dano9258

When I leased my Acura TSX last March, one of the big selling points they made was that Acura's hold their value better than any car brand out there. Another was, that they are the most reliable. Im finding out that neither is true. My car purchase price (MSRP) was $38k on the V6 w/Tech. With 14,800 miles and excellent condition, its only worth $26850 now according to both KBB and Black Book. How is it possible that it lost $12000 in just under a year, and that I still owe $35000? The lease end purchase price is $21500 and that is 2 years away.

Also, my car has had issues with its brakes (squeak BADLY!), and the speakers rattle. I looked up on Consumer Reports and it says the 09 and 10' models have only average reliability, comparable to an Audi. ARE YOU SERIOUS!? Why did I buy this car?

Im thinking with 2 years left on the lease, I want out now! Oh wait, Acura Financial doesn't let you swap leases like every other brand out there. Another little suprise to make me hate Acura a little more.

Honestly Im just venting a bit because I found out my car is worth nothing now, but Im wondering if its because the TSX is a crappy car or what? All I can say, is I can't wait for March 2013 when I can hand them the car and say "Good Luck with it!"

KillerG

sorry to hear about your bad experience : (

i got my 4 banger for 29 out the door and have been very satisfied. In all honesty i never really buy a car based on its resale value, but i understand your frustration because it is important to some people. Perhaps its devaluation has to do with the fact that its on the higher end of the tsx spectrum and thus has more room to go lower?

The brake squeal was an issue that honda was sued about and is a whole issue by itself and the speaker rattle has been a problem with a TSB like you said.

All that being said i have yet to have any problems that ive had to take my tsx in for so i guess i got a lucky 09.

I hope your next lease experience goes better!

MrOtocinclus

I don't understand why you're concerned with resale value when you have a lease. If anything, you should be happy that your residual is high because otherwise you'd be paying more for your lease. Another factor to consider is that the V6, for some reason, depreciates more than the I4.

You could swap out of the lease, but you would lose money. You could do a trade-in where the dealer pays your remaining payments and residual. That's how you would do it if you bought the car outright at any time before lease end.

You can also look at swapalease.com. I just did a quick search and TSX leases are available, i.e. they wouldn't be if Acura didn't allow people to swap out of their leases.

Good luck.

Edit: Just a thought, but try imagining that you don't have a car and have to take the bus everywhere. You might feel better that you have such a POS Acura.

ressling

^ +1. While you are certainly entitled to rant, you need to keep in mind that you actually didn't BUY your car. Also, you should understand that basic economics predicates that ANY vehicle bought or leased new depreciates the most within the first three years, particularly the first year.

Last, the reason why most TSX owners on this forum have the I4 is because it's a better value. Paying nearly $40k for a V6 TSX is a complete rip-off if you ask me.

You can do swapalease or leasetrader.com, but you will definitely lose your shirt. I suggest you tough it out for the next 2 years. It really isn't that much time if you think about it.

nj2pa2nc

sorry to hear of the problems you seem to be having. First I do not lease as I put on way too many miles. I own a 06 6MT tsx, bought new. It has almost 120,000 problem free miles. I know the re-sale value is lower due to the mileage. It is an excellent car (IMO)

black label

The 35000 you supposedly owe is only if you are buying the car out to acquire the title. If you are somehow going to pay 35000 over the next 2 years on the lease itself you got screwed.

justnspace

iTrader: (1)

lol

ESHBG

dano9258, I'm not trying to be rude but it doesn't sound as if you have a firm grasp on economics. A good rule of thumb w/ vehicles is to assume that they will lose 30% of their value within the first few years. If you take 30% of your MSRP, the $26,850 figure you quote is actually a few hundred dollars better than that. Also, why did you pay MSRP?!? Even w/ a lease, it is still best to negotiate the buying price. And thirdly, a little more research would have shown that a V6 TSX may not have been the best buy at that price point.

I can totally understand your frustrations but you can't blame the car or the brand for your poor decisions; if swapping leases was important to you or something you would have one day considered, that is something you should have researched before you entered into the lease.

its rayden

wow, you agreed to lease payments based of MSRP? shame on you.

