geebee

HI All:

Here's my info and dilemma:

Currently I have a 99Accord V6 EX, an excellent car, highly recommended for it's price (24K)range. I want to upgrade to something just as fast, but more luxury, better driving, and quieter.

The three choices I've test driven are: Lexus 2002 ES300, Lexus 2001 GS300, and 2002 Acura TL-S. I eliminated the ES, and my finalists are the TL-S for $29,500 or the GS with prem package for $39,500. Both are non nav.

My heart says GS, my head says TL, but there are things about both cars I hate. Maybe you can help me make up my mind.

I listen to most of my music in the car. It's very important to me. My Honda has what I consider the best front end I've ever had. A single disc in dash, six disc in trunk. (upgraded with a better amp and speakers). That way, with a 24 CD wallet, I can listen to 30 different CD's changing them at 70mph. The GS stereo sounds great, but with just that cartridge system, you'd have to stop to change to any other discs. AND WHERE ARE THE STEERING WHEEL CONTROLS? How can a $40k car not have any? Not only that, where do you store stuff like extra cd's? The center console was too small for a CD wallet, and it barely fit into the glove box. No sunglass holder, and very little storage anywhere seems very annoying.

The TL stereo is a slotloading indash six. Possible to add any disc easily at 70 mph. Proper steering wheel controls. Plenty of Hondalike storage.

The GS has incredibly nice seats and interior otherwise. The TL is nice inside, but definitely too much like my Accord. A big edge to the GS, and my main problem with the TL.

I'm also VERY sensitive to glare and extraneous light. The GS opti guages, even dimmed down, would bother me. The Tl guages are white during the day, backlit numerals at night. However the GS guages will turn off, the TL guages will not. I like to turn off all guages for 3 AM highway cruise control. Any easy fix for that?

The TL has standard HID lights and is $10 K cheaper. A very large percentage less.

The TL has more horsepower and a much more intuitive automanual. The FWD is better for snow.

BUT... BUT... BUT... The GS has enough power for me, handles like a dream (RWD advantage), has the most beautiful and luxurious interior, and the exterior looks hot. It's also quieter. Maybe MOST importantly, the GS touches me a certain way. You could say, it gets me hard to drive it!

So my head, heart, and wallet are all battling in a raging dilemma.
I'm so confused that I may just sit tight till the next generation GS comes out in 03 or 04. Or buy a Tl now and go to a newer GS or TL in a couple of years.

Sorry for the length of this post, but it helps to get things out sometimes. Any thoughts or ideas appreciated.

Gerry

Beiruty

Without being biased, maybe I am, get the TL-S with the NAV. It's all what you need and what the GS will offer at lower price....

Very recommended. Get your self in 30min + test drive and you are hooked.

Closer

my suggestion for you.
1) used gs400
2) new TLS
3) new gs300


http://www.autotrader.com/findacar/r...used&x=109&y=8

LarryLynx

Are these the only cars you've driven? If so, I assume that you have previous experience or for some other reason you don't want or need to drive, for instance, a RWD BMW 330ci. That car (equipped for $40,000) would probably be a pretty nice ride and would no doubt get into your shorts as well. Not to dissuade you from your two choices, and I do love my TLS, but you seem to be limiting your choices, and not necessarily based on $$$. If money is not the issue, then I would buy the car that I most enjoy driving, all things considered. If money IS an issue, then I would immediately go down to the nearest Acura dealer, because you are not going to get the value anywhere else.

ACURA TYPE S CL

buy a tls.price is reasonable..and u can have navi too.for price cheaper than gs 300..and much more powerful..i bet gs series are going to change the style pretty soon..as es 300 is just like another camry..so..go for tls or cls.u will not regret..i love my cls still and will love it forever.

bigbadboss101

I don't own a TL-S but for $3x,000 it is as good a choice as you can get. For me it was my second choice as I got something in the $25,000 range.

If you have more that 3x,000 to spend, than you can look at some of the European cars.

As for Lexus, I will take the Acura ahead of the current Lexus. Once Toyota put more soul into their cars, I will consider buying one from them. Very reliable, good look, classy, but need more guts. GS400 is fast but a redesign is due IMO.

ShadyUpInSmoke

i dunno man...i love GS's...but i love TLS's too...depends just like larry said...buy what is most fun to drive if money isn't an issue, but if it is, Acura gives the most stuff for your value. larry hit the nail on the head. i see why your confused, cuz so am i!

