McKulit

This might be worth a try ... www.swapalease.com

jotty sansotta

Thanks Guys. I'm going to consider these options in about a year. Live and learn I guess.

johnnysquire

Read the lease CAREFULLY. Some have early termination options - even if it seems crazy high, you might be better off "refinancing" with a loan.

By my calculations, you're paying over 20% interest ($13.5K over 48mos, with 10% tax and 20% interest is only $460/mo). Unless you've declared bankruptcy recently, you can do better than that. Swapalease or similar isn't going to help you, since you'll need to find somebody willing to pay your payment (or you cover the difference).

Wid-TL

It's not a big deal man. You still have a nice car, and learned a little along the way.

Did you lease through Honda Financial Services? If so, each month your bill will have a line item listed as "Payoff Amount", that is good through that month.

Mine is $22,720, good thru December 9th. 48 month lease, with 17 payments remaining on '05 navi.

I'm guessing that this is shown in the event that you terminate your lease early (trade-in, etc).

You could always call them, and ask them how difficult it would be to either refinance a 60 or 72 month loan through them, or get a loan elsewhere and pay it off the lease.

Good luck

jotty sansotta

I leased through Honda Financial Services. Will they help me at the dealership if I want to try and re finance?

johnnysquire

I hope you're kidding. No, the people who had a financial incentive to hose you will not help un-hose you. Especially not in the first month or two, where they'll lose their $$ if you re-fi.

Think of it this way. You're paying $500/month, and the "loan" at some reasonable interest rate only cost the dealer $400/month. They're pocketing the $100/month difference (in essence). You're already committed, so they have no incentive to change that.

Go to your local bank or, better, if you have one, your credit union. Apply for a loan to buy out/pay off the lease. I think you'll see that you can reduce your payments with a 6 year note and no further cash out-of-pocket. And if you decide to unload the car at some point, it'll be a simple payoff and you can drive as many miles as you'd like until then. Unless your credit really stinks.

joerockt

Im pretty sure that's not how a lease is calculated. You're calculating a conventional loan...

johnnysquire

Dollar-wise, a lease IS just a loan of the difference between the purchase price/capitalized cost and the residual value (a/k/a depreciation) over the term of the lease. They use "money factor" to calculate the monthly payment, but that's just the interest rate divided by 2,400. The residual is an estimate of what the car will be worth at the end of the lease period.

Example - the current promotion on base TLs from the Acura site is 36 months, $359/month, $2000 at signing ($1000 "down", plus fees and first month payment), max 10K miles/year.

It specifies cap cost of $31,725 (MSRP of $34,440, so the price is about $1,500 over invoice - the car price is cap cost PLUS downpayment) and residual of $20,319. That's a "loan" of $11,406 for 36 months, at 8%. Acura doesn't say so, but the money factor is .00333

Anyone with decent credit and a bit of negotiating skill can match or beat that, BTW.

jotty sansotta

I have great credit. 764

johnnysquire

If that's right, and you have some history ("substantial" they call it) you should be looking at loan/lease rates of 6% (money factor of .0025) or less.

CL-SSS

This is true, but the dealer doesn't loose any money from the deal. The more money you finance/lease the more the dealer makes.

Your payment should actually be lower than someone with the navi and the S because the residual value is higher, they must have given you a very high money factor.

nfnsquared

Negative, he's not paying 20%. It's around 10%, or a money factor of 0.00417. Certainly not a great deal, but no where near 20%. Please don't fll his brain with inaccurate figures.

Jolly, you're less than half my age and you're driving a brand new TL! I waited 27 years before I could even think about owning one of these beauties. Again, my advice is to learn from this and then forget about it and enjoy the car. Trust me, 10 years down the road, you'll look back on this and laugh and realize what a valuable lesson you learned.

Just for sh!ts and grins, you might punch in all of your numbers into the lease calc web page link that I gave you earlier and print out the results. Take the print out to your dealer on a busy Saturday and show it to your salesman and tell him how appreciative you are of the "excellent" deal that he gave you. In fact, you're so appreciative that you want to show all the other prospective customers in the showroom what a great deal he gave you. In addition you're going to tell all of your friends and anyone who asks you in passing about your TL about what a great deal he gave you. Then just sit back and watch his face twitch. Oh yeah, might be worthwhile doing the same presentation to the General Manager as well.

joerockt

At your age?

