All of us PAWS owners know about our suspension woes. This past weekend my wife and I flew to StL to tend to some family business in IL and to attend a friend's son's wedding in Bloomington, IL. Since I knew I would be doing a lot of driving in the 4 days I upped my reserved full size car (Camry) to a premium level Chrysler 300. Nice car but not quite the level of RLX appointments and fit 'n finish, BUT, the suspension was so much better than the RLX, and not just a little bit better. The ride was so much better, less harsh, and much more comfortable - and the 300 is a much lesser car than the RLX. I was almost embarrassed by the difference in feel. How did Acura screw this up so badly? They should allow the PAWS owners some form of TSB to get the ride back to where is should be for a $60K car. I have been a Honda/Acura owner since 1991 and honestly, this may be my last Acura due to the ride of my 2 yo RLX Adv. Not only did Acura drop the ball on this design but also took the air out of it. Shame on you engineers who allowed this to happen. I have been a proponent of the RLX since purchase in Aug 2013 but after the comparison this past weekend I can say that I am honesty shocked that Acura would allow this car to go to production with this suspension. There, I said it...the suspension is a woefully, poor design. Now, Acura, do something about it for current PAWS owners to help save your customer base. Your test mules should be compensated with more than oats.

 

Finally, I am not alone in how bad they screwed it up.

It really does take getting into another vehicle (in this case, pretty much ANY vehicle) to immediately tell how poorly designed the suspension is on the 2014 PAWS.

Thank you Miner for speaking up and supporting what I have been saying for a loooong time now.

 

I believe Acura in general is aimed towards a more sportier crowd and therefore the suspension tuning. But in a 60k family sedan, they should have thought otherwise. May be create a separate model series for sport oriented cars like the Germans do. Their SUVs on the other hand have a "comfy" enough suspension and are selling well.

 

^they did.

they have the sporty SH-SHAWD electric hybrid top of the line flagship

then they have the PAWS front wheel drive version.

Acura screwed up the less sporty one's suspension, Comfy.

 

Did you guys test drive the car? Not at all doubting your claims but you'd think you would have noticed this at that time? Or is it something that gets worse with time?

 

It appears to be something that worsens with time, dom. It's not a matter of people missing it during the test drive. This is a well-documented issue on the forum here, and not just from miner and holographique, others with early to mid build 2014s were affected by this.

Acura has been trying to fix the various suspension problems in the early PAWS RLX but honestly, they need to swap out the 2014 suspension with whatever they did for the 2016 to satisfy people.

The only other solution is for those who choose to remain with the brand, to upgrade to a 2015 PAWS, or any year Sport Hybrid. Unfortunately, because word has gotten around that the early 2014 PAWS cars suck so badly, the resale value makes it hard to trade out of one without losing your shirt, and some have chosen to lose their shirt to get out of their 2014 PAWS.

I hate to say it, but it may have simply been better for the RLX to remain vaporware for another year before a simultaneous release of PAWS and Sport Hybrid, with correct fixes. However, that's water under the bridge now. They're going through this with the NSX, delaying release rather than releasing a car with issues from the get--mayhap Acura has learned.

 

Not trying to be a prick by any means. Just wondering why it wasn't noticed earlier or before purchase. Thanks for the explanation Bob.

 

...and from I have been reading, much of this is the damper / strut valve issue, which permeates most all of the Acura models. The struts I replaced on my RL, over time created this harsh crashing on minor bumps.

What it has made clear (especially by the latest TSB) is that the 2016 PAWs and the SH models have different components.

 

Completely fair question Dom. And here's my response: no it was not noticed during the test drive for two very important reasons:

1) most dealerships are in the burbs, where road conditions are FAR better than what you find in the city.

2) based on my excellent previous experience with Acura suspension quality in my 06 TL (and the various Acura's I've driven as loaners during the lifetime of my 06 TL), I didn't think I had to make a concerted and focused effort to test out bad road conditions when test driving an Acura vehicle that cost $30k more than my previous Acura. I think it was a fair assumption that, shit...I'm paying more, it should drive the same if not better than my 06 TL. No?

That is what is all came down to for me and how I got stuck in the situation I am in now. With a $60k vehicle whereby my driving enjoyment is mared every single time I get in to drive because of a poorly designed suspension system. And that is where I feel Acura owes me (and others) for not having pulled through on expectations of their quality that they themselves had built up to the point of the 2014 RLX PAWS vehicle. Add to that the poor residual of this car, it just leaves one with a really bad taste in your mouth.

Like Bob said, the least Acura could do is provide a complete replacement of the suspension system on the 2014 models to match that of the 2016 models that were fixed. Which again is pure proof that Acura acknowledges the 2014 design was flawed. To the point of making a very pointed statement about it in the 2016 model news release.