BakedWafer

Alot more personality. And the plus is you can wreck the Lexus in 0-60 and 1/4 mile.

iatacs19

go drive them 1 more time each and bring your cd's with you.

rockinTLS

That last sentence says alot. If cost is no object go with your heart. It's your car and your money, buy what you will be happy with.

I love my TL-S but the GS was never in my budget, even used. I have loved the GS' styling since they came out in 98 or 99.

Good luck.

jbrown

The GS-300 is a slug. It is HEAVY, body rolls like a mofo, and isn't as fast as a TL-S. I drove a GS-300 before I bought my TL-S and I never looked back. The only real competition is in the $40K price range and they include:
1. BMW 330/328 w/sport package (sorry about your resale value). In retrospect, I'm glad I didn't go for a bimmer.
2. Audi S4 (amazing, if I could have come up with the extra $10K, I probably would have bought it). It is, without a doubt the best car in the $40-60K price range. But if you have a bunch of tall friends or need a big trunk...look elsewhere, space is a little cramped.

1SICKLEX

As a GS owner if $$$ is not an issue go with the GS. Discover www.clublexus.com for more info on what your heart desires.

ShadyUpInSmoke

SICKLEX:
of course your gonna be biased. isn't there a lexus forum or are you gonna sit here and piss everyone else off? :p

jbrown

292 posts and you don't even own one, stop hating and go hang with your friends in you numb-riding, slow moving, jell-o shifting, overweight wannabe status-symbols!

Guest

All BMW's have excellent resale value, longterm reliability is the only real issue.

Purely speculative, as the IS300, SC430 and the GS430 are considered by many, "exhilarating" cars to drive and own. I really don't consider the GS300 a slug, 0-60 in 7.7 isn't slow per se, but is compared to the GS430. For me, money wasn't an issue so I chose the 430, it is roomy and luxurious, full leather and beautiful wood, not to mention fast. You could argue "well, it should be for the price ", but there are more expensive, less luxurious cars (Hummer, Corvette to name 2) and slower (too many to list). I like the GS's because there aren't alot of them, plain and simple. Why ? The style is very different, you either love it or hate it, and the price. I am starting to see alot more TL/TLS's, much like Camry's and Accords, probably because they are all very reliable, but so is the GS, so either way it's a win-win situation.

I think 1SICKLEX owns a GS400, which only weighs 150 lbs. more than a TLS, has a bigger interior, better handling, e-shift, and is faster.

1SICKLEX

WTF is your problem I told him go with the heart. I don't care if it's a @#$%^ blender if your heart says go with it BUY IT!

He visted here for your opinion, I told him visit us for ours. I know talking about any other car but Acura here will shut down the thread.

jbrown grown folks are talking so stay outta this.

Technically speaking you can't seriously compare a 30k car to a 40k car to me (my opinion) it's not a Lex/Acura thing it's a chedder thing. 40k cars feel more solid than 30k cars (more features, rarer) just as 20k cars can't mess with 30k cars, 10k cars can't mess with 20k cars. Get your heads outta your a$$ please.

I am getting a lil tired of the bashing and I have not said anything derogatory....

jbrown u infant baby technically u call me 3SICKLEX and take 1 guess why..............

BlackShadow

TedC, I think he meant that 1sicklex don't own a TL-S.

Guest

I hear you BlackShadow, I know what he meant, but geebee (who started this post) simply can't decide between the 2 cars, and 1SICKLEX simply pointed him to another forum, he didn't trashtalk, unlike jbrown, who just talks smack about another car, does he even know other cars exist on our planet ?

1SICKLEX

Thank u TedC, I am tired of being branded and I have not said anything bad about the @#$%^ car. If u commute a lot buy what YOU WANT, cause you'll be in the car you saved some $$$$ in and everytime u see the car u WANTED you'll be like DAHM.

This does not apply to Acura/Lexus it applies to any car.
Knew a guy who bought a Camero to save $$$$ over a Vette, after 3 years he said $%^& it and bought the Vette, said he should have done it from day 1.

Met a guy through CL who had a 300, after driving around with us he bought a 400, said he should have done that from day one.

I am not bashing the TL, jeez.

jbrown

1SUCKLEX, what the hell is a Camero? Is GM releasing a Buick-badged pony car? You can't compare $30K and $40K cars, but you can compare a CamAro ($25K) to a Corvette ($42K)?

