2007 TL Type S 1/4 Mile E.T.
#41
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Originally Posted by Fleet_king_at_va
RIDE OUT THE WHEEL HOP? What magazines have you been reading? Riding out the wheel hop will do some serious damage! Its all about the launch and doing it correctly.
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Originally Posted by U4ICTHEORY
On the way to San Diego from Stockton we managed to stay right behind an M3... turn for turn, straight for straight... though we never passed it up... we also never fell behind... is the TL-S fast?... it's damn fast enough...
Excuse me if I have some trouble with this but my TL 6MTcan't stay with my stock 330Ci 6MT through the twisty & it can't stay with my old Vette 4MT either. This is not a driver issue as the result is regardless which one I am driving at the time.
BTW as for a twisty performance car the TL/TL-S did not even get invited to the last big C&D shootout at VIR a few months back.
This is a list of cars performance & prices published by C&D. All the cars are pure stock effectively driven from the dealers to the test facility Virginia International Raceway. The track is 4.2 miles long, fast & slow turns with good changes in elevation.
The cars are ranked by lap times not price
Corvette Z06 $77, 230 Lap 2.58.2
Porsche GT-3 $121,559 Lap 3.01.8
Corvette $56,056 Lap 3.03.6
*Lotus Exige-S $66,035 Lap?
*Audi R-8 $117,725 Lap?
Porsche 911 Turbo $141,510 Lap 3.05.8
Ford Shelby-GT500 $43,765 Lap 3.05.9
BMW 335i Coupe $ 46,200 Lap 3.10.5
Audi RS-4 $74,325 Lap 3.11.5
BMW Z4-M Coupe $57,500 Lap 3. 11.7
Pontiac Solstice GXP $31,096 Lap 3.13.5
Mazdaspeed-3 $24,650 Lap 3.15.0
Mini Cooper-S $ 26,170 Lap 3.22.9
*Overall finish position listed but not the lap times
#43
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Originally Posted by BEAR-AvHistory
This is the same TL-S that beat the Vette & the SS & runs with an M-3, must be some kind of a super car in disguise.
Excuse me if I have some trouble with this but my TL 6MTcan't stay with my stock 330Ci 6MT through the twisty & it can't stay with my old Vette 4MT either. This is not a driver issue as the result is regardless which one I am driving at the time.
BTW as for a twisty performance car the TL/TL-S did not even get invited to the last big C&D shootout at VIR a few months back.
This is a list of cars performance & prices published by C&D. All the cars are pure stock effectively driven from the dealers to the test facility Virginia International Raceway. The track is 4.2 miles long, fast & slow turns with good changes in elevation.
The cars are ranked by lap times not price
Corvette Z06 $77, 230 Lap 2.58.2
Porsche GT-3 $121,559 Lap 3.01.8
Corvette $56,056 Lap 3.03.6
*Lotus Exige-S $66,035 Lap?
*Audi R-8 $117,725 Lap?
Porsche 911 Turbo $141,510 Lap 3.05.8
Ford Shelby-GT500 $43,765 Lap 3.05.9
BMW 335i Coupe $ 46,200 Lap 3.10.5
Audi RS-4 $74,325 Lap 3.11.5
BMW Z4-M Coupe $57,500 Lap 3. 11.7
Pontiac Solstice GXP $31,096 Lap 3.13.5
Mazdaspeed-3 $24,650 Lap 3.15.0
Mini Cooper-S $ 26,170 Lap 3.22.9
*Overall finish position listed but not the lap times
Excuse me if I have some trouble with this but my TL 6MTcan't stay with my stock 330Ci 6MT through the twisty & it can't stay with my old Vette 4MT either. This is not a driver issue as the result is regardless which one I am driving at the time.
BTW as for a twisty performance car the TL/TL-S did not even get invited to the last big C&D shootout at VIR a few months back.
This is a list of cars performance & prices published by C&D. All the cars are pure stock effectively driven from the dealers to the test facility Virginia International Raceway. The track is 4.2 miles long, fast & slow turns with good changes in elevation.
The cars are ranked by lap times not price
Corvette Z06 $77, 230 Lap 2.58.2
Porsche GT-3 $121,559 Lap 3.01.8
Corvette $56,056 Lap 3.03.6
*Lotus Exige-S $66,035 Lap?
*Audi R-8 $117,725 Lap?
