twigglius

iTrader: (6)

Is the GM Synchromesh only recommedned for MT or should us AT guys use it as well?

Adamo0926

I'm glad I listened to you guys.....it's been about a month since I have had the GM Synchromesh put in and the feel of the stick is 100% better. It's almost unbelievable the difference it has made.

quantum13

GM Synchromesh is an MTF fluid and should not be used on an AT trans.

Also, I use the AmsOil MTF in my car and I feel the same way about it as you guys do about the GM stuff. The trans is much smoother and feels better.

Road Rage

Guys - guys - I think the GMSFM is great or I would not have posted on it. If I am a BS'er, that is news to me. I have posted in detail on what is good about the GMSFM, and have also run extensive lab analyses on used HG MTF, GMSFM, and others.

The Specialty Formulations was around a long time until I decided to try it - note that my friend Michael Wan (we have never met, onbly email buds) has a lot of respect for Molakule, the man behind SF, but MW is also a sensible chapskate (I say that with respect) and did not like the price increases in the SF MTL-P. Me? I am well endowed financially, at least to cover the xtra cost of a few quarts of fluid - and yes, I pay for everything I use and recommend, so there is not corruption in this boy - I y'am what I y'am, a la Popeye.

Anyway, I tried the MTL-P, and found it to shift as well as GMSFM, and that it had a heartier (robust, stronger, longer lasting for those in Yorba Linda). I hated the color (purple) as I like stealth fluids. But the MTL-P has the best quality base stocks (GIV and GV) and should standup to both track and hard street use well.

So:
1) It shifts as well as GMSFM (which is to say, state of the art - SOTA)
2) Its formulary is 2nd to none, and is no one size fits all product: its viscosity and add pack are designed for trannies like Honda uses, and is safe with yellow metals, and even worked well with the carbon fiber synchros in the S2000)
3) It had no downsides, other than the color
4) It is pricey, but competitive with GMSFM (Michael would prefer Amsoil's new MT lube because it is a better deal for the money, but I do not care)

So all in all, why would I not endorse it? Does it mean I no longer think GMSFM is a fine product? Of course not! Would I immediately recommend you drain your GMSFM? Of course not? And note, GMSFM has been endorsed by me, and validated in use by many on these Forums - so it has the weight of experience and time. MTL-P does not.

I posted in detail originally in my MTL-P post, and my GMSFM analyses (which I believe have more fact and less opinion than any other reviews on the 'Net on that product). Hey, I could just be a BS'er, making all these facts up (that would make me a creative BS'er, no?).

You all are free to pick what you will. If it works for ya, I am happy - if it doesn't, post your opinions. But I just wanted to set the rec straight on my "motives", since some intimations of suspicion were starting to creep in here. (Oh yes, I think a blanket rejection of a lubricant because it has GM involvement is pretty silly - actually, GM has been a leader in that it has more fluid specs and products out there, tailored specifically for the product in which they are intended to be used. Most mfrs. just have 1 or 2 products, that seem somehow to be universally perfect in their add packs and lubricity - as someone with professional training in engineering (more IT these days than mechanical), I know that GM's spec for GMS, GMS FM, GM Syncromesh, are designed to get optimal results based on the specific needs of the DUT's (devices under test, for those in Yorba Linda).

Peace, guys. Enjoy your cars. Now cvan we go backl to more imnportant issues, like butt prints, which wipers to use, and the new Type-S?

SouthernBoy

Nice to have you back, RR. We need all the Virginians we can get on this site.

trancemission

Was just at the dealer today. The head mechanic told me they have a new MTF coming in for the 07's. Hes going to try that and if that doesnt do it then he will go to GM and buy that syncro shit himself.

DMZ

https://acurazine.com/forums/showthread.php?t=118339

10,000 miles later with the GM Syncromesh fluid, and it still shifts as smooth as the day after I did it!

Adamo0926

I am so happy my dealership carries the GM Synchromesh MTF and that I decided to change to it. Usually I am very skeptical that a product can make as much of a difference that people claim....but with this stuff it's all true ! The issue with shifting into 3rd gear has completely disappeared. The shifting overall is a complete pleasure after putting this stuff in. It's like healing water for the 6 speed TL....maybe it came out of the ground at Fatima

jennarocks

I think its funny that everytime this topics comes up, some people think that the TL is the first application of GMSFM to honda/acura vehicles. as if this is something that is new and that we are somehow guineapigs or something. Please understand that GMSFM has been used by other honda/acura owners for years, i.e. S2000, ITR, etc. I changed out my MTF at 9K miles. have a little less than 20K on it now and 3rd gear is no longer a problem. tranny is still 'notchy' but smooth and feels solid. if you're thinking about it, then do it. its a proven solution to the our imperfect tranny.