Chris 07 Type S

I have leased 2 cars in my life, and bought both of them. Original value of the car was 40K, the agreed amount to buy the car back at the time the lease was signed was in the low 20's. 60 days out from my leases expiring, they would call and ask me if I was interested in buying the car. I said no. 30 Days out they call again, at this point I offered them 1/2 of what the agreed amount was, they declined. Both times 10 days later they called back with a counter. Both times I paid around 30% less then what I originally agreed to. It is MUCH cheaper for the leasing agent to sell you the car for less then the agreed amount, not only in cost of changing ownership, but they get out from a note that is not barring them any interest into one (if you finance) that bares them interest.

Trust me... They will do a deal at the end of the lease.

jotty sansotta

I plan on making a visit to them this Saturday!

johnnysquire

Apologies - my back of the envelope calculation was off, and I'll edit the previous post if I can, but your 10% is flat wrong. YOUR calculator, with the numbers you gave, says his payment (with tax) should be $473 at 10%.

His payment is $526. Assuming that's with tax, it's 13% (money factor of .0054), which is date-rape for somebody with a 750+ FICO.

johnnysquire

Couldn't edit the previous post, but It's noteworthy that a $31,200 loan ($29900+tax-900down) at 6% for 6 years is $516.

Four years in (when his current lease is up), he'd owe $12K, so he'd be right-side up by $4K, with $500 more cash in his pocket over the term of the lease. I'd say $4,500 on a $30,000 purchase is worth fixing.

sixsixfour

I agree. If that is your score you didnt use it to your full advantage; you could have gotten a better rate/deal, or did a purchase instead of a lease altogether. that being said, it shows just how green you are, and the salesman smelled that a mile away. he knew that either you had a lower credit score or didnt know what you had until it was too late.

sorry bro, you just gotta charge this one to experience.

jotty sansotta

Has anyone else had any experience negotiating the buying price after the lease has ended? How much did you bargain? Is this a viable option?

Joe5.0

For an extra year of payments you could have OWNED the car. Sorry man, better luck next time and dont lease again.

timmahh

Sales people are idiots for the most part.. they're not there to be your friend, they are working.

(If you're a sales person don't chime in with ".. that's not true" etc.)

You probably looked like a treasure chest to the sales person when you walked in, all happy about getting a nice new car, and they give you the BS of "oh we'll take care of you", well they certainly took you.. For me leasing doesn't make any sense, I drive far too much per year and don't see the point of paying for a car for 4 years, then buying it..

At the end of your lease turn the car in, and please talk to people on here first before you buy again - it's good to get feedback and see what others paid BEFORE you dive in.. I was able to get my car deal setup before I even got the dealership, I walked up and someone was waiting for me, the car was less than the already on-sale "internet price".

Read your lease contract and see if there is anyway out of it; if not just stick with it or try doing something with it in a year or so

Who is your finance company ?

timmahh

OMG another southpark avatar! <3

sorry OP

Joe5.0

dAAAArrRRRRR!!!!

Wid-TL

COOP (used to be a member here) tried this, and Honda Financial wouldn't budge on the price. But when I had Hyundai lease, they cut a good bit off. I'll be trying my luck with this for both my wife's MDX and my TL over the next few years.

nfnsquared

It's actually about 10.8%. You can't apply his first payment as part of the down payment or cap cost reduction. Only $974 of the $1500 applies in the lease calculations. If I plug in his revised numbers that he gave:

MSRP $34250
Base/Gross Cap Cost $31142
Cap Cost Reduction $974
Adjusted Cap Cost $30168 (Gross Cap minus Cap Cost Red)
Residual Value $16990 (50%)
Money Factor 0.0045 or 10.8
Local Sales Tax 8% (this is still an estimate, he never said what it was)
Monthly payments = $525.69, which is within 42 cents of his actual payment
Total lease cost =$26284.92, which is $57.17 more that what he said his total lease cost was.

