chazy777

I had my Viper791XV car alarm installed and according to my installer they told me the DEI has no information on this alarm tapping into the keyless opening of windows. The Viper791XV also has capability of remotely closing all the windows too which is a major plus!

Does anybody have information on configuring this alarm to do this WITHOUT buying any extra devices? I'm waiting for confirmation that this can't be done.

According to DEI, the Viper791XV requires a $25 device (my installer's price) to be able to open the trunk of the car remotely... which sux. So I won't be surprised if it's confirmed differently with the windows.

I need to confirm all this myself so I make sure my installer doens't rip me off. Thank you!

jackabyte

That's alot of BS about the trunk thingy. All they need to do is to tap into the correct wire. If it required something additional my installer would have charged me for it. Now about the windows feature, my guy tells me it can't be done, that does not mean that I believe him but I have not done the research on my own, maybe one day.

chazy777

Well all that matters is what DEI says. This is the source of information installers rely on. My installer says DEI does not have the info yet on the windows and DEI says this $25 part is required for trunk. Are you saying you have the VIP791XV on your TL and you didn't have to pay for a $25 part to remotely open the trunk with it?

All I need is this trunk and remote windows ability cause I"m having to carry around 2 remotes! The Acura remote just for the trunk. I don't really care about remotely opening the windows that much though; this is nothing but something to show off (then you have to be sly and act like you don't want to close the windows remotely). I wish Acura switched it to where it closes all your windows remotely rather then opened. That way as you are walking away from your car, you can close all your windows, instead of doing that first before turning off your engine and opening the door. I always have all my windows open when I'm driving.. (that is if the weather is clear and warm)

jackabyte

I have VIP691XV which is exactly the same system without the remote start, I have a 6MT.
My guy charged me $300 out the door for your system he charges $350. I'll give him a call tommorow and find out about the extra $25 for the trunk. If you find out anything concrete about the windows feature I would like to hear about it.

GunnmeTaLCURA04

hey on all my cars, when i have installed my alarms (Vipers) all they need to do is tap into the trunk release switch in your car .THATS IT!!! and as far as the windows go, i was told that for my 1999 626, i had to purchase these switches that could handle 2 windows at same time. so would need 2. left 2 and 2 right. but trunk.. hmm bull shit maybe. i dont think the TL;s trunk release button is any different than any other.

but hey.. maybe they did things TOOO high tech. hmm doubt it.. i mean. we got 3 sided tape...

I'm Batman

Well I am a qualified source on this subject and I know for a fact that DEI has the info on the windows for your car. Yes you will need a 530T window module to make the 791 operate the windows. Most dealers charge $99 for this installed. As far as your trunk release the part needed is a relay and the $25 is what most installers charge for the part and labor on it.

It would seem the smart thing to do would have been for the installer to go over all of this BEFORE the install/sale.

I hope this helps.

chazy777

Well for this TL the dealer said this part is needed.. I"m stuck with this damn installer and I discovered I was ripped off after all labor was done. No refunds allowed. I got charged almost $800 for this alarm and install. They included a 2nd one-way remote free to make me feel better about getting ripped off.. (wow)

But yea, he says this particular car requires a part in order to tap into the trunk release because of how high tech this car is. But they have absolutely no info on the windows from DEI. If they get this info, they will do this for me free of charge (another courtesy in getting ripped off) ..They told me they can install parts that I'd have to pay for for it to work (like you mentioned; and which I do not want to do) If DEI or anybody on this forum doesn't provide me info on how to tap into the windows without additional parts, then I'm out of luck and I'll just go and pay the damn $25 for them to install the remote trunk. If you can show me proof (wiring diagram of TL maybe?) why an additional part isn't needed, I would greatly appreciate it!

chazy777

Ok. Yes they told me it's $50 for every 2 windows. I can't believe this is needed when the Acura can already do this with the other remote??? Including the trunk. And what about the moon roof? I guess the 530T will not be able to interact with this at all? or would that be another part I'd have to pay for? It's not worth paying for these 530Ts.. that's a rip off when the car can already do it with the other remote (and the turn of the key to close all of them (inc. moonroof).

