luxurycarson20s

I Have An 01 Tl Dropped On H&r Sports, As Soon As They Were Put On I Had My Car Alignment, Everything Was In Spec, There Was No Camber Kit Or Anything Needed, 6 Months Later I Go To Rotate My Tires, And The 2 Front Tires Have Excessive Tread Wear On The Inside 2 Front Tires, They Are Down To The Secondary Rubber, And Metal Will Be Coming Soon. Does Anyone Know Why This Could Have Happened, Could The Camber Have Gone Outta Line? Something With The Struts? Is There Just An Adjustment That Has To Be Made. I Have No Idea Where To Take It, Im Located In The South Florida Area, Broward Area. If Anyone Can Help Me Out In Anyway I Would Greatly Appreciate It. Thanks In Advance

Ps. Mods I Know This Probably Belongs In Tires/wheels Sectoin, Could U Please Just Keep It Here For A Day Or 2 And Then Move It, Because I Need To Make A Decision Soon Otherwise The Car Will Be Undriveable. Thank You Guys

optomos

You have a 1.75 drop on the front right? With a 1.75 drop you need a camber kit! I had a .75 drop on my old car & it still needed a camber kit. It didnt eat up the tires fast, but it still ate em up nevertheless. I have no idea who told you the car was in spec, but you were fed some BS.

car_lost

there is a place down south that i would recommend. they are great guys. its called Doral Autotek and the number is 305-716-0232. they charge about $65 (after taxes) for an alignment. i'm pretty sure the front has a certain amount of adjustment when it comes to camber and what not. the palce is located literally in between Dolphin Mall and Miami International Mall.

hope that helps.

fsttyms1

i would have another alignment done to see what the specs are. you would have to have SERIOUS camber to wear out a set of fronts in 6 months, where as TOE would wear them out real fast
after teh alignment see what the specs are with the camber and what the Toe was

whatwasthat

i thought H&R springs were safe? safe meanign that they wouldn't need a camber kit.. i would be installing tein basics soon, what would be the reasons that people get the camber kit?

i think my question is kinda confusing but what causes camber kit to be needed? is it b/c the dropp is too low or something? what is it that happens when your car is ddropped?

LacViet

I believe that you need to wait for a week or so after install the spring to let the spring settle down first before do the alignment. From what you told us, you did the alignment right after you installed the spring?

TL_S_Driver

agreed. the alignment should wait until after the springs settle. a week sounds about right.

luxurycarson20s

thanks for all your help guys, after the springs were put in i had the car aligned a day or two after. and havent since then. its been about 6 months and i went to go get the tires balanced and rotated, and the guy says ''we cant do this because the inside's of your 2 front tires are down too the secondary rubber and metal is almost showing. so today i am going back to the place that did my alignment and having another one done and asking them the things you guys told me to ask about the specs and toe. i will keep you guys posted and thanks for the help.

Michael03TLS

luxurycarson20s,

Some interesting points have been brought up in this discussion. LacViet brought up an important point when having your car lowered by any aftermarket springs/shock or coilover system.
He said:
What probably happened is that you had your alignment done too soon and during that six month period ( probably more like within a month's time), your springs had sunk in and "broke-in" after your alignment and then your alignment issues came into play. As far as fsttyms1 mentioning that it's awfully fast to have worn inside tires within 6months, I would agree on that; also depends how you drive too while you had that screwed up alignment. fsttyms1 said "TOE" out-of-specifications would wear the tires out fast. I recently had an alignment done with about ~2.1"inch drop in the front and had some "Toe" out of specifications, but the Acura dealership played around with some adjustments and it went back in specifications. With that drop, I did not need a front camber kit. The only camber kit you really need to worry about is the REAR camber kit on the TL's. That is where most of the camber changes on our cars, unless you slammed the front end aggressively with more than 2.5" inches.

It may or may not be your alignment shop's fault for your tire wearing problem because you did the alignment too soon. However, it is important to bring it to a reputable and competent mechanic. Not all mechanics are the same nor do they know exactly how the TL's suspension is setup. Acura dealerships are expensive but you can pretty much count on the alignment job to be done properly. Also ask for a senior mechanic to do the job .

