shahram72

In my search for a replacement car I am also considering a newer RL. Geez it seems Honda is slipping, so many issues to avoid. Do any of the newer RL's have VCM? I want to avoid that. Would like to find a 2010 with low miles. I prefer the look of my 05, but it's slowly turning into swiss cheese, and I'm not going to do a timing belt on a rust bucket.

An Accord will suit me just fine (going new), but the stereo is crap, even if I go uplevel, which is stupid to me, it's still crap compared to the RL. I'm thinking an LX, get some wheels and the lip spoiler and then I can upgrade speakers and add a small sub for barely acceptable audio. Also liking the Mazda 3, 6, and upcoming CX-3.

Money is a factor, would love a base TLX 2.4, but this car is going to sit outside for 10 years, I'm thinking cheap, but another RL is a possibility. Oh, and I have to avoid the PAX system as well. Was this just a part of the tech package? Did any years add bluetooth streaming?

oo7spy

First, the 1995-2004 RL was the first generation making 2005-2008 the second. 2009-2012 was technically a 2G mid-model change (MMC), so 2.5 would be more accurate.

The MMC RL has essentially the same engine with an added 0.2L of displacement. It's a J37 and is shared with the MDX, Pilot, and SH-AWD 4G TL. It does not have VCM. Unfortunately for your search, RL sales declined steadily year after year, with 2012 selling less than 400. You can find them, but you will have to be patient or lucky.

If you are getting Honda anything, get an EX or EX-L.

If you are concerned about your car holding up and being worth much down the road, Mazdas are a pretty poor choice in both of those regards from what I have heard.

shahram72

That's helpful info. I have seen many Mazdas and owned one and found them to be as reliable as Hondas, or better than average. The one I sold when I got the RL was cherry and drove great. And I just don't know about Honda being the gold standard anymore. Something has changed. Now all the CVT's and we have a CRV that shakes at idle. There are owners who have sold CRV's that shake badly. Mine aint bad, but not acceptable for a properly engineered car. Accords have the same engine and tranny, but we don't know yet how long they will last. So let me spend more and get the TLX, IT has a 8 speed DCT. Nope, people are reporting vibration and rough shifting with that. And it doesn't even have leather and surround for $31K You gotta be kidding me!! It's a better deal than the Accord EXL. I'm not getting EXL anything. If it's Honda it's LX for me. If I am getting cheap crap, I'll get cheap crap or go upmarket. Mazda's still have conventional autos, and I suspect thats more for drive feel. If I get a new Accord and the tranny dies at 100K, I'm gonna be pissed. Just drove a friend's Chevy Equinox and I have to say, the fit and finish is better than my Honda. We just don't know how long it will hold up. He trades every 3 years, so who cares, But I want a 10 year car. I'm so frustrated. Can't afford what I really want. Makes me want to get a effing Kia Rio and be done with it. There are just no good options other than riding the bus. I buy a shaking CRV, OK, it's a cheap car, although I don't think $24K is cheap, but sell me a vibrating Acura and I might just lose it and drive the damn thing through the showroom window!

How about a base V-6 mustang? I am having an ADD car fit right now. That's why I started this thread, maybe staying with the same thing is best.

oo7spy

Well, I hate to break it to you, but Toyota is the gold standard of reliability and look how many cars they have recalled in the past decade. Some models are worse than others in any brand, but Honda is still has a solid place in the top 3 of reliability metrics. I can't help but question if you are seeing the whole forest or are looking for the burning trees. In 2014, Honda sold 388,000 Accords and 335,000 CR-Vs. If 1% of those cars has some of the issues you mention, then you are looking at 3,880 Accord and 3,350 CRV owners who have an opportunity to express their unhappiness online. You have to take it all with a grain of salt and really evaluate what you are looking at. Buying a used car does involve risk, but you usually end up ahead of those who pay for new cars.

