Hello everyone!

Turns out my new to me TL Type S is going to need a new clutch in the foreseeable future. So this leads to my question:

What experience do you have with different types / brands of clutches? How do they feel vs the OE clutch. I did search through the forums but I couldn't find what I am looking for. I am undecided if I want to upgrade to a higher stage clutch or not. I have plans in the very distant future to turbo my car, but that will not happen for at least several years. I might just wait until then to upgrade the clutch. I want something that grabs, will take abuse (I don't drive easy), and still be good for many years until I have future mods in place. Thanks!

 

The LUK (OEM) clutch kit and flywheel are available from rockauto.com. Make sure you replace the flywheel too. Beware! Many clutch kits and flywheels are the LUK's repackaged with a higher price tag!
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Do you absolutely need a higher torque capacity clutch? Like..did you do modifications that necessitate this?

If not...don't do it. You're going to put more wear on the engine thrust bearings as well as a lot of other components. You'll want to do a clutch interlock bypass and be very mindful of how much time you spend with the clutch pushed down. And you'll have to push the pedal harder to get it to move. And deal with potential harsher engagement, noise, and more frequent maintenance.

Those are the downsides.

The up-sides depend on how much power you're making. If you're making 100 more HP than stock...obviously, you're ready to deal with these downsides of a stronger clutch.

If you're around the stock power output....think of it like this. If Honda thought the clutch needed more grabbing power...why didn't they put a stronger clutch in from the factory?

 

LUK supplies factory clutches to Honda for this application.

Do they supply the same clutch for their aftermarket sales (like the kits on Rockauto)? Almost for sure no.

I'm not saying the aftermarket one is automatically bad. But the one you'd buy from a dealer almost for sure is better in some way.

For hard driving on stock power, your safest bet is to buy everything for the clutch swap from an Acura/Honda dealer.

Or at the very least, the friction disc and bearings from a dealer. I don't fully trust aftermarket discs or bearings. Especially for hard use.

The aftermarket stuff means taking a risk. Not sure how big the risk is because I don't work at Honda or at LUK.

 

And I would argue the contrary, the LuK aftermarket clutch and flywheel I bought for my TL were virtually identical to the OEM parts I took off the car, right down to the casting numbers and spring arrangements.

 

Yeah, they probably look identical. No reason for LUK to change the design.

But you'll never know if they were made using the same assembly line, process, internal construction, quality requirements, and etc etc etc etc as the Honda dealer one.

For example...the springs LOOK the same. Are they from the same manufacturer?

Or...are you sure the friction material is the same?

and so on.

I used to work in automotive R&D at an OEM. In knowing how all this works...you'd probably need to work at LUK or Honda (in development) to know the details of what you're getting from the aftermarket part vs the dealer part.

You can always ask the golden question.

Why does the dealer part cost more, even at wholesale pricing? If the aftermarket one was exactly the same...why would the dealer part exist?

 

Dealership and supply chain markup. I used to work for Mercedes-Benz and while OEM manufacturers to like to save a buck here and there, you can get cost savings in two ways, cheaping out on materials, or economies of scale. Given the literally millions of miles on LuK aftermarket clutch sets with no reports of premature failures, my bet is the parts are identical.

 

I changed my OEM luk clutch/flywheel Today with Rockautos Luk . Its Exactly the same. Exactly. Look on my thread.

Thanks to @DMZ I got the the same parts for more than 50% off.

 

You...didn't read my post, eh?

 

First, see this thread for some background on clutch setups:
https://acurazine.com/forums/3g-tl-p...utches-906678/

I have a very low opinion of the LuK SACs, but they are readily available and cheap (aftermarket). The LuK clutch works OK
when new, but nobody will ever say it's fantastic. That's because it isn't. You need a conventional pressure plate to get a good
solid feel of the clutch engagement. That being said, your options are extremely limited.

Most of what BROlando said about OEM parts is true, but one factor that most people aren't aware of is that parts suppliers
have different prices for service parts. Service parts are the parts that are produced for the sole purpose of being sold through
parts dealers (the Honda dealer in the case). In short, the suppliers typically charge Honda more for these than the ones that
are shipped to the plant for vehicle production. If the same supplier (LuK in this case) also sells these parts through aftermarket
channels, then they have competition with other manufacturers that drives the price down. In most cases it is the exact same
part that would go to the OEM. This is because it simply costs more to change the production process and develop another
part, than what might be saved on the cheaper part.

 

As Euro-R_Spec_TSX put it - the factory clutch/pressure plate is pretty dog doo. If you have driven cars with more traditional clutch setups (read: pressure plate that isn't self adjusting) then the TLs stock clutch will feel really vague and gross.

However, most of the aftermarket clutches available are precisely that - aftermarket. Even the best aftermarket clutches can be quite chattery and engage not very smoothly; any traditional aftermarket clutch will make some compromises in terms of comfort and smoothness.

I'm running the XLR8 'daily' clutch and flywheel combo in my car, which is the AASCO lightweight flywheel and a South Bend organic clutch. I absolutely love the flywheel weight, and the clutch is very predictable and direct, but there is definitely a compromise in terms of engagement smoothness. Occasionally the clutch will chatter if it isn't modulated just so.

IMO - If you care about having the *best* setup, follow through with Eric's post above regarding his setup. If you absolutely need higher torque capacity then get something aftermarket and be ready for the compromises, otherwise just stick with the stock setup.

 

I'm gonna go play the lottery then with my "one in MILLIONS" odds since my LUK SAC & DMF from RockAuto only lasted 40K miles. Installed by Honda themselves so it's hard to blame "installation error" as well.

Second time around I did the clutch install myself, with a ClutchMaster 250FX clutch/FW (traditional style sprung hub CLUTCH and standard FW) combo and couldn't be happier. I was hoping someone would have the SouthBend clutch in stock since I have one of them in the subie and instantly fell in love with it, but to no avail.

@OP as you can see, some people think "OEM or bust", while others opt for aftermarket. There's pros and cons of each, there is no "best". It's a decision you and you yourself need to make.

 

Not sure what to make of that; on the surface at least, it sounds like the pressure plate wasn't correctly adjusted upon installation or the dual mass flywheel wasn't replaced. Regardless, I've already got over 40,000 on my LuK clutch and flywheel and the system is going strong.

 

Just replaced my LuK clutch and about to take the first loonng drive!!

 

when it comes time to replace my clutch, i'll be taking a hard look at this:
https://www.heeltoeauto.com/clutch-f...j32-daily.html

 

Thanks for all the input everyone! I wound up buying the Luk clutch kit and flywheel. Now to just get time to install it one of these weekends.