Do 04-08 TL Type S Six speeds have LSD
Do 04-08 TL Type S Six speeds have LSD
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02-11-2009, 07:54 AM
#8
Race Director
iTrader: (1)
Hold on let's this straight, because the title and the first post contradict.
ALL 6SPD 04-08 TLs have LSD? Or just Type-S 6SPD?
I thought when buying the car that the 6spd have LSD. So far no one has confirmed that to me. I mean, it def pulls to one side when floored.
ALL 6SPD 04-08 TLs have LSD? Or just Type-S 6SPD?
I thought when buying the car that the 6spd have LSD. So far no one has confirmed that to me. I mean, it def pulls to one side when floored.
02-11-2009, 08:57 AM
#10
Senior Moderator
iTrader: (1)
All 04-06 6MT TL's have LSD.
All 07-08 TL-S w/ MT have LSD.
Hope that is clear enough.
All 07-08 TL-S w/ MT have LSD.
Hope that is clear enough.
02-11-2009, 09:17 AM
#11
Instructor
Seriously though, isn't VSA basically a form of LSD? my 6 spd (non typeS) pulls to one side when I accelerate hard but if one wheel starts slipping VSA activates and slows down that wheel (I believe it actually applies the brakes). VSA works great in the snow or on ice but I am not aware that the TL has a true limited slip differential. Correct me if I'm wrong, please!
02-11-2009, 09:29 AM
#12
Race Director
iTrader: (1)
^^ hahaha, I was thinking the same thing LOL
Seriously though, isn't VSA basically a form of LSD? my 6 spd (non typeS) pulls to one side when I accelerate hard but if one wheel starts slipping VSA activates and slows down that wheel (I believe it actually applies the brakes). VSA works great in the snow or on ice but I am not aware that the TL has a true limited slip differential. Correct me if I'm wrong, please!
Seriously though, isn't VSA basically a form of LSD? my 6 spd (non typeS) pulls to one side when I accelerate hard but if one wheel starts slipping VSA activates and slows down that wheel (I believe it actually applies the brakes). VSA works great in the snow or on ice but I am not aware that the TL has a true limited slip differential. Correct me if I'm wrong, please!
02-11-2009, 10:44 AM
#15
Drifting
It is a front-wheel drive car with a decent amount of power. It will always pull to one side when floored. Welcome to torque-steer my friend. 
As for VSA? Not really a LSD, but more of a lets keep wheel spin under control. I turned off VSA in the snow the other day and both fronts spin easily. In my last car only one would spin and dig through the snow/ice....usually leaving me stuck at the foot of my driveway. My TL climbs right up.
As for VSA? Not really a LSD, but more of a lets keep wheel spin under control. I turned off VSA in the snow the other day and both fronts spin easily. In my last car only one would spin and dig through the snow/ice....usually leaving me stuck at the foot of my driveway. My TL climbs right up.
02-11-2009, 10:52 AM
#16
Instructor
The VSA works very well under certain circumstances but when you really want both wheels to spin it's great to be able to temporarily turn it off.
What I was asking is why would a manufacturer have both VSA and LSD on a car? I thought the TL only has VSA.
02-11-2009, 11:03 AM
#17
Race Director
iTrader: (1)
It is a front-wheel drive car with a decent amount of power. It will always pull to one side when floored. Welcome to torque-steer my friend.
As for VSA? Not really a LSD, but more of a lets keep wheel spin under control. I turned off VSA in the snow the other day and both fronts spin easily. In my last car only one would spin and dig through the snow/ice....usually leaving me stuck at the foot of my driveway. My TL climbs right up.
As for VSA? Not really a LSD, but more of a lets keep wheel spin under control. I turned off VSA in the snow the other day and both fronts spin easily. In my last car only one would spin and dig through the snow/ice....usually leaving me stuck at the foot of my driveway. My TL climbs right up.
That's why I said "I am not aware that the TL has a true limited slip differential."
The VSA works very well under certain circumstances but when you really want both wheels to spin it's great to be able to temporarily turn it off.
What I was asking is why would a manufacturer have both VSA and LSD on a car? I thought the TL only has VSA.
The VSA works very well under certain circumstances but when you really want both wheels to spin it's great to be able to temporarily turn it off.
What I was asking is why would a manufacturer have both VSA and LSD on a car? I thought the TL only has VSA.
02-11-2009, 11:12 AM
#18
Safety Car
there are a ton of reasons they did it on the manual...the auto just doesnt have room for it..... the computer doesnt communicate with the gearbox the way it does to control the auto. in the auto if u smash the gas and ripa corner itll grap it in time to slow u down and control ur turn.....the manual actually has more potential of slipping out because the computer takes an extra sec to calulate...."slipping wheels or clutch slipping" then it has to adjust torque steer to some degree..... lots of factors not ebough space or time to type it. plus dont u like when a car spins both tires?? not just one?