Anyway, if you want to stick to the $40K range, the Audi S4 and S6 are absolutely phenomenal. They run, handle (not that you could call what happens when you turn a GS-300 steering wheel handling), stop, and overall perform better than a GS-300. The 430 is a little faster than the 300 in a straight line, but that's it. Yeah the Levinson stereo is bad-@ss for a factory system, but not many people buy a car based on the stereo. The Audi's are built better as well, my shop happens to run a pretty well-established car audio company as well as a high-end custom home A/V company, and our car installers have taken them all apart and put them all back together. Everyting from Audis to Yugos, and let me tell you, Toyota/Lexus don't have sh1t on Audi, or Honda/Acura for that matter when it comes to build quality.

But when it comes right down to it, I only have to drive my car, beegee will only have to drive his car and you drive yours, so if we're all happy with our rides (and I definitely am), it doesn't matter what anybody says.

BTW, the infant baby says "3SICKLEX=3****SUX"

chiawei

Simply not true. My 2001 530i has depreciated by over 20%. The car was delivered in 3/01. Currently has 8K miles. I paid $48K for the car (not including tax+fees). The trade-in value is only about $40k now. I tried to sell my 530i recently (BMW currently has $7500 rebate on 540i 6-speed), market situation is not good right now. My 530i is like in dead water with very little interest.

If you can muster more cash, buy a 540i 6-speed, fully loaded for around $53k now.

1SICKLEX

Once again jbrown (pour soul) you are missing my point. The guy that bought the Camero could easily afford the Vette but to save money (and have some sort of comparable performance) he bought the Camero. In all honesty nothing wrong with the car but he wasn't happy with it (his heart wanted the Vette). After seeing the Z06 he finally decided enough was enough and bought a Vette. Funny thing is he's taken it back to the dealer more times than the Camero already but he is so happy with his Vette it does not matter.......

U also have probably never driven an Audi (I have driven plenty) u have not driven a Lex so your opinions hold no weight.

U say Lexus/Toyota has bad build quality probably cause you shop knows they are harder to put back together.

And Audi's are good I agree, taking out a speaker is to run an amp is hell...........

And stop mis-using my name, jbrown=Jim Brown the football great? Alright then, I am not disrespecting you or would u like me to start.

Chiawai, unfortunately all new cars depreciate like this, that is why 1-2 year old cars are getting more and more popular.

jbrown

There you go with the Camero again, anyway I have had EXTENSIVE driving time (minimum 1-week daily in each) in the Lexus LS-400 (decent) and SC-400 (joke), Mercedes S430 (awesome, but Nav/AC not user-friendly) and C43 (very impressive), and Audi A4 1.8T (fun), TT roadster (more fun), and S4 (amazing), and of course my baby, the TL-S (worth every penny, and more).

You see more than wires when you take off door panels, completely remove interiors, and pull off front and rear bumpers, you see what the car is made of, and Lexus' are nice, but they certainly aren't the best.

badazzTL

i say get a tls and use the extra 10k for mods Let us know what you decide

1SICKLEX

If the SC400 is a joke it shows how biased u are. It was a10 best winner 6 years in a row. It's interior was picked best in the industry PERIOD. The design inspired seemingly every other car.

The S 430 is a boat to drive compared to theLS 400 not even the 430.

c43 (never driven but raced) is a blast, I like this car a lot.

S4 never raced but it is a wonderful sleeper.

Who is the best? Going by sales figures Lexus is. And considering there are no sub 30k cars that is quite an accomplishment.

Anyway u are happy, I am happy, hopefully JeeBee will be happy.

Mr Hyde

It inspired seemingly every other car??????????????????????????

What are you serious?????????? Just how overinflated is that ego and that head of yours??

AND SICKLEX, YES LEXUS IS THE BEST MAKE IN THE WHOLE WIDE WORLD!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! EVERYONE ELSE PALES IN COMPARISON!!!!!!!!!! ALL BOW DOWN BEFORE THE GREATNESS THAT IS LEXUS!!!!!!

can you leave now???

JBROWN, the quality f your posts leaves much to be desired as well. Be Warned, Flamers wont be tolerated here period. If your best argument insnt good enough to stand on its own merits without name calling, then maybe you shouldnt pose it.

No sense in trying to instigate things.