Originally Posted by Dafried

However, which one of these filters should I use? Dealers cost $5.19 and Fram cost $9. I could care less about $4 if there is any difference.

Thanks in advance,

David

Originally Posted by Road Rage

I tried to edit my last post to clarify, but had timed out. So here goes:

The salient point here is that if the bypass valve in the oil filter is not properly indexed to the engine it is used it, it could open prematurely, allowing unfiltered oil to flow, or fail to open when needed, leading to a burst filler, a damaged filter medium,or driving external oil leaks, Or all at once in a Big Bang event.

The oil pump pressure regulating valve, usually built into the oil pump, helps control the operating pressure of the lubrication system. The regulating valve is set by the manufacturer to maintain the correct pressure. The valve utilized a ball (or plunger) and spring mechanism. When the operating pressure is below the preset PSI level, the spring holds the ball in the closed position so that oil flows to the bearings under pressure. When the desired amount of pressure is reached, the valve opens enough to maintain this pressure. Once the valve is open, the pressure remains fairly constant, with only small changes as the engine speed varies. If the oil pressure regulating valve becomes stuck in the closed position or slow to move to the open position after the engine has started, the pressure in the system will exceed the regulating valve setting. This may cause an over-pressurized oil filter. If a deformed oil filter is observed, the oil pressure regulating valve must be serviced immediately.

Relief (By-Pass) Valve. In a full flow system, all the oil passes through the filter to reach the engine. If the filter clogs, an alternative route to the engine must be provided for the oil, or the bearings and other internal parts may fail, due to oil starvation. A relief, or by-pass, valve is used to allow unfiltered oil to lubricate the engine. Unfiltered oil is far better than no oil at all. This relief (by-pass) valve is built into the engine block in some cars. Otherwise, the relief (by-pass) valve is a component of the oil filter itself. Under normal conditions, the valve remains closed. When there is sufficient contaminant in the oil filter to reach a preset level of pressure differential to oil flow (around 10-12 PSI in most passenger cars), pressure differential on the relief (by-pass) valve caused it to open. This condition can occur when the oil filter has become clogged or when the weather is cold and the oil is thick and flows slowly.

Anti-Drainback Valve. Some oil filter mountings may allow oil to drain out of the filter through the oil pump when the engine is stopped. When the engine is next started, oil must refill the filter before full oil pressure reaches the engine. The anti-drainback valve, included in the filter when required, prevents oil from draining out of the filter. This anti-drainback valve is actually a rubber flap that covers the inside of the inlet holes of the filter. When the oil pump starts pumping oil, the pressure will unseat the flap. The purpose of this valve is to keep the oil filter filled at all times, so when the engine is started there will be an almost instantaneous supply of oil to the engine.

Originally Posted by tman

There's a good reason why Honda put a smaller filter for the 3G. I remember a post by a 3G owner that he had oil all over his right front wheel and surrounding area. He put on a the larger size filter, but the filter was damaged when he hit a big pothole or something and the upper A arm hit the filter. After changing my oil recently, the A arm is really close. Something to think about.

Originally Posted by deandorsey

his recommendation would be for you to use the stock acura filter.

Originally Posted by DarkWraith33

Gonna let this one go I assume?! I'll be getting the items I need for my oil change soon. Gonna go with Mobil 1 10w30 along with the M1-110 or Purolator filter. I know Pep Boys has the Purolator one. (I am not sure if it is bigger or the same size as the stock filter. Anyone know?)

Mods? This seems to be the useable oil filter list for the 3G TL... Or at least from the info I can muster from here and there. Throw it in the garage for reference???

Originally Posted by DarkWraith33

So the going list so far:

15400-PLM-A01 (Stock Filter - Filtech made)
15400-PLM-A02 (Stock Filter - Fram made)
15400-PCX-004 (Someone had this listed as OK)
Mobil 1 #M1-104 (Oversized from stock)
Mobil 1 #M1-110 (Same size as stock)
Purolator PureONE PL14610 (Just checked PepBoys: $5.99)
Hastings LF-386
Wix 51334
Fram 6607
Fram 7317

Also, I THINK there is a crush washer that is needed as well... Anybody have a part number or any other info on that???

