LightningSTL26

hey guys im in a real dilemma here with what kind of coilovers to get. i just bought some falken torque5 19x7.5 but i dont know what kinda coilovers i should get in order to get a good drop but still maintain a good ride. im goin to be doing a lot of freeway driving so i want it to be comfortable, but i also dont want my tires to rub. i was thinking of going with the tein basics but i heard they bottom out a lot. so PLEASE PLEASE give me some input! thanks!

Phrosttz0

TEIN SS

chewi

tein basics is ok if u don't mind being on the softer side

MQMH_03

yeah go with tein ss or apexi ws dampeners (if u can still get them). I actually recently purchased tanabe sustec ss pro coilovers for my car. Got them for a hell of a deal too. 1/2 of what they retail for new --- $1100

LightningSTL26

where did u get the sustec ss?? and are there any major differences between the tein ss and the tanabe? how do u like the ride so far mqmh?

MQMH_03

I haven't got them installed yet, but once they are on, I'll let you know. I heard that they are supposedly a bit stiffer than the teins, but which translates into better handling. I think the teins ss are 16 way adjustable and the tanabe are 8 way.... by the way your avatar rocks... kristen kreuk

Pure Adrenaline

iTrader: (2)

Stiffer also means a harsh ride. It all comes down to trade-offs based on what you're looking for in the coilovers.

Virtually all coilovers available for our cars will let you set up a drop to your liking; that's the whole point of coilovers -- infinite adjustability within the range.

The big question is how stiff you want it, and if you want damping adjustability.

Hell, you could get Ground Control sleeve-type coilovers (cheap in both price and quality) and ride low as hell and have a terrible handling characteristic. Or you could go all out and buy Zeal coilovers (near 2,000 dollars). Tein SS is popular among the TL owners here because it gives both height and damping adjustabilities at an affordable price (usually about 850-950 dollars). Tein is also the only company that makes EDFC (Electronic Damping Force Controller) which is a computer unit that controls 4 servos to electronically change damping rates on the fly. This is the setup I have on my car, and I love having a soft ride on the highway and sporty handling in the city; all by pushing a couple of buttons.

MQMH_03

yeah very good point Pure Adrenaline, I am hoping that my tanabe's are too rough of a ride that its unbearable... I would have loved to have gotten the Teins, but they are a little out of my price range. I got a hell of a deal on the Tanabe's $500 when they retailed for 1100. Too bad the Tanabe Sustec's dont have anything like the EDFC that Teins have huh...

LightningSTL26

i c sounds the the tein ss is a good choice for me...just one question, do i need the pillow ball upper mounts in order to have the edfc? oh and thanks for the compliment about my avatar, kristin kreuk is a godess in my eyes

Michael03TLS

LightningSTL26,

No you do not have to have the aluminum pillowball mounts in order use or install the EDFC in the future if you own a TL or TLS. It is only the CL(S) which requires you to use the Tein SS-P which have the pillowball mounts; these have different piston rod length in comparison to the Tein SS. The front hood of the CL's have less room for clearance, hence, that's why they need the Tein SS-P coilovers in order to use the EDFC. You can read my some of what I said about Tein coilovers in the link below. The Tein SS-P's also have different spring designs in comparision to Tein SS or Tein Basics; I am surprised that NO ONE ever mentioned this in this TL forum, not even Mr. Pure Adrenaline. Anyways, if you are noise sensitive, because the springs hit against the aluminum pillowball mounts without any rubber coil spring isolators, then certainly the Tein SS-P's are not right for you. BUT , the aluminum pillowball mounts and the "straight" spring design of the Tein SS-P, in comparision to the Tein SS/Basic's "progressive" (tapered) style spring design, give much more of a firmer ride, steering response and handling ability for cornering and more vehicular stability, as well as maintain height measurements of your vehicle (i.e differential spring sagging values and compression of springs withing the coilover in comparision to to Tein Basic/SS using the stock OEM, upper spring seat mounts). Any true, race-breed and sport-oriented coilover that is used on track has a firm spring mounts ,such as aluminum pillowballs, and "straight" spring style. You can see how it would improve your handling on the streets. The epitome of a true sports or sport-luxury cars are BMWs for example and the strut system, such as BMW's 645I coupe- especially the back, has "straight springs" and tightly wound coils which give a firmer, more responsive handling car.

