What I just found out this week is very disturbing to me. I'm pissed that honda, for the 2002 Accords are adding all these new options as standard equipment; 6cd changer premium audio system, more wood trims and panels, side airbags, and have you noticed a pattern yet? If so CONGRATS! Yes, all these items are standard on the 2 TLs. For some reason or another they are either downgrading the TL or really trying to upgrade the accord because they are pushing for the damn accord to have the exact same stuff as the TL. One of my friends also told me that he heard accords were going to see how well the new altima is going to affect their sales and if it does, then 2003 or 2004 accords will most likely have a modified sportshift type system, HID lights, remotelink system, and all the trimmings the TL has now. I'm just very ticked off that honda is giving the accord all this stuff and really downgrading the TL...and plus, as if the TL doesn't already resemble the accord or vice versa (02 TL rims, basic console inside TL w/o nav, clear signal lights, etc)

 

It's only natural that a car gets better and better...it's called competition. Relax, be happy that you own one of the top of the line "Hondas".

Most of what you stated probably has to do with the fact that the Camry is still outselling the Accord.

 

Well --

The new Accord is slated for a 245hp engine to compete w/ the newly redesigned Toyota Camry, which will unveil w/ about 225hp. These ammenities most certainly were lacking in previous Accords, and it was almost a no-brainer for some Accord EX shoppers to opt for a TL, w/ 25 more hp than the Accord, and all the mentioned ammenties standard. Can't wait for the wars to begin!

 

Keep in mind Honda already knows what you mentioned here.You should be happy to know that TL is always going to bemore upscale than Accord so if Accord is getting all these amenities it's pretty obvious the next generation TL will have much more to offer

 

If you are saying these upgrades on the honda will be for the 2002 models your wrong.. Honda is not making any drastic changes to the 2002 except maybe some modifications and simple cosmetic changes. The "new" Accords are slated for a 2003-2004 release in which maybe you will see some of these "fancier" additions until then keep your pants on why would you be upset about a car vompany making its cars more desirable that just means you have more to look forward to in future Acura models!!!

 

Re the thread from THE ROCK, the 2001 Accords have all the features indicated in your thread EX model) including the Homelink. The main differences are the memory seats, and VSA in the TL-s as the V6 models have TCS. The main difference is that the tl is a nicer car with better HP. If you get in a TL, although it is nicer, you cannot help but notice many of the same interior parts, ie visors, power window controls, homelink controls, door handle openers. I have a 1998 Accord EXV6, which is great. I am ready to move up to the TL-S and having some similarities to the Accord, which I still love (am keeping Accord as 2nd car) I think the TL-S is great and I cannot wait to get one.

 

Don't get too upset. Remember that the TL is under the Acura brand and will always have more and better features than the Accord.

I was considering the Accord V6 EX, but I think an extra few $Ks to get the TL-S will make it a much better investment for the years to come.

Since the Odyssey already has the Nav option, does anyone know whether the Accord will get that too?


<FONT COLOR="#800080" SIZE="1" FACE="Verdana, Arial">[This message has been edited by oracion on May 26, 2001 @ ]</font>

 

Also something everyone should remember:

Every other family down the street has a Accord. Not everyone has a TL Type S.

Just has long Honda doesn't decide to put those darn struts, like the Civic, I am a happy camper. If Honda decides to start using struts on all their cars, I might go with another brand.

 

This is probably why Honda decided on the Acura brand name instead of sticking with the Honda tag--it creates a market distinction of "class" where there really is none. In fact, the TL is sold as the Honda Inspire in Japan.

The TL really is a very close cousin to the Accord, and their prices reflect that fact (similarly equipped Accord EX-V6). You do get quite a bit more for the TL than the Accord, not least of which is a better performing engine. I think buyers shouldn't complain about how much better the Accord is getting, but rather enjoy the abundance of features and quality that you get for only a (relatively) little more amount of money.

 

Well the standard TL is only $4k more than a loaded Accord. I'm not sure of all the differences. The TL looks better, has a slightly larger engine, nicer interior. It looks like Honda doped up the front end of the Accord to make the TL more appealing if you want my opinion. The front end of the Accord is definitely not inspiring. I saw an older one that actually looked better.

What is amazing is that you can buy an Accord for $15k. So is the TL a $15k Accord with $15k in options?

 

The Accord and the TLS are 2 different animals, how can you compare the two?? They have completely different suspensions, engines, & transmissions. Yes the TL/TLS is built on an extended Accord chassis but thats about it. Unlike the ES 300 (Camry) or the I30 (Maxima).

 

1000bpm,

I have to disagree. They aren't TOTALLY different. Many of the controls are exactly the same and in the exact same place. Like the oddball sunroof control. This is much like a comparison of a VW Passat and an A4. SAme shifter etc, but different dash layout, seats, suspension tuning.

I'm curious, how different is the suspension between the 2? Do they share any of the same parts or design?

 

To me the critical components of a car are the engine, chassis, transmission, aesthetics and how these integrate with oone another. Other than the basic chassis (which was extended by 2 or 3 inches for the TLS), the TLS and the Accord share none of the above. There is no striking resemblance between the TLS and the Accord, on the other hand the Lexus and the Camry look very similar. Same goes for the I30 and the Maxima.

The TLS has a rakish profile compared to the straight lines of the accord. The chassis for the TL-S has been beefed up considerably. Compared to the TL the stabilizer bar is thicker in the TLS and the springs and shocks are firmer to improve handling performance. The VSA (not available on the Accord or the TL) does a pretty good job of keeping the car in rein when you begin to lose control during hard cornering. Admittedly there are times when the VSA is better switched off ;-). The SS isn’t even available on the Accord, and the V6 powertrain on the Accord, while very good, does not compare to that of the TLS. Do not underestimate the TLS’s engine, it’s a phenomenal piece of engineering.