Originally Posted by Road Rage

I tried to edit my last post to clarify, but had timed out. So here goes:

The salient point here is that if the bypass valve in the oil filter is not properly indexed to the engine it is used it, it could open prematurely, allowing unfiltered oil to flow, or fail to open when needed, leading to a burst filler, a damaged filter medium,or driving external oil leaks, Or all at once in a Big Bang event.

The oil pump pressure regulating valve, usually built into the oil pump, helps control the operating pressure of the lubrication system. The regulating valve is set by the manufacturer to maintain the correct pressure. The valve utilized a ball (or plunger) and spring mechanism. When the operating pressure is below the preset PSI level, the spring holds the ball in the closed position so that oil flows to the bearings under pressure. When the desired amount of pressure is reached, the valve opens enough to maintain this pressure. Once the valve is open, the pressure remains fairly constant, with only small changes as the engine speed varies. If the oil pressure regulating valve becomes stuck in the closed position or slow to move to the open position after the engine has started, the pressure in the system will exceed the regulating valve setting. This may cause an over-pressurized oil filter. If a deformed oil filter is observed, the oil pressure regulating valve must be serviced immediately.

Relief (By-Pass) Valve. In a full flow system, all the oil passes through the filter to reach the engine. If the filter clogs, an alternative route to the engine must be provided for the oil, or the bearings and other internal parts may fail, due to oil starvation. A relief, or by-pass, valve is used to allow unfiltered oil to lubricate the engine. Unfiltered oil is far better than no oil at all. This relief (by-pass) valve is built into the engine block in some cars. Otherwise, the relief (by-pass) valve is a component of the oil filter itself. Under normal conditions, the valve remains closed. When there is sufficient contaminant in the oil filter to reach a preset level of pressure differential to oil flow (around 10-12 PSI in most passenger cars), pressure differential on the relief (by-pass) valve caused it to open. This condition can occur when the oil filter has become clogged or when the weather is cold and the oil is thick and flows slowly.

Anti-Drainback Valve. Some oil filter mountings may allow oil to drain out of the filter through the oil pump when the engine is stopped. When the engine is next started, oil must refill the filter before full oil pressure reaches the engine. The anti-drainback valve, included in the filter when required, prevents oil from draining out of the filter. This anti-drainback valve is actually a rubber flap that covers the inside of the inlet holes of the filter. When the oil pump starts pumping oil, the pressure will unseat the flap. The purpose of this valve is to keep the oil filter filled at all times, so when the engine is started there will be an almost instantaneous supply of oil to the engine.

Originally Posted by DarkWraith33

So the going list so far:

15400-PLM-A01 (Stock Filter - Filtech made)
15400-PLM-A02 (Stock Filter - Fram made)
15400-PCX-004 (Someone had this listed as OK)
Mobil 1 #M1-104 (Oversized from stock)
Mobil 1 #M1-110 (Same size as stock)
Purolator PureONE PL14610 (Just checked PepBoys: $5.99)
Hastings LF-386
Wix 51334
Fram 6607
Fram 7317

Also, I THINK there is a crush washer that is needed as well... Anybody have a part number or any other info on that???

Originally Posted by Road Rage

http://www.shoclub.com/lubrication-o...n-oilpart1.htm

You didn't do your homework. I know all about external oil pressure regulation - but consider that this is a closed-loop SYSTEM, and various components affect operating parameters. Read what the SHO guy measured.
See where the pressure dropped all of a sudden on the abover post - this would not at all be related to the oil pressure reulator, but to a separate mechanical entity. Since the relief valve in the filter does most assuredly regulate flow, using a filer designed for a different application is problematic - I do not know if the PCX filter is right, nor does the dealer. Just because a filter "fits", does not guarantee its fitness for an application.

