rexracer

Just purchased 05 Tl with Navi. The built date is March 2005. The car has 600 miles on it. The car has developed an annoying vibration that can be felt through the steering wheel and gas pedal. The vibration does not cause the steering wheel to shimmy. However, I have notice over the past week that the vibration has gotten worse. The vibration noticeable at most speeds. Does this sound like the vibration problems that some people have experienced? If so I thought this was supposed to be fixed with the 05’s. Is there any fix for this?

rets

Welcome to the forum

Sorry to hear that. Could you identify when/where your TL will develop that annoying vibration? Like MPH, RPM, gears, etc. Thanks.

ndx2

hi rex-
is your car MT or AT?

jtow

Rex, is there any noise associated with the vibration?

thegabrielles

That does not sound like the vibration I had with my 04, If I had to pick a direction I would say I felt it more in the seat than the steering wheel. If it is getting worse you might want to get those front tires checked. If you hit a curb or even a bad pothole you could have a bad tire on it. Although that can cause a pull also. Normally if it is a bad tire you will feel it at low speeds as well, almost feels like a warped rotor. Either way GOOD LUCK!!!! Mt new 05 is a Mar05 build car so I certainley dont want to hear about vibration issues with them!!!!

rexracer

My car has a AT. Vibration occurs between 1200 - 2500 rpms and between 40-60 mph. I have an appointment to bring the car to the dealer next week.

thegabrielles

Yikes...that sounds like mine after all. My vibration really seemed to start at about 55mph and went up. Keep us posted!!!!

For Your info, when replacing my old (2004) TL with the new one I talked to several managers through Acura. They admit there is a vibration with the TL but they feel it is inherant with the car. Did you get the Navi? If sop it comes with Michelans(much better tire) the non Navi cars still come with Bridgestones all though they supposedly fixed the problems with the tire.

rexracer

My car has a Navi and the Michelins. I don't think the vibratrion is related to a tire balancing. I also forgot to metion that the sterring wheel will vibtrate around 1100-1500 rpms when the car is parked and I rev the engine.

Brewmaster

well that's not good ... could it be a pulley/fly wheel???

need4spd

Rexracer, sorry, sounds like the harmonic resonence issue Acura has with the TL, they still have yet to fix it in a year and a half from when they first knew of it.

thegabrielles

I was not refering to a balance issue but a bad tire. Never actually ran mine up to 1500 while in park so I don tknow if thats an issue. Experiance with other cars has taught me that without a load on the motor vibrations can come from an engine, and they do seem to go away at increased RPM. I am going to guess that you believe it is the same issue. If so then I wonder if it could be those motor mounts, If you dont already know it they use speed to increase there stiffness. Its a hydraulic mount that uses vacuum to adjust. While working on my 04, I found out that this is where the "harmonic Vibration" seems to be coming from, it starts with the tires and suspension but ultimitely it is the engine vibration that is felt through the car. Hopefully your dealer will treat you right and know just what to do. I'll bet they balance the tires before touching anything else.

rets

Could be. Sounds like that.

https://acurazine.com/forums/showthread.php?t=90614

https://acurazine.com/forums/showthread.php?t=94301

ThaShef

Rexracer, I think I have the same problem as you but so far I thought it was a common problem. I am wondering if I should take it into the dealer to have it checked out. My Car was built on Jan 28th, 2005

Xpditor

Well, guys...

I have a theory about this vibration. Here it is.

The wheel hubs are balanced at the factory. Then, when the wheels and tires are installed, they are balanced and mounted on the car. So far, so good.

Then, for almost every car, the dealer removes one of the wheel lug nuts and replaces it with a locking one that is not the same weight.

Now, all the wheel/tire combinations are no longer balanced.

But... if you take the wheel and tire off and check it, it will still be balanced because the lug nuts are not on it. The mechanic scratches his head, puts the tire back on, installs the 4 lug nuts and 1 locking lug nut and the vibration is still there.

To prove this theory, I need a volunteer who has a gram scale (no questions asked ) and who will remove a stock lug nut and a locking lug nut and compare their weights.

If they are identical, my theory is wrong. If they are different....

Mystery solved!

-XP

KJSmitty

I actually have a scale and performed your idea in Dec 03 when I installed the locks. The locks did weigh more but less than 2/10 of an ounce if I remember correctly. Besides, at their location/spinning "diameter" it would take quite the difference to feel anything other than even a finite vibration. IE, one ounce of weight at the rim edge would probably equate to 6-10 ounces at the lug area of rotation.

Xpditor

That is almost 6 grams of weight out of balance. What kind of locking lugs did you have?

I know that the lug nuts are different sizes between the TL, RSX, TSX, MDX. Each has a different length although I believe the thread is the same on all.

I'm willing to bet that there is only one size of locking lug nut used by the dealer.

What kind did you get? The Acura part? Or after-market generic?

sftroy

There may be vibs from a tire being off balance due to the lug nuts/locks, however, the 1500/1800 RPM at high speeds vibs are definately caused by something else. My 04 was balanced by Acura 3 times and once by Bridgestone/Firestone - vibrations continued. Its not the tires as I had the PVC EL42's and the TU2 EL42's as well as LS-Zs. The vibs in my 04 were so significant that the steering wheel shook and the vibs could be felt on the gas pedal and seat.