I think the best thing you can do is search out the common issues of each car you look into. Then, when you take it for a test drive, focus on finding those issues and be ready to walk away from anything.

shahram72

007spy, I can't argue with a thing you are saying. I am a bit upset right now. I am happy with my CRV. I just have an RL with cancer and am a bit upset about that. Driving home today I was listening to a DVD-A of Elton John. The song was Bennie and the Jets. His voice was coming from over the hood. Then a DTS CD of Tipper. Very interesting and engaging surround effects on that. I guess I could just listen to talk radio in the new car, I like that too, but nothing new I buy will even approach that level of quality. That said, the Bose system in my car could fail, see my problem? I have decided to just drive my RL for a while more. It's over 100K miles not anyway and then worry about it later. I just like to have a plan in case something happens.

shahram72

OK, I want this.... If it were $30K, I would be all over it. Who knows what deals I will find a year from now. It's basically a year old! But wait... does this have ELS? Is the stereo optional now?!?!? AAAARRRRGHHHHG!

http://www.carmax.com/enus/view-car/...results%20page

teh CL

iTrader: (1)

IMO, if rust is the only issue you have with your RL then instead dropping a chunk of change on a newer car why not freshen up the RL for the long haul and enjoy the ride.

OR find a low mileage 08'.

For the money these cars are worth now a days they are 100% bang for the buck. I just spent 3k in the last month on my front suspension alone & it did suck but I can't complain about this car at all, don't see her slowing down any time soon.

Good luck.

oo7spy

shahram, if I were you, I would change the timing belt. I honestly don't fully understand where the logic is coming from unless the rust is compromising the car's ability to drive. If you can live with the rust and the car will still drive everyday, then change the belt and drive it to 200k miles. Sure the radio may crap out, but that's a $300 fix tops.

If that doesn't convince you, then upgrading the stereo on a newer car is usually trivial and not all that expensive. In an Accord, you could have better than RL quality for less than $500.

As for the RLX, I would drive the heck out of a PAW-S and be absolutely sure it's what you want. I personally see it as a step down from the MMC RL. If it were a SH-AWD, then there would be no questions asked, but you aren't getting in one of those for less than $50k.

shahram72

Seeing how the rust is all over the car, well, door handles, rear fenderlip and trunklid. And all over the underside, but you can't see that, wouldn't that pretty much need a repaint? That's big bucks. And my car has the no start issue now, might just be a fuel pump relay, but it happens so infrequent, not sure how to diagnose that. And the sunroof leaks sometimes after being parked in the rain. I see your points, it's just quite an undertaking to fix EVERYTHING.

oo7spy

I wasn't saying fix everything. I was just saying if the current condition is tolerable, then the car should be good for quite a bit longer. As with any car, if the cost of needed repairs/maintenance approaches 75% of the car's value, then it is time to consider a new ride. At that point, there is no guarantee your transmission won't fall apart and you'll be upside down. If that is your case, I understand. You might get an idea of what a place like Car Max will give you for the car. You don't have to be dishonest or sneaky or worry about getting some sucker to be stuck with your car. Car Max's business is to take away the car you don't want and (ideally) get you into a car you do want.

I've seen you mention a part-out, but that is a loaded option. You have to have a place to store the car, and you have to have the time and know-how to remove parts without damaging them to ship to buyers. If it's not already part of your day to day business, you're better off letting it go completely.

shahram72

Again 007, your're absolutely right, and that's why I will continue to drive the car for now. Will re-evaluate at the end of payments in January. What's painful is going to a lesser car to go new. I think everyone here can relate to that, except those fortunate enough to be able to afford a new RLX. Heck, even those are taking a bath on resale value. No one wants these cars. Why?

shahram72

I so wish I could change the belt myself. I know how to use tools, but I always fail cause I can't reach or loosen something. It's just lack of experience I guess.

MrKev

Rl was one of the cars that was built properly without any problems not even a tranny problem. I'd prefer that over any new vehicle off the luxury brand

shahram72

Oh yes, I am fairly confident that the driveline in my car is very solid and long lasting. Just worried about everything else. My trusted Honda mechanic even told me when I said I was not going to do the timing belt because of the rust, that although he did not recommend taking the risk, that the timing belt would likely not break for a long long time. He said it could break tomorrow, or next year, but he would be very surprised. He is very honest, and why I buy Hondas, why I even DARE to own this car. He made no bones about how the expensive engine will be toast if it breaks, but it will likely make it till when I sell the car. I know it's Russian Roulette. He knows I understand this, but he also knows I have lost love for the car because of the rust. I did do the timing belt service on my 04 Honda Pilot that was a cream puff and drive till 160K miles, when somebody T-boned my wife in it, so in the end even that was wasted money. Just feel like you can't win sometimes. Now I am sitting at my garage computer typing this with my new 2015 CRV at my back, which is a fine car, but let's be honest. It's a jacked up Civic.

oo7spy

There ain't nothin wrong with a Civic.




