MrLogan13

iTrader: (1)

Here:

http://www.makealeap.org/idling_myth

Mercedes>BMW

Idling a car for an hour wastes .75 of a gallon, it's worth it, a lot of worse things to do than warm your car up.

acstsx10

Not sure if they have pressure sensors, but basic heat transfer principles would say your ass is much better at transferring heat than leather. Therefore, when you sit down the difference in temperature makes it FEEL cold unless the seat is hotter than you, which is not likely.

Mercedes>BMW

I was at the Acura dealership last week because of the seat heaters, long story short they said the seat heaters on HIGH get as hot as 98 degrees without anyone sitting on them. When you sit on them it's hotter because it combines the heat.

parasitius

Makes perfect sense to anyone who has ever used a heated blanket! Only gets hot when insulated. Course in 'Murica, unlike Japan, we just heat our houses instead... so few know the pleasure

MrLogan13

iTrader: (1)

It does a lot more than just waste the .75 gallon of fuel, see the above link I posted.

MrLogan13

iTrader: (1)

I'm not sure why the engine warm up myth persists despite the fact that mechanics and manufacturers state that it's not necessary and inefficient at warming up the engine. Totally unnecessary in any car built within the last two decades. There are countless resources available on the web, from legit, reputable sources that state this. The only people left who still argue about it are the end users.

Mercedes>BMW

Wtf? Gas isn't THAT expensive, it's 2x the price in Europe and more costly in other countries. People that get 25+ mpg need to stop bitching about gas. I think me going to a store a mile away is a waste of gas but at the same time im paying for my car every month, I should except to waste some gas and I dont really care about the greenhouse or emissions as the people who want priuses can help that problem. Sorry it just pissed me when people talk about wasting gas when their car gets such good MPG, when I talk about V8's and the car I want and it only gets 17mpg combined it's worth every penny.

P.s. If you want to save more gas get a bicycle, ride it to work every day, and do your chores. Shit if you get a bicicle you can save oh so much money on insurance and car payments, why stop at gas and filling up, if you cant do any of these things than put some unleaded in your tank why dont you (I know about Acura and the whole premium recommended but unleaded is okay somewhat idea).

.75 of a gallon is fine with me as long as I have my a/c working I'd be happy to be paying, way more things I waste money on than gas, shit maybe today I shouldn't have ate would of saved $10. I cant stand being in the car without the a/c being on. It's 67 degrees in my house and when it gets to 69 degrees i start itching because its too hot. Not everyone cares about emissions nor cares about gas $, its not very complicated.

MrLogan13

iTrader: (1)

I think you're misunderstanding what I'm saying. When I say that it's more than just the .75 gallons, I'm talking about adding additional wear to the engine, such as increased risk of corrosion in the exhaust system, prematurely wearing out spark plugs; please read the article I posted:

If someone wants to idle to engine to run a heater or AC for their comfort, then that's fine; more power to them. But be aware that it's not harmless. I'm talking about the myth that an engine warm up is required before driving--it's not.

Mercedes>BMW

Oh okay, if its just the exhaust system and spark plugs and things like that I'm fine with it, in a few years (I'm at 60k) I'll have to start maintaining my car like an older car because of the higher miles so when I have to get a tune up maybe at 100k or around that it'll be fine. The salt is rusting away on my minivan, have gotten the muffler replaced a few times from corrosion and not to worried about replacing the exhaust system on the tsx.

I did skim (not very fast) through the article before I posted the post before this one. Who knows I could trade this car in a few years for a TL, maybe I shouldn't be so concerned like I said other people do much worse.

ceb

A catalytic converter can cost well over $1k to replace. A cold engine dumps exhaust into a cold cat. This leads to increased emissions and early cat failure.

The way to prevent this is to get the engine to operating temps as quickly as possible - by driving the car.

At 60k miles, you're quickly approaching the end of the emissions warranty and converter failures caused by excessive cold idling are not uncommon at this mileage.