By the way, please make sure that you are buying GM Synromesh FRICTION MODIFIED, as there is a regular GM Syncromesh Fluid.

jennarocks

For those of you who are so worried about your warranties, please have a little common sense. Just b/c it says GM on the bottle doesn't mean that its somehow chemically exclusive to GM vehicles. the bottom line is that its a chemical, made like every other chemical. Its not that unusual to believe that a GM fluid could be used on our trannies... its about chemical makeup, viscosity, etc...

secondly, if you really want to get technical, the dealer can deny a warranty based on ANYTHING. example... i have a K&N air filter which my dealership sells. truth be told, if that K&N was ever found to be the cause of an engine failure or any other failure, Acura could deny me warranty coverage. if I use a aftermarket brake pad that causes brake failure and they can prove it, i lose my warranty. Hell, if i use a leather cleaner, and it screws up my leather, i lose my warranty. get the point? don't have warranty phobia... be educated to what you are doing, why you are doing it, and know the outcome/results of what youre doing.

DMZ

I accompanied an Acura mechanic as he took my TL on a test drive today.

He swore mine was THE SMOOTHEST SHIFTING 2004/5/6 6 speed TL he's ever driven and wanted to know what I did. He was virtually shocked when I told him about the GM fluid.

He's also going to become an AcuraZine regular.



P.S. He was also surprised to see a DGP/Camel/6MT/Navi, a combo he's never seen.
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.
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ussi

iTrader: (1)

does this stuff work BETTER for supercharged cars or should i just stick with the redline ATF?

TLin05

Put the GM FM in my 05 about 5,000 miles ago. Before then, my carefully driven TL would balk at shifting into 3rd gear once or twice a week. Since the switch ... Not Once. Great stuff.

sqzbox

Anyone tried RedLine low viscosity MTF???

ragin

So I've got an 06 MT with 300 miles on it. No issues with the tranny. Would you switch this early?

Boulder GT3

Be very careful about the oil you put in the gear box and I would stay way from low viscosity MTF as this is made for gear boxes only. The TL has a transaxle meaning the ring and pinion are in the gear box oil as well. These are very high load gears and need a higher viscosity oil than the light Redline gear oils.

Also, make sure you don't put an oil that has friction modfiers in it as many of these are corrosive to "yellow" parts which include synchros. Also, some oils are too slippery for the synchros and can cause damage. Lot's to understand before you shift off of the factory fill. Just make sure you do the research.


I use Redline in my track cars and change it very often. Basically, put a finger in the fill hole and if it smells burnt at all get rid of it.

bowton

I purchased a new '05 TL. Had the occasional problem with engaging 3rd gear. drove me nuts. Brought it to three different dealers and non of them would confirm the problem, therefore, there is no problem with 3rd gear right?

Returned car to one of the dealers again with copies of forum posts describing the problem along with the GM fluid recommendation and testimonials. Brought it straight to the service manager. He called the regional service advisors and got approval to install the GM fluid. They put it in and it transformed the tranny instantly. I have not once failed to engage third and most obvious is how smooth shifting is in every gear. It's a smooth as my '90 integra after 150,000 miles.

I hate the fact that this is a bandaid solution but it works and until Acura confesses to the problem with this tranny and offers a new one as a drop in replacement under warranty I'll stick with it.

I could use some help with a related topic.

I have a 1983 ford ranger beater truck with 4sp manual. Ford specs ATF as the transmission fluid. Can I use GM syncromesh fluid or Redline MTF in this transmission? it's pretty notchy especially when not warmed up. Thanks for your input?

DMZ

Where are you and whose your dealer?

We should keep a list of dealers who are using the GM fluid in case someone here ever has a problem and gets refused warranty work on their 6 speed tranny because they had the GM stuff in it.

quantum13

Something I'd like to add is that AmsOil MTF is specifically designed to be compatible with Honda. The GM stuff isn't specifcally meant for that (not to say its not good - its just not specified). I put it in my car and am enjoying it. I put full synth AmsOil 10w30 in the engine as well. Been running that stuff for years - works great at extended change intervals (10k). My accord has 210k miles on it w/ no smoking and still passes emissions checks.