If it's an EX-L.

rlerman

Take a look at a Mazda 6 GT. pretty nice car, just lacks AWD I believe, but you likely don't need it in SC. Gets like 38 mpg with the Eco version.

shahram72

I love the look of the Mazda 6, it's on my short list. Mine would be a base anyway. No, I don't need 4WD, but it does snow here occasionally. Last time we had a snow storm, I took the RL out and I was the ONLY car on the road. Nothing but 4x4 trucks and me in my RL. Hey! Walmart was open! It's nasty here when it snows, we are not equipped to deal with it. Then it melted halfway one day and froze overnight. Then my street was covered in 1" of ice. I called in to work. I could barely walk to the street, no way I could drive.

teh CL

iTrader: (1)

You most definitely can change your timing belt if your partially mechanically inclined. It's more time consuming than anything. If you've never dabled then I wouldn't bother but it is definitely doable

SSjTrunks112O

Acura RL Technology | eBay

don't know how you like ebay but I saw this on there. the price seems pretty low but I guess it's bc 41,xxx miles is a bit high for a 2014.

SSjTrunks112O

Acura RL 4DR Sedan Navigation | eBay

same here. both are from dealers atleast..

stevieray

If it's the rust that's bothering you so much, then go look for a solid '07 or '08 with 60-80K miles on it and call it a day. There's probably 50 of them on cars.com ranging from $24K to $14K. I've said this before and I'll say it again---this is the biggest automotive steal in today's market. I doubt that there's another $56K retail car that you can buy for these prices and have the technology AND reliability of a 2G RL. Another factor to consider is that 2G RLs are made in Japan, not here. I've never owned an Acura that's been made in the States and don't plan to. Anybody that tells you that they are the same quality is fooling themselves.

I wouldn't buy a new car if you held a gun to my head. Do your due diligence and let someone else take the hit on depreciation. Good luck---

shahram72

Yeah, I hear ya, and agree, just wish I didn't like the old look so much better than the new. Honda got on the crack pipe for a few years there. It's not ugly, but it's sharp angles mixed with smooth curves. Not pure design at all.

Oh, those RLX's posted are tempting, I just don't know if I want to do that to myself again. As good cars as they probably are, I just see $$$ as they get older. You can't have your cake and eat it too. Not if you are of normal means. I make good money, but I pay for 4 people! Now I am renting a violin! Good God!

SSjTrunks112O

speaking of which, which was the last year RL to be made in Japan? Was it the '08, '10, '12, or are they all still made in Japan including the RLX? I vaguely remember hearing something that RL's might be made in the US following the tsunami but I'm not 100% sure? I want to say and assume that Acura's flagship would be built in Japan. The only thing that is throwing me off is that the TLX is built in the US..

speaking of which, you are spot on with the RL being the best bang for the buck out there. You get a lot of car for the money, even new if you haggle them down. It's not even close imo either!

SSjTrunks112O

nm just found my answer. all the RL's and RLX's are made in Japan.

stevieray

Again, get a good, solid '07-08 and call it a day. That's the body style you like, right?

shahram72

You might be right, as others here have stated, stevieray. Today I did something crazy. After washing my wife's new CRV, I decided to take it out for a spirited drive, CVT and all! I just wanted to see how it handled when pushed. The power is adequate for the car, any more would get you into trouble. The car is defintely not up to the task. I think a lot of the problem was the cheap 16" economy tires, they just roll over and play dead, but the suspension also was trouble on a very bumpy road I took it on. The car wanted to change direction. Maybe I am just spoiled by the VSA and SH-AWD. The RL just goes where you point it, no drama at all. But this has me worried about an Accord. It has to be better. Would be nice to take an Accord on a spirited drive. But I have really taken the assists for granted on the RL and I realize that after today. But an Accord with 17" tires would have been a more fair comparison. I remember my old Dodge Stealth being very confidence inspiring on all roads when pushed. And it had no assists, not even ABS.

