TL-Rocket

Hey folks,

I just replaced my timing belt. Everything went well. I just did a big write-up on it and somehow on this site all of my narrative was lost. There were some interesting tricks and shortcuts and precautions. If you want to know -just ask. I don't have the energy right now to type everything again.

Thank you,
TL-Rocket

'04 TL 6MT 107,500 Miles

estevens636

My TL is now at over 95000 miles.. Time for a timing belt, i'm sure. Would you mind passing on the tips? Is this something best to get done at the dealership? ThX

mmade22

Great to hear you did it yourself and all is well. Great job and I'm always intereseted in threads like this. I should be getting my third timing belt this Fall when I hit the 220,000 mark. Nice!

BostonSilverTypeS

wow 220,000, u do some serious driving...nice!!

Yonkers914

iTrader: (1)

I though you change the timing belt every 100k how come your getting a third one at 220k? Is it nessercary to change it more often as the miles past 100k?

TL-Rocket

Some of the things to take note of as well as some tricks:
(Please note that this job does require some experience. I take no responsibility for any misfortune you may encounter.)
1) Removing the crankshaft pulley - We don't know how or with what Honda
tightened the crankshaft pulley bolt, but it is TIGHT!! If you have access to a 3/4" impact gun then use that. We didn't so we used a breaker bar and socket and attached that to the crankshaft pulley bolt. We then let that rest against the front drive shaft (with some padding). We gave the ignition key a quick touch and just like that the bolt broke free (starter motor generates over 1.25 horsepower at incredible torque).

The next tips will follow......

TL-Rocket

i_love_cars

iTrader: (1)

It would be incredibly helpful to have any information regarding your experience with this.

I'm at 89k and am expecting to do my timing belt soon - I've already been in the crank pulley as I swapped it for an unorthodox UDP, but if there are any caveats with the timing belt install that you ran into already that others should know about, we'd very much appreciate it.

TL-Rocket

Some of the things to take note of as well as some tricks:
(Please note that this job does require some experience. I take no responsibility for any misfortune you may encounter.)
2) When it comes time to remove the old timing belt, take your time. Be sure that the engine is at TDC for the #1 piston. The marks should align at the crankshaft pulley, the front cylinder bank camshaft pulley and the rear cylinder bank camshaft pulley. In addition to this, you should place two additional marks at each location using some sought of marker (flourescent finger nail polish is great). On the belt mark the valleys and on the pulley mark the peaks. You shouldn't rely just on the TDC markings. The reason for this is because after removing the old timing belt the rear camshaft will reposition itself as TDC #1 is not a natural resting place for it. Now take the old belt and match it up with the new belt fastening them to each other with a pair of thin vise-grips (not so tightly that you damage the teeth of the belt). Now transfer the markings from the old belt to the new belt. After you've cleaned up the pulleys (and replaced the water pump, tensioner pulley, tensioner and idler pulley) it is time to install the new timing belt. Place the belt over the pulleys matching up the markings. Note that because the rear camshaft pulley has moved you will have to turn it back to make it line up... Turn it back in the opposite direction it turned - when it turned on its own before it stopped because the valves made contact with the piston crown (KEEP ThIS IN MIND). Once the belt has been mounted - verify that all the marks line up at TDC. Also, when you place the belt on the rear camshaft pulley you will want to use a miniclamp to make sure it stays there.
After you have verified that everything is correctly in place, manually rotate the engine (large ratchet on crankshaft pulley) at least 2 times. Verify that the TDC markings still line up. The precautions I state here are necessary for all "J" series Honda engines.

TL-Rocket

i_love_cars

iTrader: (1)

Thanks for the post, and for anyone reading this that may not know, TDC = Top Dead Center.

djbonsu

iTrader: (3)

by third timing belt, im pretty sure he is making reference and including the original timing belt that came with the car. these are the intervals the belt should be changed at i believe ---> 1)0-105k miles 2)105k-210k miles 3)210k-315k miles

Majofo

damn.. I remember when you broke the 100k mark.

mmade22

Ding ding ding! Correct... The first one was on Acura..

Majofo- I will have 180k on it by Saturday.


OP- Great thread.

FooFooTheSnoo

Great tips.

