PIERCE@ACURA-O.P.

Ok heres the scenario...

I was driving home from a friends house an hour ago at a reasonable speed(80ish) on a long bridge here in town. A car blows up behind me going super fast on slows on my tail. I can see the angel eyes but I think its a 535 or something-... plus i hate it when someone does this so I go to the next lane and wait for him.
Any way I downshift into third after he is behind me and floor it. I roll through third and shift at 7100 into fourth and start climbing. i look in my rearview and this guy is on me but not closing at all-as a matter of fact I am gaining distance on him. At about 120 I decide that its my race and decide to let off-as I slow down what passes me but a quad exhaust blue M3. He was driving crazy but I got him!

All you 6mt guys know what I'm saying-3rd at 80-through 4th at 130---its brutal!

Pierce

Mike

PIERCE@ACURA-O.P.

how about that mike

SergeyM

M3 with angel eyes? Or was it 535? Those diesels aren't that good at higher speeds. But diesel in Florida? Or was it the new M5? Questions, questions...

PIERCE@ACURA-O.P.

uh hum-I was ready for this-

M3

i couldn't believe it either-0-60 i lose
80-120 i win

that simple

pierce

PIERCE@ACURA-O.P.

ok so you are saying the 535 is diesel-sorry i didn't check edmunds tonite...


I meant the smaller displacement 6yl 5-series-certainly not the new m5(525??)

I thought a regular bimmer rolled up on me and most of them are SLOW-I was pleasantly surpeised that it was an M3..

Pierce

againstallodds1

Quick question, I might be wrong though. The dyno with our same set up aem cai and comptech exhaust shows our peak horsepower at around 6100 rpms. Why did you wait till 7100 to shift, by then you are losing hp.

Pure Adrenaline

iTrader: (2)

Because after you shift, you're that much closer to the peak horsepower RPM range in the next gear.




Pierce -- I actually don't doubt you. I was questioned before when I posted about a race against a silver E46 M3. He couldn't pull away from me, for who knows what reason. Anything is possible on the street, and based on your posts here, I would say you're pretty credible. So yeah, nice kill.

againstallodds1

makes sence

Pro Stock John

Nice kill, grabbing 3rd shows me you wanted it.

PIERCE@ACURA-O.P.

Exactly-

At that speed the race was gonna be in 4th gear mostly so the trade-off from shifting a little past peak power in 3rd is way offset by hitting fourth gear in a higher rpm range, rather than bogging a little and waiting for the power to come up.

I'm glad to see that another TL owner has had a similar experience! Who would have thought it was possible-Obviously the E46M3 is flat in that range???

pierce

ACCURATEin

...just wait until you throw the SC on your TL...it'll be that much nastier!

Nice job.

TCMS

right.

Mike

o come on now i was just ribbing you. as PA said any thing can happen so good kill.

as you also know all things being equal you're going to get owned with your current mods.

nikko

Pierce, don't get fooled...many people with BMW 3 series can easily customize their cars to look like an m3, they change the badge and install a new rear bumper and quad exhaust....
In any case what year do you think it was?
I had some fun on hwy a few night ago with a 2005 M3 Coupe and a 2005 Acura TL manual and while TL was behind us about 5 cl and still loosing ground ,M3 ran approx 2cl in front of me at almost 150 mph.
I was impressed about that M3, I knew they were fast but not so fast!
P.S. I own a 2005 BMW 545i.

2005 M3 is 333hp@7900rpm and 262 ft/lb@4900
Weight 3415 lb.

2005 Acura TL MT is 3500 lb and almost 80hp less.

You're still sure it was a real M3 and not a decoy?

Pure Adrenaline

iTrader: (2)

Man, you can magazine race all day you want, but the bottom line is that anything is possible on the street. Shit happens. This doesn't mean all TLs can beat all M3s now. Relax.

TCMS

I dont get the point of even posting this.

I can say I beat a porsche 911 turbo and blame the driver, but what is the point?


