Just out of curiousity, has anyone upgraded their TL-P suspension to the TL-S suspension (ie: shocks, springs, and rear sway)?

I find the ride of the TL-P a bit soft - I just want it to be a little more firm for better handling. Additionaly, I DON'T want to lower the car. So I'm thinking upgrading to the TL-S suspension might be the best choice.

Opinions?

 

check out my listing in blackmarket - $100 for type s springs and shocks w/ 45k miles.

 

just get aftermarket springs.....dont waste your money on TLS stuff when you can get the stuff and to it yourself

 

FYI - All after market springs will drop your car noticably. H&R OE will be the least .75- 1 inch.

 

TL,

If you want a firmer ride to your TL-P, then yes it will give you a firmer ride. The TLS's suspension can be a tad bumpy in terms of it's stiffness when going over some roads but you might be okay if you don't have the 50 series tires that the TLS has;You'll definitely feel the suspension being more firmer.

If you are going to buy the TLS shocks/springs setup new from Acura, it's better off to go aftermarket, since they're pricey, besides the labor costs.

 

The TL-S suspension is much firmer trust me.

 

It's not worth it

 

Hmm...seems like I'm getting mixed opinions here

Well, I called my dealer today and they don't recommed it either...they said to go aftermarket for better price.

However, they gave me some weird advice. He said to just get new struts and bushings. What are bushings? Never heard of changing them out to increase handling performance. He said the factory bushings are just plastic and not strong enough to make full use of the swaybar. He also recommended Comptech.

Since I don't want to lower...and just want the ride a bit stiffer (ie: better handling...less like a boat)...what are my best upgrade options. Any suggestions?

If it ends up I have to lower my ride...then I would like a minimal lowering. I don't want it slammed or anything...b/c I live in Canada and have to drive in the winter when there's a few feet of snow on the ground.

Thanks!

 

well, you could just replace the shocks with tokico blues or illuminas - it will be stiffer, and keep stock springs. or get hr oe springs.

 

Yeah i would definately recommend the Illuminas and some H&R Springs, that should quench your thrist for better handling

 

TL,

You said:
Yes if you are going to buy off Acura as new parts, then yes I definitely say it's not worth it in terms of the money, labor, performance, time you are going to spend. It's mainly the "price" that you are going to pay for new parts. The TLS's shock/spring system is pretty good but kinda high in terms of height for the wheelwell gaps. I HIGHLY recommend a sway bar modification to either Comptech or Eibach for better handling and less "boat feel". Warning: becareful if you are driving in heavy snow in Alberta though because the sway bars change your car's lateral suspension meaning that your car will be more firmly planted in the ground and if you don't have good snow tires, expect yourself to wipe out in snow!

I assume when you are talking about "bushings," they are the bushings that are for the sway bars. Yes the bushings on the sway bars might not be good enough for performance and handling for the sway bar; usually people have polyurethane bushings for the rear of the sway bars. For my Eibach sway bars, the front bushings were reused ( i think they were black polyurethane ones). I am not sure if Comptech supplies their sway bars with new polyurethane bushing but they should from what I read.

Eibach's polyurethane bushing for sway bars: Those red little blocks

Your said:
Options ( considering you want better handling, less boat feel and little to no lowering - Although I recommend lowering it at least a little because the TL's wheel gaps look like hell in my opinion besides that is what is contributing to the some of that :"boat feel").

1) I have Tein coilovers; they are coilovers which is the complete strut assembly ( shocks/springs) which gives you the ability to lower the car OR raise the height to stock height adjustment ( which I doubt you will really want) and has 16 way adjustable shock dampening ability. Stocks and springs are "mated" for each other with no "guess" work with which to pair springs/shocks. This is the best option but also the most costly in price. For me it feels very stock like for a TLS and probably better in terms of smoothness and shock absorbing ability. For you, you will feel a bit more bumpy since you have a TL, but still very comfortable since the springs on the Teins aren't that hard. This setup is worth it with no regrets; just make sure you find a good installer.

