SSFTSX

Since Honda/ Acura now operates in 6 year cycle rather than 4 year product cylcle for cost reasons.
. So 36 month (3Year update) should be more extensive. Just look at Honda Legend Acura RL. (It got new engine/lighhs/rims) etc.
TSX/EuroAccord main competitor Toyota Avensis has been fully updated. Now it boosts 6speed Automatic with 180bhp/350lb-ft turbo diesel with 25% less carbon particles than Honda engine. It also got Push button start/HDD navigation/AFS light/LED/bi Xenon/autovipers & all the feature what is part of Honda Legend/Acura RL. The list is very extensive.
Toyota Avensis is the same vehicle as Lexus HS250 which is sltotted above IS in Lexus lineup.

So what you guys are expecting or suggested on Acura survey for TSX mid life update.
1. Engine
2. Transmission
3. Lighting
4. Navigation
5. Rims.
6 Styling changes.
7. Electronics (like Pushbutton)

Honda usually Mimic Toyota. Its good for us that Toyoat has raised the bar too high for Honda to jump.

nj2pa2nc

With the numerous brand of vehicles we have owned over the years we never had a toyota. We have owned mercedes, volvo, nissan, mazda, mitsubishi, honda, hyundai, vw, ford, chevy and acura.

iTimmy

not again...

DeadLock

Toyota and Honda have an entirely different business plan and mindset on how they want to engineer and market their products, at least they do so in the US.

I do not think the Honda ever really copies the advancements of any other car maker. I think Honda is more setback in terms of seeing how the new technology is played out in the automotive industry before trying to improve on it and incorporating it into all of its products. Also, a lot of the times, Honda is the innovator of technologies but they use them in select cars (NSX, s2000, ITR etc...).

I think to be competitive in this day and age, it would be wise not to improve only one aspect of the list you created, but to improve a little of everything. Another characteristic of Honda is practical use.......some things are just not needed. Also, I do not think I agree with the "Toyota set the bar too high" statement. And I am only talking about the US market. The only imports I would buy would be Toyota or Honda, but I still do not see a vast difference in the Toyota Lexus brand compared to Honda Acura.

LuvMyTSX

Toyota has raised the bar too high for Honda to jump? Are you serious?

By the way, Honda is on a 5 year cycle for most products, not 6. The RL is the exception.

SSFTSX

6speed Auto/HDD Navigaiton/LED/Bi-Xenon/AFS/Push button/ACC/CMBS/LDW/LKAS/Parking sensors/graphite finish console in 4 cylinder car smaller than Camry under Toyota badge is pretty high. And price is cheaper than Euro Accord.

LuvMyTSX

The Euro Accord has some of those features also. The Avensis is not sold here so it is a moot point. How about we compare apples to apples with vehicles sold in the US and in the same class.

asaldworth

There are a couple things I would like changed for the 2010 model (just like they changed some minor things between the 2004 and 2005):

Move the rear-view camera to the center of the trunk lid and add the 'guidance' lines on the screen (you know, the one with the green/yellow/red lines)

Make the bluetooth interface better. BMW's iDrive system automatically downloads your phonebook and makes it really easy to call one of your contacts.

Push button start

bi xenon lights (come on, Acura was the pioneer of xenon lights back in 1998-1999, what happened?)

arrow display in the MID when using the navigation system

more powerful engine (either add a turbo, or add a V6 option) (i know this is probably not feasible for until the mid cycle change, but I think they made the wrong decision of not upgrading the engine for 2009)

iTimmy

Stop thinking logically! The OP has a tendency to shift reality in which ever direction suits his thoughts best.

Simply put, no matter how much sense you make and valid your points are you won't win this argument.

SSFTSX

Thats true but Look what will be Honda Logical Response
1. Toyota has improved fuel economy across the board in 4 cylinder VVTI by 20 percent for its Avensis. that easily transalte into 6 to 8 mpg. There is alot of other changes in CO2 levels and NVH/Torque.

2. Top of the line diesel engine is now the same as IS220. with 100lb-ft and 30bhp extra. combine that with 6speed Auto. It blows away EuroAccord. That is the single most important criteria for European sales if Honda has to survive.

All these are in car cheaper than Euro Accord. Honda will be forced uprate its 4cylinder engines interms of fuel economy. and possibly create all new deisel engine. so less investment money available for any other changes to TSX.

jlukja

Lets address what is being said and not who said it.

iTimmy

I've always got along with you, but have to respectfully disagree, the source of information is highly important. The OP has, more then a few times, taken information highly out of context to support his/her claim(s).

