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Is it possible to steal our TL's using this method?

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Old 07-31-2006, 09:01 PM
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Is it possible to steal our TL's using this method?

http://www.wired.com/wired/archive/1...key&topic_set=
Old 07-31-2006, 10:23 PM
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someone want to give this one a try on theirs???
Old 07-31-2006, 10:26 PM
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Anyone see that movie, oh, what was it called..? OH! "Gone in 60 Seconds" How'd they get the key? An inside man...
Old 07-31-2006, 10:36 PM
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Sure seems likely.

From the link:

...<snip> For the past few years, Bay Area cops have pursued a ring of thieves that break into Hondas and Acuras with “jiggle” keys – keys with the teeth shaved down so they can turn the tumblers inside any car’s door lock. After the thieves gain access, they shuffle through the glove compartment and snatch the manual, where dealers – unbeknownst to many car owners – often leave an extra valet key.

<snip>
Earl Hyser, the superintendant of State Farm Insurance’s Vehicle Research Facility, told me that some transponder-equipped cars came with a secret “cheat” code designed to allow people who lose their keys to drive back to the shop.

<snip>
He called an acquaintance who worked at a Honda dealership. I listened, awestruck, as Montes fed the guy a barely credible story about a cousin who had dropped his keys down a sewer. The dealership employee was at home but evidently could access the Honda database online. I gave Honky’s VIN to Montes, who passed it along to his friend. We soon had the prescribed sequence of pulls, which I scribbled down in my notebook.

<snip>
After my second attempt, Honky’s hybrid engine awoke with its customary whisper.
Old 08-01-2006, 12:44 AM
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Originally Posted by A_UFO
From the link:
...<snip> For the past few years, Bay Area cops have pursued a ring of thieves that break into Hondas and Acuras with “jiggle” keys – keys with the teeth shaved down so they can turn the tumblers inside any car’s door lock.
Otherwise known as a screwdriver....

Originally Posted by A_UFO
From the link:
After the thieves gain access, they shuffle through the glove compartment and snatch the manual, where dealers – unbeknownst to many car owners – often leave an extra valet key.
Heh heh. I dont keep the owners manual in the glove box.... While you guys are at it, make sure you remove the card in the owners manual with the radio anti-theft code.

Originally Posted by A_UFO
From the link:
<snip>
He called an acquaintance who worked at a Honda dealership. I listened, awestruck, as Montes fed the guy a barely credible story about a cousin who had dropped his keys down a sewer. The dealership employee was at home but evidently could access the Honda database online. I gave Honky’s VIN to Montes, who passed it along to his friend. We soon had the prescribed sequence of pulls, which I scribbled down in my notebook.
Depends on the dealer. The local Pontiac dealer by my house won't even do this. When I asked about this, they said they can only do that if I present the actual title to the car. They said anything else doesn't prove legal ownership. A little strict, but I'd rather have safer rather than sorry I guess. But I have heard of the occasional dealership give a key without so much as asking for ID, but those were all hearsay.
Old 08-01-2006, 09:05 AM
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Heh heh. I dont keep the owners manual in the glove box.... While you guys are at it, make sure you remove the card in the owners manual with the radio anti-theft code.
but there is still the codes that are pasted onto the side of the glovebox
Old 08-01-2006, 09:20 AM
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meh, if they want my freakin car that bad they can have it. as longs as my family aint in it.
Old 08-01-2006, 09:41 AM
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Originally Posted by trancemission
meh, if they want my freakin car that bad they can have it. as longs as my family aint in it.
The problem is if they do get it, and the insurance company denies your claim, then your out the repairs(least) or worse if the car was completly striped and unrepairable you are out the value of the car!! Be cause the deem the car "unstealable". That is such a crock. Any one that has installed a remote start on one knows how easy it is to bypass the system.

I blame the insurance companies!!!!
Old 08-01-2006, 09:50 AM
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Originally Posted by Black_05_TL_6SP
The problem is if they do get it, and the insurance company denies your claim, then your out the repairs(least) or worse if the car was completly striped and unrepairable you are out the value of the car!!
If someone stole my car I cant imagine why my insurance wouldnt claim it.

Really though the point I was going for is, if somebody is going to go to that extreme to get your car its best to just let them take it. I know theres alot of aftermath but I would much rather go through that then sit in front of a jury trying to convince them why I capped someone...


EDIT: oh yeah, thanks for the Birthday wish my friend
Old 08-01-2006, 10:25 AM
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Scary and informative story. Insurance companies are the Devil !!!
Old 08-01-2006, 10:43 AM
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That is so damn stupid. If insurance companies are going to do this then they should offer full coverage without theft.
Old 08-01-2006, 11:00 AM
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Originally Posted by trancemission
If someone stole my car I cant imagine why my insurance wouldnt claim it.

Really though the point I was going for is, if somebody is going to go to that extreme to get your car its best to just let them take it. I know theres alot of aftermath but I would much rather go through that then sit in front of a jury trying to convince them why I capped someone...


