Not looking for a flame war, but when they initially came out, my first impression was "Look at the idiot who left his lights on..."

I hear what you guys are saying, and I agree that in less than optimal conditions that the headlights should be on. But on nice days, turn the damn things off. They don't help, and only make things worse...

 

Well, if they really bother you, then the DRLs are doing their job as intended, since you take notice of these vehicles. I think your comments are a good testimonial to the efficacy of DRLs.

 

I dunno man.... even if i mount 4 huge PIAA offroad lights on my hood and straight piped... i still would be unseen at times. They still cut into my lane like no one is there. Lots of drivers really should be banned from the road. Good luck on daytime mod though. I would do it if i didn't have HID fogs. Cuz of that, i manually turn on my fog+corner mod after i start the car to protect the bulbs.

 

Not a chance. If you're incapable of remembering to turn on your lights when needed, then you shouldn't be driving. I feel the same way about automatic wipers.

Guy: "Gee Martha, why is it all of a sudden I can't see out the windsheld?"
Wife: "It's raining, you moron!"

Fortunately, GM has backed off the stupid idea and newer models run the parking lights instead of brights. Don't get me wrong, I ride a motorcycle as well and the lights (not hi beams) are always on. I added some halogen lights to the lower fork for added visibility. If you need to run your lights, then just turn them on!

rw

 

Canada is not trying to get rid of DRL's. All vechicles sold in Canada have DRL's and have had for 10+ years.

 

Except there's something to be said for convenience. Also, up where I live, you should have running lights on at all times. It makes sense to have automatic DRLs, that way my life doesn't depend on someone forgetting to turn their lights on. There's an idealized world where everyone would remember, and then there's reality.

However the whole DRL argument seems to be based on the fact that people in the US who simulate DRLs by using their normal headlights... or car makers are shoving bright lights in as DRLs. This, I can understand being a problem. The thing about DRLs is, properly implemented, they're not the same as having your head lights on.

DRLs are supposed to be 'running lights' visible to anyone looking at the front of your car, same as any other running light on your vehicle. They are supposed to be much less intense than normal headlights. In many cases, DRLs are completely separate lights, and even coloured differently from headlights. The goal is to have emissive elements on the front of the car, instead of depending on reflected light. This improves visibility, even in sunlight.

If someone's DRLs are blinding you, they need to get them fixed, or they need to stop running their headlights to fill in as DRLs. Proper DRLs don't blind you, they just help you notice cars better. I fail to see how one can argue against a feature that improves visibility of oncoming traffic, any more than one can argue against turn signals. Someone should tell the car manufacturers to use illumination strengths that don't dazzle people, since that's counterproductive to the intent.

I simply don't get dazzled driving around in Canada during the day.

Probably the strongest argument against DRLs is that once most cars have DRLs, cars without them are actually even harder to see (drivers and pedestrians get conditioned to looking for lights rather than cars). However even at that there's a 10-11% reduction, depending on study, in head-on collisions due to the technology.

Where DRLs are most useful is in rural or urban two-lane traffic, where the risk of being hit by an oncoming vehicle is greater. Where they are not nearly as useful is on divided highways.

I also agree with earlier posters, that if you have front running lights, they should also have rear running lights.

 

What I object to getting subjected to brights in my face. In the states, we consider it impolite to bright someone. Run your low beams if you want added visibility. As for being on all the time, most (if not all) DRL implementations here run the brights at half intensity. I was travelling recently and drove a rental with DRLs. Because some of the lights are on, I found myself driving without all the lights on. It would have been obvious if the design was not selective.

It sounds like your DRLs are fundamentally different from the ones found in the states. Here they are the high beams which are aimed much higher than the normal lights, lowered intensity or not.

The only such beneficial study (Canada has never done one) was from Norway where the ambient lighting is quite different from what you find in Atlanta, GA ! Our NHTSA has conducted a analysis based on those cars which have them here (not mandated) and found statistically no difference.