Not to mention subjects like this are pure speculation, there is no right or wrong answer, we can debate, argue and disagree all day long but the only way to prove what will happen is to wait and see. While I think it is interesting and even helpful to discuss what we think may happen, its very dangerous to misinterpret opinions as facts.

If you still feel who said what is irrelevant, fair enough, I'll add the OP to my ignore list and carry on with life. This forum, in particular forums dedicated to relatively new platforms, can be hugely educational and having content like this spewed in here removes a lot of that value.

LuvMyTSX

Again, you wanted to talk about the MMC for the TSX, so let's talk about the TSX, not Euro Accord. It's a different market in Europe.

LuvMyTSX

I believe he agrees with you, he just wants to keep the discussion on topic.

So, let's proceed with TSX DISCUSSION and not the Euro Accord in overseas markets vs overseas products that don't compete in the US.

jlukja

My statement was to make sure that this thread does not take the same direction as previous threads where SSFTSX posted. Those degenerated into SSFTSX bashing. We need to take the focus off of SSFTSX and put it onto the thread topic. I agree that this subject is pure speculation. but its a fair topic and warrants discussion. I have no problem with you, or anyone else, pointing out when someone goes off on a tangent or takes things out of context. I just wanted to make sure that the focus of the next post isn't on the poster but on the topic.

dom

I'm not agreeing with him here but its essentially the same thing, at least mechanically, for the most part. If one gets an updated 4 banger so will the other etc.....

LuvMyTSX

I agree with that also. What I disagree with is discussing its competitors that aren't sold here. Of course the equipment etc. will be different in Europe compared to here.

Colin

Let me gaze into my crystal ball.....I predict that the product cycle will be 5 years not 6. I predict that the TSX will get the hard disc navigation system from the TL sooner rather than later. The V-6 will arrive before the MMC.

Push button start could be a possibility, but I'd hope the MDX gets it first. I say no LED tail lights, no auto wipers, no bi-xenons....noooo.... the ball is getting cloudy... no more predictions...

dom

LuvMyTSX

Those were my predictions as well.

wackura

I often ask myself what features they would have to add in addition to a V6 that would inspire me to trade in hazardously early. Assuming this decision would be at least 18 months away I have lots of time to think about it, and if a V6 TSX costs $35,000 I'll have to do some cross shopping but I suspect it will still be a better value than cars such as the IS350 for which there's not even a manual transmission available. What's the point of that? I suspect the European options will be less equiped and less powered for the price.

LukeaTron

If by "equiped" you're talking amenities, I have to disagree there. They currently get a bunch of fancy goodies we don't like radar cruise control. They do have the smaller engine though and I have assume that trend will continue. I assume if they're going to update the K24 they're going to update the other K engines as well. I don't know how likely an across the board change is for a mid model refresh given the current economic climate. My guess is that they would more likely introduce the upgraded K series on either a new model or a new generation of an existing model. The technology from that engine will then be incorporated into the new versions of the similar engines as those models are either refreshed or roll over to the next generation.

I think keyless entry is the biggest thing they're missing out on at the moment and I hope that gets incorporated into as many models as possible as quickly as possible.

SSFTSX

http://www.hybridcars.com/vehicle/lexus-hs250h.html
Look at this way. Lexus has brought exact copy of that Car as HS250. Even including heads up display.187 bhp engine on regular fuel.
It is not camry it comes with 17inch standard wheel and 18inch optional.
And still getting 30% better fuel than most efficient Lexus. Which will be 40mpg from 2.4litre engine. I bet hybrid produce more torque than 2.4litre TSX.

So who is going to buy TSX in current form. so competition has heat not only in EU with massive 180bhp/350ft-lb TDI 6speed Auto engine but also in US where most people buy 4cylinder for fuel economic.

Honda has not only to upgrade diesel engine but also gasoline engine. with all the navigation and electronics and lighting enhencements. I doubt Honda can put one set of headlights for US and another for EU. Only the gril will be different.

wackura

My next car must have the USB memory stick reader option. Now that I have it I never want to let it go. USB flash memory audio on random mode is the best way to listen to audio in your car short of some sort of free on demand satelite technology which won't exist for a long time to come. I bought a 32 gig stick off Amazon. My entire mp3 collection is always one button away and there's nothing more to it.

