I would personally go for a brand new car, so I would pick a black 3.2TL Type S.

 

That's total BS about the GS4 getting more status and looks

with my TL-S...the kit..and drop...
everywhere I go...ppl look at my car in *AWE* ...i get approached at gas stations.....at car washes... people ask me..how u like the car?? nice car... how much is it?... I'm thinking of getting one...etc...

I go to clubs.... I got parked next to nsx...new sc4 ...m3, m5s...

I drive on the roads...people just kept looking at my car..and point fingers at my car...and talks about it..

our car is just as good of a looker than the lexus GS series...
for a couple Gs less

city

 

Looks are speculative city, and in all fairness, you are (I assume) comparing your modified vehicle to a stock GS. Modded vs. modded would still be opinion but more accurate. Acura definitely played it conservative and safe (a Honda trait) so as not to set the TL too far apart, hence the Accord comparisons. On the other hand, the GS's love-it-or-leave-it appearance looks like no other car out there, hence the reason I bought one. And again, I don't understand why people feel the need to justify saving money, especially when they say their next car will be _____(fill in the blank), usually costing $20k more than their TL/TLs ?? When you buy it will you feel ripped off spending the extra cash ?

 

For a guy who drives a Lexus you sure do spend a lot of time discussing Acuras and rolling your eyes at those of us who chose Acura.

Many of the people who choose Acura over Lexus cannot afford a GS430, TED. Somehow I think you know this, and yet you come to this website to gloat. Furthermore, you are not making much of a point when you bring up how often people talk about what their next car will be. It is normal to want nicer things than one already has; to hope that one's next car will be nicer than one's current car.

Frankly Ted, it is my opinion that you do not communicate very effectively. Why don't you just come right out and say "I can afford a nicer car than most of you, it makes me feel good to know this, and I enjoy my perceived status"? That would be refreshingly honest.

 

geez...you are a freak

and i agree with you completely...i was about to say the same thing when i got busy here at work....

 

Um, I could afford Teds lease..but um...leases are dumb!
(85% of all Lexi, um Lexus's are leased..source RL Polk)

 

Hahaha you see Ted you are not fooling anyone. You claim you are here just as an automotive enthusiast like others here, but yet your posts dictate your intentions as otherwise and its now obvious I am not the only one who sees this.
Yet you come here and accuse us of being insecure with our choices and having something to justify/prove.

Also whether leased or not; I and probably others could afford the GS. I chose the TL-S for what I felt was the best for me, based on my needs and what I wanted to spend.

 

Are we still comparing the TL to a GS? Ted, of course your GS is better, you paid $10-20k more, I sure hope so! BTW, leasing is not a bad idea is you change cars every 2-3 years, do the math.

 

I leased my Type S for $406 per month, 48 months, virtually no money down, and I know I'll be able to get out of the lease early if I decide I'm ready (I've gotten out of Acura leases three times without any significant harm done). And, I write off part of my lease payment for tax benefits.

I want to want to know why you think leases are dumb, but the truth is I don't want to know why you think this. I'm trying really hard to care what you think..well...OK FINE!!! TELL US WHY YOU THINK LEASES ARE DUMB? (there, I said it )

 

Oh take no offense...didn't mean any with my comment. It's just that for me and most people there is no benefit to a lease. If you do a cost/benefit analysis...(consumer reports has a good one) most people lose money in significant amounts so as to not make a lease cost effective. The dealers FLAT LOVE THEM! They make much more money off a lease than a straight purchase...anytime a dealer makes more money from us....ewww that's Bad, that's Bad. But you're right you can get in em' for cheap. As long as you don't go over your mileage limit and don't care about equity...it's all good.
Cost/Benefit analysis: down payment, term, interest rate, depreciation, mileage penalty & wear & Tear, tax implications etc.
Most people can pay 10-12% more $ per month and own the car at the end and thus have equity for a new purchase. (see your tax advisor) Hope this helps.

 

Looks are speculative city

EXACTLY MY POINT tedc..
doesn't mean GS4 are a much better looker than TL type S...
that's my main point... and I was replying to someone mentioning...GS4 are better looker than TLs..
in my opinion... My TL type S looks far much better than GS4.. I don't like the big and short A$$ backend...and the two circular lights ...seems like out of place....IS300 has much better connection between the lights.. more in place..

I had the money and choice to get GS4, M3, porsche boxter, s4..
but I decided to save the extra cash... and TL type S was also one of my top choices...for the style, performance, roominess...bigger trunk than all of those cars mentioned

city

 

Well, for starters I've owned both an Accord and a Legend, so that statement doesn't make sense.
Again, see above; also I came here before I bought my car when I was considering a TL.
Yes, it is normal to want nicer things, but when you use it to justify your purchase over another vehicle, even though you may actually want said vehicle or something in it's price range eventually, isn't that contradictive ??
As for Hyde:
Please find one post I made about people being insecure, I can find literally dozens (heck, 3 right in this topic !) feeling they need to justify their purchase.
What a classic ! You then go on to feel the need to justify buying your car !!!

