rybocf

Well, if Accura is going to stick it to us, I'm going to try to find a replacement tire, even if its at my own cost.

I spent too much money on this not to enjoy it. I love the car, but the constant small vibration detracts from it completely.

Just for reference: I do not have the 50-55 mph vibration issue, I feel it a little, but I can tell its the low rpm on the tranny.

I never got the flatspotting problem until yesterday, and WOW it sucked. I could tell right away what it was based on reports from this site, thank God or I would have freaked. It was like driving on square wheels for a minute.

My problem is a constant slight vibration in the wheel and floor boards at most speeds above "slow". It was greatly reduced by fixing some balancing issues, but it is still there all the time. I'm convinced its the tires.

Oh well. I guess there's nothing left for me to do. I don't feel like being pissed off at Acura or my dealer anymore, but don't feel like dropping $600-700 on tires.

I wonder if talking to Bridgestone and making a deal with them will work.

Ryan

chas083

1. YES. rpms, gear or in neutral did not make a difference.

2. YES. 3 times. First Conti Extremes- no improvement. Second back to EL-42s (2 new ones replacing 2 out of round)- slightly better but still significant flat spotting. Third Michelin Pilot Sport A/Ss. Now no flatspotting even in subfreezing weather.

3. YES

gldman

Thanks all for your comments. I have not had any vibration or flat spots so far. However, the EL42s are really noisey and slip when it is wet. I was planning on getting the Conti extremes which were great on my '02 TL-S. With the comments here I am thinking of buying the Michelin Sport A/S. If anyone has any trouble with the Michelins please post. I will probably buy them in early January. My dealer would not do anything considering I really do not have a problem. I plan to save the EL42s and put them back on the car before I trade it.

My issues were paint chips or scrapes on the bumper and warped molding below the right rear door. The molding has been ordered but the dealer is still waiting. They tell me they will touch up the bumper when the molding is replaced.

My vin is in the 16,200's.

Thanks all

acuraddict

I hadn't thought about trying to contact Bridgestone. That might be worth the effort...you never know. For now I'm hoping my dealer can work something out, but your idea will be my next move if necessary.

Hey Ryan, if you do decide to contact Bridgestone, keep us posted.

Chilli

Forget about the vibration issue. Who do you think is winning this pissing contest , Accuraddict or Fsconsult?:ar15: :bigun2:

DMZ

Here's the poop on these EL42's from tirerack.com:

http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tires....omCompare1=yes

Since most reviews by owners say "THEY WOULD DEFINITELY NOT BUY THIS TIRE AGAIN", I'd say that about says it all.

http://www.tirerack.com/survey/Surve...ommentStatus=P

6spdzoomzoom

I think they both seem to be a little childish.

But who really cares... They need to start a new bashing thread.

need4spd

I did contact Bridgestone (and posted previously) and they created a file on my tires (I had recomended to all to call bridgestone also, and still recoemend it).

They asked that I go to a bridgestone/firestone company store (not an authorized center), unfortunately the closest one is 35 miles away and I will have to wait many hours until the tires get cold for the flat spot to show. With the holidays, it has been hard to get there.

I am sure that they will do something, the problem is I do not want anouther Bridgestone tire with a Nylon cap, as it too will flat spot (as indicated on the LS-Z from anouther post and the S-03, per tire rack).

Anyway, I would appreciate any recomendations on this.


Here is my original post on 11-20-03 http://www.acura-tl.com/forum/showth...e&pagenumber=2

Bridgestone Contact Info
I called the Bridgestone hot line, no answers, but they do want me to bring it to a Bridgestone Tire Retailer to check the cold flat spots.

Also, they said they are documenting the issue and if enough come in, they would look at it further.

Therefore I recomend that all the TL drivers having tire vibration issues contact Bridgestone and indicate that this is an OEM appliation and you are not satisfied with the cold tire flat spots creating vibration issues and ask what they are going to do.

I did tell them that there are a lot of complaints on this, and a tire should not be doing this!

Here is the information for Bridgestone:

Tel - 800-367-3872

Consumer Affairs Dept.
P. O. Box 7988
Chicago, IL 60680-9534
Tel - 800-367-3872
FAX - 800-760-7859


Good luck and I hope this helps!

brahtw8

I think he meant a transmission chip, not an engine chip. The lugging or bogging problem as I understand it could be solved by a new program for the transmission that held 4th gear longer so you wouldn't shift into 5th at 1500 rpm.

scelipt

do have the 17tns or the 18tns on your car

Motavar

I wonder if the tires will fall apart in the summer time like those Ford Explorer tires.

fsconsult

I've also heard from another site, that a person experiencing the same type of engine vibration related to 5th gear has had the problem fixed through disconnecting the battery. He is not positive if this was the result of the fix. He actually brought the car in to fix the the glove box, and apparently service had to disconnect the baterries.