The Tein SS-P are still mean for "streets" still as the spring rates aren't that high on them and made for the more sportier applications for our cousin car the CLS. Obviously the trade off is the noise factor which is due to the aluminum pillowball mounts not insulated properly by Tein (poor craftsman ship on their part), ballbearings in the aluminum pillowball mounts and likely weak springs besides the "imperfect" fitment of the springs on the aluminum pillowball mounts, as well as on the lower spring perch. I am placing my bet that other coilovers of Japanese made quality, perhaps Tanabe with aluminum pillowballs, will not have this "quaity issue" problem.

Tein in general is a "decent" coilover for price vs performance but it is not in the "excellent" category in my opinion. I can list several reasons off the top of my head that would not put Tein in the top category. Like Pure Adrenaline said, the only reason that I did try Tein is the EDFC, electronic dampening force controller, but other than that, I would not buy Tein again though as some of their "quality" is questionable such as: weak spring rates, springs not fitting properly and squarely on the spring pearches, lack of insulating coil spring rubber isolator, seat locking rings are weak in comparision to other brands of coilovers, marginal paint on the shock body, shock body is not aluminum and looks average, piston rod is smaller than Apexi piston rod's 40mm, and oh, that "mysterious clunking" noise that happens to some Tein coilovers, that has never been actually been accounted for in some of our TL member's tein coilovers. Tein has also had "rust issues" (certainly not good for people that have a lot of salt on their roads in winter) in the past with their seat locking rings rusting and so your suspension would fall due to the seat rings breaking; this has been confirm with me personally talking to a Tein representative at the US distribution warehouse in Downey,CA besides talking to other people who race their cars and own their high performance shops and use these products. They "said" they have fixed this problem though.

For these reasons, I think Tein is overrated by members in this TL forum. I can say for the "price vs. performance" factor, Tein is a decent buy. When pushed with more "sport" oriented driving, the spring rates are a common complaint for being inadequate, but I can say the valving is good for a "comfortable" ride quality though but still doubtful for "real sport handling". Even with Tein SS/Basic/SS-P, I would say it would not give "Bimmer" type of sport-luxury feel for handling/cornering. Especially for the 2G TL, Tein realized that they had indeed put weak spring rates on the Tein coilovers, especially Tein SS/Basic, because if you look at the Tein coilovers for the +04 and up, it is significantly increased in terms of it's spring rates.

Tanabe or Apexi WS are also good choices to get for our TL's instead also.



MQMH_03,
I think you meant you are hoping that the Tanabe's aren't too rough that's it's unbearable? Anyways, read my review and analysis here:

Tanabe VS Tein, CLICK this link

That is my prediction that your Tanabe coilovers will be firmer but not by a whole lot and the handling, response, cornering ability will be better though than Tein SS/Basic.

I want to see if I am right or not so can you give feedback after you install your Tanabe Sustec SS PRO and for other TL members to know how good they are for our 2G TL MQMH_03?

Secondly, did you buy your Tanabe Sustec SS PRO used? off from that guy that was selling them in the blackmarket section of this forum?

Thanks,
Michael

LightningSTL26

wow...mike, thanks for the great feedback. very imformative. anyway ur write-up really did give me some second thoughts about buying the tein now...i may want to go with some apexi's or something now. well it looks like im going to look into a couple of other options before making a final decision now. anyway thanks again for ur feedback.

Michael03TLS

You're welcome for the feedback As a user and someone who has experience with Tein, I have to give the positives and negatives about a product and I simply can't say "get Teins because I have it... or my buddy has it and it's good so get it..everyone in this TL forum has it so it must be good and popular" These statements are just simply hearsay and don't mean much. I try my best to be objective and fair, and since most TL members have been so great to each other helping each other out with their modifications and other unrelated questions, I have to do the same in return.

