wajo22

Guys,
Today, I'm supposed to buy a 2005 TL with Nav. It has 108k miles on it. I'm not sure if the 105k service was done. I asked the dealer that's selling it, but they seem unable to confirm it. They said they checked the belt and it looks great, but they can't verify the timing belt has been done. I pulled a carfax that shows two different services done around 107k. I called the dealers where the services were done, but they don't want to disclose any information due to the privacy act. Below are some of the details in the carfax. What would you guys recommend? Also, I'm trying to lower the price from $13995; therefore, I need some strong reasons to negotiate the price. Your suggestions are well appreciated. Thank you.

Pictures of the vehicle:

http://www.johnsautosales.com/vehicl...2216769|334889



Carfax:

12/12/2011
105,284
Massachusetts
Inspection Station
Billerica, MA
Passed safety inspection
Passed emissions inspection

04/18/2012
107,842
Herb Connolly Acura
Framingham, MA
508-820-9313
herbconnolly.com
Vehicle serviced

04/30/2012
107,951
Dealer Inventory
Wilmington, MA
Vehicle offered for sale
05/02/2012
Service Facility
Wilmington, MA
Vehicle serviced

05/05/2012
108,063
Dealer Inventory
Vehicle offered for sale

05/08/2012
Massachusetts
Motor Vehicle Dept.
Everett, MA
Vehicle purchase reported

05/09/2012
Dealer Inventory
Wilmington, MA
Vehicle sold

06/02/2012
108,207
Dealer Inventory
Vehicle offered for sale

06/04/2012
Dealer Inventory
Vehicle offered for sale


06/15/2012
108,364
Massachusetts
Inspection Station
Somerville, MA
Passed safety inspection
Passed emissions inspection

07/04/2012
Dealer Inventory
Vehicle offered for sale

EL PESADO

iTrader: (5)

That's too much money for a car with 108k take your time u will find something better with $13k

sapanpatel123

The car looks like it's been taken care of though. If you feel the test drive is fine and have checked the engine then I'd say take a stab at lowering the price and see where that goes. The leather is near to perfect for the amount of miles.

parasitius

Privacy act? Sounds like a load of hogwash so that possibly they can have you dump $1000 with them to have something that was already done redone? Whose privacy -- the old owner doesn't own the car anymore. Local dealer told me 105k wasn't done without hesitation.

wajo22

I was thinking the same thing, but when I checked on the market value of the car, both NADA and KELLEY BLUE BOOK estimated a value around $15k. I found a dark gray with 87k miles for $15400, but I happened to prefer the ebony finish. I'm a little bit ambivalent right now.

Italiano

^^^yea..anytime ive bought a car and called ..the service dept can tell u if the service has been done..... On kbb,are u looking at retail value...what u should look at is trade in vaule for that vehicle...gives u more of an accurate vaule of what dealer got it for....Always haggle with dealer.....

Carraway

Well, without any proof that the belt and water pump have been replaced, you'll have to have it done. At the very least I'd find a good independent mechanic or nearby Acura dealer and arrange to take it for a pre-purchase inspection. It'll likely cost around $100, but it will be well worth it to get an independent assessment of the car.

Edit - to add to the general comparisons, there's a 2005 TL (MT) in my area with 37K miles dealer listed for $17,495. (Carfax shows one owner and no accidents).

parasitius

Yeah $50 inspection I had Honda dealer do was worth every penny. Went back to dealer and demanded extra $250 off to cover the brake work Honda dealer said was immediately necessary.

If it's any help for comparison my '07 TL-S was $15,450 with 115k miles. 105k wasn't done so I had to get it immediately.

wajo22

I've just talked with the dealership where the last service was done, and they told me with no hesitation that timing belt has not been done on that car. May be I've been a bit too impatient because I need a car so badly right now. But I guess I'll keep looking.

justnspace

iTrader: (1)

^negotiate that into the price of the car..

erdoc48

^^Yup... tell them to knock off a grand as this service will be needed after you buy.

swoosh

iTrader: (5)

Aman

But whate about if the dealership is hiding something else?

I would get it inspected by an independent shop somewhere to make sure everything else is 100%.

Links31

Best option yet. Trust me, i know the urgency on wanting to get a ride, or even a nice one right away. It took me at least 4-6 months before i purchased my TL. During that time was just researching on a good TL with low mileage and in good condition and it paid off, with a 06 Base nighthwk perl/ 63k for 16k mint condition non- navi. The navi and other stuff can add on later but it was worth it. Plus, your insurance likes it even more when its in the 60k range n under in regards to mileage.

wajo22

Negotiation in the next hour. I'll update you, guys. Thank you for all your suggestions.

i_love_cars

iTrader: (1)

If they don't have a garage and can't do the 105k for you, I would basically negotiate the price of the car $12,500. If they can't do that, then walk away because it's not your fault that they are into the car for more than it's worth. Don't pay for their greed and/or stupidity in either giving someone else too much on a trade-in or paying too much at auction.