If someone wants to pay for automatic lights or wipers, then so be it.

rw

 

Oh I would agree here, it is irritating when, e.g. on a rainy day, someone is driving around with their normal (as opposed to DRL) headlights on.. on high beam.

Here it depends. I've seen DRLs that are the high beam bulbs run at low intensity, I've seen foglights adapted, I've seen independant lights in the bulb housings, and I've even seen completely separate lighting housings dedicated to DRLs.

Some, I'm sure, are better designed than others for the level of possible interference with oncoming drivers, but that doesn't make DRLs useless, it simply means some implementations have flaws.


Even systems (like, say, the Accords up here) that use higher aimed bulbs run them at low intensity. Not all systems use the highbeams, though. Depends on make and model of car. Even so, I can't say as I'm blinded, nor dazzled by anyones DRLs while driving.

This may change if DRL systems get brighter (I'm not sure what the regulation on brightness is for them)... or if car lights just get brighter overall with HIDs and the like.


Canada's done at least two that I can find references to on a quick Google search. One found an 11% reduction, the other a 15% reduction. The latter was 28% reduction if you focused only on head on or side impacts where the lights would be visible.


I dug into the ambient light issue a bit more, and I can understand it from the perspective of longer periods of twilight, but during the daytime, there's plenty of light around here. Norways mileage may vary

I guess my final thoughts on the matter are that I see DRLs as being valuable safety equipment, but they do have to be designed with some sense. The idea is to make your car glow a bit to be visible, not to replicate the function of your high beams. I also think DRLs need to have rear-visible lights as well, for the jokers that don't turn on normal lights during the rain.

(In fact, the argument about getting dazzled by bright lights affects me fairly often in the rain, compared to driving around in decent weather, because people actually turn on their headlights, which are much, much brighter than the average DRL here)

 

So, should we do away with mandatory seat belts and airbags also? They remove most of my freedom to fly around or be thrown out in an accident. At heart I am a libertarian and understand what you are saying. However, your freedom ends when it impacts my safety and my wallet. If you sign away your rights to medical insurance coverage and other things that we all have to pay for jointly then it's another story.

 

This is too funny, people getting upset over DRL!


First off, DRLs help other people notice your vehicle sooner - that is a fact! All new model motorcycles are required to have DRLs, why? so they are seen sooner. I ride and am glad my light is on all the time, I already have too many schmucks pulling out in front of me with the light on all the time... and no I don't speed too much on my HOG.

Second, people driving with their regular lights on during the day might blind you ...not DRLs.

Thirdly, fog lights are for when there is fog, not to help you see better at night. This pisses me off the most when all the SUVs drive with their fog lights on all the time, in Germany you can get a ticket if you have them on when there is no fog... that is why they are called fog lights!

:-) I just had to get that off my chest... yes, I feel better now.

btw ... I guess the original question is dead ... there is no way to mod the lights for DRL...

 

They only help alert and competent drivers see you. I give up on the rest of society... they wouldn't see you even if you waved a red flag in their face.

 

Really. I couldn't find any. Please reference those. I find it interesting that your government is unaware of such either.

http://www.tc.gc.ca/roadsafety/stats/menu.htm

Is this where your 11% "proof" originates?

http://www.tc.gc.ca/road/faq.htm

or here? (scroll down a bit)

http://www.ibiblio.org/rdu/DRLs/studies.htm

If so, please note the word "estimate" used in all these references. Why is that? Obviously, any such study would necessarily have to make assumptions as to how many people with non-DRL vehicles do or don't turn on their lights when they should. If a non-DRL car is involved in an accident, how do you know whether or not their lights were on? Whatever.

The current implementation of vehicles in the states is poorly designed and irritating. Fortunately, our studies (using actual data) and that of Japan have concluded there are significant problems, especially masking issues for motorcyclists.


rw

 

Studies here, in the UK, and in Japan have concluded that DRL use in automobiles reduces the effectiveness of lights for use with motorcycles.

