dlevesque

I need to purchase new winter tires and rims for my 2016 RDX elite.

My dealer is proposing either 17 in steel rims (120$ CAD each) or 18 in mag wheels (225 $CAD each). He can't offer 18 in steel rims.

I am a bit reluctant to buy non acura/honda rims as I had a slight fit problem on a previous honda.

Any comments, insights or suggestions on the following:

17 in vs 18 in for winter tires;
steel vs mag;
Acura vs OEM;
Good place to buy wheels & tires in Montreal, Canada.

Thanks!

TacoBello

Smaller rims are a good idea, as the tire will ultimately have a bigger sidewall. This is a good thing for when you hit potholes, or plow into something frozen- there's a smaller chance of the wheel getting bent.

I would not buy tires or rims from a dealership, as the markup on that stuff is astronomical. Try Costco. They have an excellent warranty policy, customer service and they WILL take care of you if you have any issues.

I've had steel winter rims on pretty much every car I've owned, except one, and I've never had issues.

Aluminum wheels aren't the best idea for winter use. Yes, they look much better than steelies, but they aren't as strong.

ceb

For best winter performance you'll want the tallest sidewall and narrowest tire possible. So a 17" (or 16 if it clears the bits) with an overall outside diameter of the tire equal to the OE size.

Unless you are really hard on wheels, a steel wheel is overkill and doesn't look good.

Try finding some used wheels from a CR-V (local junkyard maybe?)

If using steel wheels then you'll also need new lugnuts so that is something else to keep track of.

Don't forget that you'll need TPMS sensors for your new wheels.

TacoBello

Yes, ceb is right. Although a narrow tire isn't the best for performance driving, it really helps in the snow. The narrower the tire, the smaller the surface area contacting the ground, the more weight is distributed across that area, making the tires sink in deeper into the snow and providing better traction.

If you want to go with 16" rims, make sure they clear the brake rotor and caliper first.

TPMS is a must, unless you don't mind that annoying light on the dash being on all the time.

Used oem wheels is not a bad idea, but again, steelies will take pothole impacts better and they are cheaper to replace if one gets taco'd. I have a preference for steelies, but I can imagine that on a new car, you want to keep it looking sharp. Those used oem wheels are not a bad option.

ceb

No TPMS also shuts down some of your nannies.

TacoBello

That's odd... I'll take your word for it though. I've never driven without them.

andysinnh

I'm doing the same thing now - looking at a 17" option for snows for my RDX. The 17" CR-V steel wheels will be a good, economical option. According to TireRack, when you look at their tire/wheel package options, 17" is as low as they go (and it makes sense when you look at the clearance with the stock 18" wheels). If you go with that size wheel, then 235-65R17 is the same overall diameter and a good mix of width and sidewall height for the winter. The CR-V wheels are 17x6.5 with +50mm offset, which matches well with the 7.5" +45mm offset stock 18" wheels.

I do have a question - TPMS sensors. The stock sensors are made for alloys - but not sure they'd tighten enough for a thinner steel wheel. Anyone know? And is there a cross-ref of TPMS sensors across honda that would work with the '15 RDX that maybe come on a vehicle with steel wheels? Thanks for any experience here.

andy

ceb

VSA is disabled. Not sure what else is affected.

dirleton

I am planning to stick with 18" wheels (Tire Rack) and go one size narrower on the tire. Am I doing something dumb?

andysinnh

It's not dumb, but choosing a narrower tire on an 18" wheel might give you a different feel. Having done winter tire/wheel combos for probably 3 decades now, I always try to go 1 wheel size (diameter) down if I can, because you get more distance between the road and the rim - and around here pot holes are the biggest tire/wheel killer in the winter. Plus you get a bit more flex when trying to get traction, which always helps. The other thing is, after looking at tirerack's options, you can save a fair amount of cash by going 17" - probably close to $20 per wheel alone, let alone the tire cost.

Just my $.02

andy

dlevesque

Thanks for all the answers.

I am ok with the look of steel wheels when new. That’s what I had on my old CR-V. They were silver painted and looked good until the rust started after a few years. Funny though, I used the same nuts as the ones on the mag wheels. As you mentioned, Costco also said I need new nuts for the RDX. But can I keep my locking nuts?

I also had TPMS installed, I hate the warning light. I have a TPMS programming tool so I reprogrammed the TPMS each season. I saved on wheel change and TPMS reprogramming. Anybody knows if the RDX needs reprogramming every season?

Finally, how do I calculate the correct tire size? I currently have 235/60R18. Is there a magic formula? I will google it tomorrow.

dlevesque

Just found the correct size on the answer from andysinnh :
235-65R17

johnrh

On my 2009 TSX I used 16" steel wheels and a narrower Michelin xice tire, both ordered through tirerack.com with TPMS sensors installed.