 

Also, I didn't lease my car, and I sure as hell don't feel the need to "gloat" that since I saved $20k over the price of an M5, my car is somehow better.

 

Ted,

Can you let it go already? You are really starting to sound ridiculous. Your M5 example has nothing to do it.

Clearly there are people on this site that take issue with your comments. I suggest you go to the Lexus GS board where you would be more likely to find some sympathetic ears.

I think I can speak for several people on here in saying that I find your last reply to be antagonistic, obnoxious and lacking purpose.

 

Ted, chill dude. You sound snobby and arrogant (even though it might be unintentional) when you started comparing your GS to our TL(TL-S) because your car is in a different price category.

People do "justify saving money" because the reality is money do not grow on trees. I don't think it's being contradictory at all to desire a nicer car but actually buying a more affordable one. For most of us, we have a budget and things we are saving towards (college tuition for our kids or for ourselves, mortgage/rent, retirement).

I know the GS is a better car in terms of status, handling, and engineering (not going to discuss how it looks), but you don't have to rub it in. Chill my friend.

 

Leasing is fine if you don't want to OWN anything and want to ride new.

How about compare cars and not talk about PEOPLE. When you tl folks are trying to prove your TL is the best thing since sliced bread (and do not sway the potential buyer) you start attacking people (ya'll do it to me all the time too).

Saving money is cool, but buying ANY car is not saving money. Keeping your PREVIOUS car is.
Then if you add 5k in mods WTF, who is fooling who.
Then the popular argument is (SURVEY SAYS)

1. I can beat or meet a GS4
2. I can beat and meet an M3.
3, ETC ETC ETC

OH AND I SAVED 10-20K!

Nothing wrong with the TL at all, but when you are OBVIOUSLY OUTMATCHED and OUTCLASSED admit it.

Funny but I have NEVER heard ANY Lexus owner (any model) say "oh I saved 20k and with mods I can beat the M5".

We buy Lexus automobiles becasue they are recognized as the BEST or one of the BEST and they SUIT OUR NEEDS.

Some of you buy your cars because "I get a 4x8 Acura badge" and I saved 5k than the competition.

There are MANY TL owners here who KNOW they drive FAMILY CARS and are HAPPY with their choice and ADMIT they bought the car for the slightly added panache and feature content and KNOW the car is really in it's own class/world and I applaud ther comments.

Then there are some TL owners here who are EMBARRESSING these guys thinking they drive a Bentley/Ferrari in one for 30K.

It ain't about saving money, it's about comparing a 30k car with a 50k car AND THERE IS NO COMPARISON.

P.s. the GS 400 was 15th out of 20 cars chosen as the PEOPLE's FAVORITE CARS of ALL TIME. You won............

 

On one is gloating. A GS 430 like Ted's is a 55k car, A FACT.
Your car is 33k LOADED, a fact.

I feel NO ONE here is gloating, most of us here are adults and jeez, WTF is a car in the GRAND SCHEME of things.........

 

Ummmm....1sicklex....I don't agree at all with the following statement:

Statements like that are certainly not quite as epidemic on ClubLexus.com as they are here, but I've seen several threads where people are trying to figure out what it'd take to make the GS4 an M5 killer, and they (almost?) all include some statement about how much money can be saved over buying an M5 outright.

For example, recently one of the CL guys put the SRT stage 2 supercharger on his GS400 (~420HP at the flywheel!!!) and the general consensus was that he was ready to go eat M5s for lunch and that he had about $65K invested in his car vs. the ~$80K needed for an M5.

Heck, I'll say it right now! One of the main reasons I decided on the GS430 is that with L-Tuned suspension, torque converter, limited slip diff, and intake/ECU, the GS4 falls right in between the E55 and M5 performance-/handling-wise for a whole heck of a lot less $$$ (and without having to deal with Austin's crappy BMW dealer!). However, it's still missing some of the luxo features of the bimmer such as scheduled climate control, auto folding side mirrors, etc.

I can understand how these guys apply the exact same logic to their TL-Ses.

Sigh...why do these threads degrade so quickly?

 

correction...

a true fully loaded TL type s...is not 33k....

add all accessories...TL type S can go well into 36-37k OTD..btw..

city

 

this is OUR TL site...we can brag...we can say things we want...
some of us..feels the GS4 is not much faster comparing the money it's worth...