Please explain how low beams are more blinding that high beams (look at any older GM vehicle)

Ths solution was provided with one of the first posts - just leave your lights on. They automatically shut off. Unlike DRLs, they run all the lights, not just the high beams.

rw

 

What are you saying? That light on motorcycles do not help them in being seen?!? Or that if all the cars have their lights on it washes out the cycles ... DRLs still help cars in being spotted sooner, as studies in Germany have shown.

I never said that low beams are more blinding than highs, I said, "Second, people driving with their regular lights on during the day might blind you ...not DRLs." That went to the dude who said the DRLs blind him, he is probably talking about the regular beams and not DRLs ...I didn't even mention high beams.

And the solution to the mod was never really posted, as in rewiring the system to allow for DRLs; driving with your lights on is a work around that blinds/ annoys other drivers. Yes I drive with the lights on all the time, but I wish the TL had DRLs. As an EE there must be a way to wire the fogs as DRLs or the highs in series ... if I only had a schematic/wiring diagram. Where there's a will there's a way.

 

That is what NHTSA, the Japanese, and the British are saying.

Here, DRLs are high beams run at half power. At up to 7000 candela allowed by NHTSA. You know, those lamps that are aimed at your face as you approach them. At least until GM got enough complaints to change their designs on a number of their vehicles. Mercifully, they are now using the parking lights.

If you are not proposing using your lights as the Daytime Running Lights, then what is your idea?

rw

 

DRLs were designed to save energy as well as provide a safety feature.

 

I am using my lights as DRLs, but wish I didn't have to. I'd like to mod the lights to DRLs if not too involved (the purpose of this thread) ...but no one seems to have any ideas. If and when I get some wiring diagrams, I'll see what can be done. Back in the day installing a switch to only have the front lights on was easy enough to do ... but I don't know what it would take with the newer cars.

 

To jdone;

Of course I've long heard the argument for having people wear seat belts because it lowers insurance and costs for everyone. But we could apply that same logic to smoking (which it is already, anyway) or a host of other things. Why not do this. If someone had an accident and they're at fault (say with a tree) and it can be shown that they were not wearing a seat belt, then the insurance company doesn't have to pay. The guy loses everything for his negligence. Talk about hitting someone in their wallet! I know this won't fly, but it raises the issue of ultimate responsibility, doesn't it?

Life isn't always fair and to be really free means you have the freedom to not only do the best you can, but also to fail.

 

Relax. LED based taillights and side markers are both energy efficient and long lasting.

rw

 

The reason for the switch was for night-time evasive purposes. Energy was never a concern. My point was that it was easy enough to wire up new configurations, since the wiring and the access both were simple.

You know the more I think about it, running with your regular lights on is the best solution, it is really not worth the hassle of tearing stuff apart and rewiring things just to have DRLs. Yes they would be nice, but I'll just leave my lights on all the time. I am surprised the TL does not have the automatic lights on when it gets dark feature... even my Sable has it!

 

How much more would you be willing to pay for a TL with DRL. 300? 500?

 

I don't really think that DRLs are nessessary. I would never use them. When it is raining or if it is Dusk or Dawn, then you can put your lights on. Why would you want your lights on during a sunny day? You wouldn't be able to see them. But hey, if you want people to see you, just drive with your parking lights, or your fogs.

 

Totally agree with you but I like to stimulate discussion.

 

too funny.

in the south, what you call "running lights"

are called "PARKING lights"

as in... turn these on when you are NOT MOVING


LMAO.


anyway, i concur with those that say the TL should have DRL's. they DO work.



doug

 

A fact is DRL reduces accidents. Everyone has DRL and it really helps you to judge distance of oncoming and traffic behind you.

I was traveling Montata and Idaho over weekend and I saw signs saying "Please use headlight for safety" or something like that.

I can see DRL will be mandated in States soon.
In night, DRL does almost nothing to illuminate road. You will know right away if you are missing HID.

 

What a resurrection of an old thread!

 

Sorry I don't have pictures yet. I just got done installing a daytime running light module. It makes the fog lights come on at 75% intentisy when ever the car is turned on. My headlightsand fog lights still work normally. I used to just ride around with my headlights on all the time, but now I don't have to. I am very pleased with how this turned out.

