I hate cars

I was already runnning late going over to a friend's house to watch the UFC tonight. I started the car and got a loud whine. It didn't sound like the usual power steering, sort of like torque converter. I ran it through the gears, power-braked, and determined it wasn't the transmission. I turned the wheel side to side and determined it wasn't the power steering. I also noticed the Navi screen had horizontal lines moving up and down.

I remembered last night as I was bedding in the brakes and running the car pretty hard that there was a slight electrical smell but with the smell of hot brakes and a very hot engine, transmission, and braking system I didn't think anything of it.

So I got my IR temp gun and shot the alternator and it was 260F at the "magnet area" in the center of the case. This is after about 3 minutes of idle run time. I left it running and got my volt meter and it had 12.5v with it running. Alternator is dead. I checked the temp one more time before shutting it off and it was 315F in another minute or two. I waited a second with the engine off to make sure it was likely a bad bearing and the stator/rotor rubbing on the housing and not an electrical problem with the battery back-feeding causing it to heat up. It started cooling off so I'm satisfied it's purely a mechanical problem. I disconnected the battery anyway. I didn't like the interference with the navi system, I can only imagine the potential havoc it might wreck on the ECU and sensors.

So the question is, has anyone run one of the rebuilt OEM Denso units? I'm 90% sure I'm going to go with a brand new unit, this car has to be reliable which brings me to the next question.... Is $325 the best I'm going to get for a new OEM alternator for this car??? That's pretty damn expensive. I found the $325 one at Delray Acura and just about everywhere else I look they're nearly $400. I posted this problem just to make sure I'm not overlooking some really cheap website where I can get it for half price.

I have a feeling $325 is going to be the best I'm going to get but I thought I would ask anyway.

I'm not totally against rebuilt as long as all bearings are replaced along with the regulator and all pertinent electronics. Basically as long as all of the wear/electronic items are replaced I would go rebuilt but my experience has been they replace just the failed part, throw some shiny paint on it and resell it for 3/4 the price of a new one.

Also for Majofo or anyone with an electronics background, any idea why/how there were issues with the navi because the alternator died? Can it supply "dirty" power from a simple failure like this? Just making sure I don't have more than one problem or something else didn't cause the failure. I had been tuning the audio system for over an hour prior with the key on and a charger to keep the battery up without running the engine.

o4Komodo

iTrader: (2)

Your alternator was probably running but sending either weak current or in fluxes of current. Sort of similar to a dying battery, where lights are dim or flickering even.

its been a while so i forgot the structure and the rebuild procedures of alternators and stators... But the repair job isn't entirely all that hard. Identify the faulty piece and replace. So, yes, odds are you wont find an alternator with new parts. Just replaced parts.

i was also lead to believe that most replacement alternators are actually rebuilt alternators too. But, that's replacement and not "brand new".

as for price, im not sure what they go for. But if you're finding it for less than the average 400 then it seems like a reasonable deal to me

3GTLCHICK

I had an Autozone brand put in my car. No issues after almost a year. $100 dollars or so...

Turbonut

iTrader: (1)

I'd agree to stay away from the run of the mill aftermarket stores as I'ver encountered many problems with their rebuilt electrical units. Although many come with a lifetime warranty, it becomes quite annoying to do replacements after a short period of time. A few years ago, I pulled a remanufactured starter apart and the housing was filled with grease and shavings, not even cleaned.

Here's a new unit from Rock Auto:
USA INDUSTRIES Part # 511500 w/ Nippondenso 130 Amp (Only 1 Remaining) $182.79 $0.00 $182.79
USA Industries Starter/Alternator Features:
All components and housings are 100% new
All units state of the art computer load tested to simulate extreme operating conditions
Graphics packaging and unit shrink wrapped for zero shipping damage
Design improvements to surpass OEM standards and amperage ratings

If you're interested, here's the 5% Discount Code:
710F1AC6FB23
Expires: 03/24/2013

RaviNJCLs

iTrader: (4)

What about finding an OEM one out of a salvage?

Turbonut

iTrader: (1)

^
Used Parts:LKQ Central CA (United)
2115 South Union Avenue
Bakersfield, CA 93307
800-832-8733
601-60941 Used Sugg. Retail: $70.00
ALTERNATOR 2005 to 2005 (3.2L, 6 cyl)

Azndjay

car-part.com

I hate cars

Awesome, thank you. I owe you one. Just bought it. Now to decide if I should put a fire extinguisher in the car and limp it around for the 1.3 mile drive to work and the 1.6 mile drive home. If it weren't for the super high alternator temps, I would charge the battery every night and drive it to work with no alternator but I'm afraid I'm going to seriously screw something up if I drive it such as a fire or having it lock up and burn the belt off. I would ride my bike the short distance to work but it would be sure death.