We don't target other lexus ppl..it's usually U LEXUS GUYS who come in here..and start jumpin on us when we make a comment

if u don't like what us TL guys say...then u shouldn't be here in the first place

city

 

To further prove my point I did a few simple searches of the ClubLexus.com forums and found the following:

* GS4 can be an M5 killer for $$$ less (supercharger)
* GS4 can be an E55 killer for $$$ less (intake/ECU)
* IS3 can be an M3 killer for $$$ less (turbo)
* SC3 can be a 911-TT killer for $$$ less (twin turbos)

It happens there, too...

 

Yet another useless post from a Lexus owner who likes hanging out at the Acura web site.

Lexus owners hanging out at the TL website is the equivalent of junior college guys hanging out at their local high school. Go do something else already! Go drive your car around, or take up golf...anything! But just go away!

SickLex, do you have a point? Is there any content to your last two posts that has some redeeming quality that I'm just not grasping?

 

I think that he was talking about the price with factory options, not dealer options. I'm not saying that's a fair distinction to make, just saying that that's how he arrived at the $33K max-out price given that the nav system is the only factory option.

 

ya...he was wrong about that...

factory options...there's the OEM kit, spoiler, etc..
even with just navi..it's closer to 34K invoice

city

 

Mario there are a ton of posts here by TL owners saying this car or that car shouldn't even be compared because they're "not in our class", and the point I made about a GS compared to an M5 based on price was in response to the countless posts discounting competitor vehicles as overpriced. It's funny how the same people that b!tch about quality, trannies or customer service are the first ones to jump on someone else if they comment on the same car. I don't get where the snobby or arrogant part came from, I never once compared my car to a TL, yet when someone compares their TL to a GS it is justified, or else that person shouldn't be here.
Tea, I don't even think you read farther back then one or two posts, because you always think people are getting off-topic or add nothing to the conversation even when they include quotes. It's funny how someone offers an opposing view and you call them a troll, say they should leave or are ignorant.

 

Okay, you're right. You never did compare your GS to the TL.

One thing I don't quite understand is why Lexus owners are posting messages here if they don't even own a TL? And from what I read, these Lexus owners have no desire to buy an Acura period.

I know it's a free country, but what's the motive behind it? I sure don't go around to message boards to talk about a car that I have no interest in owning.

 

Ted,

I actually do read all the posts if I think the thread is interesting. Look, I'm not on this site for the purpose of arguing. But I will challenge other people's comments when I see fit, just like I will express comments that support other people's threads when I see fit.

Let me say again; Lexus owners hanging out at the TL site is the equivalent of junior college guys hanging out at high schools in an attempt to impress the younger girls. And, I often see it as a transparent attempt to push our buttons when you come on this site to post some of your opinions about our cars. If you're so interested in talking about Acuras, maybe you drive the wrong car.

 

city001, actually the OEM kit, spoiler, etc., are all dealer options, not factory options. Factory options are what the car rolls off the assembly line with; dealer options are what can be added by the dealer at the dealer's location.

In fact, I said the navigation system was the only factory option, but actually Acura treats that as a completely different configuration, not a factory option.

Check out Edmunds' "Options & Colors" section to see what the manufacturer considers to be a factory option. Note the statement "NOTE: Accessories are dealer installed. Contact a dealer for availability."

And the TL-S w/Nav isn't "34k invoice." It's $30,763 invoice and $33,710 MSRP, both already including destination charge.

Mario, I can't speak for anyone else, but I'm a Lexus GS430 owner and frequent these boards because I owned a 2000 TL before the GS4. I originally considered a TL-S until I drove one and decided that it didn't offer enough over the TL to make it compelling to me. However, I still like to see what people are doing to their TL-Ses to get the most out of them. I generally show up on these TL-S/GS4 comparo threads because I think I can (and do) give an objective view of the two cars given that I've owned them both (albeit a TL-P, not a TL-S, but I'm intimately aware of the incremental difference between the two).

 

I know quite a few members here that belong to ClubLexus , should they not be allowed there because they either don't own a Lexus or ever intend to ?? And I'll say it for the thousandth time, I rarely if ever post a blanket opinion here, no "Acura sux", Lexus rulz, TL's are POS, etc", and if you find it please post it, because Mr. Hyde is under that impression. What cracks me up is all the bashing that goes on here, and the moment you defend said vehicle, you are an instigator and serve no purpose here, unless, of course you join in the bashing. And the amount of blind opinions based as "fact" here is overwhelming, and yet I simply try to provide data from various mags stating otherwise, and they're considered unreliable, only to be used when favorably supporting Acura. The overwhelming tone here is "think Acura or leave, we don't care about your opinion regardless of whether it holds a shred of truth or not."

 

Seems this thread has gone from a comparison to why only TL members should visit the board......

Put it this way, this is a public forum and anyone is welcomed unless banned by the board owner, so live with it whether you like it or not.

