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For all who are spending 300+ for timing belt kits...
Just done my 3rd J-series timing belt. This time it was a 06 Accord EX V-6 (135,000). I know they are late with the timing belt, but it's not my car. Otherwise it would have been about 100,000. All the seals looked good, so no need to replace them. I have seen the seals last over 250+
I also changed the spark plugs (NGK) and the antifreeze.
Ordered the Gates TCKWP329 Engine Timing Belt Kit with Water Pump: $144.56 This is the same kit that works on the RL.
Old water pump was stamped Honda Aisin.
New water pump was stamped Aisin.
Old rollers were stamped Koyo.
New rollers were stamped Koyo.
Old tensioner was no name.
New tensioner was no name.
For the drive belt, I went with Gates: $24.65
Now if you look on any site that sells Honda parts, you will see the name "Unitta" in parentheses next to the timing belt. Google "Unitta" and see what you come up with: Gates Unitta. Honda/Acura do not make parts, they pick the best suppliers.
Just wanted to let everyone one that is rushing to the dealership to get these parts and paying 300+ for everything, when they can be paying less than 180.00 with free shipping from Amazon.
I will not say that the parts you mention are not the same or are less quality parts. However, I will say with certainty that there are black market products all over the world that say the same manufacturer/brand, and they are not the same or near the quality.
You may be saving $120 with Amazon, but you are losing a warranty.
For clarity, I'll reiterate. I'm not saying this is a bad idea; I just wouldn't take a chance on a discount for a timing belt.
I will not say that the parts you mention are not the same or are less quality parts. However, I will say with certainty that there are black market products all over the world that say the same manufacturer/brand, and they are not the same or near the quality.
You may be saving $120 with Amazon, but you are losing a warranty.
For clarity, I'll reiterate. I'm not saying this is a bad idea; I just wouldn't take a chance on a discount for a timing belt.
I understand what you are saying, but Gates Unitta is not a black market company. They are a leading supplier of rubber to most of the car manufacturers. You have to understand that Honda/Acura does not make parts, they just choose the best suppliers, and stamp their logo on it. If you call a dealerships service department, they will tell you that Gates makes their belts. When you remove your tensioners, you will see Koyo or NTN on them, no Honda/Acura.
Originally Posted by HEAVY_RL
a bolt on part that wont compromise my engine... no problem.
Water pump, no way I'd gamble over a bar tab.
Once again, Honda stamped their name on it. Actually, for water pumps Honda/Acura use a bunch of manufacturers to manufacture them. OEM is usually Yamada/Yotec, Atsugi/Paraut, or Aisin depending on the Honda/Acura model. Back in the day I used to wonder why there were weird names on the water pumps I purchased from the dealership. Especially if it was a "Honda" part...
I understand that Honda doesn't build the parts (like the Denso radiators), but Amazon isn't a credible site. They sell knock off parts everyday. I'm just saying that, TO ME, it is worth $150 to know that the parts I am putting in are 100% backed by the manufacturer and have a warranty.
I appreciate the contribution to the community in any case.
Just done my 3rd J-series timing belt. This time it was a 06 Accord EX V-6 (135,000). I know they are late with the timing belt, but it's not my car. Otherwise it would have been about 100,000. All the seals looked good, so no need to replace them. I have seen the seals last over 250+
I also changed the spark plugs (NGK) and the antifreeze.
Ordered the Gates TCKWP329 Engine Timing Belt Kit with Water Pump: $144.56 This is the same kit that works on the RL.
Old water pump was stamped Honda Aisin.
New water pump was stamped Aisin.
Old rollers were stamped Koyo.
New rollers were stamped Koyo.
Old tensioner was no name.
New tensioner was no name.
For the drive belt, I went with Gates: $24.65
Now if you look on any site that sells Honda parts, you will see the name "Unitta" in parentheses next to the timing belt. Google "Unitta" and see what you come up with: Gates Unitta. Honda/Acura do not make parts, they pick the best suppliers.
Just wanted to let everyone one that is rushing to the dealership to get these parts and paying 300+ for everything, when they can be paying less than 180.00 with free shipping from Amazon.
Thanks for the info, not everyones has access or the funds for dealer parts. This could potentially help those that think that up keep on an RL is out of their budget. Fortunately I've got a friend at the dealership
I understand that Honda doesn't build the parts (like the Denso radiators), but Amazon isn't a credible site. They sell knock off parts everyday. I'm just saying that, TO ME, it is worth $150 to know that the parts I am putting in are 100% backed by the manufacturer and have a warranty.
I appreciate the contribution to the community in any case.
Yes, Amazon does sell knock off parts, but that is for the buyer to recognize what they are buying. Just like Ebay.