If 105k maintenance had been done, then 13k would be a fair price. If they can do 105k maint for you, then I would negotiate that in for a final price of 13k.

An independent shop would do 105k maint for you probably for 600-700 bucks, so from 13k I would take off 500 at least to bring the price to $12.5k I wouldn't pay a cent more than that.

They are advertising 13,995 as their "super special uber-low" internet price which is ridonkulous.

I typically avoid lots like these that have no more than 40-50 cars on the lot because they tend to be stubborn on price and make up crap about their extra-high costs for marketing and whatever else just because they're independent, and often times get cars from auction that nobody else wants.

I would look for private party seller if possible.

edgarr

Just wait for the right one. I got mine for 12,800, 05, 6sp with 93,xxx miles. Try to get a bank loan and buy it private, you'll save more money that way.

ff4930

way too much for an 05 and that mileage. Keep looking.

I got mine for $19k and is an 08, with 38k miles and is CPO. And is NY.

tlpod03

if it helps any i got my AM TL 04 with 65k miles for 12500, i think the price they are offering is a little high

truonghthe

if you need a car that bad then negotiate the price and paying $115 has Acura dealer do PPI which will save you from getting headache later on.

estabro

I agree. That's BS. Any dealer can look up the VIN and tell you what's in the system. HIPA does not apply to cars...

OP-- Get off the phone and visit a dealer's service in person with the VIN and ask nicely for them to look it up.

wajo22

They agree to take care of the 105k service tomorrow, and then I negotiate another $400 off the loan payment to make my payment much lower. I haven't signed the paper yet, as I told them I will do it tomorrow once the service is done.

Also, they offered me a two year (24K miles) extended warranty for $1300, which I think too high.

What do you guys think?

truonghthe

^^^no that extend warranty is not worth $1300 IMO. So did you fix your legend yet?

Anavrin351

you got 105k and timing belt right? isnt timing belt done at 90k? I wouldnt pay more than 11.5k for it. with all maint up to date. if you walk they will call you the next day agreeing to that price, unless they have had alot of interest in it.

truonghthe

Op state that the dealer agree to perform 105k service for free of charge and they also agree taking $400 off the original price. 3rd gen TL is the most attractive used car they usually don;t stay on the lot for long unless there is a major mechanical issue.

wajo22

I quit on the legend, man. I was spending so much money to fix what wasn't the problem. My pocket got shorter, I got tired.

LoveMyTL-S

No, the timing belt is due at 105k miles.

parasitius

Instead of $1300, take $50 or $100 to another dealer and get it independently inspected inspected ... if the inspection passes, ain't nothing going to happen in 2 years worth $1300. (And stuff that might happen won't be covered) Because 1300 warranty you are counting on more than 1300 worth of problems -- that's the only situation where it puts you ahead.

TheLowLife

^anything could happen within 2 years that would cost ~$1300

Ruby

After reading this whole thread, I think you can get a better deal. Keep looking!

cpm06wdptl

I agree that you can find a better deal out there. On a side note, Why is the front caliper so damn rusty? Lol. It looks like the previous owner only used salt water to wash it

wajo22

Parasitius,

That's a brilliant idea. And that's exactly what I'll do. By the way, they'll give me a warranty that covers anything that happens to the car within 30 days. So I'll have time to figure out whether I'll need that $1300 warranty.

The other day, they let me take the car on the freeway for half an hour; I fell in love with the vehicle.

Tehvine

The price is too high. I paid just under 13 for my 04 6MT with 82k a little over two years ago. Got new brakes all around, new synchro's before I took delivery.

LaCostaRacer

You can assume the service has not been done. If the service had been done, the dealer would have made a big deal about that point.

The price is a bit high. The KBB for a 2006 in excellent condition and 50K miles is 19K which is much more reasonable than almost 14K for a car with 108K. Figure on 10 cents a mile as a very conservative value of what low mileage means in comparing vehicles. The mileage difference is almost 6K and then the 2006 has features missing on the 2005 like TPMS which is worth something too.

ryanwgregg

Just another idea on price....

I just got my '05 Base TL with 103,000 miles for $12,000 and it just had $1800 worth of service done to it. I will take care of the 105,000 Service myself.

THEReeM718

iTrader: (2)

bought my 04 TL 5 months ago for $12k with 66k miles,original owner,you should keep on looking for a better deal.

Acura-OC

There is much more to buying a car than just number of miles and price.

Which color is better?

Which interior color is better?

Is it better to by a car with low miles after lease without any service records? or

Higher miles car that was financed without service records?

Even higher miles with plenty of records?

Is it available for a test drive or is it thousand miles away?

There are plenty of non car issues. Is there a car available to drive or you need to rent/borrow? Are there any issues with the car you have? How much does it cost to wait?

Some people make $500 per day and some per week.