Colin

On the plus side, at least you're used to being 'upside down'

https://acurazine.com/forums/showpos...7&postcount=13

TSXV6Guy

I think we need to put things in perspective... Yes, the 2nd Gen TSX has some issues: brake squeal, rattles, speaker problems, etc. All this is annoying but relatively minor, compared to, say, Audi.
Example, the brake squeal involved replacing the brake pads. That's it.
On the other hand, the Audis that I know of have had major problems: engine block cracking, no-start due to electronic cluster issues, differential noise, etc.

So in perspective, our cars are not that bad, even though I am really annoyed by that one rattle that I can't pinpoint yet, and that I am starting to think that one of my CV joints is starting to make noise at only 8000 miles.

justnspace

iTrader: (1)

an educated buyer is a smart buyer, or in this case Lessee

TSteezyX

lol. $38k for a TSX.

5thTo2nd

Last I checked Acuras still reign supreme among luxury makes for resale and residual value. Doesn't sound like you know much about used car values or how to negotiate a new car deal.

All issues you're describing have been addressed by TSB's so stop your damn belly-aching or get an Audi and maybe you'll have better luck with reliability.

dano9258

First off, to all of you who are saying I don't understand economics, you guys are idiots. Every one of you stated that it will lose 30% in the first few years. Its only been 10 months and its lost 30%.

Second off, I didn't pay MSRP for the car. I paid somewhere around $34k and then had to put the negative equity of my previous car into it, bringing it to $38k. $34000 for a V6 tech TSX is a great deal, considering its a full 1.5 seconds faster than all of your I4s and only a couple thousand more.

Finally, for all of you stating you can get rid of it on swap a lease or one of those sites, no you can't. Acura Financial does not allow you to transfer your lease. All of the leases listed on there if you notice are 36 mo, meaning dealers are placing their NEW leases on there, not used leases.

Oh, and as far as all the issues being taken care of by TSB's....a quality car should not have that many issues in the first place. Granted it isn't as bad as the Pontiac I had, my Scion and Nissan both had absolutely nothing wrong with them the whole time I owned them. And don't say it doesn't have many issues, because Consumer Reports, an unbiased company, states the TSX is only average reliability, which for an Acura is absolutely horrible.

justnspace

iTrader: (1)

All cars will have their quirks. Although, they do go through extensive QC, sometimes flaws do sneak pass.
Be glad that you dont have a failing high pressure fuel pump.

its rayden

zing bmw

st_101

As a car brand Acura on average hold their value well. Unfortunately these statistics are based on value after 3-5 years and not 10 months.

In 2 more years your TSX will be worth at least $21500. This is 57%, exactly the value that Acura Finance uses for a 3 year lease. If you remove the $4k that was financed to pay off your old car, it's actually 63% of the value.

Part of the value problem is you are trying to determine the value after only 10 months. The car has lost a lot of value because there will be few buyers willing to pay more than what you have found. Think about it, if you bought it new for $34k, how much would you pay for a 1 year old one?

TSteezyX

lol again.

Just go buy an A4. It will solve all your reliability and lease contract worries.

Aman

1. Don't believe anything the dealer tells you. In most cases, they know less about the car than you do. Do your own research. You can't expect any car to live up to any dealer's claims.

2. Dissing people and their cars will get you nowhere. Grow up.

3. It'll lose more than 30% in the first few years, but whatever. All cars lose a huge chunk of their resale in the first year. Acuras probably aren't as popular with the general public because of its styling, which hasn't exactly been well-recieved.

What years were your Scion and Nissan? Pretty much every single new car sold will have a few issues, and if they're covered by TSBs or recalls, especially on a leased vehicle, why do you care?

Sounds like you're complaining about a bunch of factors that don't apply to you. My

dominik331

KBB site lists a 2010 Tsx Tech V6 with 14800 at $33175. Looks to me like homeboy doesn't know what he is talking about.

