coastal rider

Group - 'appreciate your help on suspension choice

I want to replace the stock struts (too soft and wallowing) and possibly springs, but not more than approx 1" lower to just refine the look and give a bit firmer ride plus improved handling. No flash, sleeper effect and discrete. I use stock 17" wheels. Also I' prefer to not have to use camber kit parts (exta cost). At last alignment I was riding at near o degrees camber on all 4 corners. I ride a curvy road frequently though have to live with rough road patches.

So, I've noticed Koni yellows (adjustable) which have an optional 20mm (~3/4") lowered perch position setting. Has anyone out here used these using OEM springs and how do they ride and handle? At ~3/4" drop how much (-) camber is added? Other strut / spring combo suggestions?

I've read through most all the earlier postings and surprised that this option was not mentioned.

Thx for your feedback.

RaviNJCLs

iTrader: (4)

Since you're not looking to go too low, I would look at the Koni Yellows with the H&R OE Sport springs. It's about a 0.75 inch drop according to the H&R website.

The tokico Illuminas are also a good choice.

With that small of a drop your camber will not really be affected. However you should get the alignment done.

fuzzy02CLS

iTrader: (2)

Why spend the $$ on Koni's & not get more of a drop?
I think you'll be happy with the Tokico blues with the H&R springs, or a used set of the old gray CT springs.
Your going to have to see what the alignment is after your done. Even with a small drop some CL's need a camber kit, & some don't.

coastal rider

Thank, RaviNJCLs. I looked at the H&R web-site and unfortunately they do not offer suspension springs for a later model CL. Eibach's ProKit spring offering gives 2" lowering in front and 1.5" in rear.

fuzzy02CLS

iTrader: (2)

The TL ones fit the CL. If you want to try the gray CT ones there's several on Ebay right now & a few for sale here in the the black market.

RaviNJCLs

iTrader: (4)

Yeh, sorry, I meant to tell you that you need to get the TL ones.

Yeh, personally I would get a lower drop, but that's just me. I think the regular H&R Sport is one of the best drops. With a nice set of shocks/struts, I think you car would look really nice and handle well.

Below is a pic of my CL when I had the H&R Sport drop with stock shocks....

coastal rider

Thanks, fuzzy02CLS and RaviNJCLs for your feedback.

When you lowered your car using either CT or H&R (1.75" front / 1.5" rear) do you recall how much your camber went negative? Also how does your vehicle ride afterwards:
- over dips and rises - does it pull down firm to the road but not jerky?
- over rough patches in the road - rough, jarring or much different from stock?
I used Tokicos on a Prelude with some definite stiffness but whoa what handling, wheels and tires stock, but I can't live with the harshness over rough roads - 75 miles round-trip to work!
How how has your dealer responded to your installs in regards to warranty coverage?

Stealth CL

those springs wont give you a harsh ride at all. im on Tokico illuminas with eibach springs, and if i set the dampening level to softest i feel that they are smoother than stock. even on medium settings, they ride really good, not to hard at all. now at hard settings, theyre rough but the handling is far superior.

i love the illuminas adjustability, in dampening, but wish i went with coilovers, for the adjustment in height too.

fuzzy02CLS

iTrader: (2)

My setup rides great. It's stiffer then stock, but not anywhere near rough. Even on bad roads. Had 2 CL's with the same suspension setup.

paulff3

I would suggest Tein High.Tech springs and Bilstein sport shocks.

RaviNJCLs

iTrader: (4)

I didn't need a camber kit with either the H&R's and the Teins. The Teins were set a little lower than the H&R's. Maybe 0.5 inch more all around.

I likes the ride setting more stiff. It would pull down on rises and dips firmly, but not jerky at all. On rough roads which we have a lot off in NJ, it was a little rougher than stock. Overall, I would still always recommend getting Teins. I like them a lot.

paulff3

The quality of Tein is very good, too. The powder coating is premium.

No camber kit or alignment needed when I had mine put in.

coastal rider

Guys,

Again thanks for your feedback. I hope this assists others who want to firm their suspension without lowering much ala the sleeper effect. After further research into what's available, taking my car to a well known good mod shop, poking on the web and talking with the spring and shock mfrs:

SPRINGS

CompTech
The old 'gray' coils (they call silver), lighter in color than the current silver 1.7"/1.5" versions. Anyways the old coils were ~.75:/.5" and they had a persistant rust problem CompTech was not able to resolve with the mfr which got them to change mfrs with the resulting lower ride height. The old ~.75"/.5" coils are no longer available.

H&R - their former OE Sport coils (~.75"/.5") are also no longer available - now only the 1.75"/1.5" drop, unless you have a '99-'01 CL for which they still carry them. The 1.75"/1.5" Sport Spring is specifically for the TL. I recall that the TL is a bit heaver than the CL (add'l door, rear pillar etc in the rear) and that's likely why a CL with the TL springs has a slight rake to it (car's back end sits a bit higher). No custom height orders (springs made in Deutschland).

Tein - 2" drop in front alone steered me away though allegedly a reputable make especially among the VW crowd.