2) Another option with minimal drop is: 1) H&R OE springs (very minimal drop, adds nicer look to the TL - about 1" drop front and back) with 2) Tokico illuminas (Koni Yellows will be firmer and less comfortable)
1) Tein H.tech Springs 1.5" front ( since the TL has such a big wheelgap here) and 1" in the back with probably 2) Tokico Illuminas also.
Tein website

Some place in Alberta for modifications but not necessary the best prices

I don't recommend mismatching business of using stock springs with aftermarket shocks or aftermarket springs with stock shocks either. Most people have been happy with the shocks Tokico Illuminas and Koni Yellows ( but firmer ). It's the springs you are probably looking for: since you want no drop or minimal drop. I recommend to drop it minimal because like I said the TL's wheelgaps are ugly and way too high to begin with. Hope this helps.

 

Nice break out!!!!! We need more intelligent answers like this on this site.

 

Thanks for all the great input guys...especially Michael03TLS!!

This really helped to get me up to speed on what I need. I'm going to do some research on the three options Michael03TLS gave me. They all seem to be very good options!

I think I might end up doing a slight drop on the TL afterall...1 to 1.5 inches doesn't seem that bad. My TL has the oem bodykit...and it would definitely look much nicer with a drop. I'm just hesitant to drop it too far because I will be driving the car in the winter.

So does the term coilover mean a complete strut assembly (ie: in 1 single unit)?

In terms of springs, do any you have any experiences with using the H&R OE, or Tein H.tech springs in the winter? I remember reading on these forums that some of these aftermarket springs don't fair too well in the salty winter conditions. As for shocks, I will must likely go with the Tokico Illuminas for shocks.

Anyways, I'll be doing more research, then posting any further questions. I'll also keep u guys updated on what I ultimately choose. Thanks!

 

haha thanks for the compliment Shaqs2002TLS Normally people would probably think my post are long, but at least if you read through the whole thing, it would make alot of sense and give a member an "informed consumer" background so he can make the right choices. I've learned alot from just reading so many threads and never posting anything before but if someone ask something, I'll answer with the best of my ability so he/she can make the right choices. Knowledge and reading is the only way to make the right car modification choices.People here at Acurazine, except for a few, have been so nice in helping each other out; that should be the way for us Acura enthusiast.

TL,
The slight drop will definitely look better for you since you have body kit, but I understand your concerns about your snow problem in Alberta too; you certainly don't want your car to act like a "shovel" in snow hehe.

The term "coilover" varies slightly from what each other claim it is. Yes, in general the coilover is the WHOLE shock(strut)/spring assembly with the hardware such as washers, bump stopper, rubber bushings, and lower and sometimes upper spring seats, and spring seat adjusting locks. For Teins, it reuses your OEM upper spring mount.The main difference for the term "coilover" in my opinion is the "Adjustability" of height of the vehicle. Since aftermarket shocks have adjustability in terms of dampening, it can be confusing. Coilovers =1) vehicle height adjustability and 2) shock dampening adjustability.

You said:
I believe there are no rust issues with H&R springs at all or the H.tech. The Tein H.tech springs came out not that long ago so we don't know for sure but I am sure they are quite good too. Comptech in the past was the one with the "rust" issues though with their original,silver colored springs.

Another springs you can consider is Eibach which is 1.5" both front and back; it might be little lower than you expect but the ride quality should be pretty good on them too because they are progressive springs, plus they have 1 million mile warranty on the springs LOL. H&R or Tein H.tech are probably the way to go though since you want mildest drop, but at least you have one more option. Also mild drops will not require you to get camber kits; I'd still advise you to get an alignment after the lowering of your car though just to be safe. Anytime you lower a car, you generally need to get an alignment...WAIT about 2-3weeks for the spring/shocks to settle or "break-in" though because they do sink a bit.

Also there is one more option for Shocks, which is the Bilstein shock, made for Honda accords, which will feel like "stock" for TLS or CLS stock suspension. Read this other CL's opinion of his ride here. His name is "NiteQwill" and he's knows alot and is very helpful to talk to if need more questions:
Read NiteQwill's review on his H&R springs/Bilstein combo for suspension and his DIY guide.

Haha you probably learned about 2 months of reading for suspension parts/opinions already from just reading my opinion.