shahram72

Hey I just had a thought. I know I said I am uncomfortable replacing the timing belt by myself, I was just going to let it ride. But I have totally missed an option. How about I just change the belts (serpentine and timing) with the help of someone who knows how to do it? My father in law has a guy who does everything and just redid his old Ford Ranger doing the timing belt, replaceing the AC system and lots of other fixes and now it's great, and right now they are both working on my wife's wrecked ex-Pilot. He bought it for the $850 the insurance company sold it to us for after totalling it. They fixed the broken rear suspension and are replacing the doors and doing paint and body work. Changing just the belts is not as good as doing the whole job including pulleys, seals, and water pump, and plugs, but it's a whole lot better than doing nothing, isn't it? Then at least I don't have to worry about the belt snapping. I'm just afraid to let anyone other than my mechanic touch the car, but heck if you guys think I could do it, then I should be able to with help! Now how about belt brands? Is a Gates fine? Or do I need the Honda one? The Gates belt is $30. Also a bit concerned that after doing the job, something will squeal from being disturbed (it could happen) and then I am stuck almost forced to do the whole job right. This is all a balance of risk. The cost of doing this is a non-issue. So is this option better than just leaving the 11 year old belt in there? Would like to keep this car longer, oh well the rust. Gets me to work in comfort.

cobra10363

I'm going to agree with the above post from stevieray and there is no need to repeat what he stated above

I don't think it's a matter of convincing.. it's more of what you're looking for and a price point. In my car hunt, i make a list of two or three makes and models i'm interested and a price range i want to stay in and then hit the net as oppose to driving around jumping from dealer to dealer. Then zero in on the ones that appeal to you and go and look at them and test drive them with the mindset of "i can walk away". I'm almost positive your gut will tell you if it's the right car or not.

I just purchased (two weeks ago) a 07 RL with 70k miles on it.. I think i got a decent deal but my other option was a VW CC. I called my mechanic and asked him "VW CC or Honda RL" his response was I'd rather work on a Honda any day over a VW. That was enough to convince me to lean further towards a RL. This is my third Honda 1. Accord LX, 2. TSX, and now a RL..

shahram72

Now I am looking at a V6 Mustang. It's so different! So beautiful, so impractical!

teh CL

iTrader: (1)

My dad went through the same thing after I got my RL months back. He drove it and fell in love with it and told me to find him one. 2 weeks later (after I find him a great RL) he goes to check out a Passat CC. I tell him he's nuts going CC over the RL but buys the CC anyways...

Not even 3 days after buying the CC the radio takes a shit. Great start to owning his first VW..

Ratheruneeq

Preach brother Stevie! LOL I take great pride in my Saitama JP built Acuras, all the way from the G2 legend to the G2 RL.... my last car ever i buy god willing will be a lower mileage 08 or a low mileage 09-12.... Im not interested in anything else in life.....

Ratheruneeq

another point to be made is that.... the only thing i really dislike slightly on the g3/kb2 RL is the indentation at the bottom of the front grill/bumper but that can be remedied with some custom work or an aftermaret mesh grill... other than that... people can say what they want about it, but when youre in the physical presence of that thing, everyone shuts up. its a pretty awesome car with bold presence. The uniqueness factor only adds to it.
Its like the G2 just with a plusher body and in my opinion sexier tail and headlights....... plus the woodgrain console that oddly enough wasnt an option for the ka9 or kb1 but they offered burlwood consoles for the legends.... lol

shahram72

Sometimes a car just bites you. The Acura did for me and still does, I just wish it were younger (hmm, I'm hearing a parallel here...). He bought what he liked, might as well make the best of it, that's what I did with my RL, even with the rust. Now talking about my last post and getting bitten... Went to lunch with my wife today and then went to the Ford dealership to look at and sit in a V6 Mustang. Guys, I'm bit. I can't do it now which is a good thing because I tend to get infatuated with cars and then lose interest, so I have time to cool down. But with all the different cars I have been looking at and talking about here on the forums, it always comes down to what I am giving up with the RL, and I feel stuck. This is the only car I have looked at that's in my price range and makes me feel. "WOW". It's different enough and exciting enough. So I don't know, we'll see. Got plenty of time to enjoy my new HID's and front end work on my RL. I'd rather a prolonged goodbye, it will have to go one day anyway, I just want to appreciate it since I may not own anything like it again.