Think about it. Even push button start for the sake of leaving your keys in your pocket or however that works doesn't save you the same amount of effort comparable to finding where you left your iPod, carrying your iPod to and from your car, plugging and unplugging it.

davidspalding

Please stop typing as fast as you drive. It hurts my eyeballs to try to decipher your grammar, capitalization and spelling.

wackura

A luxurious Prius will have numerous compromises that an I4 TSX won't. We don't know what those compromises will be but there will obviously be more than a few to keep the price under $35k. Lets start with the fact that it looks like a cheap subcompact with a Lexus sticker on the front.

LukeaTron

Word.

Regarding the keyless ignition entry, it's one of those things that doesn't seem all that spectacular on paper but in application, it's a game changer, much like the usb card reader experience you describe. It's one of those things that once you have it, it's absence is all but intolerable.

09TSXMN

I agree with you completely, have you figured out how to sort your files by alpbabetical order instead of when they were downloaded on your memory stick?

wackura

No, that definately sucks I admit but since I never really listen to a single album it hasn't affected my quality of life. When I get some free time I plan to look into the issue and find an mp3 organization utility and when I do I'll pass it along.

SSFTSX

I dont think there is many compromises Involved. Camry which is bigger and less aerodynamic with CVT transmission manage faster than TSX Auto on Edmunds tests with 10 mpg better fuel economy than TSX. Prius is just golf cart in comparision.
80 to 90% of TSX buyers are entrly level luxury buyers. that will look for enhance luxury options in Lexus. I have no doubt this HS250 is full fledged Lexus in looks and feels.
Only 10 to 15% of TSX are 6MT.

wackura

You have no idea what corners they plan to cut to create a viable Priused based Lexus for under $35k. You don't know what the ride quality will be, how it will perform, you know almost nothing. That corners need to be cut is a certainty. Your assumption that it will be a TSX killer is retarded and nobody but you would think to make such a comparison.

SSFTSX

It is not Prius based. It is Toyota Avensis. The car is so aerodynamic that 1.8L produce same performance figures as 2.0L Accord. 2.0L is closer to 2.4L auto in performance. This thing is shock to Honda in Europe.

It is the Size of 1G TSX from Outside and interior is similar to 2G TSX.
Lexus offer Luxury features which are not available in TSX.
Considering Camry hybrid performance this would not have any problem in dispatching 4cylinder TSX Auto into dust.

JD23

What are the chances SH-AWD gets added to a possible Type-S model?

Colin

I heard no AWD.

iTimmy

Acura seems to be focusing on more luxury and less sport, more Lexus competition then BMW. I think keyless ignition is a must, Acura is really late to making this happen, even if only an option on Tech. package cars, like the TL would be a huge step in the right direction. I think we will see subtle changes and an early face lift - I really don't see anything revolutionary happening with this platform.

I hate to say it, because I know its going to stir the pot by the RDX driveline is the obvious choice for an optional driveline for this platform, but I doubt it will happen.

AustinJay

I guess someone bought the wrong car then.

Colin

I think I know what you're trying to say, but just to clarify. Pushbutton start will never be an option. It be a part of a package or not offered at all.

FWIW, I think the RDX drivetrain would be a big mistake. There is little room for a top mounted intercooler under the TSX hood, and if you move it to the front, turbo lag becomes more of an issue.

JeffS

That's good. The AWD would add too much weight, over burden the 4 banger, kill fuel economy and none of Honda's V6 engines, except maybe the 3.7L, produce enough torque to warrant the AWD anyway.

So would it be safe to say there will be a Type S model though????

iTimmy

I see how that was confusing, and you inferred correctly, I meant it should be part of tech. package and not an option only available to tech. package cars, the later would be quite foolish. It is a hugely popular feature to the masses, I can't believe how Honda/Acura is missing the boat with this.

Do you think the RDX drive train would be a mistake due to physical constraints, while I'm not familiar with available space I will take your word on it, or that you feel it would just be a poor application on the TSX?

wackura

You're really all over the map talking about hybrids that don't exist or are slower than syrup and a sedan that's not available in the US. The hybrid Camry does 0-60 in 8.something seconds. If this new car supposedly blows the TSX out of the water due to aerodynamics alone I'll have to see it to believe it. If the TSX gets a V6 I won't really care what kind of gas mileage it gets. You can have your silly hybrid.

The new Lexus is Prius based http://wot.motortrend.com/6414793/au...rid/index.html
And not to belabor the obvious but it's a rather ugly car. It looks like a baloon with Ford 500 decals.