The installer has never worked with this car before so they didn't know till they got all into it.. I know.. my bad for being their guinea pig Sux too cause I have a 6MT and I can't have remote start on it. It's illegal (good reasons why) ..but this will be another $50 part that is needed.. I'm looking for someone that can hook me up with this (secretly) .. I have never left my car in gear when I parked it. If I let anybody else drive it and park it, I would never risk remote starting it. Anybody know where I can get this done?

direk_04TL

... not even sure if this is possible but worth a shot i think. i remember one of my friends getting a viper alarm installed on his 2002 celica gts and had his regular Toyota keyless remote to operate both the alarm and the keyless entry of the car. maybe you can program the TL remote or the Viper alarm to respond to both the keyless entry and the arm/disarm of the Viper alarm. anyway, just my .02.

jpellegrino

can anybody hook me up wit h the diagram so i can install myself?

taschroth

I have the DEI Valet 554R installed which is basically the same guts as the Viper with a few less features. The trunk pop just taps into the factory switch, not sure if a relay was used or not. Using a relay is sometimes not needed, but, is a good saftey measure to isolate the system.

As for the windows, I had a viper on my MDX with window rollup. I know the TL has rolldown built in but an aftermarket has it's own type of signaling, saftey stops etc. The correct way to do it is use the DEI moduals. I know this seems redundent but you just don't want someone guessing when it come to your factory wiring.

I did NOT get the window feature on the TL, it was just for the cool factor on the MDX and it added MILES of wiring into the doors and dash. Also, IF you ever have ANY electric problem the dealer WILL blame your aftermarket elecronics.

You get what you pay for... Make sure you go with a reputable company and one that if they fry your stock electronics, will pay to fix them!

Also, you MUST get the remote start if you have the automatic tranny!

I'm Batman

Chazzy don't do the remote start on your 6MT. Sooner or later it WILL cause a problem and you don't want to hurt someone. Trust me.

As far as having to use the 530T, this allows the 791 to interface with the car. Plus it has safety and function features that the car doesn't. For safety is has built in resistance monitoring. Seeing you are not at the car when you roll up the window the 530T will detect when something is stuck in the window, like an arm and it will stop rolling the window up. Plus it will do one touch up/down for all windows.

I know for a fact the DEI has the window info!!!!!!!!!!

chazy777

well it's not worth any $$$ to me to get the remote windows done through my Viper Remote. I'll just have to make sure I have the Acura remote stored away in the car in case I want to show off the remote windows opening.

So I'll go and just have them put the trunk relay on since I really want to have that feature without having to carry the Acura remote..At least it's only $25 and not $50 or more, cause then I may reconsider..

damn, I was really hoping to go to them with the info on how to use the factory wiring for the windows and trunk. Why is it so easy to use the factory wiring for the remote power locks? How come no 530T's or whatever are needed for this?

Does anybody on this forum have remote start secretly installed in their 6MT? If so, does it move a lot with parking break on hard and engine cut off when left in 1rst gear and remote starting it? My brother has a 4runner MT with remote start, and when left in gear it simply budges an inch (if even) and cuts out. Parking break is defintiely important to be on hard though! ANd I would think that with the AcuraTL 6MT, since the clutch releases earlier then most other MTs, that it would cut out right away when left in gear and simply not start.. It would be great if someone can test this theory..oh and hopefully you are smart enough to test this theory while in the driver's seat! :busted: (hope it doesn't hurt the car to test??) If I know that it defintiely takes off pretty good when left in gear.. then I most likely will not risk getting it put on.

PoochaKannInc

One of my friend's started my TL, (you need the clutch down for that), and then released it thinking the car was in neutral, but I had left it in 1st. The car moved forward about a foot and a half. I didn't have the e-brake up because it was level ground and I had it in gear, but that almost gave me a heart attack.

I don't recommend it because sometimes you might leave it in gear, and not put the e-brake up, or someone else might have driven your car and will leave it in gear instead of in neutral as you "normally" would. The extra convenience is not worth me endangering an innocent persons life.

chazy777

When remote start is put in illegally in a MT, the clutch has to be bypassed to start. And the ebrake will always be on when you ahve the car parked.. You only remote start it when it's parked, not while you are in the car with the ebrake off.