Jotty, have fun at the dealer this weekend. Can't wait to hear what he says!

Dr.Murdock

i also have a 48 month lease(12kmiles) and pay 390 a month with 5k down. buy off at the end is also around 16k.

johnnysquire

FYI - He said the agreed price was 29,990, not 31,142.

nfnsquared

^^^^

jotty sansotta

Hey Guys, I decided to call before I traveled all the way to the dealership and managed to get myself a meeting with the finance manager this Saturday afternoon to discuss my lease.

black label

Sorry Timmahh. got to chime in about the idiots comment.

Wait a minute, I saw the "for the most part" after my initial reaction , I'm satisfied being in the minority that aren't idiots (but that goes beyond sales people to the population at large) .

I'm friendly and a nice guy in general, but your right, I'm not at the dealership to be your friend. It is a job.

On the other hand, I'm on Azine to be a friend to other Acura faithful. To the OP, find out if you have GAP insurance.

bmaczo6

iTrader: (1)

Jotty,
When you enter into a transaction as a buyer it is your responsibility to know how much you should pay. The goal of the seller is to extract as much money from you as possible and (possibly) get you to come back for your next car. I say possibly because many dealers/salesmen think very short term and may only be interested in getting as much money from you now. They acted exactly as we would expect a seller to act. I am sorry, but there is no way to say this gently, it was your fault you paid too much. At this point all you can do is try to move forward and reduce your expenses. As best you can remain calm in any discussion you have with them.

I would guess it is too late for Honda finance to work this up as a purchase instead of a lease but you can ask. As has already been suggested you can check with some other sources for a loan to purchase the car. With your credit score you should have no trouble buying this lease out now and saving some money. This will probably be your best option.

Good luck!

HiTEC

With a credit score like that why didn't you just pay cash for your car? That's what I do with all my cars.

jay0k

Maybe I'm old fashioned but leasing a car to me has always seemed like a bad idea. I'm sure the dealers love it because there are some many different angles to take you at.

When you buy a car outright there is no guessing. You know the purchase price, you know the interest rate, you know the length fo the load. Some simple math and you know your montly payment and total amount paid.

HiTEC

I agree with you 100%, but leasing is a key for some to get more than they can afford. I've bought my past three cars cash, and bought my wifes last car cash, and plan to do that going forward if I can.

You look at all these people getting foreclosed on these days with their sub-prime and bad ARM mortgages. I keep watching these news stories about how the Fed is wanting to bail all these people out that made very bad financial decisions, and I just shake my head. Not the people that ended up in the situation were "poor" they just don't know how to manage their money and spend more than they can afford. When I'm out on the road I look at all these people in their $50K+ SUV's and I wonder if they are the same jackasses waiting for the Fed to bail them out of their mortages and credit card debt??

Sorry to hijack the thread.

jotty sansotta

How much money would you estimate I could save from buying out the lease?

bmaczo6

iTrader: (1)

It is not easy to say. You need to check to see what the current interest rate would be to buy and then run the numbers.

If you were to finance $30,000 at 7% for 5 years the payment would be $594

jazz_123

Well the dealer does lose money when the lease is up and they trying to resell the car!

johnnysquire

nfnsquared - I don't think we're disagreeing about anything other than the difference between the money factor used for calculation and comparable APR (not just the interest rate) - you can ignore the $29,990 number, but that's what he thinks he negotiated, and lease fees would "count" for APR, not principal if you were comparing to a loan.

The stealer threw in the lease fees, or maybe just lied, but it doesn't matter - either way he's paying an absurd amount for the car.

Jotty - to figure it out do a little math -

Lease Payment x Months Left on Lease = X
Payment on Loan to Buyout Lease x Months Left on Lease = Y
Remaining Principal On Loan when Lease would have run out = Z

Your savings is essentially (X - Y)+($16,461 - Z), assuming the residual is really what the car would be worth if you sold it then. Honda is better at guessing that than I am, so it's a good assumption.

U8INIT

What does your credit score have to do with cash on hand?

jazz_123

It doesnt matter if you pay with cash! Dealerships hate cash!