And as far as Honda vs. Ford reliability and engineering, there is no question, but I've got plenty of stories to support one over the other. Plenty of failures and successes on both sides. Don't think I'd be afraid to own a Ford, since Honda is not really impressing me in the same price range. I've owned Fords before.

Ratheruneeq

So Im not really sure I understand your logic. You have this decent budget to get into another car. You claim to "get infatuated with cars and then lose interest" but you wont get a critical maintenance done such as timing belt, water pump etc because of rust?

Bruh.... By a horse, donkey, a mountain bike, a moped..... anything but a car.

Then you mentioned getting into a Mazda? What exactly are you trying to do? One doesn't just up and leave an RL and downgrade to a Mazda happily. It just doesn't happen.

If your RL is mechanically sound, the rust is the only thing bothering and you have the budget to get into another car loan. Why not just get a professional paint job and body work done on it?
Or, Im sure finding another RL (one thats been garaged most of its life) shouldnt be too dificult considering the history of owner types with these cars, but A Mazda? What exactly is there to be infatuated with on a Mazda, coming from an RL? You mentioned reliability. What exactly is more reliable on a Mazda?

oo7spy

I'll take a V6 Accord over a V6 Mustang any day. If you can get behind a Coyote 5.0, then I can understand the infatuation, but otherwise .

shahram72

The V6 on the Mustang is the truck motor which some see as bad but I see as a long lasting workhorse. I'm just trying to find something I like. The rust is ALL OVER the car and will get worse. I could fix it but that would cost thousands and then there's everything else. I am pained. I love the RL, but it's dying from the rust. Have any of you tried to tackle that much rust? Some of it will only come back and that's after you've spent at least $2K. I'm just looking at something different. New Hondas are not what they used to be. I have a 2015 here in the garage.

Ratheruneeq

Personally id have no problem pulling the trigger on a low mileage kb2 if I could swing it. Search iakonafuji for motivation lol

oo7spy

What do you mean "it's the truck motor." The mustang ran a pitiful 4.0L V6 and then a 3.7L in the past 5 years. The F-150 Ecoboost runs a 3.5L similar to the Taurus and Flex. Are you talking about the 4.0L V6 in the Ranger? A 4.0 pushing a whopping 210 HP would be anything but infatuating.

Your comment about Honda's not being like they used to be is funny too. Have you ever been in 1G CR-V? The 3G blows that away.

shahram72

I mean the motor was originally introduced for the new F-150. That means a lot to me, truck motors are usually pretty solid. The new 3.7L in the Ford is not like the old one of even a few years ago, yes they were solid motors (except the early ones in the 90's), but slow. The new one makes 300hp and propels the car 0-60 in 6 seconds. Hardly slow. The Ecoboost in the Mustang is a 2.3L making 310hp. I'm not touching that one. plus it costs thousands more! I actually drove a 1G CRV at the dealer when they first came out. I remember it was fine, but slow. The current CRV is leaps and bounds better, I own one, but I was referencing my disappointment in it's cheap materials and the vibration issue. Maybe I was being unfair, but the cars are overpriced for what they are. I would not have bought it had I not had an $8000 check from the insurance company. And also, Honda is forcing CVT on everybody if you want a 4 cyl. It's fine, but I'd rather have a normal tranny. The higher model Honda are very nice, but go look at the cheaper ones. Chevy and Ford is using nicer materials inside than Honda, it's shameful.

Point is, if I don't get a another used RL I am going NEW. And I have to like what I buy. There's plenty to like out there, but I'm at a point in my life where I feel like it might be my last chance to own something for the kid in me (I'm 43). Can always get another luxury car next time.

Nexx

are we sure this isnt that same guy trolling about good deal on cars he isnt intending to buy anyways?