 

I think this is where we keep being misunderstood in our complaints about the suspension in the 2014 PAWS RLX.

When the car is on good pavement, it is the Acura "sport tuned" suspension experience we have all come to love. It is why I drive Acura's. It was what I experienced and came used to in my 06 TL and every other Acura vehicle I've driven to date. So let's be clear, this is NOT what we are complaining about.

What we are complaining about is the complete lack of compliant behavior and recovery of the vehicle when hitting bad road conditions, which does exist in EVERY OTHER ACURA. The chassis takes the brunt of the energy force instead of the shocks. And it takes it with a hard shock/slamming feeling. It feels like the chassis is ready to break. NO other Acura I've driven (RDX, TLX, MDX, ILX, TSX, TL) has EVER experienced this type of behavior. Period.

 

A definite nerve is hit with this initial posting. It seems as if Honda acquired a mid 90's hunday with 250k hard miles and told the engineers to 'make it as good'.
Firmness is subjective,, but my vette is much firmer but does not rattle over every bump.
I too have rented many a car since my RLX purchase - NONE have had such rattle weirdness as the RLX. And the rattles definitely contribute to the overall feeling that the suspension is sub par. The other rented cars seemed just as 'firm', some even had 19 inch wheels, but don't send rattly feedback at every little bump.
My test drive when purchasing seemed quite OK, but I regret most test miles were highway and the road noise masked the suspension defects.


Acura slipped this one over on a prior RL owner... not again for sure.
Still hoping for an updated TSB...


I got the AC moan thingy conquered, but this truly needs new parts that actually work.

 

^^^^^
Well, I think you mean the first year 1G Hyundai Genesis, which went through similar suspension growing pains and had similar complaints, to the point that Hyundai made significant changes for the second model year.

 

Holografique, I hope this makes you feel a little better. I am longtime with the brands and test drove an early RLX when it first came out. I felt a jarring feeling on the test drive. Even having felt it myself once I could not believe I felt it and only remembered it later as I figured at the time I must have just hit one really bad bump. It is really hard to imagine the top of the line, at that time, Acura could have that issue. Especially with the "marketing" of quiet glass and cabin etc. and never anything similar in lower cost cars. I could have easily walked out an owner if I needed a car at that time etc.
I recently drove the 2016 RLX and it seemed to feel normal.
I am waiting for the top of the line Acura to have apple car play.
Somebody (who works at Acura but may not have inside info) told me to wait for the next RLX.
I am also interested in checking out the new accord touring. I heard they made improvements in cabin quietness. I hope the new 19" wheels on the touring don't make the car sensitive to bumps. I am also interested in checking out the NSX if it ever becomes real but likely won't buy one for the same reason many don't. I also think the new Mercedes and Lexus look nice but don't really want to drive a Mercedes or Lexus. I am hesitant to get the hybrid because I travel mostly on the highway, quickly. I actually liked the accord "space" more than the TLX. Let's hope Acura gets their act together for something with the latest technology including inside the car and top of the line.

 

<p>@miner</p><p>@holografique</p><p>@neuronbob</p><p>Yesterday, I drove over a kerbstone accidentally. &nbsp;If the valve clunk in the dampers that I heard is what you guys are hearing in your daily travels, all I can say is that I understand, finally.</p><p>If I had to hear that all the time, it'd be very annoying. &nbsp;I expected some noise, the the sound coming from the dampers was truly alarming.</p><p>But my particular RLX P-AWS that I had never made that kind of noise even when going over a gater at speed. &nbsp;It must be a particular kind of hit that causes it.</p>

 

<p></p><p>&nbsp;</p><p>@Comfy</p><p>I think that what they did wrong was to try to use the exact same suspension and same dampers for both the RLX and RLX Sport Hybrid, and the valving was designed for the heavier car.</p><p>Based on what I heard yesterday, I'd guess that a particular kind of vertical hit and release&nbsp;causes the main valve to slam in a way that is so loud it makes you think something is broken.</p>

 

Do any of you have 18" wheels on an RLX? And if so, does that help the ride?

Also, are the 19" wheels just for looks or is there a benefit in handling (under 100 MPH) over the 18 inch wheels?

 

Holy cow, never thought I'd hear you say you finally understand. I dont know how you got away with it in your 2014 PAWS.

Hard to say for sure if what you experienced in the hybrid is the same, but I can tell you it doesnt take much (definitely no curbstones) to create the overall issue with my 2014 PAWS. Usually its any large bump (or dip), potholes, or uneven breaks in pavement in road surface that makes the car "thwack" instead of the signature muted "thud" you get in the rest of the Acura fleet going over the exact same conditions. When I drove the 2016 Sport-Hybrid, I immediately felt like I was driving an "Acura" again. As for my PAWS I still dont know what I'm driving a lot of the times. Its like a dirty VCR with bad interference, struggling to make a clear image come through and annoying the heck out of the viewers desperately hoping for it to stop.