Porsche 911 Turbo $141,510 Lap 3.05.8
Ford Shelby-GT500 $43,765 Lap 3.05.9
BMW 335i Coupe $ 46,200 Lap 3.10.5
Audi RS-4 $74,325 Lap 3.11.5
BMW Z4-M Coupe $57,500 Lap 3. 11.7
Pontiac Solstice GXP $31,096 Lap 3.13.5
Mazdaspeed-3 $24,650 Lap 3.15.0
Mini Cooper-S $ 26,170 Lap 3.22.9
*Overall finish position listed but not the lap times
i never passed up nor pulled close to the M3... i actually was roughly about 6-8 cars behind the whole time... and we wern't racing... just trying to get to so.cal in good time... 75-110 (on a some streches we did get up to about 130-135 but only for short periods of time when traffic broke loose) was our speed range the entire trip... niether of us were pushing it to hard... i did however manage a damn good 27 miles to the gallon on the way there and averaged 78 miles per hour. niether of our cars are supped up in anyway shape or form... it was just a drive, not a competition/race or anything like that... if i came out sounding like that, my appologies to you and your family... again, this wasn't a race, wasn't trying to pass up an M3... wasn't anything like that... not even close, just a benchmark i used... read what i put as far as taking a vette, S2K, M.C. SS... i never once said i kill these cars everyday... just so happend i did that day... why? who knows?... your guess is as good as mine.
#44
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Obviously the person driving the TL-S cannot drive that car. I've seen 2004-06 TL 6mt's run constant low-14's here at the track. The TL-S (with a good driver) is very possible of low 14's or possibly high 13's. This car is pretty powerful for a FWD car (wheel hop/torque steer), but if all of these things are managed with a good 60', then the right times can be in reach.
I plan on taking my TL-S to the track here very shortly to see what I can do with it. I'm just waiting till I change the oil at least once before taking it there.
I plan on taking my TL-S to the track here very shortly to see what I can do with it. I'm just waiting till I change the oil at least once before taking it there.
#45
Originally Posted by BEAR-AvHistory
Car & Driver a few months back when they explained why most people can't match their published acceleration performance numbers at thier local track.
Wow, well I will definitely have to take a look into that. I remember when I first bought my TL-S I tried to launch my car and the thing was wheel hoping like crazy. It took my a few times to learn how to feather out the clutch. The only thing I cannot stand is the FWD.
#46
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I have an '07 TL-S automatic.
I've had many other performance car as well.
My TL-S felt like a "high 14 second car" from the moment I first drove it. My '06 Accord V6 EX 6 speed manual was DEFINITELY quicker.
I didn't really buy the car to drag race people, though. Even the 6 speed manual TL is lame for that purpose in an age when base model Corvettes are running mid twelve second quarter miles.
I see the TL-S as "a nice luxury/sport cruiser."
People over on this thread are telling me how "fast" TLs are while calling 1992 LT1 Corvettes "slow."
https://acurazine.com/forums/showthread.php?t=166737
I've had many other performance car as well.
My TL-S felt like a "high 14 second car" from the moment I first drove it. My '06 Accord V6 EX 6 speed manual was DEFINITELY quicker.
I didn't really buy the car to drag race people, though. Even the 6 speed manual TL is lame for that purpose in an age when base model Corvettes are running mid twelve second quarter miles.
I see the TL-S as "a nice luxury/sport cruiser."
People over on this thread are telling me how "fast" TLs are while calling 1992 LT1 Corvettes "slow."
https://acurazine.com/forums/showthread.php?t=166737
#47
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Originally Posted by harddrivin1le
I have an '07 TL-S automatic.
I've had many other performance car as well.
My TL-S felt like a "high 14 second car" from the moment I first drove it. My '06 Accord V6 EX 6 speed manual was DEFINITELY quicker.
I didn't really buy the car to drag race people, though. Even the 6 speed manual TL is lame for that purpose in an age when base model Corvettes are running mid twelve second quarter miles.
I see the TL-S as "a nice luxury/sport cruiser."
People over on this thread are telling me how "fast" TLs are while calling 1992 LT1 Corvettes "slow."
https://acurazine.com/forums/showthread.php?t=166737
I've had many other performance car as well.
My TL-S felt like a "high 14 second car" from the moment I first drove it. My '06 Accord V6 EX 6 speed manual was DEFINITELY quicker.