 

Michael03TLS, after doing more reading...I think I've decided upon the Tien Coilovers. It seems to be best to have a spring/strut that is perfectly matched. Also, the Tiens have hight adjustabiliy, which is ideal - I can raise it in the winter - and lower in the summer.

Now my question is: do you recommend the Tien SS, or Tien basics? From my understanding, the only difference is damping adjustabiliy on the SS. All I want is a ride that's fairly close to the stock Type -S... maybe a little better in terms of performance. Do you know how the default damping setting is for the Tien basics? Would it be too harsh? That's my main concern..soft is okay.

Thanks!

 

TL,

Okay Tein coilovers are a good choice in general for our TLs. I understand that you are "use to a TL" suspension but are looking for TLS suspension "feeling". Yes the Tein coilovers are going to be pretty much like "TLS feeling". Be aware of the change of feeling from 1) TL suspension to a 2) TLS suspension, it will certainly be firmer, handler better and probably you'll feel the bumps on uneven roads much more, but still acceptable; some people say it's harsh and it's because of where they are coming from. The TL(P) suspension is very soft actually and comfortable but I am certain that you feel it's "floaty"; even stock TLS suspension is "floaty". Changing to aftermarket Eibach sway bar should help your car's handling big time, which you should think about later if you don't have the mod on your car already; make sure you have good tires because after all these modifications, you are will handle a lot better and you want grippy tires to upgrade to as the stock Michelins are junk.

You said:Be aware of the fact that if you raise up and down on the suspension, it will change your camber readings on the car; what this means is that you will have to get an alignment done again if the height adjustment is changed a lot. Get an alignment done after you put in your aftermarket suspension after about 2-3 weeks of driving so the springs/shock settle in but NOT right after you put the suspension in. You probably will require a rear camber kit arms if you lower your car quite a bit; milder drop no camber kits ( usually 1-1.25" drop. Generally you try to set it pretty much at what you want, get an alignment and then leave it. Yes Tein coilovers are ideal because they have height adjustments over a normal shock/spring system (fixed height and no changing at all)

You said: Humm..
If you are "used to a TL(P) suspension", i would say either one is good for your ride quality, handling, cornering, performance and "feel" of the car. Remember "TLS feeling" suspension is going to be firmer no doubt as I described up top. However, if you were going from a 1) TLS suspension to 2) Tein coilovers, you would say Tein coilovers, Basic or SS, would be too soft of a suspension; the reason for this is because the Tein SS or Basics have too soft of a spring rate on them. I have the Tein SS-P , which have the upper pillowball aluminum mounts, which are noiser, firmer spring "feeling", better cornering/handling, but these are expensive and I would probably not recommend them. The spring rates on the Tein Basics/SS have been complained about being kinda soft; even the spring rates on the TLS is firmer from my experience. However, the Tein Basic and Tein SS dampening rates on the shocks are very good, meaning it will feel comfortable and kinda accomodate for the softer spring rates. Of course you can only adjust dampening on the Tein SS and NOT the Tein Basics. I would say, from riding in a friend's car with Tein Basics ( he had TLS suspension), it is very comfortable but a bit soft for hard cornering( when pushed to the limit) without being able to adjust the dampening of the shocks. It will however still handle very well for you and your car. NO, it will not be "harsh", but it will feel quite a bit more bumpier compared to a soft, TL(P) suspension setup and more "sport-like".; any aftermarket system is going to be more firmer/harsh. It will more or less feel like a stiffer,firmer, bumpier ride like a TLS suspension.In general, like I said, the flaw with Tein coilover for the 2G TL is the soft spring rates but I guess they didn't want it to feel uncomfortable for "street" applications.

I would say that if you are coming from a TL(P) suspension feeling, you will be happy with either one of the Tein products: Tein Basic or Tein SS.
However, note the differences and advantages:

1)Tein Basics: no dampening adjustments. Not compatable with EDFC ( electronic dampening controller). EDFC is very nice to have. I have it. It gives you the ability to adjust the dampening while in the car or driving and it sets your shock dampening from hardest to softest or in-between. It's a very nice gadget to have! If you get Tein Basics, you WILL NOT be able to get the EDFC if you "later decide" to have Tein Basic work with the EDFC.