And its not just a sound issue. You feel it in the steering wheel and throughout the rest of the chassis. That is honestly what makes me feel like the car is going to break or something is breaking more so than the sound. Ive just never driven any car that had such a hard slamming recovery to bumps, except maybe my old 89 CRX?

The chassis shock along with the sound just creates a very unerving experience that causes the driver to constantly be on the lookout for anything subpar on the road. That's just not the type of driving experience anyone should expect in a $60k vehicle. There's just no excuse for it and it's very dissapointing. That's what I mean when I say it really mars what would otherwise be an incredible driving experience with the RLX. At least for me, I'm spending more time focused on the type of road conditions Im driving over rather than just enjoying the drive.

 

Have you considered asking Acura to redo the suspension TSB.

 

Does that involve Acura Client Relations?

 

I would start with a fact based approach with the local service department. Car still has an issue that x happens when y happens. Can they fix it. Let them tell you the current root cause and resolution and be nice. If that does not work then repeat and escalate. Arrange the appointment in advance and get a loaner each time if needed and be nice to the service department even if frustrated. If they fix x you are "happy" if not make more appointments. Try to work with the Sr. Service techs. If you can find something that duplicates/demonstrates it even better. I don't think "customer service" is going to fix unless you really escalated at corp.

 

<p></p><p>Acura Client Relations: &nbsp;They do not like it if you have to keep talking to them about the same problem. &nbsp;If you're talking about Twitter or email from them, as long as you're continuing to respond to an issue as if it is the same issue, quoting the same emails in line, they're going to escalate very quickly.</p><p>They do *not* like to be talking about the same problem over and over.</p><p>However, my comments refer to usual problems...it sounds like this suspension thing is in a completely different category where they seem to be admitting that something's wrong and they're not quite sure what.</p><p>I don't recall seeing where they've even made a release of a TSB designed to fix the *rear* suspension clunking.</p>

 

You're right that they never released a TSB for the rear suspension. The TSB was for the front suspension, and that particular "rattle/clunk" (which was very loud and apparent) is resolved and hasnt appeared since I had it performed. But the TSB didnt do anything to address the harsh ride handling or lack of compliant recovery over bumps, etc.

From the details that Acura provided in the 2016 model press release, it seems to me that there is alot more that would have to be done to the 2014 models to really fix the issue. Quoted from the press release...

"Both the front and rear shock absorbers get an increase in piston rod diameter and the rear stabilizer bar's stiffness is decreased. The front and rear spring rates and shock absorber damping force were all decreased to provide better shock absorption and road surface tracking. Furthermore, the front upper spring/shock mounts and rear bump stops were changed for improved action."

None of that was done in the TSB. I'm no expert but the above description in the press release sounds like a complete overhaul of the suspension design.

 

In reading through the 2016 PAWS changes more carefully, it appears to be a combination of new components and adjustments to existing components.

 

I would have to assume that if the Service Department wanted they could change all of those "improved" parts from the 2016, to the 2014.....I think it would not hurt to ask the GM and Service Department in conjunction with Acura Client Relations to do that for you, without you paying for it of course. I am sure your problem is well documented with the Service Department by now......

 

Actually, Ive never really bothered my Service Department with it because with all the information here on the forum, reviews, etc all reporting similar issues, it seemed clear that this was not something the Service Dept of a local dealer would be able to address. Its a design flaw that could only be handled by Acura Engineering.

The only documented event they have is me reporting the "rattle/clunk" specific to getting the front suspension TSB performed. Otherwise, my only complaints have been in conversation with my Service Tech, the rep and one of the finance guys (who also drives an RLX) at the dealership where I get the cars serviced.

 

Some new info on the rattle problem..
Acura TSB 14-040 was updated Aug 19, 2015 (3 days ago).
The reason for the change was to update the affected vehicles.

The TSB ADDS 2015 PAWS as affected.
The TSB DELETES ALL SH-AWD as affected.


(This TSB swaps out the front spring/damper assembly)


Could it be that the SH's never had the rattle prone parts?


So the Acura RLX user experience differences between the PAWS and SH may NOT be about the weight differences, etc, but that they in fact used different parts.
Unfortunately, the 'replacement assembly' in the update may be the same part as in the original TSB - which did not really do much to resolve the problem.


And a check of the dealer parts number lists confirms that the front springs, dampers, top rubber mount, and bump stop are updated for 2016 for the PAWS.