Secondly, luxurycarson20s
Ask for a printout of the BEFORE and AFTER alignment specifications sheet and readings. IF they can't do that, you are bringing it to the wrong shop to get it done and if they lie to you or don't do it right, you'll just get guiled.

whatwasthat,

Read here for more camber kit questions (in addition to the search option):
https://acurazine.com/forums/showthread.php?t=116850

As far as your questions go:
H&R springs are safe in general, but it doesn't mean you won't need a camber kit for sure. I believe the H&R sport is 1.75" front and 1.5" back. In my opinion, this is already borderline in terms of a camber kit. To be safe for dropping without camber kit, I would say 1-1.25 front and back. Some people say they don't need a camber kit, I would say show me the proof first, such as his/her alignment readings; some people are either ignorant, cheap ( in terms of not buying a camber kit), or plain stupid and not knowing what the consequences of lowering a car escalates to.

You answered your own questions: Why cars need a camber kit? In general the lower you go, the more risk you have of having negative camber which can adversely affect your handling, tire wear, and cornering. You tires will look like this as Patrick, in the above link, said : your tires / \ in the back part of your car.
Read here for more of a thorough explain by Eibach:

http://eibach.com/cgi-bin/htmlos.exe...55549700005834

luxurycarson20s

ok guys, so i went to have the car looked it, they told me the camber was in spec, the toe was out of spec and needed to be adjusted. they said the camber was fine and in spec, it was just the toe. he said the problem is becuase i waited 6-8 months and alsmot 10k for a rotation and alignment. he said the only way to correct it is to raise it to stock suspension. he said if i bring the car in every 2k miles and have the tires rotated and the car aligned it will slow down the tread wear on the insides but will still continue to happen. i was looking for aftermarket rims, but if im going to continue to have this problem im obviously not getting them. right now im getting 2 new tires, having the car re-aligned, coming back in a month or so and see if the toe is going out of spec and after that i will be back every 2k miles to have it switched and see if the problem continues.

ANY COMMENTS AND SUGGESTIONS ARE WELCOME, AND I DO APPRECIATE ALL THE HELP I GET ON THE BOARD FROM U GUYS.

Lawaia

Alignment every 2k miles?? Do yourself a favor and find another shop. That guy is surely smokin' some crack.

optomos

The wear on the inside of BOTH tires denotes camber wear. Toe has to do with the direction the tires are facing...camber has to do with the angle they are at. With a positive camber the tires are angled in thus the wear is on the inside edges of the tires.

Did they give you a printout of the alignment? Have you been to more than one shop? If not you need to go to another location like NTB & have them try to do an alignment. IF they cant (in your case they wont be able to) they will give you a readout of what the problem is & wont charge you. You should get at least three opinoins from 3 different shops without tell the shops anything. Let them disover for themselves.

REDLINEN

I have said many times !!!! I was dropped 3 inches for 8 months and with my custom alignment I had no camber issues the tires were still like new. And now Im dropped on a diffrent setup (tein) I still have no camber issues after I got my alignment. Get a good alignment by someone who knows what the hell they are doing and ya will not need a camber kit believe me!!!!

Michael03TLS

luxurycarson20s,

I'd be weary of what kind of mechanic is doing your alignment on your car (even if he is your friend or so-called trusted mechanic). Optomos explains it in simple terms as to why your tires are wearing on the "inside", which does indicate it's a camber issue. I'd go with Optomos's advice in trying to get other opinions, with printouts, independently and not tell each of those shops that you already had an alignment.

My drop is about ~2" in the front. This is more of a drop than your H&R springs. With my drop of 2", my camber was still in specification but was negative (-.4 left and -.5 right). The max negative camber you can have in the front is -1.0. The problem with my drop was with "TOE" being out; it was beyond the tolerance and was in red readings at -.2 left, -.25right. The max TOE tolerance is -.1 for each side. So you can see that I was out by double the amount for TOE. The Acura dealership did in fact adjust my TOE settings correctly.

It's possible that you can have 1) negative front camber AND 2) Toe specification problems that would wear your tires out so fast. This would make sense to being worn on the 1)inside of the tires and 2)being so fast within 6months.

[B]Advice:[/B]Get some "free" readings from other alignment shops, if it is possible, to get a general idea of what is needed... such as:
A) Is the camber out or not in the front?
B) Is the toe out as the mechanic says it is? What is the reading?
C)Is the camber in the rear out of specifications such as being more than -1.0 degress, then you *may* need a camber for the rear later during the actual alignment so you might want to have the parts ready.

IF worse comes to worse,take it to an Acura Dealership and have them do it there. It is going to be more expensive but it's going to be done right rather than you guessing. I KNOW as a FACT that they adjusted my TOE problems, like what you are having if your mechanic is telling you the truth, back to normal readings by adjusting the lower control arms somehow when I was watching them. In short, they know your Acura suspension setup better than "outside" mechanics.

PLUS Any shop that can't give you a printout of your alignment readings is incompetent and unknowledgeable, so I suggest you go elsewhere.