Accord aside, I’m going to go a step further and say the TL and the TLS are two very different cars. Aesthetically they may be identical but they handle VERY differently. I had a ’02 TL for a week and the TLS was a BIG step up in terms of handling and acceleration. I suspect a large part of the improved handling has to do with the torque based steering, the VSA system and last but not least the extra horses.

Many people who have not driven the TLS assume that it is pretty much the same car as the TL with a few extra horses. To me, the difference is not subtle.

 

Yeah, but the Accord doesn't have all this: http://www.hondabeat.com/acura/tltech.cfm


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'01 White Diamond Pearl 3.2TL
-Wing, tint, wood and Whistler

 

All I can sy Gomez is that you are a freak. I had my laugh for the day.

 

That's got to be the most comprehensive write up on the TL i've seen yet

 

Gomez and 1000bpm are right on the money regarding all the technical differences between accord and TL, but forgetting all that, JUST DRIVE THEM! Drive em back to back and notice: Accord has poor road feel, plenty of noise, gutless engine/tranny combo, mushy handling, and thats all before even thinking about features. A 15k car loaded up with leather and toys will never compare to a TL, nor would accord buyers want it to.

Millions of Accord owners love their 4 door minivan-sedans!

 

I guess i'm just looking back a few year where the "acura" name brand was supposedly such high class compared to the honda brand even though they are the same company. But now, they've made it more and more like Honda again...just look at the new RSX. It's a souped up civic coupe for heavens sake! i think that by 2010, acuras=hondas Like a Honda TL type S....that sounds funny even typing it, but its not that far fetched

 

Platform and component sharing is the wave of the future. For example, the Jaguar S-Type shares it's platform with the Lincoln LS. The Jaguar X-Type shares it's platform with the Ford Mondeo (Contour). The Lexus ES300 is derived from the Camry and the Toyota Highlander is a restyled RX300. Personally, I'm more influenced by performance, handling, and grade of materials than whether my hazard flasher button and power door lock switch is the same as what's in an Accord. As long as the components that are shared across model lines are of the appropriate quality, what difference does it make? No one will ever mistake an Accord EX V6 for a TL - they are (and always will be) targeted toward totally different market segments. If the Accord came in a Type S with the same content as the TL-S I'd still pay a couple of thousand more so I didn't have to drive the same car as a million other people (Honda produces 500K Accords per year vs 70K TL's).

 

What is there to be upset about TL/Accord is the same thing........write a letter to Honda telling em to at least TRY to differentiate the 2, sigh.....

For real a loaded v-6 EX Accord costs THE SAME as a tl (which to Acura's credit is loaded except for NAV) says a bunch about the tl..........

 

I have to agree. My woman once owned a 98 Accord V6 EX Coupe. I am so glad that we got rid of it (that's another issue). The tow cars feel different all together. The TL is much smoother and quieter and less road noise IMO.

 

Although it's great that Honda is working to make their "base" models more desirable, I agree that they have let some dilution into the Acura brand over the past five years or so. The dealers are better and you get a longer warranty, but Acura is no longer vastly superior to their sister cars from Honda. Acura was created to be the "luxury and performance" division of American Honda Motor Company. Just look at the NSX and the old Legend--amazing cars that were ahead of their time. I see signs, however, that they are trying to correct this. The Type-S designation is great, although personally I'd like to see an even bigger distinction (like BMW M models, for instance). I also feel that the S2000 should have been sold as an Acura here in the States. They won't make all the smartest business decisions, and they certainly haven't in the near past, but there are signs of hope...

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Why doesn't everybody make cars as well as Acura?

 

Well the industry term "Lexus-like" dictates why does everyone not make they're cars as good as Lexus!

If ALL automobiles were as reliable as Acura and Lexus there would be less road rage...

 

I had a 98 EX V6 sedan and loved it for what it was. It decent power, handling, ride, etc. for a great price. With the color I had, black currant pearl, and the wheels I put on it, I was always amazed by the number of people who stopped to compliment it. On top of that, I got 115000 trouble free miles out of it in 3 years. The TL-S (and TL I suppose) have EXCELLENT power, handling, ride etc for a great price. It's everything I liked about my Accord but at a much higher level. Also, if their bumping up the features and power on the Accord, you know the TL will get nothing but better (I think rear wheel drive and 300hp aren't too far off).

 

I think the Acuras should go the AWD route.....it is not difficult to convert a FWD to an AWD unlike converting a FWD to a RWD....example the Audi A4 Quattro and non-quattro (FWD)....or the Passat FWD and 4-motion....or the Ford Mondeo (FWD) and the Jaguar X-type which is AWD (based on same platform)....etc. In all these cases the base car began life as a FWD but for select models, got converted to the AWD version....

I think Acuras should go the AWD route, even though the platforms may be shared with their Honda Brethren.....which goes along with the "wave of the future" (platform sharing), while maintaining differentiation enough when compared to their pedestrian siblings....

Having said all that, IF Honda came out with an AWD version of the Accord with tuning similar to the Type-s (and the 5-speed transmission) and had the Navigation option, without a question I would prefer the Honda and not the Acura, if the Honda is priced 3-4 grands less...Now, Honda does not have the NAVIGATION SYSTEM and hence the Accord is not even an option for me...in fact, many cars sold in the US might be attractive from a driving perspective, but I would not even consider if it does not have the NAV option....hopefully, more cars would have this option in the future, which would widen my choices...

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2000 Naples Gold 3.2TL/Navi - Factory Stock but with up-graded tires

<FONT COLOR="#800080" SIZE="1" FACE="Verdana, Arial">[This message has been edited by hunter001 on June 03, 2001 @ ]</font>