For my 2016 RDX I have bought separate 18" acura OEM alloy wheels from a local dealer. There are over 10 in the greater Toronto area, and a few are willing to go lower than the suggested retail price to get your business. I ended up paying $350 all-in for each wheel including TPMS sensor and center cap. (The same price applied to last year's wheels, plus the regular and elite wheels for 2016). The $350 does not include tax. I also ended up buying some Bridgestone DMV2 Blizzaks (same size as the current all seasons) from Costco a couple of weeks ago. (They were offering a $70 off rebate until last week I think).

I was going to buy a winter tire and wheel package with the same tires from tirerack.com, but with the crappy USD/CAD exchange rate, I actually ended up saving a little bit by buying the wheels and tires separately myself. I'll have my local dealer mount the tires on the new wheels, and install them on my RDX, in November. I also like the fact that I will not have to worry about centering rings, or a second set of lug nuts for the winter wheels.

johnrh

you may or may not need new lug nut and new locking nuts. from what i understand, they are 3 general types of fit -- flat, cone-shaped, and rounded
(I could be wrong with the terms). Generally, if you need new lug nuts, you likely won't be able to safely use your current locking nuts. A good reference source for this kind of information is the tirerack.com website. The same site is also good for finding out what other tire sizes (such as the 235/65-17 mentioned by andy) will work for winter driving.

I think the TPMS sensors do not need to be reprogrammed (at least that was the case with my TSX).

BLEXV6

I have 17" non OEM alloys with Michelein snow tires. They are great. My dealer had a good deal based on other quotes and I don't want to pay for OEMs for winter tires and I hate the steel tires as they do not look good.

dirleton

The manual says to get winter tires the same size as OEM.

rosen39

They are assuming you are using the stock 18" wheels to mount them on.

ceb

Or perhaps it is an admonishment to make sure to get the same outside diameter.

That said, there is nothing wrong with getting the same size tire but a thinner tire with a taller sidewall will be cheaper AND give you slightly better winter performance.

YeuEmMaiMai

personally I would not go with skinnier tires, they will cause you to wander more on roads that have been cleared

ceb

That's incorrect. Wider, lower profile tires tend to tramline more

andysinnh

going from a stock 235-60R18 to a winter 235-65R17 tire doesn't change a lot of the driving dynamics, although the slightly taller sidewall and the typically "squirmier" tread will change the feel and cornering sensation. But the reason you're putting a snow tire on this vehicle is to get thru the snow and bad winter weather, not to practice your off-ramp handling dynamics. It's not such a big deal on the RDX of 17 vs 18 wheels since there's a lot of rubber between your rim and the pot holes in either case. But on a lower-profile setup like on the wife's TL the drop by an inch in the wheel diameter can be the difference between a wheel bend and just a "wow, that was deep" comment But you can save some significant $$ when going with the 17" setup on the RDX, based on my research...

andy

YeuEmMaiMai

No, they don't, wide tires tend not to wander

ceb

Sigh.. From Tirerack. Bolding is mine. No need to read the entire article if you don't want to:Tire Tech Tramlining: Coping with the Ruts in the Road

(Lea en español)
The term "tramlining" is being used to describe when directional control is disrupted by the vehicle's tendency to follow the longitudinal ruts and/or grooves in the road. It's name could be compared to the tram or trolley driver who does not steer because his vehicle follows the path established by the tracks.
Any vehicle can exhibit tramlining on certain areas of the highway because of uneven pavement or severe rutting. And all vehicles tramline to some degree rather than obediently following the driver's steering input. For example, there's usually at least a small change in steering resistance felt through the wheel when crossing an uneven expansion joint or asphalt junction during lane changes.
Noticeable increases in tramlining are frequently uncovered when drivers living in the snowbelt make the seasonal changeover from winter tires to summer tires, or when any driver upgrades the performance of their tires using either the same size or going to a "Plus Size" tire and wheel package. The reason that it becomes more pronounced then is because neither the typically narrower and softer handling winter tires nor the Original Equipment tires generate as much grip or responsiveness as the higher performance summer tires. Since the vehicle's suspension works as a complete package, a higher performance tire will also uncover any previously unnoticed looseness in the rest of the suspension.
Components

