another and cover each other's backs; however, perhaps the owner would be a bit more curious about how his "managers" are running his business.

Z Factor

Good suggestion

Modeler

prozzi,

I'm sorry to hear about your terrible experience. I'd be a lot more mad than you seem to be, if someone tried to pull crap like that over me. I'd rip them a new one!

Anyway, just like you I tried to save money by buying from a dealer hours away from me (4-5 hours drive in my case). My experience has been a complete opposite of yours. For the benefit of everyone who wants to buy from a remote dealer, here's a little checklist of things:

1. Get the price of the car in writing! And not just some hand-written note. The dealership should be willing to fax/mail you a contract showing the purchase price of the car, cost of any options (such as protection package), list of any accessories that will be on the car, AND ANY AND ALL fees (such as documentation fee). Fees are typically already pre-printed on the contract.

2. If they're selling you a vehicle for which they already have a VIN number, the contract should include that number.

3. Make sure that the deposit you make on the vehicle is fully refundable.

4. DO NOT bring a trade-in to a remote dealer. That's the way to trap yourself. I sold my previous car to CarMax - a large chain of used-car stores on the East coast.

5. If financing, apply for financing with the dealership at least 3-4 days before you go there. GET THE INTEREST RATE IN WRITING! If the interest rate is not what you want it to be, arrange for financing well before you come to a dealership. Use www.bankrate.com to locate the best interest rate.

6. Ask the dealer how your state's registration/taxes will be handled. Will they give you a temp permit from the state where the dealership is located? How much will this permit cost (it was free for me)? Is the dealer required to collect taxes for the state where the dealership is located?

7. Ask the dealer what documents you need to bring with you. If you're financing with Honda Finance, you will be asked for a recent paystub. In most states you will be asked to provide proof of insurance. And in some states (like NJ) you will be required to add your new vehicle to your insurance policy BEFORE you pick up the car. Your insurance company can fax proof of insurance directly to the dealer.

I think that's the most important things. Hope this helps someone. I'll post it in separate thread as well...

Nadimus

Thanks for posting it. I'll keep it in mind when will be doing shopping.

prozzi

Hey Dulnev,

Thanks for the info, I will definitely be more prepared next time. I have bought many vehicles and no dealer has ever treated me like this. Question for you, you said you traded in to Carmax, did you just drive in and sell it? How were they comparable for a trade in? I was pretty mad, but I did have 2 1/2 hours to calm down before I got home.

emendez

Best experience I had was trading in my old Mustang on a 2001 Lincoln LS in late 2000. I had done the research and knew that book value was around $10K but I just wanted to get the LS for my wife. Dealer looked at my car, drove it and came back with $13K to cover the down payment on the LS. I literally paid something like $50 that day and the whole experience was second to none. I only wish buying a car was like that all the time. Granted, it was the last day of the month and they desperately wanted the sale but it was still too smooth.

Animate

Prozzi's experience is all too familiar. There's a reason car salesmen constantly rate among the least trustworthy professions (right along with lawyers and reporters), although certainly there are exceptions to the rule. This problem is compounded by the fact that we are dealing with an extremely popular car. They know that if you walk, they'll still sell the car (and maybe even get more than you were willing to pay!).

Modeler

CarMax is great! I had two local dealers give me quotes on my trade-in. They were in the $23,000 - $24,000 range and were conditional on buying the new TL with NAVI from them at MSRP minus maximum of $500.

I took the car in to CarMax. They spend 30 minutes appraising it, then give you a detailed condition report and non-negotiable trade-in quote based on Kelly Blue Book values. "Trade-in" is an incorrect term for this transaction, since you can simply sell your car to them, without buying a car from them. The "trade-in" price is the same in both cases.

They offered me $23,500 and the offer was valid for a week or 300 miles. I brought in the car couple of days later and they cut me a check and paid off my loan. Nice and easy!

FirstAcura

Prozzi,

I would follow the suggestion by TRIPP11, but I would also include copies of your email correspondence with the sales rep.

I ordered my car on Sep 6th and purchased on 31 Oct when it arrived. Paid MSRP, not happy with that but at least I knew to bring my own lube and bend over in advance.

Still estactic with the car though!!!

Tripp11

Yeah, but you had the hottest and newest thing on the block on October 31st....and there's something said for that! :worship:

Good to hear that you have no problems with your TL!!

Nadimus

prozzi,

Have you tried other dealers in IL or WI (Milwaukee)?

prozzi

I have tried Milwaukee, but they don't have the car and won't get one until april, wich is fine I guess. And would give me 500 of Msrp. But I haven't tried other dealers in Illinois yet, I am kind of afraid to try now and have the same thing happen.

EVS Motors Inc.

I've worked with dealers for a while now, they are all like that. Even your highline dealerships.

The person you have to blame are not the salespeople its the salesmanager that makes them do what they do. They figure since you drove all the way in you won't want to leave empty handed.

Last week I went to a Nissan dealership to negotaiate a purchase for a Nissan Titan, they gave me $0 discount and said the truck was in demand, what dumbasses. Its a freaking Nissan Truck. Some sales managers just want way too much money. They obviously lost business, they would've made a customer a bit happy if they even gave $500 off. The customer needs to feel that they got something out of it. Atleast you were able to get $1k off, the Nissan dealership gave me $0!

Modeler

I couldn't disagree with you more. Not only are dealings with different dealerships different because of a great variation in the "quality" of sales people, I find that there's a tremendous difference in corporate culture at different dealerships.