What is the manufacturers warranty if this comes from the dealership?
I bought a similar Gates kit w/o water pump for my 96 Accord. Great quality minus the honda logo. But yes, Gates is one of the primary source for Honda belts.
I didn't mind too much on an old Accord.
However, doing it on an RL, I see how some people might be doubting it. $100-$200 more for a part that last about 8 years on normal driving, not a bad investment to go OEM.
But thank you for posting it. I was unsure what water pump brand they used, but now I know.
This is not entirely correct, it's not black market. Gates is the OEM supplier for Honda for the timing belts at least. in other countries the name is called Unitta. As far as the bearings for Koyo here is what I have heard: When Honda spec'd the parts they called for a certain metal, they had no choice but to use that metal in the manufacturing. In the aftermarket Gates kits the Belts should be close quality to the Honda timing belt, the difference in the idlers with Koyo stamped on it should be that they used a different metal alloy. I have heard they should be similar quality, as close as you can get to aftermarket anyhow. However you do need to replace the seals (probably just the large outer seal), those have been known to leak so I assume it is not oem quality. Whether being exact OEM or in the case of the gates kits near quality is up to you, but for aftermarket this is the kit to get. for an 2002 Odyssey the kit to get is a Gates TCK286 Timing Belt Component Kit. I would be wary of getting the $197 Aisin water pump kit, Aisin is the OEM supplier for honda but they use unknown parts in the kit like the tensioner and in that kit I would replace the seals with true OEM, all aftermarket kits should have the seals replaced with OEM. So there's your irony, OEM supplier (although now replaced by Yamada) using probably cheap knock off china parts. the water pump I have a suspicion is not identical quality to Honda OEM from the reviews on it, but I could be wrong.
Originally Posted by oo7spy
I will not say that the parts you mention are not the same or are less quality parts. However, I will say with certainty that there are black market products all over the world that say the same manufacturer/brand, and they are not the same or near the quality.
You may be saving $120 with Amazon, but you are losing a warranty.
For clarity, I'll reiterate. I'm not saying this is a bad idea; I just wouldn't take a chance on a discount for a timing belt.
On the contrary - and since this is an RL forum I'll focus on that - the Aisin kit is the one you should get. The Gates kit comes with a chinese made unknown water pump.
The Aisin kit comes with an Aisin water pump, made in Japan and is the original water pump that is in the RL at the factory. Honda switched to Yamada recently, but Aisin still supplies lexus for example. The tensioner and bearings are Koyo. And there are seals in there too. The belt is a Mitsuboshi.
Reading reviews online, the chinese pump in the Gates kit has many people bitching in broke a year - 1.5 years after installing it.
Given that any good rubber company makes a good rubber belt; I'd say Aisin kit since it's an OEM Japanese pump.
I've got an Odyssey so my knowledge is on that. I've read many reviews that say the aisin also leaks, but I think it's due to the seal so like I said if you replace it with oem it may solve that. The gates kit I pointed to has no water pump and the idlers are said to be koyo bearings. like I also said the Aisin kits I doubt are true OEM quality because they no longer have to follow Honda/Acura's specs at least for the metals and I suspect also the seals. I never mentioned the gates water pump or was trying to dispute that, that is without a doubt garbage. I'm not sure about the RL kit but on the 1999-2004 Odyssey kit the tensioner and one of the idlers I think were some unknown brand. I think they made a good choice switching to Yamada. Some are even stamped Yotec.
Originally Posted by RL09
On the contrary - and since this is an RL forum I'll focus on that - the Aisin kit is the one you should get. The Gates kit comes with a chinese made unknown water pump.
The Aisin kit comes with an Aisin water pump, made in Japan and is the original water pump that is in the RL at the factory. Honda switched to Yamada recently, but Aisin still supplies lexus for example. The tensioner and bearings are Koyo. And there are seals in there too. The belt is a Mitsuboshi.
Reading reviews online, the chinese pump in the Gates kit has many people bitching in broke a year - 1.5 years after installing it.
Given that any good rubber company makes a good rubber belt; I'd say Aisin kit since it's an OEM Japanese pump.
I've got an Odyssey so my knowledge is on that. I've read many reviews that say the aisin also leaks, but I think it's due to the seal so like I said if you replace it with oem it may solve that. The gates kit I pointed to has no water pump and the idlers are said to be koyo bearings. like I also said the Aisin kits I doubt are true OEM quality because they no longer have to follow Honda/Acura's specs at least for the metals and I suspect also the seals. I never mentioned the gates water pump or was trying to dispute that, that is without a doubt garbage. I'm not sure about the RL kit but on the 1999-2004 Odyssey kit the tensioner and one of the idlers I think were some unknown brand. I think they made a good choice switching to Yamada. Some are even stamped Yotec.