I didn't even think of the LKQ you listed. I practically lived at that place when I was young and broke, trying to keep the GN running. The owner would let me go in the back and pull parts myself and give me a discount, he probably felt sorry for me. I'm going to look around and see what they have as far as TLs.

johnny3

I've always the best sucess having the OEM starter/alternator units rebuilt at a rebuild shop that specializes in that only. Yours may not be rebuildable because of the heat it's been suffering but you could find a salvage one if you have the time to wait on shiping.

Turbonut

iTrader: (1)

Purchased many items from the Rock on Thursday, delivered Saturday.
Hopefully you'll get the delivery quickly.

ZOMGVTEK

Usually you can snag used OEM ones real cheap. Might be able to find one shipping close to you.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/06-07-08-HONDA-PILOT-ALTERNATOR-3-5L-6-CYL-4X4-/300865897725?pt=Motors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&fits=Make%3AAcura%7CModel%3ATL&hash=item460d0144fd&vxp=mtr
I replaced a few alternators with used OEM's and never had an issue.

I hate cars

That would be great. I charged the battery overnight to leave me the option of driving it the 1.7 or so miles to work this morning, trying not to inconvienence the fiancee. I fired it up and between the whine and the lines going through my navi I shut it off and got a ride. I hope it shows up soon. Thanks again.

Oh, almost forgot, there is some sort of backfeeding going on. I decided to clean the garage out late last night so I hooked the battery up so I could have the stereo. After about an hour I checked the alternator and it was 115 degrees and everything around it was about 65 degrees.

I hate cars

I would go the used OEM route if they could guarantee low, low miles but reliability is the most important thing so new to me is worth the additional cost. I might take my old one apart to see what the damage is and specifically if it's rebuildable maybe into a slightly higher output. My system is very efficient and most of the time it's not drawing more than 100w total but a little more headroom wouldn't hurt. I actually wish there was a way to tweak the voltage, maybe .5V extra.

I've had a whine for a long time but it got louder overnight. I'm interested to see if drivability changes. It seems like most cars have close to 14v when running and this one has been at 13.5v for a long time.

Wacker

I also use a local rebuilder. Ive known him for years and trust him implicitly. He knows I'm a gear head, so, he always has my old bearings, seals, regulators, brushes, stators etc laying out to show me what failed. I have built many myself, but getting the kits or even figuring out what kit it takes is a chore for someone like me. I've walked into his shop before and he said things like "Ok, that's gonna take a *blah blah blah* but I'm out of those and they are on back order, so I can take a bearing set out of a *blah blah blah* and brushes out of a *blah blah blah* and that regulator is pretty common so I probably have one of those laying around." His knowledge is impressive. Usually gives same day service and when he isnt busy he has pulled me around back and rebuilt things right in front of me. Electrically he can do in 5 minutes what would take me two hours of internet research followed by another two hours of labor then a week of waiting on parts that I broke in the process.

I hate cars

If I had a guy like that I would definitely go the rebuilt route. I used to have a lot of friends in the industry but I stopped racing 5 years ago and I rarely go with any of the teams anymore either. It sucks to have to pay more to know you're getting the job done right. A good rebuilder can give you a product just as good as new if not better with upgraded components. My problem is I've seen what comes from the so called bulk rebuild houses and it's pretty scary.

Wacker

As have I.

Some of them are our customers and I have to go in from time to time.....not cool.

I'm really tempted to be a dick and blame the alternator failure on the fact that you have the wrong battery in the car, but we both know that isnt the case.

ZOMGVTEK

I see an extremely stable 14.2-14.3V almost 100% of the time. The alternator field never appears to turn off under low loads on this car like it did on my Accord.

13.5V is definitely a bit suspect if the meter is reasonably accurate.

Personally, I would take my chances with a high miles used OEM over a random rebuild. Most 'remanufactured' units are probably fine, but taking it somewhere to get it rebuilt it questionable.

I hate cars

Definitely. That's why I bought a new one. Unless I had a friend doing the rebuild, I'm going new. If I could find a 20-30k used OEM alternator I would use one of those as well over rebuilt.

Legend2TL

FWIW, Bosch rebuilt units are OK for Honda/Acura's. They advertise what they replace (bearings, regulator, diodes,...) and I've used a couple. Little more expensive but worth it.

I would not get a used from the junkyard.
Also check Honda/Acura I know they do some rebuilt products, not sure about alternators.