It's only natural: dealerships are owned by different individuals with different goals. Yes, they're all in the business of making money, but there are SO many ways of doing it. Some dealerships have a very short-term outlook and try to extract the max amount of money from any transaction (like your Nissan dealer). Some have a longer term outlook, preferring to make a bit less upfront, but make the customer happy and build some loyalty, hoping that the customer would come back for future purchases.

Of the dealerships I've worked with latelly, I believe one to be in the earlier (short-term profit) category and two in the latter one.

HacksawHilliard

You shouldn't be so upset that they didn't give you any discount. New models generally are in high demand, hence the $0 discount. Wait a while for the demand to cool off, then go in and work out a deal.

prozzi

Well this dealer must be selling car like hot cakes, they have had the same 28 TL on their lot since I started working with them, he told me he has has the 6speed nav tl for 2 weeks. Also he had told me to come down last weekend because they were giving huge sales, well they must not have worked because they still have the same cars.
One thing I noticed is that the driver seat was badly wrinkled on the TL, for only having 74 miles on it I tought this was pretty bad, but it could be because of the cold and dry weather.

ndabunka

I'm pleased to see that some of you on here found Carmax pleasent to work with but for the value of the community details need to be offered so here I go...Carmax is a way to wholesale your car. You don't get any of the tax benefits of trade in (i.e. proceeds of the sale DO NOT offset partial costs of the new purchase). That alone can mean a thousand dollars (in my recent case it would have actually been $1,134.00). However, the guys at CarMax do tend to provide a more objective view of the condition of the car and you may get a few more dollars but you need to make certain that those $'s offest the tax losses. CarMax is good with "common" cars (Mustangs, eclipse, etc) and they can even give you a wholesale figure for the hotter higherline cars (BMW 330i for example). But don't bother with them if you have a "rare" or limited production car. I found that they do the same thing that the dealers do when you bring them a higher-valued car (in my case a mint 2001 CLK55 ///AMG) in that they call around to the wholesaler individuals and see what they can get you for the car. If the dealer can get you to use CarMax they are simply removing a LOT of issues on their side (i.e. tax paperwork, bringing the car into their inventory, holding costs, etc). In short, they are being lazy. A dealer did the same thing with me offering me $39K for my AMG while I was on their lot (NOTE: Delaership also has a Benz dealership in the next town over who had apprasied the car @ $40K). At $39K it was still about $2K lower than WHOLESALE but the tax advantages would make up for a little over $1K of that). However, when I brought the car to the dealership the NEXT day, they tried to back down to $36K (even though they could not find anything wrong with mine). Salesman then recommended I try CarMax. Carmax took over two hours to put a number together and essentially it was the same as the dealer (but without the tax benefits). I was lucky in that I already had an individual who was supposed to fly into town a week or so later with a $41K figure (if he liked what he saw). So, I went back to the dealerhsip. Tied up their ONLY NAVI (in paperwork contingent on the sale of mine) in early December and then picked it up 12/19 after my buyer had picked up my Benz. Making the dealer hold the car on the lot for 3 weeks was in some ways refreshing!

Modeler

Note that this does not apply in all states. In Virginia you pay tax on the GROSS price of the vehicle so the trade-in does not reduce your taxable amount.

By the way, we are lucky in VA to have a 3% tax rate on cars, which more than compensates for the gross-basis taxation.

bgronek

Yea...in Phoenix/Scottsdale AZ we are socked with 8.1% sales tax. Count your blessings on that point.

prozzi

Here is my e-mail that I just got from my salesman I was working with last night, now mind you the sales manager did step in but he was right next to him.

"Paul,

I was really sorry to see you go last night; I didn't get a chance to say goodbye and find out that we didn't get a car. What happened?

Please call me and let me know what happened last night, I feel horrible.

Tripp11

If he was right next to the sales manager, how the hell does he not know what happened? Sounds like he was bored today for a bit and decided to send a "I'm playing dumb" email to woooo you over.

Seriously, take your business elsewhere and tell the next dealership your fiasco last time and stress this will NOT happen again to them. I would also write the owner a letter stating your displeasure.

EVS Motors Inc.

I'm sure he knew, wasn't he the one going back between you and the sales manager?

What I think is going on now is that the sales manager wants you back in to buy the car. He will probably give you your $2,000 discount and a bit more for your trade to get your business. If it were me I would go somewhere else. Don't give them business if they screw you the first time. Let the salesmen know you already got a better deal elsewhere and tell him that he and his manager should learn a lesson in treating customers respectfully.

dafunda

prozz, looks like you lived my worst nightmare. Where I live, I gotta drive 2 hours minimum to get to any acura dealer and when I hammered the deal over the internet, this scenerio was just what i wanted to avoid; in fact, my circumstances were worse: turned in a lease and had no car and needed a ride from a friend who incidentally left before i put pen to paper - talk about setting myself up.

Nevertheless, all when well b/c the salesman (retired cop) did business the right way and i count my blessings.

FYI, you can perhaps vent your disgust more concretely when you buy your TL - Acura will send you a survey and in it, they will ask for your shopping experience with up to 2 other dealerships - bombs away.

newacuraforme

Man I had a similar experience with a Jeep salesman. I learned not to go out there unless they give you something in writing or fax.

Modeler

A very good point! I ripped Radley of Falls Church, VA and Pohanka of Chantilly, VA each a new one on the survey!

prozzi

I am definitely not going to give them my business, and I will be getting the TL sooner or later, so I will give Acura my mind on the dealership. Good idea.

EVS Motors Inc.

Very good idea! Manufacturers take customers very seriously when it comes to rating dealers, so what you can do is threaten them what you will do, maybe you will get invoice??