 

<p></p><p>I'm a little concerned about decreasing the stiffness and diameter of the rear stabilizer bar.</p><p>But maybe that's what you were after.</p><p>Unless the spring rates are different now, F/R, and the campers F/R work differently from the previous design, F/R, then they have altered the car's attitude when under pressure.</p>

 

I think you should still bring this up, since you have nothing to loose at this point...

 

I believe TampaRLX-SH has driven both the 2014 Sport Hybrid and the 2016 Sport Hybrid, maybe he remembers any difference in the handling characteristics between the two....Unless they did not change any of the suspension parts on the Sport Hybrid, only on the P-AWS.

 

<p>The adjustable suspension of the NSX Sport Hybrid might very well portend changes across a wide range of Hondas.</p>

 

Funny how some consider a poorly designed suspension as being a sport suspension. This issue has permeated throughout the lineup. Though not the only reason it was the prime reason for getting rid of the RDX after less than 30 months of ownership.

 

I think he tested the 2016 PAWS and indicated there was a noticeable improvement in the suspension and handling from the 2014 PAWS. If I remember he had the 2016 PAWS as a loaner for a few days while waiting for his 2016 Sport-Hybrid to arrive, which gave him the opportunity to see the difference.

 

^^^

Correct. There is a noticeable difference in the suspension from the 2014 to the 2016 PAWS RLX.

My experience with the 2014 pre-production SH RLX was in March of 2014. Although I cannot be certain in that length of time if my 2016 SH rides exactly the same, I recall the ride being very different then the 2014 PAWS. I wrote about it here in the forum. That was when I 1st posted my theory that the suspension was tuned for the SH and did not behave favorably on the PAWS.

I am fairly confident the 2014 & 2016 SH have the same suspension & tuning.

But the issue with the plastic component of the struts failing causing harsh impacts & noise has been reported on every model in the line up, some front, some rear. I can say that even the warranty replacement front struts replaced on my RL 2 years ago eroded to this behavior. It was not as severe as the RLX PAWS and I think the RLX has additional issues than the struts themselves. The mountings were in question and the rear of the RLX bobbed up and down a lot, perhaps resulting in the sway bar re-tuning and spring rates. I think the strut / damper supplier must be getting a lot of pressure to revise them. My service adviser tells me he has a lot of complaints from RDX, MDX and ILX owners, fewer from TLX and just not enough RLX owners to be noted.

And yes, there where many improvements to the RLX in the 2016 MY over the 2014. I cannot speak to the 2015 as I never drove one.

1) Suspension tuning
2) Quieter engine - less DI clatter
3) No A/C moan
4) Improved UI software (I have only experienced two freezes, but it was my phone, not the car when streaming via Aha or Pandora)
5) Better / consistent Acuralink connectivity (no Red Light)

And the added content, which is common in progressive MY releases.

In fact I have only had one item on my list, which the dealer addressed already - the Homelink range. It now works as good as or better than my former RL.

To think of it, this has been the most defect free car in my 1st month of ownership that I have ever had. I hope I did not just jinx myself!

 

For the first time ever, instead of trading in every 2-3 years I have kept the '07RL I bought new in mid 2006. 122K miles later it still runs like a champ. Timing thingy done at 100k but otherwise typical maintenance and new brakes back at 65Kmi.

Its finally time to consider a trade, but reading so many negative comments on the forum about the RLX, which I was considering, (even though the styling odd and lost) I think I will pass for now and see what happens in a few months. Back to considering Infiniti, at least they are nice to look at!

 

I did the front TSB for a slight rattle. I could hear it but nobody else could so they did it to humor me. It has been solid as a bank vault since.

 

I would still consider it, just consider the Sport-Hybrid instead of the PAWS version.

It's been said a few times here before and after my test drive of the Sport-Hybrid, I can attest to it: The Sport-Hybrid is the RLX experience.

 

The negative comments are largely about the early 2014 PAWS RLX. Every Sport Hybrid owner has been satisfied despite relatively minor quibbles.

 

My 10 day old 16 RLX SprtHybrd hit 1,000 miles today. If you are a current Acura owner you must test drive this car (if you can find one) before you give up on an Acura. This is the car I had hoped I was getting when I bought my 14 RLX Advance. This SprtHybrd is so much fun to drive both on the highway and in Houston traffic.

 

LoneStar welcome aboard! You sound like you drank the same elixir as the rest of the Sport Hybrid owners......maybe, just maybe it is the car and not something funny in our drinks! I agree the Sport Hybrid is the real deal.

I think I was the first one on AZ to take this baby home (over 10 months ago) and I still look forward to sitting behind the wheel. My original enthusiasm has not worn off yet. You have many enjoyable miles in front of you my friend.

Since each of us has their own experiences with our cars please keep posting your thoughts, likes and dislikes.