Like I stated, EDFC (electronic dampening) is the most coolest thing about Tein coilovers if you want to spent the extra money and to make full useage of the dampening settings by using electronic box to "fine-tune" your suspension, rather than having to take out your back seat or drill a hole in the rear decklid to put a hexagon wrench stem to adjust the dampening settings. But I did state other reasons why I think Tein isn't good either, mainly due to quality issues and some spring rate issues. I mean it's a good, decent product to endorse, but I can't fully endorse it.

Ideally, if you can find a company that has aluminum pillow ball mounts on the coilovers, that doesn't make noise problems, with a sufficient spring rate and good dampening, it should give you the advantage for better handling and cornering rather than a coilover that uses your stock OEM upper, spring seat mounts. It's like adding an extra plate of metal to hold your coilover ( spring/shock) system and have it wedged in the upper shock tower of your car engine; you can see how this would hold your shock/spring system more firmly in place for a firmer suspension. Tanabe might be worth looking into. Usually using aluminum pillowball coilovers are more for track use and more noiser but it's worth it if you can find one of good quality, low noise level for the improved performance. If you don't like noise at all and want really quiet driving and know that it will be softer in response, then just get a coilover with no aluminum pillowball mounts and a system that uses OEM TLS upper, spring seat mounts.

Hope this helps you in the end. Just explore all your options before rushing into buying any type of coilover out there. Usually Japanese coilovers are best, rather than the Taiwanese coilovers (can't be the price on these though), but as I pointed out, Japanese Tein coilovers have issues too. Also consider technical support as a consideration factor if you need to phone and ask things about coilovers when you purchase these suspension parts; Tein has technical support that seems to be pretty good in their distribution warehouse in Downey,Southern California. Maybe you can try to phone Tanabe or Apexi distribution warehouses in the US to see how it's like too. I mean I am sure you already found out so many answers just by doing your own investigation and by hearing what other "users" of these coilover products have to say about their experience. Of course technical support people who work for these companies are going to be somewhat biased in their opinions to say it's a "great product".

MQMH_03

Hey, thats a great write-up. I am very excited to install my coilovers and see how they ride. Yes, you are right, I did purchase my Tanabe Sustec's from a guy in the blackmarket section. Great deal too! I got them for half the msrp. I am still waiting for them to come in the mail though Hopefully they get here soon so i can get them on the TL and report back how they compare in terms of performance, ride height and dampening.

Michael03TLS

MQMH_03,


Thank you very much and I hope everything goes well with the Tanabe Sustec Pro SS; it's the one with aluminum pillowball mounts with height and dampening adjustability, so it's basically loaded with features and you didn't pay an arm and leg on the price. I have always heard good things about Tanabe but need to hear more people's experience, especially the good and negative things about it."Chewi" got the last set of Apexi WS from Sparkmotoring site I posted so we can certainly compare the results and how it is when you two get it both installed; I am local and going ride his car to see how it is also and we can exchange feedback. I am predicting the Tanabe Sustec Pro SS will be better handling, response, and for cornering so we'll see what happens. Both are good choices and alternatives to Tein I believe. It's only the EDFC, electronic dampening, that gives Tein a slight advantage for "features" in my opinion.


It's just nice to know how the Tanabe Sustec Pro SS will handle for our 2G TL because it's a heavier car than the Honda Accord of the same 98-02 platform.

And also to satisfy my curiousity, tell me if the aluminum pillowballs make any noise while you drive after install them. Thanks again

chewi

Just got my Apexi's in today from UPS

Here they are
[IMG][/IMG]
[IMG][/IMG]

Michael03TLS

Very nice Chewi. Can't wait to see you have them installed and then see how the ride quality is on the Apexi WS. I told MQMH_03 that once he has his Tanabe Sustec Pro SS installed also, we need some feedback regarding both of them through comparative analysis in the most objective and fair way so it can give other TL member some options to choose from other than Tein coilovers.

Thanks guys