SodaLuvr

Ford WSD-M2C200-C type is the recommended fluid. Either get the real fluid from the dealer or check with RL/RP for what they recommend.

papiowhisperer

Greetings,

I'm about to go from GM SM F-M to the new
and improved Honda MT oil. Nothing
against the GM product al all - it's
fabuluos, it's just that I'm currently
running a mixture of the old Honda
MT oil w/ one qt. GM SM. The reason
for the switch is that I can get 3 qts.
of Honda oil for 15 bucks. I'll try it out
and if I don't think it's as good,
I'll switch to the GM product in a
blink of my eye.

Cheers

clsdave

Since people are still having shifting problems with the MT I thought it would be nice to bump this thread. May be we will get some new poll takers and opinions.

I'm still very happy with the GMSFM fluid after 10,000 miles.

bags2

FYI - I went in to my dealer for an oil change and MTF fluid change 2 weeks ago ('06 - 13K miles). I had been having the "sticky" 3rd gear problem since I got the car. (By the way, I drove an '04 MT TL for 2 years and it had no 3rd gear issue to speak of - shifted very smoothly in all gears). I immediately knew the problem when i felt it in the new TL, since i had read about it on the forums for a couple of years.

When I set up the appointment I asked the service tech about the GM synchromesh FM (like everyone suggested) and he said I could bring it in and they would replace the factory. I bought it and took it in. Once I arrived the tech I was working with gave me the run-around saying he never heard of the problem and that they would have to drive the car and determine if there was an issue and then determine if I could have a loaner car.

I then proceeded to pull out 50 pages of printouts from this forum and read him the riot act HA HA! (actually i was very calm and respectful but demanded the "proper service"). I told him that he was not going to "feel" the problem upon inspection since I just drove the car for 15 miles to get it to the dealer and the fluid was warm now.

after I sat around for 1 hour awaiting a response they finally sent out a tech who showed me the Acura bulletin for the 3rd gear problem and said they would fix it ASAP and give me a rental car. However, they called Acura home service in California and they said that if I wanted the GM MTF fluid put in, it would void the warranty.

I had them put in the Honda MTF instead - with the mindset that if it solves the problem the way they say it should, then I will not have voided the warranty and the problem would be fixed. If not, then I would take the car back and have them put in the GM stuff.

All in all (and to answer the question originally asked) the Honda MTF fluid was a noticeable improvement over the factory MTF fluid. Although it isn’t quite as smooth as I wanted it to be, it is good enough, especially since I have not voided the warranty. The car shifts pretty smoothly into 3rd always now. However, I have yet to drive the car in cold weather. When I do, I will repost (will be a few months though, as I live in PA.

of course, i have not felt the GM MTF fluid, so i can;t compare apples to apples - i can only tell you that for me, the Honda fluid did improve/fix the 3rd geaer issue.

papiowhisperer

Yeah but, what about all that downtime?

I switched to GMS F/M, realized it was the bomb (got rid of the 3rd gear issue, etc.) switched back to the 'new' formula Honda MTF because I figured the manufacturer knows best, you know. After about 1000k miles I switched back.

Nuespeed STS, _orsport solid metal shift cable end bushings, GMS F/M oil =

buttery smooth, precise shifts. Just do it.

Steeve

Absolutely true...I read the TSB yesterday. They state that the Honda MTF has been improved and that if the tranny is showing signs of any problem, it should be replaced.
I totally agree with Brett...just change it...everyone says it fixes all problems. I'm definitely puting the GM fluid in soon...my third gear has been showing some attitude.

KN_TL

iTrader: (3)

The change to the GM fluid is felt immediately. You'll also be shocked at how shiny the existing fluid will be.

Mike 06 TL

The problem with the new improved Honda/Acura fluid is that it will feel better initially but your problems are likely to come back soon. If you read some of the other posts on this subject you'll find several people who have reported this.

Like others, I had the 3rd gear problem about 3-5 times per week for the first 12K miles on the car. Switched to the GM fluid and have not had the 3rd gear grind for THE LAST 20K miles. Proof enough for me.

Easy fix and no need to have the grease monkeys at the dealer tear into the box.

The GM fluid and the compech short shifter make this car an absolute joy to drive.

boes

What transmission filter did u use

0utl

When i 1st got my TL i had 3rd pop out a few times in the first couple months of owning it and i was really concerned that i made a mistake purchasing the car. Thanks to this sight i learned about the GM fluid changed it out and havent had it happen again and its been over 2 years now. Stuff works wonders!

BillMFD3

8 years and 100,000 miles later gm smfm

Still shifts great