He claims that now the vibrations are gone and he only notices a slight engine noise at 50-55 related to 5th gear.

Maybe disconnecting the batteries re-programmed the engine shift pattern????

brahtw8

That may well be. A lot of modern cars have adaptive electronics that change based on driving style. This may apply to the engine programming as well as the transmission. The car keeps track of how you drive and adjusts accordingly over an initial break-in period. Some of the newest cars do this programming every time you drive your car such that if you drive easy for the first half of your drive, and then want to experience full power from the car you may have to pull over and shut it off.

I don't know what the TL's systems do, but it is possible that the too-early shift to 5th is exacerbated by a light foot driving style that puts the car into fuel-economy mode and results in upshifts at RPMs lower than if you drove the car harder.

I don't know the TL specifics, but I would expect it has such adaptive electronics in one form or another.

As if I need another excuse to get on the throttle . . .

rets

I shall call...

acuraddict

I will definitely call and write a letter to whomever I speak with.

Thanks!

Rock Dog

I had a similar situation in my 2000 300M. It had a vibration, although it was very bad, the steering wheel actually oscillated about an inch at just the right speed(s).

They too claimed it was a "characteristic" of the vehicle. I ended having to Lemon Law the POS. And bought the 2001 CL-S.

Now in the 04 TL I noticed some vibration. I had the four corners spun on the Hunter GSP9700 and it took a lot of the vobration out. However... The tech showed me that the balancing computer detected that my left front tire was bad. Way out of spec for 2nd harmonic vibration allowance. The dealer is replacing the tire on Monday. So we'll see if that combined with the Hunter GSP9700 solves my issue.

DaveB99

Dog:

Can you tell me how much that cost you for the hunter??

Was it at an acura dealer or a third party?

Do the third party hunter guys know how to balance an acura 2004 in that it is so new?

mrtech

My vibration @ 50 mph is only noticable when the tires are cold. The vib is negligable after driving a several miles on the freeway. I guess this is a flat spot issue. I'm not sure if re-balancing will help minimize the vib. When it vibrates, I can feel it on the floor board as well but the steering wheel does that shimmy just vibrates a little.

This will be a tough one with the dealer since that tires will be warm by the time I get there. They have to keep the car overnight and drive the car in the morning to feel it. If I drive 65 to 70, there is no vib at any time.

BTW, I have 17" tires.

michael3314

I am going to replace the EL 42's with Michelin's at my expense because I can see an accident coming with the Bridgestones. These tires suck. These are the worst "performance" tires I have had the displeasure of driving on. I refuse to have an accident because of the poor performance of these tires. I like my TL and would like to keep it in the best shape I can. These tires are an open invation to the body shop.

Jimmyz

You should go back to your dealer & sales person and BEEAACTH!
I did and got Michelin Pilot sports put on Yesterday FREE of CHARGE.

michael3314

JimmyZ,

What did you have to do to get them replaced (other than BEEAACTH)?

Jimmyz

Michael3314 -

See my post here: 5th post down the 4th page.

Replacement Tires

jyg tl 3

drove a nov production 6mt tires were date code 45 003 4th week 03, there was no flat spotting , still notice vibration in neutral from idles to 1500 rpm,

nfnsquared

For those of you looking to replace your tires, check out these reviews at tirerack.com:


GoodYear F1 GS-D3 (hp summer) vs Michelin Pilot Sport (hp summer) vs Sumitomo HTR+ (hp all season)

nfnsquared

oops, never mind the above link, didn't notice it had a session cookie. sorry about that.

Disclaimer: I'm not a tire expert. Just posting some info.

A lot of folks seem think a lot of the Michelens, but the Goodyear is cheaper ($153, plus $50 cash card vs $183) and has better specs.

The Sumitomo is only $89 and also have good spec and reviews.

Rock Dog

$15-$20 per corner. Depending on the shop.