Tires have the most direct influence on tramlining because they are the part of the vehicle that comes into contact with the road (and the longitudinal ruts and/or grooves that exist there). Unfortunately anything that increases a high performance tire's responsiveness also increases its willingness to tramline.
High performance tires with short sidewalls that develop lots of cornering power at lower slip angles will be more susceptible to tramlining than standard All-Season passenger tires that develop less cornering force until their slip angle increases. A wider treaded tire will encounter more longitudinal ruts and/or grooves in the road than a narrow treaded tire. A tire with large tread blocks that transmits the driver's input to the road with great precision will also transmit the road's imperfections back to the vehicle's suspension. And because tires become more responsive as their tread depth wears away (which is why tires are shaved for competition and track use), a tire will become more likely to tramline as it wears.
Wheels can influence tramlining as well. Installing wider tires or a "Plus Size" tire and wheel package usually requires using wheels with a different offset than the vehicle's original wheels. In some cases, the new wheels will have slightly less offset than the original and in other cases, slightly more. It all depends on the vehicle's suspension design and available wheelwell clearances. You will even find that Original Equipment manufacturers often use different wheel offsets for their different diameter tire and wheel packages.
Usually the amount of offset change is kept to a minimum and vehicle tracking remains relatively unchanged. However if the offset is significantly different, it will alter the way the road forces are transmitted through the tire and wheel to the suspension. Therefore, large changes in wheel offset will increase the likelihood of tramlining.
Suspension bushings, ball joints and shock absorber mounts have a direct influence on tramlining as well. As miles are driven and the years go by, the suspension's wear parts will deteriorate as they age. This often happens so slowly that it isn't very noticeable. Over time the ever-increasing suspension wear permits play that eventually allows the tire to be directed by the irregularities of the road rather than be controlled by the suspension.
Imagine a worn suspension that allows a front wheel and tire to swing between the recommended 1/16-inch of toe-in and 1/16-inch of toe-out when it encounters a rut in the road. This 1/8-inch difference in the direction that the tire is pointed will result in the vehicle tramlining. Replace the worn part to remove the play and you will significantly reduce or remove the tramlining. Many drivers with higher mileage cars have reported that replacing worn suspension components has eliminated tramlining and made the car drive like it is new again...which I guess it essentially is!
Service Adjustments

Using higher tire pressures than recommended by the vehicle manufacturer for your driving conditions will unnecessarily stiffen the tire and make it even more willing to cause tramlining. If you are running higher tire pressures than necessary, simply dropping the tire pressures to those recommended by the vehicle manufacturer will help reduce tramlining.
Alignment settings can be key as well. The "camber" and "toe" settings both play a role in vehicle stability and the propensity for tramlining. Extreme positive or negative camber settings will make a vehicle more sensitive, especially when only one wheel encounters a longitudinal rut and/or groove at a time. Even if all the tires are "aimed" straight ahead when the vehicle is in motion, a tire that is "cambered" wants to turn. This is the result of the "camber thrust" generated by a leaning tire (it is also part of the explanation of how motorcycles turn). A vehicle suspension using lots of negative camber for competition or the track will experience more tramlining on the street.
Additionally, the drivers who use additional toe-out settings to encourage their vehicle to turn into corners better also encourage tramlining because the extra toe-out will reduce vehicle stability in a straight line.
In the case of the competition driver who uses non-factory alignment settings, the amount of tramlining that is acceptable has to be left up to the driver. For only street-driven cars, getting them aligned with negative camber and toe settings within the factory's specifications is an important first step.
Roads

On a multi-lane highway, usually the left lane offers the smoothest road surface because it sees the least amount of heavy truck traffic. Unfortunately, on many interstate highways, it's not legal to continually drive there (pull right except to pass). While the center lane can be almost as smooth on a six-lane highway, there can be exceptions. For example, in the case of I-94 between Chicago and Milwaukee, you will find that when the road was widened from two to three lanes, the center of the new center lane is on top of the original junction between the earlier two lanes. This means that vehicles traveling in the new center lane have their right hand tires on the original right hand truck lane and their left side tires are on the original left lane. This can cause an uncomfortable feeling for miles. Usually the right hand lanes are the least smooth because they are rutted by heavy truck traffic. When you drive in those lanes, or drive across them to exit the highway, it's possible that you'll find your vehicle may feel like it wants to follow the truck ruts and has a mind of its own.
Driving Style

If you experience tramlining, the main thing you want to remember is to keep both hands on the steering wheel in the proper "9- and 3-o'clock" positions. This will help you make the precise steering inputs that will help keep your vehicle on course. You sacrifice precise control if you drive with one hand on the wheel or both hands in the wrong place.

hand-filer

No they wont. Skinnier tires will always track better in loose snow and slush. It's all about the physics of weight, displacement and friction.

That article is geared more towards summer conditions with performance tires. I experience that often with my Mustang on rutted roads (275/35-19 fronts).
It is less applicable in cold weather conditions where hard packed snow and ice ruts rule the day. The tires will track ruts like a bowling ball in a gutter and skinnier doesn't help much. Studded ice are the way to go.

