evolaerok

New ES300

http://www.wieck.com/public/*wieck_search?ws4d_nav=true&Source=ALL&latest=7&Pa ge=2 <~~~Pics of inside!

evolaerok

Click the red arrows on the top right and you'll see more pics of the interior and engine. Tell me what you guys think? My opinion I appreciate the design of the my TL-S the more and more I look at these pics, but envy the interior of the of the ES300 (real wood!).

vandy786

Seems okay overall, but nothing to envy really. Definitely not worth the $38K price tag I hear about, IMO.

rock

The front end is not bad, looks pretty sleek. The rear looks like a big combination Toyota Paseo/Solara. Maybe it would look better if it had 17 or 18" rims. For mid to high $30,000 range, I hope Lexus keeps up the quality and fit/finish. I'll still keep my TLS.

Myers

I just looked at the ES 300 in the latest Motor Trend. They did a beautiful job on the redesign. Is it just me, but I don’t understand how Lexus sells a car like this for 37k. Yes our TL’s are not quite as luxurious, but 210hp just doesn’t cut it. I bet the 2003 TL redesign will put a strain on the ES300 just like the TL-S is turning some IS300 owners heads.

Scott

Mr Hyde

Uggghhh, well the good thing is I wont be seeing much of that rear end which looks kinda cheap to me and only brief glimpses of that front end in my rearview mirror. hehehe

TLinBama

I'm not a fan of the headlights that extend almost to the windshield! The interior is nice, but there's nothing about that car that says "sport," which is important to me and why I have the Type S.

Road Rage

Nice show, no go!

Same basic engine as last time - no power increase.

Still a preppie/old fart mobile.

Much more luxo than sport sedan.

Toyota's marketing approach is to offer cushmobile (ES300) and ripmobile (IS300). No other mfr. has 2 such vehiclesw in their line.

Audi, BMW, Acura etc. have their mid platform, and then make variants on it - Toyota has invested heavily in different vehicle platforms. We will see how that works in the marketplace - it is incredibly risky, and expensive, esp. in a market with so many contenders for dominance.

1SICKLEX

I am postive Lex will sell all 50,000 copies a year they are building...

They probably don't even need to advertise, the ES is that good at what it does.......

Ain't gonna lie when I went down to Charleston, S.C. I saw a buncha old people driving em, another reason for the GS....

Older people no longer trust Caddy and all the issues the car comes with, I think the ES/LS is for them

You see not EVERYONE cares about 0-60, some just want stylish, reliable transportation, and willing to pay more for it therefore the ES 300!

DocDave

I rented a Lincoln when on vacation. LOL what a PoS car that was. I had the V8 one too. I thought it totally sucked. Made me glad to get home and drive my new TL-S.

doc:

2K2SilverTL-S

I also picked up the new MotorTrend and saw the new ES300....It looks exactly like a Toyota Avalon from the side. And MotorTrend noted 0-60 times of 8.1 seconds. That is definitely not adequate for a sedan of that price!

Rastafarian

Thankfully I don't like it at all. Good luck to those who do, but looks to me like it'll retain its position as a popular car for married women.

RedLined

:p :p :p My thoughts exactly!!! I think that's the ugliest car in the Lexus line. I just don't get it -- hasn't Lexus seen or heard about the TL-S or the new I-30? Why anyone would buy a car that is that expensive and that slow and small (at least the current one) is beyond me.

kuan48

Rear looks too much like the new Camry and talk about wheel gap!!
Still getting use to the new headlight look, but definetly improved interior. No news though.
I guess Lexus is still targeting older folks with the ES300 and IS at younger. Makes sense though!

evolaerok

I totally agree with you guys about the exterior! But gosh look at that interior! The nav folds down for the entry of CD's ala Benz S500. Gosh I wish us TL owners had real wood...or a wood with aluminum trim much like Audi and there beautiful interiors.

tea elle

LOL, great comment!

SybariticOne

YUCK! Grandpa and Grandma can have it!!
That's the ugliest Lexus I've ever seen!!

hyc2000

Toyota Prius

Brothers?