EDIT: oh yeah, thanks for the Birthday wish my friend
I would want them to just total it out, but as the article said, the insurance company may not cover it as its seen as an unstealable car. But lord knows I wouldn't want something like this to happen with someones family in the car.

The car can be replaced, its just the hassle of going through all the work to get it taken care of. Now that I know about this, I can come up with a way to help reduce the risk of this happening. I have thought of something we can do as Honda owners to pretty much eliminate them using the factory bypass method.

Your welcome, and hope you have a great day today.
Old 08-01-2006, 12:44 PM
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When an 'unstealable' car is stolen, the insurance companies seem like they look at the owner of the car as the culprit in trying to get rid of the car (and payments) on a car they don't want or can't afford anymore.
When my friends car was stolen (and never recovered), the insurance company requested that he take a polygraph test before they pay the claim to make sure he did not assist in the theft of the car. Mind you he is a normal guy that never made a claim against his insurance, had a clean driving/criminal record and had money in his bank accounts. He had no need to get rid of his car but they still wanted him to jump throught those hoops and looked at him as a possible suspect.
Old 08-01-2006, 12:47 PM
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Originally Posted by davenlei
When an 'unstealable' car is stolen, the insurance companies seem like they look at the owner of the car as the culprit in trying to get rid of the car (and payments) on a car they don't want or can't afford anymore.
When my friends car was stolen (and never recovered), the insurance company requested that he take a polygraph test before they pay the claim to make sure he did not assist in the theft of the car. Mind you he is a normal guy that never made a claim against his insurance, had a clean driving/criminal record and had money in his bank accounts. He had no need to get rid of his car but they still wanted him to jump throught those hoops and looked at him as a possible suspect.
Thats pretty jacked up!!
Old 08-01-2006, 12:49 PM
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To get around it you can put fuel/ignition hidden kill switches in the car. I did that to one of my older cars that was really easy to steal and it worked like a charm
Old 08-01-2006, 12:55 PM
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Originally Posted by Black_05_TL_6SP
Thats pretty jacked up!!
Yeah, but typical.
Old 08-01-2006, 01:19 PM
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I will get the key cover mod and foil them all!!!!!
Old 08-01-2006, 01:21 PM
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Originally Posted by davenlei
When an 'unstealable' car is stolen, the insurance companies seem like they look at the owner of the car as the culprit in trying to get rid of the car (and payments) on a car they don't want or can't afford anymore.
There is no such thing as an "unstealable" car. How do you prevent a tow-truck from stealing your car? Just becasue the ignition is jacked up, doesn't mean they actually started the car. They could've tried then failed, than got a tow-truck, etc.

Besides... Having your valet-key in the glove-box is not negligence. You have a reasonable expectation of privacy inside your car, especially your glove box. The fact that they got the valet key is irrelevant. The main issue is that they broke into the car in the first place.

That's like saying that a burglar burgled your home, took your car keys from your bedroom, then stole your car, and the insurance claiming you were negligent for not locking your keys in a safe.
Old 08-01-2006, 01:31 PM
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The batmobile is unstealable
Old 08-01-2006, 03:49 PM
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Originally Posted by leedogg
The batmobile is unstealable
...good point
Old 08-01-2006, 06:34 PM
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Angry Secret Code = Bad Security

What I find ridiculous is that Honda/Acura have secret codes for being able to start the car without the key.

What valid scenario should allow for the safe use of the secret code to start the car? NONE!

If I call any dealership and explain how I have manage to lose my keys, the dealership should say, tow the vehicle to us so we can make replacement keys. Be prepare to show proof of identification and ownership.

Identification can be your driver's license and/or SSN. Ownership can be the registration for the license plates which you have to keep in with the car.
Old 08-01-2006, 07:16 PM
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Originally Posted by A_UFO
What I find ridiculous is that Honda/Acura have secret codes for being able to start the car without the key.
This method still requires a key copy or something that can turn the ignition cylinder on and off during the code input sequence.

And Honda is not the only manufacturer to do this.
Old 08-01-2006, 07:19 PM
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insurance companies have to pay the claim if you have lojack
Old 08-01-2006, 07:24 PM
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Did anyone notice something in the article? Geico, ESurance, Unitrin? These are discount insurance companies, no wonder they bail on the claim, you save on your premiums but get shafted on the coverage. I've never had a problem or heard of problems with State Farm.
Old 08-01-2006, 07:31 PM
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Originally Posted by mr.motoring
This method still requires a key copy or something that can turn the ignition cylinder on and off during the code input sequence.