I'm trying to ask if you leave it in gear when it's parked (ebrake on).. If the engine will cut out without moving much (or only inches) then I don't see any danger in having a remote starter. It's all about how easy it is for a MT transmission to stall when not given enough gas. A remote start only tries to start the car without giving it any gas except what flows neutrally..

parvo99

what you need for the trunk is just a relay to change the polarity from + to -. This is a $2 part that you could probably hook up yourself.

http://www.partsexpress.com/pe/showd...number=330-070

chazy777

Yea I figured it's a $2 part..just like my alarm shoudl've been no more than $400 and I paid $800 for... but as I don't know squat about installing alarms, relays; I don't have the patience / motivation to read and attempt adding the relay myself to the Viper alarm they installed. Since my installer is ripping me off at $25 for the part and installing it for me and since they know my car inside and out after installing my alarm and entire upgraded stereo system. I'll just pay them the extra $23

spyfish007

There are two ways to SAFELY put a remote start on a manual transmission. I have done it both ways. I am not looking for a single argument on the subject and I'll leave it at that.

The first method requires more input from the user. You must press a button on the remote to enable "manual check" for the alarm. (Such as a Clifford AG4 system) You then pull the key from the ignition, get out of the car and arm it. As long as the car is not disarmed or set off the car will then remote start start. The idea here is that if you got out of the car with it running it must have been out of gear. It has a switch to detect the parking brake is enabled. The system also bypasses the clutch switch ONLY when remote started.

The other method is a little more slick. If your car has a neutral switch on the transmission (see 3rd gen RX-7 - I don't know about TL) then you can use a built in wire on a system like the AG4 to put the alarm in automatic tranny mode OR you can wire up a custom relay(s) to prevent the car from starting while in neutral. The key is the switch on the tranny which not many cars have.

You have to have the correct alarm with all the angles. With that being said most shops will still not do the install. You have to find someone willing to do so ... like me. Just for the record I have put a Clifford on my RX-7 and used it that way for over 3 years with NO problems. I will be putting that system on my TL when I get it soon. After I buy a shop manual I'll be able to share some more info, or if someone is generous enough to look it for you.

I'm Batman

This is not a foolproff system. That is why Directed stopped selling the Clifford AG4 and the Intellistart 4. When it comes to a manual transmission car why take the chance of hurting something or worse someone.

spyfish007

This was obviously DEI's policy and not Clifford's and since DEI bought Clifford, they inforced their policy. Clifford felt different about this topic and they always made great products. Hopefully DEI won't screw them up to bad.

I beg to differ on the foolproff part. My car with the neutral switch was foolproof. You could leave it in gear and it would not start. You could start it in neutral and then move it to a gear and before you get it in gear it would kill the engine.

speekafreak

I installed a Viper 791 in my fiancés 2004 Tl with windows and trunk pop. The only extra part I bought was the Dei 555U to bypass the transponder. I also used 5 relays. 1 for domelight supervision, 1 for horn honk, 1 for trunk pop, 1 for factory alarm arm (this one also does windows up ch4), and 1 for factory alarm disarm (this one also does windows down ch5).

First of all to do the trunk pop you just need a relay to pulse the trunk wire (yellow/w green stripe) with 12v at the trunk pop switch. Any experienced installer can do this in 5-10 mins. The Dei DirectWire sheet on the TL doesn't call for any extra parts for the trunk. The TL is not advanced when it comes to electronics. They don't even use a databus system throughout the car like a lot of the domestic and European cars.

Next thing is the windows. WARNING: I had to drill a small hole in the door itself to run the wires for this. If you do this don't drill into the wires running from the door into the car. I used a dremel with a small drill bit with no problems.

If you haven't noticed yet you can let the windows up and down with your key on the drivers door. To open them the doors have to already be locked (factory alarm armed) in order to let them down with the key. Just turn the key once to unlock the doors and twice and hold for the windows to drop. To let them up you do just the opposite. All this is doing is pulsing ground to one of the two wires on the key cylinder. One is the factory arm wire (lock) and the other is the disarm wire (unlock). So when either of these two wires see one negative pulse and then a second pulse that holds ground the windows activate. In order for the windows to go all the way down or up the wire has to be held to ground until they do so. When the path to ground is broken the windows instantly stop. I'm not sure of the disarm and arm wire colors that are in the door. I'm at work now but can post them later when I get home.