Just curious, What are the pros and cons of not replacing these three parts? I understand replacing the water pump - not too pricey, you're in there anyway, etc. But from a purely cost standpoint, replacing these three parts would almost double my (online, wholesale) part cost. Granted that would still be cheaper than labor at a mechanic or dealer.

The manual states to replace the idler pulley bolt, not the actual pulley.

So I'd love to hear your rationale.

Thanks!

FooFooTheSnoo

Oh, by the way here’s a great place for a crank pulley tool to assist with the crank pulley bolt removal. http://www.denlorstools.com/home/dt1...48796&x=32&y=8

There’s a decent video on the site showing how to use it (although they do use multiple extensions (bad?) ).

Maybe it’ll save the starter motor?

FooFooTheSnoo

...sorry I'm new to posting!

I have an '05 TL 6MT SSM with about 107K and the B4 is due per the MID. So I'll be undertaking this process soon.

Majofo

^ That's way too expensive IMO.. you can usually rent or borrow the tool from a local part store or shop.

FooFooTheSnoo

MAJOFO, that's a great idea. I didn't even consider "tool loan" from an auto parts store. DOH! It's Murphy's Law, because I already bought it in preparation for the job.

Live and learn.

Majofo

It's okay definitely not a murphup.. I'm sure if you sold it, you could recoup your costs.. just make sure you get at least a 3 foot breaker bar, another guy and a strong boy to help you.. lol. Most shops just use a bad ass impact wrench.

01tl4tl

if you drive in `severe service` conditions according to the owner book- the tbelt time cuts down to 60kmiles

you should replace the tensioner and all roller/idler pullies and the water pump!
When one of those fail- and it will- the belt breaks and valves get bent-
3000 dollars minimum damage

01tl4tl

a new zine sponser- wholesalepartsguy has complete package with both belts-pullies-pump-etc for just under 300 shipped!

Its everything they use on the tbelt/wp job at santa rosa ca acura dealer

jpoole

I thought I could rent one too but all the local parts houses were clueless about what I wanted and the ones that knew said I had order it because they don't stock them!
I bought mine online but I have 3 vehicles that have a "J" so no biggie.

jpoole

Both my Pilot and Odyssey auto tensioners showed signs of leakage so that's why I replaced those. The Idler and tensioner pulleys are just bearings with a wide flat outer ring that ride on the backside of the belt. I figured since I was there and the mind blowing number of times those bearings have rotated in 105K miles that it was just insurance.

subinf

Good work. What was the most difficult aspect? I'm not too worried about the crank bolt b/c I'll be at a shop.

TL-Rocket

Hey Guys,

Just a note on removing the crankshaft pulley......

The best way is to borrow someone's 3/4" impact wrench (the kind they use on heavy trucks). Short of that you probably don't want to use the special Honda tool, as the shop where I did my work as well as a couple of Honda dealers reported that the tool actual chipped the crankshaft pulley. The crankshaft pulley is actually pretty poorly cast. So lacking a 3/4" impact wrench, and a desire to purchase a new crankshaft pulley as well as not having an hour (plus or minus) to mess around with breaker bars and cheaters, I used the "official" shop starter motor method (which I detailed above). This method took all of about 90 seconds. By the way, this bethod works because our Acura J32A3 engine turns "clockwise" and the crankshaft pulley bolt is a regular right-hand thread.

TL-Rocket

pimpin-tl

This does not work all the time. As we did this on a friends TL-S and all it did was made the starter stop. Maybe his battery was weak? But either way it wouldn't pop it off with that method or a IMPACT gun I had with full PSI. We had to use a shop I know which had to heat the bolt to red hot, then hit it with a impact gun and it came right off.

TL-Rocket

No matter what you have to do (but you've already done it) heating a bolt like that in that location (crankshaft) can cause all kinds of other problems. Better to rent a large 3/4" impact wrench (heavy truck size).
And yes, the battery on my car is fresh - it turns the engine over so fast you'd swear that it had no compression..... The Optima Red cell is great!!

TL-Rocket

pimpin-tl

We used the biggest IMPACT they had at that shop and it was a big one at first, and it wouldn't take it off.

