I hate cars

Your post did not come across the wrong way, I was not upset with it. I just get tired sometimes of having to say the same things. I understand how you can draw this conclusion, it's logical.

Eventually we will get failures on the Type F fluid especially considering many people who use it switched because the transmission was already shuddering and ready to be rebuilt. To tell you the truth, I fully expected it to fix the shudder temporarily but not as long as it has. Shudder is the last step before complete clutch failure and somehow the ones that have made the switch after experiencing the shudder are still going strong. Still though, failures are going to happen on this fluid, it's inevitable. I strongly believe if a car is run on this fluid since new, the transmission should outlast the rest of the car but that's not the case. Mine is probably one of the closest with a DexIII fluid from 20,000 miles and then the switch to Type F later on.

Personally I didn't have the guts to go with no FM until Inaccurate did it first. I knew it would not hurt the trans but I figured it would produce torque converter clutch shudder. Inaccurate deserves all the credit but I still would not have recommended this fluid unless I had personal experience in my semi-high mileage 5at. If I have any problems with it, I'm going to report them on here. I don't want anyone to have a trans failure because of what I recommended. I like the 3rd gen and I'm trying to prevent the same disaster as the 2g and that's exactly where we're headed without the switches and fluid. Honda fixed the second gear lube issue but they did NOTHING to fix the third gear clutch pack issue which was a high percentage of the total failures and this is what the switches and fluid fix.

There is one problem, the torque converters. There's not a huge failure rate but they do start shedding aluminum and eventually fail sometimes. As far as I know, there's nothing you can do to fix this. Running a great fluid might make a difference but I highly doubt it.

I think some of the fixes need to be clarified....

Switches- Fix the 2-3 and 3-4 flare/shudder/slop which greatly reduces wear. They get rid of most of the delay going into drive from park or neutral since the TL shifts to third gear for a second and then 1st gear to ease the harshness of going into gear. When the switches get out of calibration it sticks in third gear longer before going into first which gives the sensation of taking too long to engage.

Type F fluid (any type F fluid) Quickens shifts and increases clutch holding power of all gears. The fluid reduces wear each time the trans shifts gear in all gears. It seems to help with shift quality as perceived by the driver but this is not the primary purpose of this fluid. Full throttle shifts will probably be firmer in all TLs. I honestly think a trans run on this stuff from day one will never have a clutch pack failure if everything else is in good shape.

The easiest way to think of this fluid is Z1 is very slippery so when a clutch pack engages for each gear, it kind of slips into full engagement. Imagine driving a manual and after you shift into the next gear, slowly letting the clutch up after you've already hit the throttle letting the clutch slip for an extended time between gears. That's Z1. Type F would be the equivalent of a normal shift where you let out the clutch quickly without the slippage. If you knew some one was driving a manual and excessively slipping the clutch between gears, you would expect it to wear out sooner and an auto is no different except it can not tolerate clutch slip like a manual can.

Inaccurate

IHC,

Very good explanations and good analogies.

Jesstzn

Very well said ....

I run into the same in the detailing area .... called wives tales ...

Keep up the good info ...

Sandals

iTrader: (2)

IHC Acura no longer sells Z1. The new fluid is DW-1

DUHockey9

By no means am I saying you are wrong, because thanks to you I'm a believer and use Type F in my TL; however, I'm an OVERLY rational person and can't help myself from approaching every topic from all sides.

Your comment can also be applied to your (our) side of the coin as well, and perhaps that's why some people struggle to accept it. An idea is thrown out there (Type F fluid and replacing pressure switches is a fix), the rumors spread, and now it's fact. There's plenty of evidence to support it, which is why so many of us are believers. But I'm just saying, that logic can just as easily be used AGAINST Type F as it can be used for it.

</over abundant rationalism>

jda123

I am nearly positive that I will be rebuilding the tranny in my 2004 and I ditched the Z1 the first week that I got the car. Even with the Z1 out it is a bit sloppy because of the life that the car had before I got it. I will not blame the new fluid for it.

In fact, I am so sure that it will need rebuilt I already have got a parts catalog that lies in wait. I am hoping that the better fluid just delays the repair.

FWIW - I changed my fluid after 20K miles in my 2006 (in 7 months, sigh ) and there was absolutely no wear on the magnetic plug, and I use the Syn Mobile 1 Dex III. If you are scared of the Type F, then a good compromise is a Merc III with high quality base since it appears to also keep clutch wear at a minimum if judging from the plug alone (which may, or may not, be enough of an indicator for somebody to make a decision on).