I didn't really buy the car to drag race people, though. Even the 6 speed manual TL is lame for that purpose in an age when base model Corvettes are running mid twelve second quarter miles.
I see the TL-S as "a nice luxury/sport cruiser."
People over on this thread are telling me how "fast" TLs are while calling 1992 LT1 Corvettes "slow."
https://acurazine.com/forums/showthread.php?t=166737
(it's what happens when feelings are hurt...)
where did it ever say a corvette was slow?
(feelings hurt again...)
#48
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Originally Posted by U4ICTHEORY
yeah, he's reffering to me...
(it's what happens when feelings are hurt...)
where did it ever say a corvette was slow?
(feelings hurt again...)
(it's what happens when feelings are hurt...)
where did it ever say a corvette was slow?
(feelings hurt again...)
Anyone who's interested can open the link to the thread and read it.
https://acurazine.com/forums/showthread.php?t=166737
Truth be told, a bone stock LT1 Caprice would give a regular TL automatic a damn good run, yet I'll bet you wouldn't call that TL "slow."
The fact of the matter is that when apples to apples are compared (i.e. both cars brand new and bone stock), an LT1 Corvette is CONSIDERABLY faster than ANY Acura TL.
Why is that? The Corvette makes a little more peak power, has more area under the power curve (thanks to all that extra torque), is 250 to 400 pounds lighter (depending on which TL is being compared) and is more aerodynamic.
That's the reality of the situation - regardless of what you or anyone else on the board owns/drives.
#49
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BTW:
The OP of that thread admitted that he didn't know what model year the Corvette was.
It therefore could have EASILY been an L98 'Vette (e.g. 1991), since all 'Vettes from that era look virtually identical. Those made 250 HP, weighed around 3,350 and could run 14.5 @ 98 MPH. That's in the same ball park as a TL/6 speed and is therefore the likely truth in the story.
An LT1 'Vette ('92 through '96) was a much faster car than the L98s.
The OP of that thread admitted that he didn't know what model year the Corvette was.
It therefore could have EASILY been an L98 'Vette (e.g. 1991), since all 'Vettes from that era look virtually identical. Those made 250 HP, weighed around 3,350 and could run 14.5 @ 98 MPH. That's in the same ball park as a TL/6 speed and is therefore the likely truth in the story.
An LT1 'Vette ('92 through '96) was a much faster car than the L98s.
#50
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i agree on the tracking'. i modded the hell out of my last car, and loved street racing it... but never cared to take it to the track....
did you ever think of other things too? maybe the driver weighs 250lbs... hes got stuff in the trunk... all that stuff plays in on 1/4 times.....
i think the car is fast enough..... with a 330ciC (notice, conv.) (5AT) and a CLK 55 (conv) (5AT).. my new TL-S (and my old TL) were in the middle.... beats the pants off my buddies 330ci 2door... the 335i... well... thats a whole other ball park, and an additional $10,000+
did you ever think of other things too? maybe the driver weighs 250lbs... hes got stuff in the trunk... all that stuff plays in on 1/4 times.....
i think the car is fast enough..... with a 330ciC (notice, conv.) (5AT) and a CLK 55 (conv) (5AT).. my new TL-S (and my old TL) were in the middle.... beats the pants off my buddies 330ci 2door... the 335i... well... thats a whole other ball park, and an additional $10,000+
#51
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Originally Posted by harddrivin1le
BTW:
The OP of that thread admitted that he didn't know what model year the Corvette was.
It therefore could have EASILY been an L98 'Vette (e.g. 1991), since all 'Vettes from that era look virtually identical. Those made 250 HP, weighed around 3,350 and could run 14.5 @ 98 MPH. That's in the same ball park as a TL/6 speed and is therefore the likely truth in the story.
An LT1 'Vette ('92 through '96) was a much faster car than the L98s.
The OP of that thread admitted that he didn't know what model year the Corvette was.
It therefore could have EASILY been an L98 'Vette (e.g. 1991), since all 'Vettes from that era look virtually identical. Those made 250 HP, weighed around 3,350 and could run 14.5 @ 98 MPH. That's in the same ball park as a TL/6 speed and is therefore the likely truth in the story.
An LT1 'Vette ('92 through '96) was a much faster car than the L98s.
what did the 92 geo metro hit in the 1/4?
bet it was hot as balls...
no hard feelings for anyone... may we all drive in peace... 1/4 mile time aside, top speed aside, driver vs car aside... and finally... ego's aside...
thank you and good night...