My 05 has a similar slight vibration, nothing like the 04, but its there. I tried to get the dealer to perform the "fix" but they have not acknowledged any abnormal vibrations . . . gonna switch dealers and try again.

Keep bugging ACS about this issue - they have had enough time to determine a fix . . . .

MonkeyVillage

check tires and alignment first

vibration problem in 2004 TL is steering wheel related. but dealer tells us its normal for the 2004 TL.

MonkeyVillage

tires, smires! the 2004 Tl has vibration problem in some cars (not sure what % of all) but dealer says its "normal" for the model. we are fighting to fix it via micheline tires or new car.

KJSmitty

"Up the wrong tree"??? It wouldn't matter if I had a lock from Home Depot...

Anyway,
Have the Acura locks... used a small cheap mail scale... I don't remember the numbers but for example, - say the lugnut was 1.0 ounces the lock weighed in at 1.1 etc. Something like that anyway-who knows the accuracy of my scale.. I would have to do it again to be sure but have no need to.
I reiterate (physics 101 here), an ounce off at the center of the rim is not the same as an ounce off at the rim edge. You could leave a 1-2 ounce lug nut off and it wouldn't remotely feel like having 1-2 ounces off at the rim edge - IE were you place the weights... Thus, any small amount of wt difference between lugnuts/locks would be benign in regards to "wheel balance"
Have you've ever used a wheel balancer.? One of the reasons it has to know the diameter of the rim is so it knows where/how to calculate the weight required.


Cheers

asenj

My 05 TL, automatic, non-nav (Bridgestone tires) has a similar vibration problem. The car was in to the dealer at 1000 miles on April 11, 2005. I was again told at that time the vibration problem in the 04s had been solved (as I had been told when I bought the car), did not exist in the 05s, and was the first customer with an 05 complaining of a vibration problem. I was told later that day that the vibration problem was experienced by their service people but was taken care of by balancing the tires. The vibration problem still exists (constant low vibration at times on highways at different speeds and felt thru lower part of car and gas pedal). To go back to dealer this Friday and service manager to drive car.

Any advice as to what should be done to fix problem?

rexracer

I’m pretty much in the same boat. My car is an 05 with Navi and has the Michelin tires. Tires were balanced and steering wheel aligned this week. This has helped to some extent but the vibration is still there when I hit about 60 mph. Still feels that the wheels are still out of balance. I did a search and I don’t believe my dealer or any other Acura or Honda dealer in my area has the Hunter tire balancing machines which are considered the gold standard for wheel balancing. I’m scratching my head here because all of the other luxury dealers (Audi, BMW, Lexus, Mercedes) in my area have Hunters. Does Honda have something against Hunter??? I have an appointment to drop off my car again next week. I’ll be driving my car with the technician to show the vibration issue. I better not get any of the BS that it’s “a normal characteristic of the car”. If that’s the case then they should have disclosed that when I bought the car otherwise I would have purchased something else.

asenj

Others experiencing this problem should join in. It would be helpful to know what fixes were attempted (any successful?).

Peters

I've had a slight vibration since new particularly noticable at about 130km/h. I have an'04 and the tires and rims were replaced about three months into ownership. I don't know whether its suspension set-up, the tires, or something else, but I've given up. I bought a 911 Carerra 4 as my other car, and when I compare the two after I've just driven the Porsche, the TL seems like a taxi! LOL. I think the TL is a good car, but not that good. I still think Honda has a way to go to make it feel like a BMW, if that is even a realistic comparison.

fasttl

You must not have a six speed. I have wiped my butt with several early 90's carreras

Peters

I have a 5AT. But my 2000 911 C4 is quite something, particularly over 100km/h. There is no comparison on many fronts, nor would I suggest one should directly compare the two.

I think the TL is still a good car for what it is, and its a good price....so all in all it's not bad.

mickey3c

that means driveline vibrations and all! Some people are easy to please. I would not think bragging about beating a 10+ year old car is somethig to write home about.

fasttl

Ten years ago a carrera was $65,000. It's just wonderful to spank a "sports" car that cost twice as much, especialy, when the owners swear that there is no way in hell a "Honda" can make them eat dust

Peters

Well you can get a good 2000 or better Carrera for that kind of money now with Porsche Stability Management, four wheel drive and the ability to go 172 mph. And if you actually had to negotiate a race track, and stop quickly, the "Honda" would be in the ditch with its brakes, turned to dust or warped to hell. Ten years ago, a Honda was....well a Honda. Its nice for you to fantasize once in a while, but you gotta lay off the hallucinogens. LOL

Xpditor

Oh, yeah? How do your Porsche binders match up against these Honda brakes:
15" drilled, vented rotors, and 8 piston calipers.

Peters

[COLOR=Black][COLOR=Yellow][QUOTE=Xpditor]Oh, yeah? How do your Porsche binders match up against these Honda brakes:
15" drilled, vented rotors, and 8 piston calipers.