The Aisin & Gates kit have the following differences: The water pump and the belt itself. The belt is mitsuboshi vs Gates belt, and the pump is Aisin which is OEM. You'll be find with the Gates kit without the pump since only the pump is the problem.
I understand that Honda doesn't build the parts (like the Denso radiators), but Amazon isn't a credible site. They sell knock off parts everyday.
This. Amazon has been all over the news for its failure to do anything meaningful about the flood of Chinese knockoff sellers offering various kinds of merchandise all over its site. The merchandise routinely has the brand names and packaging of the real items, and the culprit categories specifically include auto parts.
The Honda/Acura J-series V6 is an interference engine. That's a polite way of saying that if the timing belt breaks, it will lunch your valvetrain. Everybody makes their own economic risk/reward decision. Let's just say that after making mine last year, I'm not feeling pangs of regret about paying the price of verifiably OEM parts.
How about these? bought my kit this week, plus drive belt & plugs. Less expensive than any online posting and stuff looks good. I do hope I didn't get knock offs too??
How about these? bought my kit this week, plus drive belt & plugs. Less expensive than any online posting and stuff looks good. I do hope I didn't get knock offs too??
I bought the same Aisin TKH-002 for my 09 TL, $200 from Amazon, Installed it Labor Day weekend, all is well so far. Parts looked like good quality to me and the same as what I pulled out, although it was the first ever timing belt change for me. https://acurazine.com/forums/new-mem...roject-949054/
I bought the same Aisin TKH-002 for my 09 TL, $200 from Amazon, Installed it Labor Day weekend, all is well so far. Parts looked like good quality to me and the same as what I pulled out, although it was the first ever timing belt change for me. https://acurazine.com/forums/new-mem...roject-949054/
Didn't see any markings on the belt that I pulled out, but it was worn for sure. I'm guessing it was on there for about 130k. I read somewhere that Mitsuboshi was OEM supplier for honda and toyota so I don't have any problems with it. This is also the same kit for our Honda Odyssey, but we only have 40k miles on it since we purchased it new. I plan on using the same kit on the van when we hit about 90k.
The auto-tensioner was leaking fluid too, glad that was included in the kit.
Just FYI if you live in NY/NJ/CT area, Hamilton Honda is still running timing belt special for $550, including:
- Honda timing belt
- water pump
- all drive belts
- the engine coolant
Add timing belt tensioner for extra $70 or so which is a no brainer.
The special pricing applies to Acura's too. I've done my '03 TL and '06 Odyssey with them; looking to add a 2gen RL to the fleet soon and will bring it over for timing belt as well.
Didn't see any markings on the belt that I pulled out, but it was worn for sure. I'm guessing it was on there for about 130k. I read somewhere that Mitsuboshi was OEM supplier for honda and toyota so I don't have any problems with it. This is also the same kit for our Honda Odyssey, but we only have 40k miles on it since we purchased it new. I plan on using the same kit on the van when we hit about 90k.
The auto-tensioner was leaking fluid too, glad that was included in the kit.
Yea depending on stock levels they sometimes switch suppliers.
This kit I read is what the Acura dealer gives you today with two exceptions (almost everyone still use Koyo): they switched the pump supplier to Yamada, and the belt supplier is Unitta which is made by Gates. I know the stock pump was aisin and looking forward to confirm it, but I'm uncertain which belts where stock in my year of production. I'll see if mine still could be read.
I bought the same Aisin TKH-002 for my 09 TL, $200 from Amazon, Installed it Labor Day weekend, all is well so far. Parts looked like good quality to me and the same as what I pulled out, although it was the first ever timing belt change for me. https://acurazine.com/forums/new-mem...roject-949054/
Nice adventure on that TL
You said in that thread you changed thermostats. What thermostat did you buy? I got the Motorad fail safe, but I read somewhere not to change those unless they've gone bad, and to use Honda thermostats only - whatever that means?
Thanks! It was definitely trying my patience @ times... I looked @ aftermarket thermostats on amazon, price wasn't that different from OEM. I've read the same about using honda only. I think I saw a video from ericthecarguy says he only uses OEM honda thermostats so that's what I went for as a few of his video's have been quite helpful to me at least. The old thermostat looked fine, but I replaced it anyway since I was in there and had the coolant drained from water pump change. The coolant that came out was green, I bought the newer Honda stuff which is blue in color.
Motorad cost 25 bucks shipped. I'll check how much it is at the dealer.