This is how I got the windows to work. The Viper has a factory alarm rearm wire (connector H2 green/white) and a factory alarm disarm wire (connector H2 green/black). Each wire needs to pulse a separate relay and the output of the relays need to pulse the wires in the door with ground. When hooked up correctly the Viper will pulse the factory arm wire when you arm it. It will pulse the factory disarm wire when you disarm it. You can tell its working because when you arm the Viper the factory security light will start to blink. When you disarm the Viper the factory security light will go out. Any installer that knows what they are doing should have hooked that part up already. If this is working right the windows are a piece of cake. Hook the channel 4 output from the Viper alarm (H2 violet/black) to the relay that is pulsing the arm wire. This will be the same contact you hooked the Viper rearm wire (green/white). You can diode isolate these wires if you want (I did). Next take the channel 5 output (H2 white/black) and connect it to the disarm relay where you connected the disarm wire (green/black). Now you should be good to go.

To operate your windows takes some skill at first until you get the hang of it. To roll the windows up make sure they are down and doors are unlocked. Then hit the lock button on your remote. Right after you do this press the AUX button and Lock button simultaneously and hold them until you windows are all the way closed. To open them just hit unlock once and then press and hold AUX and Unlock buttons simultaneously until your window open to the desired level. Now you can enjoy your window features for under $5 in parts (2 relays).

Sorry for the long post and please excuse some of my English. I tried to write this so that some of the do it yourself people can get an idea on how to do it. If you have any questions please ask.

I'm Batman

Spy - Directed went two years with the Clifford AG4 and Intellistart 4 product that were set up to do remote start on manuals. The problems were endless.....

I'm Batman

Speed where are you located?

speekafreak

Bat. Im located in Columbia SC.

Here are the wire colors I promised.

The factory disarm wire is located in the drivers door color is white. The factory arm wire is in the same harness. It is red/white. To easily find these wires remove the door panel and plastic from the door. Then trace the two wires coming from the lock cylinder. They are one color at the cylinder. Then they change to the colors mentioned above at a connector mounted to the door.

I have installed a few remote starts on manuals but I dont recommend it. It is very easy to get to work but there is no way I would install it on one of my own. It's too easy to make a mistake. Especially with the range these new alarms have.

chazy777

I wish I saw your post earlier. Cause I just took my car in for scheduled appointment Sat while you were posting this and paid $25 for a relay in the trunk that was "needed". It works great.. I hold the Aux down for few seconds and trunk opens. But now I'm wondering if I could've showed them your post and had the trunk done for free? They didn't charge me labor for the trunk release. But their products are a rip off to begin with. You say relays are still needed for the windows for $5? Is this the same relay they used in my trunk? (they charge $25 for) not the 530T that cost $50 each pair of windows? Another thing that sucks is the Viper remote can only perform the "driver 1 detected" functions with the seat / mirror memory settings. But I have to sacrifice by not being able to change the keyless memory settings ever again and they are locked the way they are.. If I'm allowed to change the keyless memory settings, then I have to sacrifice the seat / mirror settings. I'd rather be able to reconfigure the keyless memory settings rather than it remember my seat and mirror positioning. Cause I like to change the headlight timer, and auto lock feature occasionally. Since I'm the only one that drives the car, this is fine for me. And if someone else changes my seat/mirrors.. I'll just use the Memo buttons on the door panel to put it back to my setting. Or should the Viper remote be able to do EVERYTHING the acura remote can do? Cause they are telling me the Viper remote cannot. It can't communicate with the car in terms of the seat / mirror memo. These have to be locked into the remote.

I will call them up and inform them of your post to see if they can perform this with out the 530Ts. I'm sure they are very sick of me as I'm always bringing my car in with questions. But I've paid them so much money! they deserve it!

Thank you very much for this info! Just wish I had it earlier.

speekafreak

If you want your seat to default to the driver 1 setting everytime you disarm the Viper just have them do this. The factory disarm wire (refer to previous post for colors) from the Viper can pulse the the memo button 1 with ground every time its disarmed. To do this use the output from the factory disarm relay that they should have installed already and pulse the blue/yellow wire at the door module in the drivers door (they need to diode isolate this). That will make the car think you are pressing the memo 1 button everytime you disarm. I install alarms out of my garage and dont do this for a living just for side money. If I can figure this out I'm sure they can. The TL is a breeze to work on compared to my 2003 Avalanche.