No idea. Don't care either.

Xpditor

[QUOTE=Peters][COLOR=Black][COLOR=Yellow]You're the one that said the "Honda" would be in the ditch with brakes wharped and turned to dust.

I am suggesting the brakes on the "Honda" RL 4 Dr Sedan A-Spec are probably much better than the brakes on a Porsche that's a few years old. I know they are much better than a Corvette's.

Stereotyping=condemnation before investigation.

Peters

I don't know whether the RL A'Specs are "much" better than a Porsche or Corvette braking system. Anything from 2000 or newer in the the Carrera4 has outstanding stopping power. My 04TL, doesn't even come close to the braking power of a Carrera or Corvette.

If you want to compare the upscale RL A-Spec brakes, compare them to the optional Porsche Ceramic Composite Brakes (PCCB). I would bet even the stock Porsche brakes are comparable. Would my 04TL's brakes turn to dust on the track after a hard day of driving comparable to a Carrera4??...no doubt in my mind. Two completely different cars.

rexracer

Update:

I got me car back from the dealership earlier this week and the steering wheel still vibrates. The dealership called me yesterday to follow-up on how satisfied I was with their service. Needless to say I was not a happy camper. About 15 minutes after I spoke with the customer service rep, I received a phone call from the Service Manager. I spoke with Service Manager regarding my vibration problem and vented some of my frustration. The steering wheel appears to have two vibration issues: the normal exhaust vibration as it relates to the acceleration of the vehicle which does not bother me that much and appears to be exacerbated by a wheel balancing issue which causes the steering wheel to vibrate when the car is moving between 40-80 mph (vibration occurs even when I take my foot off the gas pedal). When I brought in my car last week for servicing, the wheels were checked on my dealer’s balancing machine and of course all the wheels were fine and required no adjustments. I asked the service manager whether they had a Hunter balancing machine. He said no. I told him that all of the other luxury brands (BMW, Audi, Lexus, Mercedes, etc.) use Hunter machines to balance their vehicles’ wheels and that Hunter is considered the “gold standard” in the industry. He agreed and even said that he might talk to management about purchasing a Hunter machine at his next meeting considering that most Acuras have high performance tires and that high performance tires are usually sensitive when it comes to balancing. The service manager offered to take my car to a “sister” dealership that has a Hunter balancing machine which of course I agreed to have done. Kudos for service! I’m keeping my fingers crossed.

fasttl

The reason the carrera brakes like there is no tomorrow is the tires. The contact patch on a carreras ultra wide tires is 50% larger than the TL's. The TL's brembos are just as good if not better brakes, plus they are devoid of fade. The 6 spd has comparable braking to a porsche boxster for 15 k less, not only that, it is faster too(non type S)!

Peters

Tires aside, if you've ever driven one on a track for a day, you realize the Porsche brakes themselves are absolutely bullet proof. I have not driven the TL on the track, so I can't relate as to the durability of the TL's brakes. As to comparing a 6spd to a Boxter...well wishfull thinking on your part. Maybe in a straight line there's some kind of comparison you can make, but try it on a track or even at high speed. The new Boxters (non-S versions) are quite something. I don't think its a meaningful comparison at all. Trust me on this one.

Tripnbeats

I was driving my junk box the other day and at 60 my wheel started shaking..... wondering what it could be i pulled over thinking maybe i didnt have the tires balanced right but thats not possible ( I just got new ones), so im looking at mechanical and I see some black shit leaking down the side of the motor mount.... YUPPPPP broken!.... so i ordered the piece from acura of delray and it was fairly cheap 30$ but when the 07 type s part are available IM ordering the mount from that sucker. I already checked out the 07 type s in stick at the dealer and the mounting looks exact except the rubber is beefier....

Steel2686

To get back on subject, I have an 05 w/navi, however, it has Firestone Widetracks on it. I have no vibration, and I also have no wheel locks on my car either. I was going to pick up a set, so I'll let you know if it changes at all.

jag123

I have this vibration too. It starts at 50mph and up. I have 3 sets of rims and rubber, the vibration is there for all 3. I have 5 lock nuts on each rim, so the weight is the same for all wheels. So its not a weight issue. I have to agree that its a vibration that comes from tire and road, but then moves into the engine and thats the driveline vibration. Its annoying

KJSmitty

Having new and/or perfectly balanced tires doesn't mean the "tires" aren't still the issue.. The tire can be balanced yet if the inner makings/belts etc. of the tire are not true, or the tread and overall tire is not perfectly round you will definitely get vibrations at highway speeds.
Sure the Hunter road force balancer does a better job of identifying and "smoothing" this issue out but it's not a fix all.. Besides, most balance shops using the Hunter tend to set (yes, it's shop defined) the "parameters" of "excessive road force" high enough so their cheaper tires don't consistently show "bad" when spun.... Basically you could say many tire manufacturers dislike the Hunter because it identifies quality control issues within the tire manufacturing process.

Bottom line, if the Hunter machine was set to the degree where it would identify tire issues significant enough to exhibit vibration at highway speeds, near all tires would fail the "road force" test.....