Myers

<a href="http://pressroom.toyota.com/photo_library/*wieck_search?ws4d_nav=true&operator=AND&search_cr iteria=02es300&Sort=priority&thumbyes=thumbyes&Num ber2Return=10&Source=TYT&Preview=TYTpreview.html&T humb=TYTthumb.html&Results=TYT.html&Results%20with %20thumb%20Table=TYTresult-w/thumb.html&Results%20no%20thumb%20Table=TYTresult. html&Page=&OffSet=&Record=&*EOF=*EOF
"> Check it out</a>


Pretty car.

Scott

vandy786

OMG, you are so right! That post goes to all the Lexus people that love saying that the TL-S looks like an Accord. Apparently, Lexus has taken it one large step further than Acura.

tgif

Well. I hate the new design at the frist sight. But it looks more eye catching when I looked at it more.

1SICKLEX

OMG, you are so right! That post goes to all the Lexus people that love saying that the TL-S looks like an Accord. Apparently, Lexus has taken it one large step further than Acura.

Conscious killing u

Well A LOT OF CARS look alike to me, I mean let's see the industry standard now, make a car with large reflector lights, smack a chrome grill in the middle, maybe add fog lamps WE HAVE A WINNER!!!!

The rear, uhhh let's take out the amber and make it clear!!!

TO ME SO MANY CARS have this treatment, including the new BMW's


Besides personally speaking I'll take perceived "UGLY" than bland or boring or "cookie-cutter" anyday...........

Honestly speaking I'll have to see it in person to make my mind up

lonny

Well, I think the new ES looks better than the old boring old-folks looking car it replaced. Plus they added a new NAV system. Unfortunately, nothing new for performance. Oh well, keep trying Lexus.

Guest

Guys, that car is not aimed at the S-Type, maybe to some extent the TL. Was I surprised that they didn't bump up the h.p. ? Yes, but think about it, when did Lexus claim to want this to be very sporty, it's just their entry-level luxury sedan. period. 215 hp is more than enough for it, it's not used to race and they don't market it to teens and twenty-somethings, and you rarely will see one modded. This car will have no problem selling regardless of what Acura puts against it.

aTL

Not something i would get behind the wheel of it looks pathetic the last two pics explain it all to me its looks like a over sized prius.

GS430

I find it quite appealing, hehe these pictures seem similar, but trust me in reality they are not.

the 38k tag is only with a fully loaded ES300 along with Mark Levingson and Navgiation. These two opinion at least make it 5~6k more than premium package. a Premium packge GS430 is now almost 7k cheaper than my fully loaded 430. O_O We are all talking about Out the Door price.

ES300 is aiming at 50000 per year, while the supply is more than demand, i am sure we would be able to find a superb deal upon that = )

ZodiakTL

if neone read the article in car and driver, lexus specifically states that now that Lexus has the IS300 out there for performance(u can argure about that separately) the ES300 if free to be what it was meant to be in the first place - an affordable pure luxo cruiser. thats why no horsepower bump, cuz acceleration is not an issue, its all about comfort and isolation from the road. thats their goal, and that's why they include most of the options also available on the LS430 model, except of teh engine. but i'm sure people will still go on comparing the ES to the TL.

gohawks63

Guys, that car is not aimed at the S-Type, maybe to some extent the TL.

I wouldn't even say that. I believe that 2002 TL-Ps have the same suspension setup as the '99-01 models. If so, the ride on previous gen TLs have a much firmer ride then the ES300s. In addition, Car and Driver did a major comparison last year with eight entry level cars. A TL (2000 model) was included in that mix. That TL spanked the ES300 and came in first out of all the models, edging the 300M.

Now the new one is bigger, heavier, softer ride, and no bump in HP/torque. IMO, no comparison with the TL-P either as far as performance.

You might be able to argue aesthetics, build material and quality, but not perfomance.

As for the 300M. A good friend of mine just traded in his 300M for a TL-S. He says that the TL-S and 300M aren't even in the same league. The TL-S is a much better car.

1SICKLEX

TL did not "spank" any cars in that comparison, they chose it like you did VALUE i.e. 27k........

ES now will be considered a luxery car, no more "entry level".....

BlackShadow

Look who it is?
The ES is still considered "entry level" even with all the goodies. That's why you guys have the GS+ series for the luxury level.

gohawks63

Check the numbers:
ES300 0-60 8.3 seconds
3.2TL 0-60 7.4 seconds

If a almost a full second doesn't qualify as a spanking, then it was a pretty good whack.