I agree with the general consensus to go down one size in diameter and one size in width. I run ice tires and try and drive according to the road conditions.
Most will get by with ice tires in less extreme conditions.

Richmond Hill RDX

I just pick up 2016 rdx elite monday night . Dealer has a special on winter tires . Michelin x ice 2 mounted on steel rims with sensors . Installed $1425 . 17 inch rims recommend by them. Costco want $1100 just for the tires. Can tire want $1600 +extra for sensors. Local tire place want $1453
So far the dealer has best price.
I must say I am suprised by this.
I will likely go to dealer

johnrh

Congrats on the purchase, and welcome to acurazine!
That sounds like a good price ... one thing I would check is the manufacture date on the tire's sidewall ... if they are more than a year old, that may explain the great price.

Coincidentally, I just picked up a 2016 elite in July, and also live in richmond hill

YeuEmMaiMai

read what I said again, skinnier tires will wander more on pavement (on roads that have been cleared) as they tend to follow the ruts worn into the road... wider tires will not do this as much...

hand-filer

Let's not get into semantics. We're talking about going down a size in width for winter which is and has been an accepted practice for a long time. The benefits are proven.

ceb

Be careful that they are actually giving you a second set of wheels and tires - not that this is merely an "upcharge" for winter tires instead of the all-seasons

ceb

Correct. The taller sidewall will help protect the wheels from pothole damage.

emsrph

Appreciate all this winter tire discussion as I need to make this jump soon.

For buying at Tirerack, do you suggest getting them to balance and include tpms or send unmounted to a local installer?

What was concluded about the wheel locks? Will they fit a steel wheel?

Thx

hand-filer

I buy them mounted and balanced. They utilize the most up to date mounting and balancing equipment.
They also supply the matching lug nuts and centering ring (if alloy) because the replacement wheels typically have a different bore size and lug nut taper.

I have a lower tool box drawer full of locking lug nuts. They are the first items I remove after purchase. Thieves are discriminant up here. They only target fancy wheels.

dirleton

The consensus on all of these winter tire threads seems to be that 235-65R17 is the best choice for the RDX. But, with that size you are losing a bit more than 1/2 inch in overall diameter. Doesn't that violate the "maintain the diameter" rule?

ceb

Not sure how you got that calculation. If the stock size is 235/60/18, then that has an outside rolling diameter of 29.1 inches. The 235/65/17 has a rolling diameter of 29.03 inches - a difference that is virtually undetectable.

dirleton

This is what happens when I do math before coffee. Sorry. But the 235/65/17 is no reduction in tread width from OEM, which violates the "go narrower" dictum - and not a great deal of difference in tread to rim (anti-pothole) spread. Why not just stick to OEM sizing (besides cost factor)? For $1,500 I'm just trying to get this right on the first try. Thanks.

ceb

It adds a half inch of sidewall for the pothole protection. One issue is the dearth of winter tires in the appropriate sizes. 215/70/17 are available and would be the approximate proper size.

Most people don't understand how tire sizing works.

The first number 215, 235 or whatever, is the width of the contact patch in the metric system. The second number 45, 55, 65 or whatever, is the percentage of the sidewall height in relationship to the width, while the third number is the size of the wheel that the tire mounts to in inches. So we have metric, percentage and imperial sizing all in one tire.

The most confusing is probably the middle number as it isn't a measurement but a percentage.

Sculldog3

I stayed with 225/60R18, the stock size. Sort of had to since I purchased the Acura accessory rims, so the stock rims became my winter rims. However, the reality is that the roads are generally well maintained, with limited opportunities to drive through 4-5 plus inches of snow. Narrower is better to get through snow, but 90% of the time that is moot. When I have been caught on less well treated roads, speed is way down, traffic usually just creeping along, and the wider tire has been a non issue. So value of snow tires is the softer rubber that grips and handles and stops better when it's cold, so 100% of the time, and the wider contact patch is nice, and it's the size that the engineers dialed in for the vehicle. A 60 versus 70 series does given more sidewall flex, but 60 series is hardly small - it's not like running a 35 series on a sports car! so anyone in a similar spot with a second set of 18" rims, all is not lost!

rosen39

The first number is the "section width" as measured at the sidewall, not the tread contact patch. See explanation from The Tire rack:

http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tirete....jsp?techid=46

ceb

You are, of course, correct. In my attempt to simplify the explanation (what exactly does "sidewall to sidewall" mean?), I used the wrong terminology. Thanks for the clarification.

Richmond Hill RDX

Hi Guys went to the dealer and bought my winter tires today. 235/65r17 Michelin x ice 2 ,Steel rims, sensors, installed, and balanced. $1489.34 . + I have a $70.00 rebate coming from Michelin. So overall not a bad price from the Acura dealer.