#52
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Originally Posted by U4ICTHEORY
what did the 92 geo metro hit in the 1/4?
bet it was hot as balls...
bet it was hot as balls...
I like my TL-S - for what it is. It's not a true high performance car, though, regardless of how Acura chooses to market it.
My baseline for "a true high performance car" has always been the Corvette. One has to go all the way back to the 1991 Corvette (last of the L98s) in order to find one that was about as quick as a new TL 6speed.
EVERY 'Vette built after that is faster. And comparing model year to model year (the only truly fair comparison), an '08, base model 'Vette will absolutely destroy any '08 TL (while providing very similar fuel economy).
That's not to say that the 'Vette is "better." Rather, it's market and intended mission are different.
#53
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Originally Posted by harddrivin1le
No idea.
I like my TL-S - for what it is. It's not a true high performance car, though, regardless of how Acura chooses to market it.
My baseline for "a true high performance car" has always been the Corvette. One has to go all the way back to the 1991 Corvette (last of the L98s) in order to find one that was about as quick as a new TL 6speed.
EVERY 'Vette built after that is faster. And comparing model year to model year (the only truly fair comparison), an '08, base model 'Vette will absolutely destroy any '08 TL (while providing very similar fuel economy).
That's not to say that the 'Vette is "better." Rather, it's market and intended mission are different.
I like my TL-S - for what it is. It's not a true high performance car, though, regardless of how Acura chooses to market it.
My baseline for "a true high performance car" has always been the Corvette. One has to go all the way back to the 1991 Corvette (last of the L98s) in order to find one that was about as quick as a new TL 6speed.
EVERY 'Vette built after that is faster. And comparing model year to model year (the only truly fair comparison), an '08, base model 'Vette will absolutely destroy any '08 TL (while providing very similar fuel economy).
That's not to say that the 'Vette is "better." Rather, it's market and intended mission are different.
IMO.... this is my competition...
LEX IS300
INF G35
VOL S60-R
JAG TYPE-S
BMW 330I
MBZ 320 KOMP
AUDI A4
what am i missing here?
#54
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Originally Posted by U4ICTHEORY
AGREED... we shouldn't even compare the two... totally different classes of cars... what do domestics have that compare to the TL-S? after thinking for about 3 seconds... i couldn't think of any... LOL
IMO.... this is my competition...
LEX IS350
INF G35
VOL S60-R
JAG TYPE-S
BMW 328I
MBZ 320 KOMP
AUDI A4
what am i missing here?
IMO.... this is my competition...
LEX IS350
INF G35
VOL S60-R
JAG TYPE-S
BMW 328I
MBZ 320 KOMP
AUDI A4
what am i missing here?
thats just me though.
#55
Exactly. Why are we comparing the TL to a american muscle? The only thing that makes the corvette a better car is the performance, Thats it. Here are the main competetors for the 2007/08 TL-S
Infiniti G35
Lexus IS-350
BMW 328/330
Mercedes C-Class
Audi A4
Infiniti G35
Lexus IS-350
BMW 328/330
Mercedes C-Class
Audi A4
#56
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Originally Posted by Fleet_king_at_va
Exactly. Why are we comparing the TL to a american muscle? The only thing that makes the corvette a better car is the performance, Thats it. Here are the main competetors for the 2007/08 TL-S
Infiniti G35
Lexus IS-350
BMW 328/330
Mercedes C-Class
Audi A4
Infiniti G35
Lexus IS-350
BMW 328/330
Mercedes C-Class
Audi A4
is there nothing from the domestics?
where is the TL-S sold at?
i know for sure here but where else?
#57
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Originally Posted by U4ICTHEORY
i have this feeling we're missing something?...
is there nothing from the domestics?
is there nothing from the domestics?
Chrysler 300/300C
Saab 9-3 and 9-5
Maybe the Lincoln LS (now replaced by the MKZ).
#58
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Originally Posted by Will Y.
Cadillac CTS, you shnooks!
Chrysler 300/300C
Saab 9-3 and 9-5
Maybe the Lincoln LS (now replaced by the MKZ).
Chrysler 300/300C
Saab 9-3 and 9-5
Maybe the Lincoln LS (now replaced by the MKZ).
-ah yes... the chrysler 300/300C does that include the charger? the lincoln LS is also a competitor to bad it's no longer around...