And Honda is not the only manufacturer to do this.
Which makes a good point about there is no valid scenario to have this secret code of procedures to start the car.
Old 08-01-2006, 07:41 PM
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Originally Posted by A_UFO
Which makes a good point about there is no valid scenario to have this secret code of procedures to start the car.
Hey man, I'm not disagreeing with you, just stating the facts.
Old 08-01-2006, 08:26 PM
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Me = have lawyer on call = insurance companies not getting out of paying the bill for something that it's clearly covered for.
Old 08-01-2006, 08:48 PM
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I'm a locksmith and have been for the past 10 years. I do all the auto work for my local Honda dealerships. Personally I have never heard of this "secret code". I know that they do require a PIN code in order to program a new key (access the computer). But as far as a bypass code is concerned this is the first. I'll give my guy at the dealership a call tomorrow morning and ask him about this.
Old 08-01-2006, 09:11 PM
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not vtech... VTEC!!!
 
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Did you RTFA?

It's on the first page...

"Sally Nguyen’s Acura TL went AWOL last New Year’s Eve and was later found gutted and submerged in the Sacramento River."

Old 08-02-2006, 02:13 AM
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Originally Posted by cTLgo
Did anyone notice something in the article? Geico, ESurance, Unitrin? These are discount insurance companies, no wonder they bail on the claim, you save on your premiums but get shafted on the coverage. I've never had a problem or heard of problems with State Farm.
exactly what i was thinking
Old 08-02-2006, 05:41 AM
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Originally Posted by cTLgo
Did anyone notice something in the article? Geico, ESurance, Unitrin? These are discount insurance companies, no wonder they bail on the claim, you save on your premiums but get shafted on the coverage. I've never had a problem or heard of problems with State Farm.

Geico is far from being a discount insurance company. They are down right expensive. I personally have Progressive and save a great deal almost 1k being with them over geico.
Old 08-02-2006, 08:54 AM
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Originally Posted by JDM5lugHatch
I'm a locksmith and have been for the past 10 years. I do all the auto work for my local Honda dealerships. Personally I have never heard of this "secret code". I know that they do require a PIN code in order to program a new key (access the computer). But as far as a bypass code is concerned this is the first. I'll give my guy at the dealership a call tomorrow morning and ask him about this.
It is confirmed, I went by Honda yesterday to pic up some things from a friend there. Honda DOES have a embedded brake code on the car. He even offered to get the code for me. They will not let this information out easily, but if a thief had access to a Honda/Acura computer system, they could get it. It just requires the VIN and that is it.

Most of the staff would require you have it towed there and then require proof of ownership. This is not a hoax, this is the real deal, this method can be used to steal the car.

Jason
Old 08-02-2006, 11:45 AM
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Originally Posted by Black_05_TL_6SP
It is confirmed, I went by Honda yesterday to pic up some things from a friend there. Honda DOES have a embedded brake code on the car. He even offered to get the code for me. They will not let this information out easily, but if a thief had access to a Honda/Acura computer system, they could get it. It just requires the VIN and that is it.

Most of the staff would require you have it towed there and then require proof of ownership. This is not a hoax, this is the real deal, this method can be used to steal the car.

Jason
You are correct to an extent. I just called my contact at the dealership and he claims that this code only works on Honda's up to 2001. After 2001 the "codes" no longer apply. According to him anyways.

However, I just hung up the phone with my contacts at Acura and they verified that the bypass does exist and gave it to me. I'm gonna copy my key onto a standard keyblank and try it out.
Old 08-02-2006, 11:57 AM
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they can't have one unique sequence for every VIN. that don't make too much sense. they probably have a sequence for a batch of VINs together and just rotate them thru VIN blocks. you can't have that many different combo just using handbrake and key etc...

people that programmed this or dealership guys could probably leak them out ezly without trace back to them. well it's added security anyway. better than without....
Old 08-02-2006, 12:06 PM
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Originally Posted by ttliang
they can't have one unique sequence for every VIN. that don't make too much sense. they probably have a sequence for a batch of VINs together and just rotate them thru VIN blocks. you can't have that many different combo just using handbrake and key etc...
That may be true. Lets see, the brake code is a 5-digit number, and there are a possible 5^10 = 9,765,625 combination codes. If each Honda/Acura model gets to choose from this entire set, there might be enough.
Old 08-02-2006, 12:22 PM
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How to Steal Any Honda/Acura

Hook an old Nintento controller up to the steering column and quickly tap the following:

Up, Up, Down, Down, Left, Right, Left, Right, B, A, B, A, Start

Voila! The car starts, and you're off to the races!!
Old 08-02-2006, 12:24 PM
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^^

Only works if Konami is the maker of the transponder system. And if you need an extra life.
Old 08-02-2006, 12:48 PM
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Originally Posted by mr.motoring
^^

Only works if Konami is the maker of the transponder system. And if you need an extra life.
ahem, 30 extra lives...
Old 08-02-2006, 01:01 PM
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Originally Posted by rimz
ahem, 30 extra lives...


If you hit Select before Start, your passenger gets 30, too!
Old 08-02-2006, 01:42 PM
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Originally Posted by chill_dog


If you hit Select before Start, your passenger gets 30, too!
Don't forget about the special weapons the car gets( laser blaster, grenade launcher , etc)

This way you can take out the thieves!!!


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