I'm buying the blue from dealer as well, along with their oil and oil filter, and pcv valve, changing that just in case. I think I've covered whatever could possibly be changed in a timing belt job.
Motorad cost 25 bucks shipped. I'll check how much it is at the dealer.
I'm buying the blue from dealer as well, along with their oil and oil filter, and pcv valve, changing that just in case. I think I've covered whatever could possibly be changed in a timing belt job.
That PCV valve is something I should add to my TODO list as well. I've always used mobil1 synthetic in all of my cars. Before that I used amsoil(almost 15years ago). $23 for 5qt jug of mobil1 from walmart fully synthetic can't go wrong. I've had the dealer do the oil changes for like the last 10years, just bring in my own oil, use their filter and they charge 18 bucks. I might be doing my own oil changes from now on, will probably switch to a bosch filter as well after looking @ reviews...
That PCV valve is something I should add to my TODO list as well. I've always used mobil1 synthetic in all of my cars. Before that I used amsoil(almost 15years ago). $23 for 5qt jug of mobil1 from walmart fully synthetic can't go wrong. I've had the dealer do the oil changes for like the last 10years, just bring in my own oil, use their filter and they charge 18 bucks. I might be doing my own oil changes from now on, will probably switch to a bosch filter as well after looking @ reviews...
I've fully committed to using synthetic mobil1. > 15 years ago i used to run amsoil for 7k miles, then just change the filter and run it another 7k miles on the same oil. Can't/shouldn't do that with conventional, sludge buildup etc. I'm sure if you use conventional and change it when you are supposed to it really dosen't matter. The 1999 honda civic my wife purchased new had synthetic since day one, had 200k miles when we sold it. Same thing with our 2011 odyssey, synthetic since day one, probably overkill for the van, but I'm sold on it.. No problems @ all. Heck as long as you change it on schedule, that $2.50 no name oil would probably be just fine.
So car's back, still got rear brakes tomorrow but the biggies are done.
A few notes: my original pump was Yamada not Aisin. It's identical. As if the same manufacturing facility. Pics below.
DJkurious bought the Gates kit, which I'm guessing in 2013 was Aisin pump, but no anymore. Those gates pumps fail. Do not buy that kit. Buy the Aisin kit. The only non japanese made thingy is the timing belt which is made in Thailand but in a facility for Mitsuboshi who mnufactures belts for honda & toyota.
The tensioner is the exact same, and the bearings are also Koyo. thing is, they might as well not have changed those two bearings as the old ones look good as new.
Also, The belts, both timing and drive, no longer have any printing on them obviously, but were in excellent shape. This timing belt was good for another 80k miles. It's touch feels exactly like the new one bought, and has no tear, wear signs, nothing. if you've taken care of your car, and have kept it at good temperatures etc etc. chances are these RLs timing belt changes wouldn't be necessary until you hit 125k miles. But, who'd do that right?
The old pump also looking spanking new.
A question : is it normal for these filters to be this black?
This on one page will give good proof how the Aisin kit is really your best bet; and the least expensive. Under 180usd shipped. Truly worth it.
Glad you got it all taken care of. The cabin filter looked like mine when I pulled it out. At first I thought it was really dirty, but after examining it I think it has some carbon or charcoal layer or something built into it. My new cabin filter just had the paper, all white. Next time i'll spend a few bucks more for a better one. It was like 2 cabin filters for $12 on Ebay. The other one went on the odyssey... same filter as the TL.
Is that your intake filter? That looks really really dirty, I don't think I've ever seen one that bad. Hopefully your engine is breathing a little better now :-D
Glad you got it all taken care of. The cabin filter looked like mine when I pulled it out. At first I thought it was really dirty, but after examining it I think it has some carbon or charcoal layer or something built into it. My new cabin filter just had the paper, all white. Next time i'll spend a few bucks more for a better one. It was like 2 cabin filters for $12 on Ebay. The other one went on the odyssey... same filter as the TL.
Is that your intake filter? That looks really really dirty, I don't think I've ever seen one that bad. Hopefully your engine is breathing a little better now :-D
Yes the engine filter. it's a bit shocking to see it this black.... i'm wondering why given how everything else looks so nice and shiny
@RL09 Thanks for the heads up on the Gates kit. I have installed about 12 of them on J-series to no complaints. The Accord that I installed the kit on is still rolling after almost 90,000 on the timing components, no issues. I will start using the Aisin kits from now on.
Glad this thread has pointed out that you can save money with the kit than the $300+ some folks are paying for the components.
06-02-2013, 09:31 PM
I will not say that the parts you mention are not the same or are less quality parts. However, I will say with certainty that there are black market products all over the world that say the same manufacturer/brand, and they are not the same or near the quality.