On the windows you can use the 530t but the only advantage you will have is when you park with the windows down and arm the alarm the windows automatically go up. The disadvantages are you will need another module to do the sunroof and you are having these guys hack up your car for no reason. When all they have to do is hook up two wires off of some relays (factory arm and disarm) they should have already installed. Again dont let these guys rob you without a gun.

When i get some more time I will post the entire list of wire colors (It's long) I have for this car in case people are searching for them.

Oh yeah another disadvantage of the 530t is that sometimes when your window track has water in it the window wont roll all the way up. It uses current sensing to tell when the window is up. The water in the track causes extra drag on the window and it makes the 530t think the window is up when its not. I have experienced this on two previous Hondas that I've put these on.

speekafreak

I was reading back over this post and caught a mistake. The factory arm wire is WHITE/RED instead of red/white.

spyfish007

Batman: I would be interested to hear what types of problems DEI had. User error? Equipment error? Installer error? We can this conversation offline if you think it needs to go there.

chazy777

Well I'm definitely printing your posts out (with some modifications) and see what they have to say about it. I'm already at a loss on the trunk. So I won't even say anything to them about this. I told them NO on the 530Ts.. that's a rip off and not worth it. You just gave even more reason why they aren't worth it. I don't want to pay anything for the windows.. If I can get the windows done for another $25 or less, then I'll think about it. I"m too afraid to do any of this myself. I don't trust myself in taking apart anything in my car or figuring out any wiring. This even goes for molefelt that I still need to have installed for my windows to prvent my tint being scratched. My current tint I had put on are all scratched up since I didn't put that on. I read up it's incredibly easy to do yourself, but still want someone with experience to put it on. I have to have my tint taken off and new tint put back on though

This place is CarTunes.. I think it's a nationwide chain company, not one of these privately owned local companies I se eeverywhere in my town and just can't trust. I've discovered cartunes seems to care less about providing good service AFTER they installed everything for you and no refunds allowed after I discovered I was ripped off and saw all their products were marked up 400% from what I can find on Internet. I discovered this and felt like they now own my ass and I have to beg and plead for generosity/service from them whenever it should be free of charge. I have to be very careful I don't irritate them. I already have irritated them with the trunk and complained how I could no longer changed my keyless memory settings taht they fixed but had to disable the "Driver 1 Settings". Also I had to take it in cause my Warn Away mode wasn't working anymore.. Turns out I had to simply go inside the panel and they showed me how to adjust the sensitivity and tap the lit-up sensor in there that knocked it back in alignement for the Warn Away sensor to work.

Each time I bring it in they give the attitude that I'm wasting their time. Even though given they are always busy and have booked clients constantly. I'm worried that if I show them your instructions on how to do it they will demand more labor costs from me. And this is something they should've installed with the $350+ labor charges they already charged me. It's not my fault they couldn't figure out the wiring on the new TL since they had no experience with it.

All places are like this though in the Bay Area, Ca.. Customer Service has been lacking in our economy I go.. pretty sad.. course aftermarket audio places have poor customer service around here since the demand is high. Unless you pay them the really big Gs $$$.

speekafreak

Hope this works. Let me know if you cant see it. My scanner doesnt work with this computer so i just snapped a couple pics of my info.

speekafreak

Chaz to test if they hooked up your disarm wire lock the doors with the factory remote. You should see the factory security light on the door start to blink. Then hit unlock on your viper remote. If your lcd says its unlocked already hit unlock a second time and hold it. Your doors will unlock and the factory security light should go out if they hooked the disarm wire up. If they didnt the factory alarm will go off when you open the door. If this is hooked up all they need to do is trigger that relay with ch5 on the viper set to validity setting for your windows to go down.

chazy777

Ok I tried that and I locked the door with my factory remote, Viper still showed it was unlocked. SO I had to press the Viper Unlock twice for it to unlock, and it did. Red light shut off. So I will tell them about the ch5 thing you mentioned.

But what about windows remotely going up? Is this something to put on another channel with another relay that performs the same function as turning the key twice clockwise in door? All I care about is remotely closing the windows.. I could care less about remotely opening them.. I always open all my windows, and it would be nice to get out of the car and let the car close the windows for me as I am walking away and arming the car.