Admittedly both didn't do as well in handling, slalom and braking, where the author went on to put some of the blame on the stock tires. Which both the TL and ES300 share the same type.

Keep in mind that this is on a 2000 TL. Pit a 2001 ES300 against a TL-S with improved handling and engine output and it's not even a contest. The ES300 will get pummeled from an overall performance/value perspective.

That's why comparisons to the IS300 (from a performance perspective) are more appropriate.

Don't get me wrong, the ES300 is a nice car I even considered buying one. Many will argue that it's even put together much better than a TL, but it's a luxury car, not a performance car.

That's my point.

Mr Hyde

Where do you get that the ES300 is now all of a sudden a luxury class car and not entry level like it was before??? I dont see the ES300 changing class and remaining in the heat with The TL, A4, 3series BMW, I30, etc.

Im a Lexus fan as well, but the styling of this new Es is a drastic departure from the former model in the wrong direction IMHO. The rear end of the car with the new tails looks cheap and the front end very very awkward.

gohawks63

My bad, I meant to say entry-level luxury.

Mr Hyde

Sorry I wasnt referring to you goaub, I was referring to SickLex

1SICKLEX

I think Automobile mag said it .......

I have not sat in it yet but from all I am hearing and reading it is THE MOST LUXERIOUS 35k car period. Check out www.familycar.com, pretty interesting stuff.....

REAL WOOD (lot's of it) Mark Levinson system, Higher Quality Leather, I mean LEXUS HAD TO make it a full blooded luxery car b/c it does only have a 3.0 lt v-6 still rated at 210 h.p.....( I know I know it's not that fast

:p
It's not changing class but WILL BE the LEADER for luxery....

For the millionth time 0-60 is not the whole story.........

TL-s now fighting more for IS buyer than ES buyer to me

Mr Hyde

So the change in class sounds more like an opinion to me. As far as the most luxury is concerned, its going to be more muted than a TL or Tl would be. One is more of a drivers car the other a passenegers car. I and most here prefer the drivers car.

The styling changes though have dropped the ES from the lsit of cars I always admired.

1SICKLEX

Yeah, as styling is an opinion too.

Well the 1st gen and 2nd gen ES look very similar, I guess there was so much nothing they could do.......

Headlights are uhhhhhhhhh BIG.....:p

Well ES is no longer for me and not for u either, c u at Starbucks

tgif

People alwasy said how the TL looks like an accord. Check this two links out and tell me is these two looks alike.

2002 Toyota Camry

http://www.thecarconnection.com/inde...56.178&sid=178

2002 ES 300

http://www.canadiandriver.com/previews/02es300.htm

PeterUbers

iTrader: (1)

I was the driver of what I think was an still is one of the greatest entry-level luxo-cruisers around, the 1994 (ok ok, 1992-1996) ES300. The thing was a tank, luxurious, SOLID, RELIABLE, and the epitome of Lexus quality and class. Till the day we sold it to CarMax, it purred like a kitten, shifted seamlessly, and NOT A RATTLE TO BE HEARD OR CREATED!

I frankly thought 188hp was more than enough for that vehicle. The only issue I had w/ the power was during those extraordinary hot, summer days when the A/C was crankin'. Just not enough juice if you had a couple passengers. A lot of that I attributed to the 4-speed tranny. The kickdown didn't really offer much passing power on the highway. However, the new 2002 comes std. w/ the 5-speed auto, which will definitely help fuel efficiency, lower engine noise (as if they needed to) and help in the passing power arena. They'll squeeze more juice outta that seemingly underpowered 210hp 3.0liter V6.

I don't care for the exterior, but I wouldn't have bought it to look aggressive on the road (ala the TL-S), therefore, who cares.

CH-TLS

Lexus hasn't been known for agressive styling (see LS400-430 for the past 10+ yrs), but this is a step in the right direction. At least it looks different than the Camry.

I think they could have picked a better color to release the first photos - that light blue reminds me of Nick Nolte's Caddy ragtop in 48 hours - didn't Acura release the TL-S in Silver and Agean Blue?

They really need to bump the HP, but I don't think Toyota has any V6 larger than 3.0l, which means some additional development $$.

I'll reserve final judgement for when I see one on the lot and go for a test drive.