Acuraboi04

I leased a 2010 Tsx also and my advice to you is don't worry about the value of the car. Enjoy it! No car is perfect out there. Put it this way you are only paying for what you use on the car until the lease is up. Plus your negative
equity. The reason they gave the car for 34k which is the msrp is to factor
in your negative equity. They had to lower the price of your car to calculate
your negative equity into you lease. Because they did the same for me.
I got the base model though. I'm satisfied w/my TSX because it feels like
a V-6 and it saves a lot of gas! Yes the car has imperfections. What you gotta worry for? Just bring it in. No worries its not your car you are only
renting it, that's the whole purpose of Leasing. No matter what car you buy
A car is a depreciating asset! I'm sure the dealer told you to lease at this point because you keep trading in your cars and are always upside down with negative equity. So after you are done w/ renting the tsx move on to greener pastures=) I'm thinking of trying lexus after.

coffeefingers

WHAAAAAAA...I don't like my lease and TSX V6 brakes squeal!

Somebody force you at gunpoint to get this car and sign the lease?

On the flip side...I love my TSX V6.

justnspace

iTrader: (1)

Well said.

ESHBG

Wow, so you leave critical pieces of info out of your first post and yet WE'RE the idiots?!? Gotcha lol

Secondly, "30% in the first few years" is a simplified statement because of the many, MANY factors involved. If you want a "one size fits all" answer in this economy and in today's times, though, than it is safe to assume you will lose up to 30% as soon as the car is titled (nowadays, it doesn't even need to be driven off of the lot. ). And wait until the price of gas shoots up even further again, your V6 will take another hit. Even though the difference is minimal when compared to the 4 cyl, it is all based on what the market perceives, and V6 = thirstier in the mind, period.

Anyway, no sense in arguing with you further about this, as Colin found a thread that proves again that you really don't appear to know what you are doing financially.

rockstar143

iTrader: (6)

You paid too much for the car, and that's in addition to not doing research on reliability prior.

Has it left you stranded? If not, then I would say you shouldn't worry too much about what car it's comparing to on the interwebz...if you're handy, I'm sure there are ways to get rid of the speaker rattle and brake squeak. PLUS, you're covered under warranty so no worries there.

Depreciation hits hard the first year or 2...I think you'd find that in 2 years from now it won't have dropped much more from that 26K (kinda like the Type s TL's they were STILL trying to sell for $30K last year). I once bought a Nissan Frontier used...hated the gas mileage and how boring it was to drive. Traded in in 5 weeks and lost 4K out of pocket to get into my EP Civic Si. It hurt, but I was happy.

dominik331

Guys the car is worth over 31k, I don't know where he is getting this 26k figure.

Tannis

I checked my TSX the other day when I was considering going with the '11 and at 16k miles KBB still lists it at roughly $25k for mint condition. Dealer offered $23,200 for it on trade. And that's a '10 Base I4. Hmmmmm...

pinatubo

Just a note for OP, if you don't like the Acura, don't drive it again, ever.

icky2unk

Lesson 1 in life, don't buy something that you can't afford.
Lesson 2 in life, don't buy something you can't afford that is a depreciating asset.
Lesson 3 in life, if you don't listen to lesson and 1 & 2, don't bitch about the fact afterwards.

I paid C$38k new (Decent for a Canadian Car) for my Acura TSX V6 and it's worth maybe C$31k now. I've only had it for 3 months and it's been depreciated 7k. However, I bought the car knowing after 5 years i'd probably only net back about 20k. So why not prepare yourself better in the future for financial decisions you make.

Flipster23

iTrader: (15)

thats your fault u didnt research and u listened to the dealer... They dont know shiiit about cars anyway most of them jump from dealer to dealer anyway

010tsxcbp

Should have done some more research before leasing the car.

MrOtocinclus

I still can't get over the fact that a "selling point" for acquiring a *lease* was resale value...

justnspace

iTrader: (1)

Where is the OP!?

KillerG

when you put it like that it does sound pretty retarded
never noticed that lol

dominik331

Don't you love it when people come into an Acura forum bashing the brand but don't have any real facts to support their bashing?