-any one know about the MKZ... isn't it a V6 W/ 260HP and AWD? sounds pretty nice....
-would anyone include the Mazda 6 in this line up?
-saab, jaguar, mbz... and yes... acura... are all american car companies... so my TL-S is technically not an import since it is from Acura of North America ...
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Originally Posted by JD TL-S
NO thanks with the american made cars.......
but... i come from a background where 440 6-packs, 5.0 stangs and 454 bow ties are gods... so i can't diss the muscle...
Acura is an American Brand (but owned by honda)... it is not, i repeat, is not a full fleged japanese car... so the TL-S is american born but raised by a family of japanese with a racing heritage... hope that makes every domestic lover feel a little better about owning a japanese car...
to me i kinda feel like i got the best of both worlds... American muscle (Kinda) and Japanese inginuity (god knows i can't spell)...
it's like the best Sushi in Detroit...
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Originally Posted by JD TL-S
NO thanks with the american made cars.......
#65
Originally Posted by BEAR-AvHistory
Acura TL - designed in California Built in Ohio with mostly US sourced parts.
#66
Senior Moderator
Well, coming from an 02 Maxima (4AT), having driven the 3G TL (non-Type S 5AT) and now owning an 07 AV6 EX-L, I am fairly convinced that the Accord/TL is simply does not have the lowend prowess attributable to a good drag racing car (though an MT should make up some ground here).
With regard to domestic competitors to the TL-S, likely only the CTS comes close. While the 300C and Lincoln LSV8 could be considered so technically, I seriously doubt many folks are cross shopping them with the TL. Also, to some degree, the ES350 can also be considered a competitor despite its more plush orientation.
With regard to domestic competitors to the TL-S, likely only the CTS comes close. While the 300C and Lincoln LSV8 could be considered so technically, I seriously doubt many folks are cross shopping them with the TL. Also, to some degree, the ES350 can also be considered a competitor despite its more plush orientation.
#67
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OH I agree BIG TIME
Originally Posted by U4ICTHEORY
as a honda fanatic and loyalist... i'm on your side with that...
but... i come from a background where 440 6-packs, 5.0 stangs and 454 bow ties are gods... so i can't diss the muscle...
Acura is an American Brand (but owned by honda)... it is not, i repeat, is not a full fleged japanese car... so the TL-S is american born but raised by a family of japanese with a racing heritage... hope that makes every domestic lover feel a little better about owning a japanese car...
to me i kinda feel like i got the best of both worlds... American muscle (Kinda) and Japanese inginuity (god knows i can't spell)...
it's like the best Sushi in Detroit...
but... i come from a background where 440 6-packs, 5.0 stangs and 454 bow ties are gods... so i can't diss the muscle...
Acura is an American Brand (but owned by honda)... it is not, i repeat, is not a full fleged japanese car... so the TL-S is american born but raised by a family of japanese with a racing heritage... hope that makes every domestic lover feel a little better about owning a japanese car...
to me i kinda feel like i got the best of both worlds... American muscle (Kinda) and Japanese inginuity (god knows i can't spell)...
it's like the best Sushi in Detroit...
thru 1971. Chevy, Ford, Dodge, I wish I was Jay Leno. But for new cars I won't
EVER by a Dodge or Ford, YUK SHIT, IMO. If I EVER buy another American car
it will BE A G.M. With 1 exception, the 2008 Dodge Challanger SRT Hemi. BUT
I don't have $50k or more for a car like this.
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This IS WHAT I MEAN
Originally Posted by Fleet_king_at_va
Even though the TL is assembled in Detroit and most of the parts are sourced from the US doesnt make the TL American. The TL made by Acura is still designed by the Japanese. Correct me if I'm wrong.
BUILT 100% IN Japan.....
#69
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Originally Posted by Fleet_king_at_va
The TL made by Acura is still designed by the Japanese. Correct me if I'm wrong.
#70
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Originally Posted by JD TL-S
OK A JAP CAR, WHOM ever builds it. If I had a choice I would prefer it was
BUILT 100% IN Japan.....
BUILT 100% IN Japan.....
word is, their selling the TL in china... with acura badging...
and i believe that there is one person on this site who lives in japan and has had his 3rd gen shipped there... so... one step closer... JDM here we come?....
I LIKE THE WHOLE 2:CENTS THING... nice nice...