The m3 is a low 13 second car, the , at best 14.0. Come on now.

blktl1

Hey I raced one about 2 months ago. I beleive him cause whe I raced him the m3 got a jump but did not pull and I was able to stay neck and neck with him. That was before my exhaust and my pulley i dunno about now.

nikko

I was talking from a pure pefromance perspective. You're right, there are some people out there owning M3s even M5s and don't know how to drive them.

PIERCE@ACURA-O.P.

You are correct-the M3 is a full second faster in a quarter mile run from 0mph. I am well aware of an M3's performance numbers as I was considering buying one.
The only point in posting this is that I was able to pull on a car that many(including myself) would argue that could not be done in a TL. I have raced a couple M3's from a dead stop before and they have obvoiusly beaten me-however I think many who post in the racing and cometition forum are interested in knowing that a TL was able to beat one in that speed range.

And as far as your 911 Turbo analogy...This was on a staight road with 1 gear change only-how much driver error could there be?? BTW a TL vs 911 tubo is quite a bit more lop-sided than M3 vs TL.

Hey Nikko-Laguna Seca Blue-I believe only M3 comes in that color-plus the quad exhaust-I am very sure this was an M3. I have friends that own them plus I have been in the car business for 14yrs and can judge a car at a distance-I even knew it was a bimmer as it rolled up behind me(didn't know model)-so I def knew what it was as it rolled by when I slowed down.

pierce

PIERCE@ACURA-O.P.

one more point and then I'm done-

M3 @ 333 hp is old hp rating
Tl @ 270hp is old hp rating+injen cai+ comptech exhaust=288+/- (beltronics fx2 meter rated my car at 294hp and 5.42 0-60)

so its not 80hp difference more like 45 or so. just wanted to clarify this.

Pierce *takes asbestos suit off and gets a beer*

Pure Adrenaline

iTrader: (2)

Here ya go, Pierce. Try this one on next time. Three layers of Nomex for maximum flaming prevention.

http://www.saferacer.com/alstgpproras.html

brahtw8

I traded a 2005 TL/6MT for a 2003 M3. My TL is considerably slower than my M3, at any speed, whether 0-60 or 80-140. My M3 is roughly equal to my NSX, which was also considerably faster than my TL, particularly at higher speeds.

Anything can happen on the street, so I am not going to call BS or flame, but it would be a mistake to conclude this is going to be the typical result when a TL and E46 M3 meet on the road.

ICBW. YMMV.

ccasmoe00

I wanted to call BS too but who knows what the Driver in the M3 was smoking that night. I cant see a TL pulling on an M3 but I also don't know how good both drivers are at going through the gears. M3's are fast as hell.

Anyway's, congrats on the your two nice ass rides(M3 & NSX).

nikko

Didn't know you have so many mods. Anyway nice kill considering how fast M3 is.

blueglows

hey i dont get it...i had a tl as a loaner and those things feel so much slower then my cl...then to clarify it i raced a member from this board with a tl 4 days ago and i won by like 3-4 cars??? i dont get it how is that possible by the way i had the mods listed below

Pure Adrenaline

iTrader: (2)

Automatic is considerably slower than the manual TL.

What year CL and what kind of mods?

nikko

Based on 14 years experience whta year do you think that M3 was?

nikko

M3 is 333hp old rating and stays the same for new SAE rating.
TL was 270hp old rating and is 258 SAE rating.
So your car is actually 282hp (including mods) which is 51hp less for almost the same weight.
In addition M3 gearing is much more aggresive than on TL.
Obviously that dude that was driving the M3 didn't have a clue how to race you!

brahtw8

Looking at the description of the encounter, I do not believe a race occurred (to the extent you can call any of these encounters 'races').

This is what I believe happened:

You had an M3 behind you. You hit the gas and the M3 followed you, but didn't pass you. You believe the M3 was not fast enough to pass and in fact was losing ground to your TL, but the most reasonable explanation is that he chose not to pass you and then simply pulled a flyby after you thought you won a race.