 

Seems like a popular topic guys... and one I have been debating too.. but after reading your comments, I think I will surpress my love for the Acura TL-S, and go for a 99-2000 GS400... I LOVE THE ACURA! but I have NOT been impressed with the four Acura dealerships here in the Dallas area.. they have all treated me like I was buying a cheap car.. one of the dealers told me they would NOT negociate on the TL-S!!!!! Whatever! Also, some of your comments concern me on this thread too.

So, GS400 or hopefully if I'm lucky, a GS430! WOOHOO! Finally a decision has been made! I will always have a weakness for the Acura, but man, after having three vettes, I want a reliable, no rattle, nicely painted car!!!!!!!

 

Understand, what I meant by A GS4 being a M5 killa modded. Owners at ClubLexus can MAKE THAT STATEMENT because it is actually POSSIBLE. It will take alot of money and work, but it is possible to hang with the M5.

TL can't period (or an M3).
And it won't be a statement like " I added headers and an exhuast to my GS, M5 watch out"! Some people know a cars LIMITATIONS etc etc etc.....

And SCwells you should know me. If a GS owner makes a dumb statement like that, Bit and I are usually the first ones to tell them REALITY CHECK! SO I agree it does happen but not as much.

Tea Elle, you sound silly. I guess you wonder why there are different cultures in the world too(hang with your OWN kind), real mature........
The question was about the GS and since we own one, duh, we have REAL input (not magazine input).
THe best forums are DIVERSE ONES, not one-sided agreeing monkeys patting each other on the back and a$$.......

Getting back to the thread if money is the issue and you need space with a touch of fast the TL-S is very tough to beat. The GS ain't going nowhere, just wait and get one later!

 

1sicklex, this is one of those very few times that I fully agree with you. Sorry I misunderstood your previous statement...

 

Hey what happened to "should I buy a TLs or GS"? Actually you should get a used 540i...LOL Loved my TL, but love my 540i more. Test drove a "fully L-Tuned" GS430 (almost traded in my 540 for it) but still didn't get the handling "satisfaction" of the 540 Sport suspension. The GS interior is so beautiful but that wasn't enough for me. My 540's B pillar is starting to rattle and it's getting on my nerves... made it worse after lowering it

While it's great to get opinions from various car owners you ultimately have to like the car...go drive both and see.

 

AC,

I love the 540 but my fear is that I would spend a good amount of money for a used one and then get reamed on servicing and parts (especially once my warranty is up). The car is awesome but I might have to consider it for my next car (But probably the M5).

1sicklex,

I appreciate your last statement and agree that we should have a diversity of opinions.

I don't own either but would agree that the GS4 is a more powerful car and is more luxurious (hence the higher price tag) yet it bothers me when people belittle the TL or any other car. The TLS is not a POS and neither is a maxima, or an I35, or a mustang GT. One might be a little better than the other but none are a POS. And yes people don't like their car compared with what they believe to be a "lesser" car but that don't make the "lesser" car a POS. Personally I like seeing some Lex guys here and TLS guys in the clublexus forums (as well as AC in both) as long as people ain't talking shizzo!

As I originally posted, I really like both cars for different reasons but the bottom line is that money will be an issue, which is why I am thinking about a new TLS vs a used GS4. I appreciate all the good info people have offered and apologize for having started such a heated debate.

I am also considering a new 2002 A4 1.8T but the car is a little small for me (I need and like a lot of room). I also don't know if I want to buy a stick now cuz a)don't know how to drive stick yet (I know it wouldn't take long but just haven't taken the time ) and b) I know they have autos on the A4s but if I want to chip it I should probably have a stick rather than auto.

One

 

and back to the topic...I would go for a new car ..TL-S over used GS4...
I prefer new cars...don't like used

if u want to buy used GS4... i'd suggest looking into used 540 or M3

city

 

tedc/1sicklex..

u guys say..everyone has a right to his/her own opinion..then don't pounce on ppl when they have a voice... respect other's opinions..

I said I prefer new cars... new is better..then THAT's HOW I FEEL
don't tell me .. new doesn't mean good ..etc..

peace

city

 

Word!!

 

Hey I'm cool, no probs with anyone here......

AC and that pesky 540........Maybe in another life I'll be a BMW dude.

 

Actually, if Lexus got off their arse and threw in a 6spd in the GS, better handling, and perhaps different rear end (i don't quite like hte rear end) I would probably be driving one today.

I'll repeat what most 540 owners say. If you want perfomance, ie speed handling, braking, etc. get a 540 Sport, but if you want something comparable with more reliability get a GS.

I'm still having fun taking exits at 90mph so I'll stick with the 540, but when Lexus comes up with a sportier (handling and manual) they certainly will have my attention and maybe my money

Yeah, it's a known fact that 540's can be expensive to service and parts are not cheap. If you ever get one used, get a CPO one with extended warranty.