If it smells burnt, then the field or stator may be toast and not worth rebuilding. I've replaced the alternator brushes on a handful of Honda/Acura's, they are a component you can buy (~$10) and replace.

S_O_C_O_M

i got a rebuilt from advance auto parts for 90 bucks. installed it myself several months ago and no problems what so ever. it also comes with a lifetime warranty.

Jackass

If you are getting electrical interference, it is not just a mechanical issue. The dirty power would more than likely be some AC voltages making it past the regulator and/or diode/rectifier and bigger than what can be absorbed by the battery.

I hate cars

That's what I was thinking, a bearing bad enough to cause rubbing on the housing and it's probably all junk, however....

I'm worried there's something else going on. I was thinking about AC voltage. The alternator will also get hot if I hook the battery up to it, without starting the engine. Diode???

Jackass

I don't know the entire design/setup of our alt systems, but I would assume there is some type of electrical fault within the housing if you have current flow when the engine is off. I am "assuming" the diodes and the regulator are internal on our cars and one of those is probably failed/shorted causing the heat and current draw.

I hate cars

Damnit lol. I'm second guessing myself.

Anyone know if the diode is built into the connector/harness or if it's in the alternator itself?

A bad diode causing the "dirty" power and apparent backfeeding of the alternator makes perfect sense right now. I would rather try my luck with a cheap diode first. Then again I don't want to pop the ECU or any other electronics with AC voltage.

HELP! LOL.

I hate cars

It's for sure not the bearings. As soon as I unplugged the wiring harness the noise went completely away and so did the heat. At least I can dive to work and back. I turned on every electrical accessory the car has, along with the system and it runs fine. Alt isn't putting out obviously so I'm really glad I went with the Diehard Platinum battery now. I'm just hoping one or all diodes can cause this issue.

johnny3

i'm blessed to have a competent rebuilder in my area also, old gripey guy abt. my age but has a lifetime of experience doing alt,starters with tons of parts. These cars alternators almost always are repairable, the whining seems to usually be a diode, they're all inside the case.

anx1300c

iTrader: (2)

IHC, do you think your system accelerated the demise of your alternator?

I hate cars

I doubt it. The subs and amps are extremely efficient. The one time I measured with it slightly louder than I normally listen, it was only drawing 90w total. While there's 1200w available for the front stage, that's only brief spikes during transients but the average draw is very low. My old system used to cause headlight dimming but this one never has.

I hate cars

Replaced the alternator last night and all is well again. I am impressed with the DieHard Platinum for getting me to work and back last week with no alternator.

The car seems to turn over faster than it ever has on the starter but it might be because I got used to it turning over slower than normal last week. The lights seem brighter too but that could be for the same reason.

I forgot to buy a belt. This one is dried out pretty bad but I guess I'll wait until I do the timing belt in the next few weeks.

Thanks again to those that helped.

LGcbp8

For anyone else looking for an alt or just general info I've seen oem ones for bout $300 new and $200 for oem reman. Sometimes location is more important than a small different in price of course.

I hate cars

In my case it was a $100 difference in price so it was worth the wait especially considering I'm buying another toy (another GN) and since I have to buy the car with cash $100 is well worth the wait.

ZOMGVTEK

Did you grid charge daily driving without an alternator?

I drove two vehicles without an alternator for about a week each. Both were fine for my then 50 mile roundtrip commute. I even did it a few times with headlights and traffic, but that was real sketchy once the battery was getting low. The car would be a trainwreck at high RPM.

Some people on ecomodder don't run alternators and just grid charge. It's a bit silly since the reduction in the battery lifespan will likely offset any quite minor fuel savings, and things like windows work poorly with the lower voltage. I suppose a lot of those people have roll up windows and almost no electronics anyways.

I hate cars

I agree about those guys running no alternator. I charged mine almost every day. I went a couple days without charging. In the morning the headlights were on. I eventually began playing the stereo, then bumping the stereo, then using the seat heater and eventually even the AC and no problems.

powdbyrice

IHC, did the sound coming from the alternator sound anything like this?

I hate cars

EXACTLY like that. Next time it's dead cold, start it and see if the alternator gets too hot to touch in just a couple minutes. I also had some barely noticeable lines in the navi. Not lines but "waves" as if there's noise in the system.

powdbyrice

great. well, not great, but at least i know the source.

i'll have to check the navi screen. i haven't noticed any other electrical issues, lights dimming etc.

oddly enough, the sound was not present when i drove the car today, but i'm sure it will be back.

thanks for the tips!