EDIT: I was able to pull the link up to those pictures.. I got them no need to email them to me from private message I sent you

speekafreak

To test and see if they hooked up the factory rearm (which i doubt) hit the lock button on your viper. If they have it hooked up the factory security light will start to blink. If they have this hooked up all they have to do is hook the ch5 output up to trigger the factory rearm relay. Once they hook that up you should be able to let the windows up by pressing lock once then press Aux and Lock at the same time and hold them until windows go up and sunroof closes. If they dont have the factory rearm hooked up they will need to hook it up like i mentioned in my first post. It is very easy and shouldnt take them over 30 mins. They should also only need one common automotive relay SPDT. These things are so cheap the shop i deal with just gives them to me 10 or so at a time. Dont let them charge you $25 for that like they did on the trunk.

chazy777

Yes I already knew the factory alarm still arms with the Viper. When I arm the Viper, both the red light and blue light blink. (which I love cause it shows the car is very armed)

I'll gonna go out to my car now to test this since I never hit the buttons like that nor did they show me, but first, shoudl I be able to do same with unlock button for opening the windows? So if this doesn't work then I need to get that relay.. and if their price is $25 I have no choice but to pay this much because I'm stuck with them. Obviously this is how they make more money off me by not charging me labor costs.

Twenties

good luck with that remote start on a manual car. i remember when my friend was trying to show off his remote start as a group of us were leaving a restaurant..... next thing you know THE CAR LUNGED OUT OF THE STALL -- HOPPED OVER THE PARKING STOP - - AND RAMMED INTO ANOTHER PARKED CAR! You should have seen the look on everyone's face. Priceless. Except for the damage done to the other person's car.

speekafreak

Chaz- It sounds like they have all the relays you need hooked up to make the windows operate. They just need to tie ch4 relay to the factory rearm relay and the ch5 to the factory disarm relay. If you werent too unsure of working on your car you could possibly do this yourself. Once hooked up read my first post on how to operate the windows. Its easy once you do it a time or two.

My fiance wanted the blue led installed since her car is blue. Just my luck she didnt want a hole drilled in the dash or A-pillar for the mounting. She wanted it to look like the factory one but blue. I took the factory led out and it is just a ciruit board with the led circuit mounted under the peice of plastic that goes in the door. The part you see flashing where it says security is not the actual led. Its just white plastic that the led light travels through. I just left the factory circuit unplugged and installed the blue led under that clear plastic. Now it flashes blue and it looks like its factory.

Since my pics didnt show HERE is the link to the pics of the wiring info. Just go there and click on the folder that says TL wiring (duh). You can check out my dogs too. To print the pics of the wire colors save them to you computer and then print. If you dont it only prints about half of it.

chazy777

Ok so what you are telling me is I need to buy 2 relays from them, one for channel 4 to open windows (factory arm relay) and another for channel 5 to close windows (factory disarm relay)... You don't have this backwards? The windows should close when the factory alarm arms right? and open when it's disarmed. Which leads to another question, if the windows are closing when the Viper is armed, wouldn't it trigger the alarm to go off from the vibrations of the windows closing? or at least trigger warn-away?

You did make it to where your fiancee can open AND close the windows with the viper remote right? using the Aux-Lock and Aux-Unlock correct?

speekafreak

Yes she uses Aux-Lock to close her windows immediately after she arms (no warn aways). She uses Aux-Unlock to lower her windows immediately after she disarms. If your car is already arming and disarming the factory alarm you shouldnt have to buy anything else to get this to work. The installers should already have the relays installed. All they should have to do is hook the CH4 output from the viper to the factory disarm output (diode isolate) and the CH5 to the factory alarm disarm output on the Viper (diode isolate). These wires are on the same connector on the alarm. Refer to my first post for colors and connector number.

MyJohnson

speekafreak,

Can the Viper 791 be installed as you've spelled it out with the GPS/Responder also installed? Or is this already part of the package.?

The LCD display looks like its as large as a cell phone (never held one in my hand) and would be something extra I'd have to carry around on my hip. The shop here has experience with MB and BMW but not the new TL.

Thanks

chazy777

My responder attenna is right behind my rear view mirror. I have the LCD remote on my keychain. It's very small and hollow feeling. I can hide it in the palm of my hand.