PIERCE@ACURA-O.P.

01 or newer E46

PIERCE@ACURA-O.P.

nikko-I don't want to get in a debate over which car has more power or is faster-I realize the M3 has more power and is a faster car...My last car was a 99 911(996) and that is very comparable speed wise to the E46 M3..I was simply sharing my experience with other TL owners.

the 333hp rating is "SAE net" rating(old rating)
the tl at 258 hp is "SAE net(revised 08/04)" this new formula for calculating horepower was adopted by Acura Before it is required by all manufacturers. In any event the old hp rating of a tl is 270 and an M3 is 333. plus you are being a little conservative on the bump for cai + exhaust. There is a dyno before and after on here(tl.com) of a TL with just those two mods and it is more than +12hp as I recall. There are many threads regarding the hp change for 06 for more clarity.

pierce

PIERCE@ACURA-O.P.

no-here's what did happen

an m3 came up on me on a 4 lane bridge in the far right lane at 120 or so-slammed on brakes cause we got boxed in-then i go in front of the car in the lane to my left and pull ahead of him and wait for the bimmer to get behind me. (keep in mind there are two lanes to the left of us the bimmer could pass me on) i am in third gear at 70+-i floor it and see the bimmers headlights tilt up-i roll through fourth gear on the bimmer is right with me but losing ground very slowly-at 120ish i shut it down-the bimmer goes by at 130++(so yes it was a race)

heres a few possible scenarios-
1.he was not in a low enough gear at the start
2.he had 4 people in the car
3.he didn't get the memo that an M3 should have kicked my ass

????
please don't get so up in arms-its not that big a deal-here's one that will really irritate you...

before my porsche my car was a 94 nsx. the ONLY race I ever lost was to a CAVALIER!!! this guy was on my tail at an onramp and i thought i'd shake him--I didn't and when we got on the expressway he pulled beside me and we both went wide open and he pulled distance on me from 60-110 or so..I was so shocked that I made him pull over at the next exit so I could see what was going on--and you guessed it-massive turbo and nos.

anything can happen on the street.

pierce

brahtw8

Nothing in your story disproves my theory. It is a reasonable explanation.

Nobody is up in arms here. I stated my opinion. Nothing more, nothing less.

PIERCE@ACURA-O.P.

agreed. i'm sure there will be several m3's lookin for me at the track next time! payback will be a bitch i'm sure...

Pro Stock John

I think that the M3 guy probably didn't grab a lower gear was suprised to find that he could not reel you in. When I raced a 99 M3 a while back, I put a bunch of cars on him if I was aggressive and downshifted AND took every gear to redline. If I didn't, we were even he might have even pulled on me a little.

I have a low 9 second car and I know when folks are racing me on the street. I've killed a lot of cars in my 6MT TL.... car is awesome from a roll.

Actuary

I trust your story, pierce.

I mean anything can happen on street. You miss your gas pedal by 2/10th of second and you are already behind.

People said it's impossible for me to beat old 540i AT, now there are other members on this board have beaten one. My next kill is going to be E90 330i AT if I can find one.

03Sheermax

Forget about the SAE crap. Lets go BY WHP, an M3 puts down roughly 280 RWHP, I can't imagine a TL 6-spd putting down more than 230 FWHP, thats a 50 HP difference, when you figure in gear ratio's, forget about it, M3 owns the TL. A kill is a kill, but in this case either the guy doesn't know what he's doing, or he wasn't trying. All things being equal(driver and conditions), only way I see a TL owning a STOCK M3, is by FI

Ryons02TLTypeS

New M5.... ummmmm yea right..... I LOVE my Type-S, but i would take a 500HP V10 anyday.......

av6ent

Yep, that M3 driver is either didn't know what he was doing or he was on the phone . So you beat the driver not the car.

Typically, M3 with a decent driver will get you destroyed anytime, anyday, anywhere. And 70+mph is E46 strongest powerband from where he pulls like mother fu<ker all the way.