2) Tein SS: dampening adjustments with or without the EDFC but you need to either A)take off the back seats to adjust it if you have no EDFC OR B)drill two tiny holes in the back rear deck lid for a hexagon key pipe tool to adjust it without taking the back seats off. Secondly, Tein SS is EDFC compatable; meaning that if you "later decide" you want EDFC to adjust the dampening levels, you can just buy EDFC unit and install it. EDFC unit is very nice to have and makes FULL use/potential of the Tein SS coilovers with convenience.

Hope this helps..haha it damn well should with all this feedback from someone who did their research, commented on the flaws of Tein coilovers, and has Teins himself with EDFC for testing all the dampening settings

Haha, if I ever drive to Calgary or Edmonton, you should be buying me lunch/dinner lol.

 

wow, nice write up michael. you seem to know your stuff..

 

whatwasthat,

Hehe thanks man That's my another great compliment to my posting replies I normally give; Yeah I admit, i don't know everything

Yeah I try to give a very informative post whenever I reply to someone or when someone needs a very good opinion. The reason why i don't have that many post replies in this forum , besides being new to it, is because I generally read alot first to educate myself. After being knowledgeable, from hearing others opinions, their mistakes, their positives, negatives, complaints, then I am able to give as close as possible "facts" to people with advantages and disadvantages of things; besides all the good people in this forum that have helped each other out, I am simply reciprocating and doing the same for others that seek answers.

 

Thanks Michael03TLS! You've definitely helped me a lot...probably saved me days of reading forums!

So I guess I'll set the Tien SS's to a mild drop...and leave it there. Since I have to take out the back seats to adjust the damping on the SS's...and I don't want to...is there any real advantage of getting over the Basics? Like..then i'd only adjust the front shocks for damping. I don't care too much for extreme performance...just a Type-S like ride with a mild drop to get rid of some of the floaty feeling. It's kinda bad when my Honda CR-V feels more firm than my TL-P...

And of course...I'll be looking at rims next! haha

 

TL,

You said:
It really depends on your budget also. I mean for the little bit more money, such as $250US dollars based on MSRP price - although it's more likely around $150-200 US difference if you shop around, it is worth having the Tein SS because of the adjustability of dampening. Can you really feel the difference? From having the EDFC, electronic dampening, YES you can feel the differences from changing the settings of the dampening and how it drives, handles, and feels in terms of the suspension. You will probably just take out the backseat and adjust the dampening to how you like it but at least you have the "ability" to do it with the Tein SS over the Tein Basics, which have fixed dampening. Just remember, from what I said about Tein products, the spring rates are a big soft for the coilovers; this is of course coming from a TLS suspension point of view. From your point of view of a TL suspension, I'd think you will do fine on either coilover setup because it's going to definitely feel firmer but still comfortable - like a TLS suspension.

If you go for the Tein Basics, just remember you can't change your mind later and say you want to have shock dampening adjustability or use the EDFC ( based on later decisions). If you can afford it, I'd still recommend the Tein SS coilovers over Tein Basics; even though you take out the back seat to adjust, nonetheless, you can still adjust the shocks according to how you like and "feel" the car should be and YES, shock dampening adjustment does "fine tune" the car's suspension and make a difference besides the spring rates.

If you have not already found a place to buy your Tein coilovers, I bought mine in California from:
www.tmengineering.net
If you find a better place in the US with better pricing, just ask Todd if he can match the price, which I think he can. His prices are pretty good because Tein Distribution warehouse is in Southern California also and he picks up his stuff every few days from the local county.

 

I did it on my 2000 TL-P,it is a lot stiffer.from 3 to 7,if max is 10.but it is a little higher that it was(i don't know why??)here is the pic,the trunk has apporx 100lbs things in it http://img312.imageshack.us/my.php?i...anon4997my.jpg

 

humm, the front doesn't even look like it's lowered at all, unless you or someone put the Tein coilovers back up to around normal. Even a 100lbs in the back shouldn't make a difference like that. It's possible that something isn't installed right?

I would certainly do some investigation into the situation.