Mercedes>BMW

So even if you push the gas in idle to heat the car up faster maybe at 2k rev's your cats will still be damaged?

parasitius

Haha funny, I was thinking of asking a similar question. Basically -- if the problem with idling is that there isn't a sufficient load on the engine, can't we just install giant fans under the car that can be run by the engine so that so long as it is idle it can just hover a few inches off the ground and thus be running the engine hard enough to not hurt it

MrLogan13

iTrader: (1)

Why go through that kind of trouble when you can just drive it?

ceb

Yes

HondoGermany

Do they sit in the COLD car and wait til the motor is getting warmer?
In this time, the motor is running warm I´m already 5miles on my way, haha

mellostack

i believe this is what you are looking for


i hope this helps

alpha2beta

http://www.allpar.com/history/interv...ller-cams.html

Yeah you still need to warm up a car for a couple of minutes before just driving away and revving the engine, unless you don't like oil at the upper end of the engine. Look at the pour test in the video, even the Mobile 1 still looks like molasses in cold temps. So many times I see people just start there car and just drive it away. Those are the people that you can hear the lifters tick as they are driving there car away later in life of the car when they get higher miles on it. The "thedailygreen" sounds like a web site that cares more about saving some gas then saving wear on your engine.

alpha2beta

No one said on here that we are going to run the car for an hour, and idling the car for a few minutes is not excessive. Plus cop cars idle more then they drive them you don't see them needing engines all the time, and people driving in rush hour are idling for long periods of time too.

ceb

Sorry, but the best way to start a modern car is to start it, put your seatbelt on and drive away gently - continuing to drive gently until the engine is up to operating temps.

A moving car, with all the bits like transmission and drivetrain moving, will warm up faster and gentler than a car sitting in place with a idling engine while you're in the house drinking coffee.

Mr Hyde

You shouldn't rev the engine while pulling away. As everyone mentioned, you should drive gently for the first few minutes.

3-5 minutes of gentle driving to get up to temps produces less wear than 10 minutes of idling. 0w-20 is pretty thin oil, and flows fairly quickly. Idling also does nothing for transmissions, differentials, etc. Driving gently warms them up the best as well.

Having said all that, I have remote start on my TSX. I start the car just before I walk out the door on normal days, but on days when I'm driving my 1 year old daughter, and its cold out, I'll let her run for 5-10 minutes first. Her comfort takes priority over the engine wear which will not affect me in the cars lifetime with me.

ceb

Correct. There is nothing wrong with making an informed decision about comfort vs. engine wear.

MrLogan13

iTrader: (1)

You're ignoring the Popular Mechanics and CNN article. Modern cars do not need to idle to be warmed up; just start and drive gently until the engine has reached operating temperature. You can search any car website, you'll find the exact same information.

Simba91102

That's right, it's on the internet so it has to be true..... Bonjour!

MrLogan13

iTrader: (1)

While it's true that internet sources should be treated with skepticism, that is also a specious argument since the links provided are from legitimate, reputable sources.

MrLogan13

iTrader: (1)

Here are a couple more from reputable sources:

Discovery: http://dsc.discovery.com/cars/top-10/car-myths/02.html

Ft. Collins local government: http://www.fcgov.com/breatheeasy/pdf...reatheeasy.pdf

Federal Trade Commission: http://www.consumer.ftc.gov/articles...ving-money-gas

Mercedes>BMW

FUCK THE FTC.... YO FUCK THE FTC... Whoops I mean FCC Lol <Inside Joke

MrLogan13

iTrader: (1)

lol

Simba91102

Umm..... it was a joke (and if you didn't recognize it, I'm not bringing you up to speed). I don't doubt that there are many accurate sources out there, plus, I already subscribe to the "start it and drive it" club.

MrLogan13

iTrader: (1)

Humor doesn't always translate well in text, not to mention inside jokes and pop culture references will be exclusive to some. My misunderstanding.

mmafighta

It's true our version of v Tec isn't really a v Tec but more so like the vvt I in the Toyota?