Some have kids and cannot spend weeks meeting people from craigslist.

There are many more questions when buying a USED car and each one of us will have different priorities.


To OP remember that you are not buying a car to please all this people on this forum.

Good luck finding a car that is right for YOU.

TrustinHFDJ

First and foremost, if that dealership your at that has the car is clueless that is not a good sign. Which means they took the car as is, and looking to get an as is price. It is good you worked out a deal, because that is a must, but you could have probably gotten a better price. It is good that they chose to do it, I would check to confirm everything is Accurate, and I would do an diagnosis at an Acura Dealership no matter what happens or how much it will cost; in the end it will cost you a lot more.

In addition, I do not like that service record, nor would I buy a car without proper OCI; cause people are plain mechanically retarded even when the car says it is time they will BS. That is not good for the overall life of your motor, and your investment which you want to last the longest.

I always suggest this, it was to someone who is seeking to purchase an Acura and the steps I took on my very own purchase. PLEASE VOID CERTAIN VARIABLE'S THEY WERE FOR SOMEONE ELSE WITH A DIFFERENT SCENARIO

Yes 15k is a skeptical price. I could see why you are shocked, always double check with KBB if your not sure. I would have to say you need to do a whole car run down really. I am quite wild when it comes to such information about my vehicle.

1. Check all the doors, trunk, hood, etc for the Acura original sticker to see if parts were replaced; generally when a car is damaged excessively they would not be able to pull out dents and would need to completely take out the original parts. The bad part about this is those parts are generally weaker then factory grade, and that jeopardizes your safety. [The doors and the rest have it with a blue sticker with acura written on it and the part #]

2. Check the vehicle for any irregularities such as chassis damage, which is another key component to your safety. The front of the vehicle has a dash board that should runs flush with vehicle. As you open the doors passenger or driver, look towards the "pit" of the door, you can see the outline of the interior and what is part of your dash. There should not be any spaces between the gaps; everything should be smooth. Generally when the chassis is jeopardized, it causes a bend which turns the whole chassis, making the interior shift. It is easily noticeable, along with the obvious things such as air bag deployment.

3. Next things you can check to be certain, measure the vehicles dimensions. Measure both sides of the vehicle driver and passenger to be sure they are the same height of the ground. Next, check the tire ducts, all the tires and frame should be even height front and back. Both the front and back are different, but both sides should be even if the chassis has not been damaged. You could also check all the gaps in the vehicle should be even. Often vehicles have specific details which should be symmetrical on both sides. For example on this vehicle, the front bumper and hood should all be flush where they meet. The rear bumpers should be smooth transition from the frame, no over or under hang where the bumper portion connects, is sunken or elevated are signs that the vehicle may have been rear ends or it rear ended a vehicle. The vehicle has lines virtually everywhere, you need make sure they are all the same size, the lining of the trunk to the headlights, and more; as mentioned with the hood and bumper.

4. Further proof of chassis damage comes in the vehicles turns, this is based on the test drive. I would drive in a figure 8 pattern in an empty parking lot. The car should roll the same either way you go in the figure 8. If you are not sure, you can drive one at a dealership for your knowledge of what is not salvage; dealers cannot sell salvage vehicles. Generally, you must go all out for a purchase which is major, so I suggest it to everyone. Test drive the hell out of the vehicle to make sure everything is functional. Especially those components which are for safety, everything else is replaceable of course, but you are not.

This is the basic run down for the main things which a vehicle must have to be in any reasonable shape.

Everything else is based off KBB, and how the vehicle performs. Is the motor tired from being over-driven or driven too roughly. Trial and error will be your only judgement, I would suggest going to a dealership and taking out one of those acura's for a test drive. Other than of course car fax notifications for all the oil changes if they are available. That will also give you a better idea of how the car was driven, if the car has had all it's oil changes on time, and it is running sloppy. It is a given that the car was being harshly used, which of course decreases the life of the motor and problems you could have. If no information is given about oil changes, it is a toughy, but more than not people just did not want to pay for the dealership to do a 40 dollar oil change, and went to cheaper spots which do not record car fax. I think if you take my advice[test drive dealership] you will be able to differentiate what is best for you. ***MOST IMPORTANTLY*** I would suggest you allow acura to do a 150 pt inspection on the vehicle and diagnosis, which will show any hidden bugs or kinks that could be hidden with a computer reset. It will cost a 150 dollars, but my friend it is beyond worth it, when you are paying 15000. Exposes any funny business, most dealerships get scared when they believe you will take such bold action; I use it myself every time I have bought a vehicle from a non-brand lot as you are doing in this case. ***Really the most important

04WDP6spd

I got my '04 6MT with 122k miles for 11k even, and it was in quite good condition. Hope that helps a bit.

Deerole

OP the price their asking is too much...n kbb is a bunch of horse shit. go on cars.com or autotrader and see what cars with that amnt of miles go for in general that will give u a better idea on what a "good" deal is