3rd party. The Hunter GSP9700 website has a "locate a GSP9700 near you" function. My local tire guy happens to have one of the machines at his shop. I've said it before (although we shouldn't have too do this.) This machine smokes conventional balance systems. I swear by it. Every car I've had with 17" or larger (the last 4 cars) get a run on this machine every 8-10 thousands miles.

The year of the car has nothing to do with it. They pull the wheel and tire off the car, measure the road force of the unit by applying a roller to the tire. This tells the system where\if there are any soft spots in the sidewall. They then measure the runout of the rim (high or low spots.) The computer then tells the tech where to place the tire with relation to the rim, and where to place the weights. They usually put weights right behind the spokes on the I.D., as well as the lip of the inside of the rim.

This system has fixed numerous little balance problems that a convential balancer was not able to pinpoint.

rets

Since svtmike said his TL has no more vibration after the dealer replaced old EL42s by new ones (EL42, 4803), I'd like to know what's the number on your EL42s if you do feel vibration from tires...

Mine is 3903, VIN 46xx, but feel no vibration from them...

acuraddict

I had the Goodyear F1s on my '02 TL Type S and they were great tires. Excellent in wet weather and sticky as hell on dry roads. I loved them.

KJSmitty

"4603" on my EL42's... Vin in upper 16XXX

Flat spotting yes, some vibration at speeds over 70mph

Smitty

need4spd

Rets. My el-42's have a date code of "3703", the week before my car was built (wk of sept 14th for tires).


MikeSVT new tires were made 11 weeks after mine.

Lore

I just picked up my Anthracite/Ebony + Navi 5AT TL this afternoon from Stevens Creek Acura. The tires have a date code of 4903 on them.

Rock Dog

I had taken my car over the a tire store that uses the Hunter GSP9700 Road Force Balancing system. Force Variation is a measurement of the sidewalls ability to stay "stiff" if you will with the load of the car on it. The machine measures the sidewall by applying a roller to it to simulate read force. 20 lbs of variation is at the top of the acceptable limit or faorce variation for your standard passenger car application (according to the tech trained on the GSP9700) My front left tire was 26 lbs. So... I took it to the delaer with this information, and insisted (although it wasn't to hard) that they replace that tire. The other three were up around that 20lb mark. Still high, but it falls within the acceptable range.

The dealer put a new EL42 on the car, and did their standard static balance (which I've stated here before, is crap when your dealing with a 17" or higher wheel/tire package) you need something more accurate. Anyway, I stopped by the tire shop to have the dealers static balance weights removed, and have the new tire (on the same wheel) run through the GSP9700. ARGH!! The new tire has a force variation of 33 lbs. IT'S WORSE THAN THE OTHER TIRE...

I have had it with these BridgeSkunk EL42 chunks of round rubber. They are absolutely the worst tires I have ever come across. Not only are the materials and tread pattern worthless in anything other than a 80 degree dry summer day scenario. But their quality control seems to be right up there with Yugo automobiles.

I've got 4,000 miles on my 04 TL, and I am sick of diking around with the tire balance and so on. Acura should be absolutely ashamed of themselves for allowing such an inferior product to be mounted to an otherwise excellent excercise in automotive design and engineering.

rets

I'd like to say this to ACS if possible. Perhaps, we should have some harsh talks through the calls, not just plain complaint about the cars.


I'm sorry to hear that, tires unbalance and rim scratch stuff. Hope the dealer can give you the good one next time as well as fix the problem.

need4spd

The abbreviation BS is fitting for bridgestone!

DMZ

Also check the reviews for the Pirelli P Zero Neros, the top rated all season tire. Not only are they substantially cheaper than the Michelin Pilot Sport A/S's, they're probably the ones I'll buy if Acura won't swap the BS's .

Mike64

Jimmyz, Acuradict and one other guy who's name I can't remember all got new tires from their dealers. What are the rest of us doing wrong? My congratulations to you three, and to Acuraddict, you seem to be getting a lot of grief on this site for all your hard work and information gathering. My hat's off to you (from one Los Angelino to another

jazz5060

Greetings,Accura addict

I also complained of the pathetic choice of tires my 04 TL.I realized Bridgestone was having a fire sell because of the Firestone connection.They obviously made Acura a deal they could not refuse.The wind up is I dumped
the EL 42 when they had 600 miles on them.I knew by then they were hopeless!!I went into American tire,they gave me $100 a piece in trade on Michelin Pilot A/S.The difference was amazing ,i to have had at least nine Acuras over the years,and the tire fiasco was the worst mistake Acura has made yet.My money is they wont be on the car next year!