 

Now that's a good bump on an old topic. Would you mind sharing where you purchased your DRL module from?

 

The company's name is Ignitoin Systems Inc.

They have a couple to choose from. The one I got was 38.50 with 4.95 shipping and handeling. It took all of about 20 minutes to install. It is not intrusive and you don't have to cut any of the cars wires.

 

I found them by a google search "reduced intensity daytime running lights" I tried the web address that came on my packing slip but it doesn't seem to work.

 

Thanks bro, just a little correction to your address, thanks for the info
http://www.automotiveelectronicaccessories.com/

I believe this is the module you purchased? http://www.automotiveelectronicacces...aeapn480hd.htm

Good thing is that it appears to be universal

 

You are right that is the one that I purchased. Thanks for fixing that web address.

 

Studies I've read show that cars with DRL's have actually been involved in more crashes that similar cars without. DRL's also waste fuel.

I personally don't like them, but if people want to have them that's fine by me... I just don't want them made mandatory.

 

Thanks for the info I've been wanting to do this mod for a long time. But since I have a 2G, I will have to connect the wiring to my highbeams instead.

 

Have you ever seen a corvette especially in ur rear view mirror during the daytime and its got that creepy look to it. Ofcourse it's the body style and everything too but I also think it's the bright yellow/orange DRL's that r close to the ground right on the side edges of the front bumper (they even wrap around a little bit). I have always wondered how that would look on my Black Baby and they r definitely noticeable.

and yes I do want light sensors that my corolla had that would make the headlamps come on when it got dark not cause I am lazy but because all this technology should be in a luxury automobile including rain sensing wipers.

 

Although I agree with your rant about seat belt laws, I do understand why they have been inacted - idiots that don't wear seat belts cost those of us that do money. I've always worn mine (before and since they've inacted these laws), so it doesn't matter much to me. If it makes more people wear them, then it's all good to me.

As for the child safety laws, I can't imagine how you can disagree with that!? Children depend on adults to provide protection for them, and the best protection available right now are child car seats (and boosters). It amazes me how many people still don't properly fasten their children in car seats even with these laws in place. Believe me, I understand how inconvenient they are - I'm the father of 3 currently in car seats with twins on the way. And, yes, I know that our parents let us jump around the car while traveling 70mph and we're still here...

For the smoking thing, I would have no problem with smokers if they just inhaled all the smoke. The problem I have is that I am inhaling some of their smoke. And yes, when I'm out in public, I'm still breathing in the smoke if they're smoking withing about 15 feet of me. So, the actions of smokers are infringing on my right to clean air.

As for regulating DRLs, I can't imagine how this would bother anyone. As mentioned previously, proper running DRLs would never blind anyone, and would be nothing but good for overall driving safety.

I believe in freedom, but I also believe in doing what is in the best interest of everyone. Common sense is not all that common. Sometimes people need some incentive to do logical things.

 

Good find! Can you please explain which wires you tapped in order to connect this thing?

 

DRLs were used in Sweden back in the 60s and yes they are a safety feature, and no, once everyone has them you don't become less noticable . I live in CanaDUH and its one of the best features added to cars in years. Even on bright sunny days on the highways some colors of cars at certain angles are difficult to see .. the DRL impoves thier visability. I prefer to be visable so some loon doesn't pull out to pass a car and head on me because I wasn't visable.

BTW the study originally was done by the Swedish insurance associations with follow up studies done by insurance and safety organizations in other countries including north america. Not the car manufacturers.

References Studies

 

[QUOTE=bluenoise]Good find! Can you please explain which wires you tapped in order to connect this thing?[/QU

I tapped into the left fog light. The blue wire with yellow stripe is the positive side. The black wire is the ground. Then there is a hot wire that goes to the positve side of the battery. The last wire needs a key on feed. I didn't want to go thru the fire wall so I found that the yellow wire in the windshield wiper motor harness worked well for this.

 

Excellent post..