Heating the bolt itself is a old trick which worked fine and would not cause any issues as there is nothing else around it that will have a issue. There is a seal, and you just don't hit the seal and concentrate on just the bolt.

jpoole

I personally do not like the idea of my crankshaft throws being hammered against unpressurized rod inserts which is why I would not use an impact. With the holding tool and a large breaker bar, the two I have removed have not been too bad. Just be sure you don't remove the motor mount first and don't use extensions.

dohcvtecsi

220k..what oil u running?

tsill

doing this now. waiting on the holder tool to come in as no one has it in my area. i have a question about the timing marks. when i line up the crank pulley white mark with the arrow on the lower cover the front cam is dead on tdc and the rear cam is a little to the right of the mark. just barely but its noticable. also, if im pulling the crank pulley why does it have to be at tdc? it seems if i'm doing the timing belt that i will set the crank gear at tdc anyway so why doesnt the manual just say to pull the crank pulley and then set to tdc?

KN_TL

iTrader: (3)

I've done this on both my TL and Pilot with no problems. Just used the jackstand method and extensions to bring it outside the fender so I could use a pipe on the bar.

I think the pulley tool is a must. I just wedged mine on the lower control arm held in place with a clamp.

I also changed the auto tensioner but now that I know how easy it is, I don't think I would do it again unless it was leaking. Compressing it with a bench vise was easy. It was harder to pull the pin!

The other thing I noticed is that when I put in a new belt, the old belt must have been stretched or the front bank moved because I was one tooth off when I put everything back together, even though I had everything at TDC before I disassembled.

tsill

so how did u put it back together? move the cam gear back to tdc mark on the engine?

it seems there are two instances that would make the belt off a tooth

1. impact gun
2. rear cam rotating at tdc as o.p. mentioned

i'm trying to figure out what to do at this point. should i set the cam gear to tdc mark on the engine or put it back the way it is. i didnt have any running issues but it seems the rear cam is of just a bit. of course the front cam could be off and the rear could be fine. i haven't removed the belt yet and i'm just not sure what the best solution is short of pulling the valve covers and checking valve lift?

tsill

so i have all my marks lined up now but have a question about my rear cam contacting the piston a couple times. just like tl-rocket said the rear cam is just about to come unsprung when it is at tdc so when i was putting the belt on it rotated to the rear. i used a ratchet to move back to tdc and when installing the belt this time it rolled to the front. not when i say rolled, for anyone that is doing this for the first time, it actually snaps to the front. BANG. so that happened to me 2x!

can someone give me some reassurance that the spring pressure on the valves isnt enough to hurt the valves or pistons when this happens? i am hoping that it would only be significant when the engine was running. i'm putting this together now and would like to make sure it's o.k. or at least should be o.k.

jpoole

The "bang" you heard was an opened valve going closed. The springs close the valves, not open them. You're fine .

tsill

thanks for that. i appreciate it. it proves a point that you really need to think things through and then understand them before you make big mistakes. so even if the cam rocked forward the valves are closing? i need to research the timing of the engine... sad to think i'm putting on a timing belt and didn't look at a manual to see how the j motor operates.

1fsthatch

dont bash yourself we learn from out fcuk ups lol

jpoole

At least one of them was trying to close. That is what "pushed" the camshaft. There was at least one just coming off the top of the lobe(valve wide open) which is where the spring is compressed the most and since the lobe is tapered it doesn't mater which way the cam rotated the valve will close. It's pretty much the same with any 4-stroke engine.

Are you back on the road yet?

tsill

not yet. timing belt is on marks line up perfect so i should be good there. i was putting the accessory belt on and chipped a piece of it off. that thing is made outta fuzz or something. never seen a belt so soft.

right now i'm trying to figure what to do with these xlr8 engine mounts i got. i'm putting the side mount on and it seems like the factory bolts are gonna be too short for the factory bracket. the xlr8 mount takes up extra threads if i sandwich it between the two factory brackets to hold it down.

i either need longer bolts or decide if 1/2 inch of threads is good enough to hold it. thanks for all the help.

killarssm

damn that once F**k things i like about an acura, an acura tl third t-belt and 220k stills on the road? that epic.

dmdk

Good job. Cant wait for pics/description.