02-11-2009, 11:20 AM
#20
Great confusing post. From what I've read, all 3G MTs have limited slip but in talking to an Acura mech on a previous thread, he said he didn't remember it having it when having to rebuild a tranny once before. See below.....
Not all Maximas had the HLSD in them it was a option on the 6MT... did you have cross drilled pedals ? If so it had it and yes you should change the fluid more often.
I have rebuilt 2 TL MT6s and from my recollection they don't have a LSD. Only the CL-S in 2003 came with a LSD.... and that was one notchy ass trans. I would recommend you stay away from the Acura MT fluid, I have been telling my boss we need to get away from it and we tried some Redline and most customers where thrilled with the way their cars shifted after the service. Not many wanted to pay for the extra $$$ stuff.
I have rebuilt 2 TL MT6s and from my recollection they don't have a LSD. Only the CL-S in 2003 came with a LSD.... and that was one notchy ass trans. I would recommend you stay away from the Acura MT fluid, I have been telling my boss we need to get away from it and we tried some Redline and most customers where thrilled with the way their cars shifted after the service. Not many wanted to pay for the extra $$$ stuff.
02-11-2009, 11:26 AM
#21
Registered Member
^^ hahaha, I was thinking the same thing LOL
Seriously though, isn't VSA basically a form of LSD? my 6 spd (non typeS) pulls to one side when I accelerate hard but if one wheel starts slipping VSA activates and slows down that wheel (I believe it actually applies the brakes). VSA works great in the snow or on ice but I am not aware that the TL has a true limited slip differential. Correct me if I'm wrong, please!
Seriously though, isn't VSA basically a form of LSD? my 6 spd (non typeS) pulls to one side when I accelerate hard but if one wheel starts slipping VSA activates and slows down that wheel (I believe it actually applies the brakes). VSA works great in the snow or on ice but I am not aware that the TL has a true limited slip differential. Correct me if I'm wrong, please!
02-11-2009, 11:28 AM
#22
Registered Member
It is a front-wheel drive car with a decent amount of power. It will always pull to one side when floored. Welcome to torque-steer my friend.
As for VSA? Not really a LSD, but more of a lets keep wheel spin under control. I turned off VSA in the snow the other day and both fronts spin easily. In my last car only one would spin and dig through the snow/ice....usually leaving me stuck at the foot of my driveway. My TL climbs right up.
As for VSA? Not really a LSD, but more of a lets keep wheel spin under control. I turned off VSA in the snow the other day and both fronts spin easily. In my last car only one would spin and dig through the snow/ice....usually leaving me stuck at the foot of my driveway. My TL climbs right up.
02-11-2009, 12:48 PM
#23
My '04 manual TL exhibits little or not torque steer under hard acceleration provided my car is pointed straight and the road surface is clear. In fact, I can take my hands off of the steering wheel and it will track true under those conditions. However, if hitting it when turning or the road has some crowning or debris, then I will get torque steer.
Same here. When reading up on the car before I got it, most car writers make it seem like the steering wheel will jerk out of my hands when I floor it. I've never had that happen. Torque steer (or perceived torque steer) is relative since what is ok to some might be massive to others. Will you feel a slight tug at the wheel at sudden full throttle? Probably. Will the steering wheel throw your hands off and the car will start driving on its own like Knight Ridder? Probably not.
02-11-2009, 12:57 PM
#24
Race Director
iTrader: (1)
It's not extreme, but it's not what a car with LSD should be doing imo. The prelude with a quiafe was nothing like this car is.
02-11-2009, 01:13 PM
#26
Safety Car
http://www.trdparts.jp/english/parts_lsd_helical.html
it looks pretty much like the lsd thats in the MT TL
it looks pretty much like the lsd thats in the MT TL
02-11-2009, 02:05 PM
#29
Instructor
Same here. When reading up on the car before I got it, most car writers make it seem like the steering wheel will jerk out of my hands when I floor it. I've never had that happen. Torque steer (or perceived torque steer) is relative since what is ok to some might be massive to others. Will you feel a slight tug at the wheel at sudden full throttle? Probably. Will the steering wheel throw your hands off and the car will start driving on its own like Knight Ridder? Probably not.
02-11-2009, 03:09 PM
#30
I think you are confusing traction control with limited slip. Traction control will control wheel spin like you described and VSA on the 3G will do that to an extent. Limited slip is there to ensure equal engine power is being provided to both drive wheels. Both wheels spinning at equal speed is exactly what you want especially if one wheel looses traction under normal driving conditions. With a drivetrain without LSD, the wheel with the less resistance receives the most power from the engine. Most cases, this is not an issue but say if one wheel is stuck in snow or ice and the other drive wheel is on solid pavement, then you have a problem. The only thing is that limited slip is somewhat harder to engineer since you have to factor in turning radius and powering both drive wheels equally even though one wheel is spinning faster than the other in a turn.