SoCaliTrojan

This is a simplistic picture that I use when explaining gap insurance, where the vertical axis represents value of the car and the horizontal axis represents time:



The red curve indicates the value of the vehicle. When a car is bought and is first driven off the lot, its value drops alot. You'll owe X dollars but the car is valued at X-Y dollars. It isn't until 3 or so years later (around the middle of your loan term) that the value of your car comes into line and the amount you owe is the value of the car.

Since the OP is looking at the value of his car after 10 months, he's basically looking at it during a time where its value has dropped substantially. OP needs to wait for another 2 years or so before he can look at the value of his car and realize that the Acura brand does hold onto its resale value. Most of the other brands have a steeper drop in value (represented by the diagonal straight black line), so by the time the curve reaches the line, the value is lower.

The purpose of gap insurance is to cover the buyer in the first half of the loan in case he wrecks the car before the loan balance catches up with the value of the car. For leases, gap insurance is automatically written into the contract.

I agree with this quote. Resale value is only for people who buy (finance) their cars. Leases are basically rentals...you rent the vehicle and are offered two options at the end of the contract: buy the vehicle or return it to its actual owner.

Financing $4k for the remaining balance of the previous car is not smart, unless the car was a piece of crap and OP was willing to throw away money to move into a better vehicle. When you toss in the extra amount to be financed, it increases your balance, which means you're paying interest on it and more taxes on your car. Paying taxes on $38k versus $34k is alot of money. It would have been better to sell the previous car on your own (since dealers low-ball you on trade-ins).

As for the quality of the car, cars are made in batches. For a typical manufacturer, out of every 10 cars, 6 cars will be built with normal/average quality, 2 cars will be made better, and 2 cars will be made worse. If you feel that you got a bad car, it can be attributed to bad luck. The TSX brakes are lacking, but that's because Acura uses really skinny brake pads in the rear. Having to replace the brakes more often in the rear than in the front is better than having a car that's unreliable and will leave you stranded on the side of the road.

black label

Most states tax you on the purchase price less the trade value if you buy a car. You basically get a tax brake on the trade as you already paid taxes on it's full value when you registered it.

Tax laws vary by state but in many cases you pay less on a lease. Instead of paying tax on the selling price of the car you pay tax on the monthly payment.

Lastly, resale value does have some importance if you want to get out of the lease early. If the car has a high resale value, you may be able to trade it in for the payoff and not have negative equity going into your next purchase.

dchung_1

I think dano9258 is not such a great car shopper. I mean who trades a car with negative equity.... and why would you put that fact in to the cost of a new car. You should only tell express the price you pay for what you bought. I mean if I had a house with a 250,000 mortgage, that was worth 200,000 and I bought a new house for 350,000 I won't say I paid 400,000. Maybe this is why so may people got F%^( in the housing market.

and FYI you always get screwed in leases. Lease are for people who like a new car every three years. Leases are financially unsound when looking at value.

Like SoCaliTrojan pointed out dealers and banks offer GAP insurance because a car lose 3 grand right out the door when you drive off the lot.

By the way dano9258 I don't know about vegas, but here in New England all V6 TSX are about $5,000 more from an I4; not "only a couple thousand more" or $2,000.

Hell, I paid 28,300 for my 2010 tsx base with fees out the door in Aug 2009 the same month they came out. Exactly 12 month later I refinanced my auto loan from Acura to a local bank. Guess what with only a spoiler, rear bumper, and ceramic tints added, my car was valued by them to be 28,700, A full year later. Why, because the original value of the car + Add ons was $33,000 but I didn't pay that.

I mean seriously who pays above MSRP, Dealer fake invoice price. I mean the "REAL/Actual" cost of of base I4 was $27,779 +1,800 for tech +4600 for v6.

RkFast

Yes....cars depreciate a lot the first year they are on the road. Perhaps you should have done that little thing called "negotiation" with the salesman and got a better price.

And yes...even the best cars develop small problems. See that sign in your dealership that says "Service Department?" Those nice folks with the shiny metal objects in their hands (called "tools") can fix those things for you.

And no...you have zero clue about how leasing works and you should have read up on it before you signed a three year contract.

Sorry folks, to rag on this guy...but I have ZERO patience for the clueless.