#71
Regarding these competitors, we're all talking about stock for stock right?
JD TL-S you said other cars had some minor bolt ons... so how would our TL-S fair at the track with the CAI and exhaust? Many of us have those.
JD TL-S you said other cars had some minor bolt ons... so how would our TL-S fair at the track with the CAI and exhaust? Many of us have those.
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Originally Posted by spiike
Regarding these competitors, we're all talking about stock for stock right?
JD TL-S you said other cars had some minor bolt ons... so how would our TL-S fair at the track with the CAI and exhaust? Many of us have those.
JD TL-S you said other cars had some minor bolt ons... so how would our TL-S fair at the track with the CAI and exhaust? Many of us have those.
just so everyone knows... what track do you reffer to?
drag? or circuit?
i believe that on the circuit the TL-S is a way better car then most would think.
going straight... hmm... i'd get a different car... 4 door, luxury cars shouldn't be dragging... it's almost tasteless...
#73
Originally Posted by U4ICTHEORY
just so everyone knows... what track do you reffer to?
drag? or circuit?
i believe that on the circuit the TL-S is a way better car then most would think.
going straight... hmm... i'd get a different car... 4 door, luxury cars shouldn't be dragging... it's almost tasteless...
drag? or circuit?
i believe that on the circuit the TL-S is a way better car then most would think.
going straight... hmm... i'd get a different car... 4 door, luxury cars shouldn't be dragging... it's almost tasteless...
of the current american cars available the only one I would even think of purchasing would be a Vette. Give me a Z06 and I'm happy.
#74
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Originally Posted by U4ICTHEORY
....
-saab, jaguar, mbz... and yes... acura... are all american car companies... so my TL-S is technically not an import since it is from Acura of North America ...
-saab, jaguar, mbz... and yes... acura... are all american car companies... so my TL-S is technically not an import since it is from Acura of North America ...
Originally Posted by BEAR-AvHistory
Acura TL - designed in California Built in Ohio with mostly US sourced parts.
Originally Posted by Fleet_king_at_va
Even though the TL is assembled in Detroit and most of the parts are sourced from the US doesnt make the TL American. The TL made by Acura is still designed by the Japanese. Correct me if I'm wrong.
Since when is Detroit in Ohio? Here let me get you a map ( ):
j/k
:wink:
#75
Originally Posted by BEAR-AvHistory
The TL was developed by a design studio in California called Honda R&D Americas, Inc. not in Tokyo.
#76
Originally Posted by Bearcat94
Wait a second ... MBZ is not an Amercian company, is it?
Opps my bad. For some reason I had detroit in my head. Marysville, Ohio is where everything is mostly done at.
Since when is Detroit in Ohio? Here let me get you a map ( ):
j/k
:wink:
Opps my bad. For some reason I had detroit in my head. Marysville, Ohio is where everything is mostly done at.
Since when is Detroit in Ohio? Here let me get you a map ( ):
j/k
:wink:
Opps my bad. For some reason I had detroit in my head. Marysville, Ohio is where everything is mostly done at.
#77
Reply
I was just at Union Grove Raceway in Wisconsin. They were having an
Import Wars special event. The weather was great. 70 degrees and sunny.
The cars were getting great traction. The only TL there was an 07 TL-S
with an auto. Its best 1/4 mile was 14.85 seconds and the worst was 15.05.
NOT very impressive. There were MANY Dodge Neon SRT's running high 12's
and low to mid 13 second 1/4 mile runs. SO many Civic's with minor add-ons
running much faster then the TL-S. Even a stock Civic Si wasn't much slower
then the TL-S. I was wondering why SO many other cars were blowing away
the TL-S. Even Cobalt LS was about as fast, or should I say as slow as the TL-S.
Import Wars special event. The weather was great. 70 degrees and sunny.
The cars were getting great traction. The only TL there was an 07 TL-S
with an auto. Its best 1/4 mile was 14.85 seconds and the worst was 15.05.
NOT very impressive. There were MANY Dodge Neon SRT's running high 12's
and low to mid 13 second 1/4 mile runs. SO many Civic's with minor add-ons
running much faster then the TL-S. Even a stock Civic Si wasn't much slower
then the TL-S. I was wondering why SO many other cars were blowing away
the TL-S. Even Cobalt LS was about as fast, or should I say as slow as the TL-S.
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Acura TL Builder (10-02-2022)