02-11-2009, 04:16 PM
#31
Registered Member
02-11-2009, 04:33 PM
#32
Instructor
I think you are confusing traction control with limited slip. Traction control will control wheel spin like you described and VSA on the 3G will do that to an extent. Limited slip is there to ensure equal engine power is being provided to both drive wheels. Both wheels spinning at equal speed is exactly what you want especially if one wheel looses traction under normal driving conditions. With a drivetrain without LSD, the wheel with the less resistance receives the most power from the engine. Most cases, this is not an issue but say if one wheel is stuck in snow or ice and the other drive wheel is on solid pavement, then you have a problem. The only thing is that limited slip is somewhat harder to engineer since you have to factor in turning radius and powering both drive wheels equally even though one wheel is spinning faster than the other in a turn.
If there is a difference between LSD and traction control, please can someone explain it because I'd like to understand it better.
02-11-2009, 07:02 PM
#33
Suzuka Master
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I don't feel like scanning it right now but LSD is listed about the 4th item down in the standard equipment section of the MSRP window sticker on the 6MT cars.
02-11-2009, 07:27 PM
#34
Race Director
iTrader: (1)
Acura's best-selling car is redesigned for 2004 with new styling, more power, and more standard safety features. The TL is based on the platform of the Accord sedan from parent-company Honda, but is more luxurious and more expensive. The '04 TL has virtually the same wheelbase as its 1999-2003 predecessor, but overall length is shorter by 6.3 inches. Interior dimensions change little. The sole engine is a 3.2-liter V6 with 270 hp. A 5-speed automatic transmission with manual shift gate returns. Replacing the sporty Type-S model is a 6-speed manual-transmission TL version with a firmer suspension than automatic-transmission models, plus Brembo-brand front brakes and a limited-slip differential. Manual versions are available with high-performance tires vs. the standard all-season treads. All TLs come with ABS, 17-inch wheels, and an antiskid system. Front side airbags are standard and are joined for '04 by head-protecting curtain side airbags. Leather upholstery with heated front seats, aluminum interior trim, and a sunroof are standard. So is satellite radio and a new audio system with an in-dash changer that plays CDs and DVD-Audio discs. Other new features include Acura's HandsFreeLink, which employs the audio system as a hands-free, wireless link to cell phones. A navigation system with voice command is optional. OnStar assistance is no longer available.
02-11-2009, 09:33 PM
#35
Senior Moderator
2004-2008 TL W/ Manual transmissions have a LSD.
the 2004-2005 TL benefit the most from this since the LSD can get full power. ALL TL's 2006-2008 have a Torque Limiting system in the ECU's programming to limit torque in the first two gears so torque steer won't be as present as on the 2004-2005 TL.
the 2004-2005 TL benefit the most from this since the LSD can get full power. ALL TL's 2006-2008 have a Torque Limiting system in the ECU's programming to limit torque in the first two gears so torque steer won't be as present as on the 2004-2005 TL.
02-11-2009, 09:52 PM
#36
Racer
Yes, you are 100% correct. I am confusing LSD with traction control. I always thought that a limited slip differential is the technical term for the system that provides traction control. It transfers power from the slipping wheel to the opposite side - to give you more traction if a wheel starts spinning in snow or on ice.
If there is a difference between LSD and traction control, please can someone explain it because I'd like to understand it better.
If there is a difference between LSD and traction control, please can someone explain it because I'd like to understand it better.
When VSA is activated, the computer automatically feathers the throttle to regain traction, also, if one wheel spins faster that the other, it will activate and compensate.
I am no professional, this is to the best of my knowledge and experience with LSDs.
Not to make things more confusing, but there are about 3-4 types of LSDs. Helical, Mechanical, Clutch-type, and i think one other. (correct me if im wrong) Most cars, have Open-Diffs where one wheel is spinning 90% of the time, the other 10% is on turns.
For the guys that know for sure, correct me. hope this clears up somethings.
-Del
02-12-2009, 08:58 AM
#38
Safety Car
the traction control in our cars shuts down the motor rev almost instantly. kinda lets the car regain its control by slowing it down....it doesnt seem to be sending power from one wheel to the next
02-12-2009, 11:13 AM
#39
Registered Member
Traction control is another item besides limited slip and VSA. The 3G manual TL makes use of five distinct traction/braking systems: LSD, VSA, traction control, ABS, and EBS (I believe that is the acronym). Pretty good stuff.
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