Thoughts on Clutch?
 

After reading through a few different forums front to back, I feel no closer to knowing for certain the health of my clutch and related parts.

With that being said, in reference to one of the forums I've read (https://acurazine.com/forums/performance-parts-modifications-112/diy-2004-2008-3g-tl-clutch-master-cylinder-replacement-894268/), at the beginning of this post there is a YouTube video illustrating "the Clutch slipping at high RPMs", but I'm more inclined to believe it may just be an amature shift? I had the problem when I first bought my TL and was learning the ins and outs of the gearbox, but now this never happens to me (I believe I, like the person in the video, was riding or slipping the Clutch).

Also, I have a pop coming from my Clutch pedal every time I press and depress it.

Additionally, this last winter, which is also when I purchased the car, there were a few occasions where I would press the Clutch pedal in to shift, and upon release it would not depress, it was stuck to the floor, and I had to pump it or pull it back up. This hasn't happened in probably 5-6 months (I bought the car 7 months ago).

As far as clutch engagement. I do not have a low engaging clutch. 0-25% into depressing, there's little to no grab, 25-50% into depressing is where is starts to grab, with most of the grabbing/clutch action happening at 50-75%, and the last 25% (or less) is like the first 0-50%....to me this is normal, but I'm not certain seeing as my TL is the only one I've driven.

I've read some forums that made me think I needed to replace my CMC or some other part, some forums that made me think there's nothing wrong and my clutch and related parts are working normally, but I'm still not certain, and I definitely dislike the pop when pressing or depressing the clutch pedal. Thoughts and/or opinions on all or any of this would be much appreciated.
Thanks.

The TL uses a self adjusting clutch and will grip until dead. Once it starts to slip, it becomes undrivable pretty quick. How many miles on the car? The TL clutch also has a strange engagement point and is more difficult to drive smoothly than other cars. The popping sound may be the slave cylinder slipping on the clutch fork.

Read up on removing the Clutch Slave Cylinder release check valve. It has the effect of delaying clutch engagement in the name of making smoother engagement. The clutch is going to feel weird until you get that thing out, IMHO.

I've had this happen to me as well on really cold days. The clutch fluid does thicken up in cold weather, and takes some pumping and driving to warm up. From your other descriptions it does sound like you have some problems with engagement, but the sticky clutch pedal is likely due in part to the cold weather.

1) Your clutch seems fine as the engagement point is correct.

2) the pedal popping sound is a TSB, caused by insufficient clearance for the master cylinder. have to replace clutch master cylinder (i had the same issue) TSB 11-004 https://acurazine.com/forums/third-g...-016-a-613659/

3) since a bad MC can cause the pedal to not return, start by taking care of the TSB (replace MC) and then see how it performs after

One it starts to slip like shown in the video in the first link of my original post? My car does that if I don't absolutely nail the shift at redline.
Also, I tested the clutch by cruising at 45mph in 5th & popping the clutch quickly.... She didn't grip. Bounced the redline 3 times or so, so I let off....

It's been doing that since I bought it with 117,000 miles on it. The pedal first stuck pressed to the floor at 119,000 miles, did it twice I believe, but hasnt done it since then. Now she's just shy of 130,000 miles.

As for the strange clutch engagement, thanks for that immensely! Haha. I've been worried that perhaps the health of the parts were causing odd, but not what would be expected odd engagement. This car took my longer to adjust to than any other drive I've driven (89 Porsche 944S2, C5 Z06 that put down 500+, Porsche Carrera 4S, 04 Mazda V6, 2010ish Jetta, etc etc etc. I felt confused, so thank you ha.

As for the popping, that's what I've read on here, and that's been the most consistent feedback.

So in summation:
Engagement is normal.
Clutch pedal pop is most likely CMC.
Slipping at high revs with normal shifts most likely indicates that the clutch.

Yes?
Think it's the clutch plate only or the clutch system as a whole or what? At this point sounds like I should get it fixed soon, huh?

Thanks. Yeah, I did get the car from FL, single owner, and brought it back to MN the day before Christmas. It got stuck probably in 0 degree weather I'd guess, after city driving for 7-8mins....

Thanks. I had read this could be the case, but have also seen that it did not fix the problem, which surprised me.
I've read the labor can be a real bitch too and was planning on having my mechanic do it :/ Thoughts?

Read my last two responses....
Thoughts on the slipping at high revs & at cruising speed in higher gear with a clutch pop?

What do you mean by "clutch pop"? Do you mean that you're driving along, and then quickly open and engage the clutch without releasing the accelerator, and it slips? Is the accelerator all the way to the floor when you do this?

As for the MC replacement, I did it myself. I don't know how much it would cost to have a mechanic do it. You'll have to weigh the pros and cons of this decision around the circumstances of your own life lol.

Yes, correct. By "clutch pop" I mean driving along at 45mph in 5th gear (or 6th), engaging full throttle, then quickly opening and engaging the clutch without releasing the accelerator. And in doing so, the engine stays at redline.

Logically this would be due to your clutch wearing out, but I've read quite a bit stating it is the factory-defective CMC, and fixing it solved this problem.

How difficult or tedious of a job is replacing the CMC? I've heard it's not an easy task. Thoughts or opinions on that? Anything you could compare it to in terms of difficulty?

Here you go bud, you can view the procedure and decide for yourself. I did not find it to be difficult.

https://acurazine.com/forums/perform...cement-894268/

You're no where near redline at 45mph in 5th or 6th gears. And doing that at WOT is no good to your tranny or driveline. You're not going to lose much by a quick release of the throttle and then back to WOT to shift gears. You may end up losing your car if you don't though.

Mine slipped too when I first bought it. Never slipped after it was fully engaged in a gear, but always slipped when shifting at high RPMs under WOT acceleration (yes I released throttle during every shift as you should). Changing fluids, MC and removing the check valve helped, but in the end only a new clutch and FW solved the problem. Good luck.

Yeah I was reading and wondering the same thing. Don't have an MT TL, but with any MT car you should let go, if only for a moment of the throttle...

I do let off the throttle when shifting, just like with a normal shift, but the Clutch won't grab unless I'm very intentional about the transition between clutch and gas, and I mean very intentional....

Thanks. Yeah, this is actually one of the first forums I read through. The OP stated it was his third least favorite maintenance repair job he's done, behind PCD and rear camber kit.... Which to me made it sound difficult if not time consuming.

How many hours would you say it took you?

It took me several hours, but this also included deleting the clutch SC check valve, installing a braided SS clutch line, and consuming a bunch of beer with friends. give yourself a saturday and you'll be fine. take your time. don't forget to get several bottles of brake fluid because you'll need to change it/bleed the clutch too.

If anybody needs a replacement clutch kit, I definitely recommend our XLR8 kit.
XLR8 Clutch System - Excelerate Performance - Japanese and European Performance Specialists!!

http://d5otzd52uv6zz.cloudfront.net/...267d22-800.jpg

Getting to the clutch/flywheel setup is one of the more time consuming jobs, but it's fully worth it in the end, and you shouldn't have to do it very often.

Thanks. Would you day deleting the SC check valve is worth it? How about the SS line? I've done a bunch of research, but more opinions is always better :)

If you're going to do a clutch job, get the LUK kit from rockauto, $172.79. And I highly recommend you change out the flywheel, $202.99 also from rockauto while you're at it. Take it from someone whose been there and done that!
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