Someone PM'ed me last night, and I asked him to do some actual legwork, and find out the PSI rating of the TL and S2000 filters - then we can have a good mental sparring. Until then, I do not recommend the PCX fiolter except for the S2000, nor does Honda, according to the engineer i contacted at Honda Eng'g in Cali this afternoon. Consider that the RPM range of the PCX is 8200-9000 depending on whether it is an F22C or F20C.

Let's keep level heads and do the work before we jump into the fire. OK?

RR.

Originally Posted by sqzbox

Ac

In actuality, your oil system is not a closed loop system as your sump is at atmospheric pressure (actually most of the time a slight negative pressure because the PVC valve vents to your intake manifold).

You are correct the pressure regulating valve is there to control the MAXIMUM oil pressure so that the pump, being a positive displacement pump that can generate very high pressures (as in hundreds of pounds per square inch) won't damage something or blow the oil filter apart (usually the weakest link).

You are also correct in that the oil filter by-pass valve setting is critical because if it is too low, it can prematurely allow unfiltered oil to by-pass the filter recirculating crud to your engine.

However, the size of the oil filter doesn't control your oil pressure, it contributes to the pressure drop through your engine from the pump back to the sump. A larger oil filter will have a lower pressure drop at any given flow rate than a smaller one. Conversely, at any given pressure drop a larger oil filter will allow more oil flow rate.

Your oil pump doesn't run at a constant speed and being a positive displacement pump, the faster it runs, the more oil it wants to pump through the engine. The more oil that pumps through your engine/filter the higher the presure drop. To keep the pressure drop from getting too high (remember that positive displacement thing), the pressure regulating valve will open and dump oil back to the sump.

You oil pump has to supply adequate flow even at idle RPM, so it is oversized from a flow perspective. Therefore, at almost any speed above idle, the pressure regualting valve is open dumping oil back to the sump.

Since the larger filter has a lower pressure drop, the oil flow through the engine will increase before the pressure regulating valve opens. More oil flow is a good thing.

Originally Posted by chas22

I have cut apart several oil filters Fram, Honda Fram, Honda Filtech, Nippon, Purolator, Napa Gold 1334 the older style large one, and Wix 51334 (same as napa gold). The smaller filters are Napa Gold 1356 or Wix 51356. The Napa Gold or Wix are far better than the Honda Fram or Filtech. The larger filter did come out on the my wifes 04 Tl and also my 04 Honda pilot. I have used the smaller one but given the choice I use the larger one. I usually buy a case of filters at a time and the same filter fits all my cars. The 04 TL, 04 Pilot, 99 Accord 4cy, 2000 Accord 6cy & 95 Acura Integra. Cut some filters open and look at the proof. One note on the Purolator One, If you cut this filter apart look at the media thickness. It's almost double. Looks like it could be restrictive under the right conditions.

Originally Posted by antlive

K&N vs Mobile 1? Which IYO is better? I have used K&N for the past 4yrs. I put 200k on my 2nd gen TL using K&N and had no issues. Just trying to see if I should change. Also, I only changed the filter ever 2 oil changes.

Originally Posted by avs007

They are probably very similar, since they are both made by Champion Labs.

Originally Posted by 01tl4tl

The physical differances in the k&n merit its use IMO
round o-ring seal that is lubricated from the inside makes good seal and easy to remove filter later.

Originally Posted by 01tl4tl

1 inch nut welded on the end- how easy can you make an oil filter to remove!
most peoples big complaint- getting a grip a regular filter or fitting tool in there.

Originally Posted by 01tl4tl

The filter material/amount and mainly the type of resins/amount of resins used as capture agent are the other differances between M1 and K&N
Information based on websites,useage of product, reading azine and pulling truthiness from thin air

Originally Posted by kosh2258

They changed the listing at AutoZone because it was referencing the M-110 for both the 3.2 TL and 3.0 Accord. The M-110 is the same size as the factory filter and it does fit. I bought that filter at AutoZone and it's currently on my car. I have no idea why they changed, but the M-104 is the larger size like the older style Honda filter that was in use.

I'm not going to lose any sleep over it.