SHOCKS / DAMPERS

Koni Yellows (adjustable) - the ability to lower the spring perch 20mm (~.8") = lowering that much. These are available for both front and back and this ride height lowering - most all other cars only have front adjustability so we are fortunate. This optional lowering does not limit the stock available spring compression travel. Yep, they are firmer than most other shocks requiring little if any tightening on the adjustment. Konis are naturally more pricey than most though from my 20+ years of experience on these applications the extra is worth it. Note that Konis last a very long time and when they fail for a moderate charge they may be rebuilt quickly in KY as opposed to replaced. With the high mileage Hondas Acuras get this is worth noting.

Bilstein - what the bimmer and Audi crowd uses are mushier ride than Konis though not available for CL's / TL's. 'Heard lots of jokes about Audi suspensions at the shop.

Tokico Illuminas (adjustable) - less cost though will not last as long as a Koni. Experience proved that with a '90 Prelude Si I had them on - a much lighter weight car at 2,700 lbs and they lasted ~60K miles. Even the stock shocks on CL's and TL's last for 100K miles+.

Feel free to add to this.

paulff3

Tein High.Tech springs will lower your car 1.25 inches all around. Your reference to a 2 inch drop for Tein is for their S.Tech springs.

coastal rider

paulff3,

Can you tell me more about these replacement Teins? Stiffness? Fixed spring rate up front; progressive in back and how compare to stock? Do you know how they compare to stock?

I like same lowering all round. Headlights have limited adjustability and mine are adjusted all the way up.

Paclark01

I have TEIN Htechs on my CL, and i think they are great. The drop is an even 1.25 all the way around. I didn't need a camber kit.

If you are looking for a raked look, then TEIN Htech are not the way to go. Go with the H&R Sports to drop the front a bit more than the rear.

paulff3

I have them on my car, too. They are awesome. The ride is slightly firmer than stock. If you want technical information call Tein directly. I talked to them several times before and after buying them.

Isn't this all a little premature? I see by your signature that you are only 6 years old.

A member use to have some nice pictures of his CLS with Tein High.Techs next to a train. I looked but could not find them. I think HellaShookOne took the pictures. But I could be off.

coastal rider

Hey, Guys,

Referring back to your earlier replies (thanks) on springs. Life gets busy and I'm back. A reminder - looking for a non-rake ~1 inch lower stance with firmer ride.

Man was I was surprised today when I called CompTech on springs. Their front rate is 260 lbs/in. The tech guy informed me that the type-S OEM rate is 255 lbs/in (only 5 lbs dif!). The limited travel with lowered springs must induce some anti-sway improving handling because the rates are nearly identical. And the Tein H-Techs on their web-site are 270 lbs/in. Go figure. Does anyone else have OEM spring rate info?

In that call I also learned that only the rear anti-sway bar is substantially different from OEM (22mm solid vs 19mm solid) - $129 for a rear bar rather than $329 for front and rear. All the Hondas I've had break the rear loose easily so this makes sense.

belcom

iTrader: (1)

this is H&R Sport and Tokico Illumina setup. It drives quite nicely, similar to stock on medium settings but much less body roll and much better response. Oh and I don't really detect much rake with H&R that everyone is talking about.

coastal rider

OK guys, thanks for your feedback to date. I ordered Koni Yellows and Tein H-Techs. The H-Techs offer only a 1.2" drop with 0 rake but that's what I want to get rid of the 4x4 look but not too obvious. As with the CompTechs they're only ~15 lbs/in higher rate than stock type S, 270 to be exact.

When replacing the rear struts what parts do you need to remove from the interior? It looks obvious the rear shock can only be adjusted with the rear parcel tray out so after all is buttoned up what do you have to remove to do the rear adjustment? Let the fun begin.

So the next obvious question surrounds anti-sway bars. Hondas are known for built-in oversteer so the rear bar has got to be increased. 3 Qs:

1) Has anyone increased just the rear bar size? My past experience has shown that increasing bar size, especially up front, reduces independent suspension movement and makes ride harsher (even with all rubber bushings) so I'm thinkig rear only (stock is only 15mm). And whose did you use? I definitely want to keep with rubber bushings for noise isolation.

2) I'm thinking of doing bars after the struts / springs to experience that combo alone but don't want to pay for another alignment. When replacing the rear bar is alignment affected (wouldn't think so)? What about with the front bar?

3) Does either bar replacement require anything else to removed aside from the OEM bar and brackets?

My apology for all the text but need to paint the pic I'm dealing with.

coastal rider

OK guys, thanks for your feedback to date. I ordered Koni Yellows and Tein H-Techs. The H-Techs offer only a 1.2" drop with 0 rake but that's what I want to get rid of the 4x4 look but not too obvious.

When replacing the rear struts what parts do you need to remove from the interior? It looks obvious the rear shock can only be adjusted with the rear parcel tray out so after all is buttoned up what do you have to remove to do the rear adjustment? Let the fun begin.

So the next obvious question surrounds anti-sway bars. Hondas are known for built-in oversteer so the rear bar has got to be increased. 3 Qs:

1) Has anyone increased just the rear bar size? My past experience has shown that increasing bar size, especially up front, reduces independent suspension movement and makes ride harsher (even with all rubber bushings) so I'm thinkig rear only (stock is only 15mm). And whose did you use? I definitely want to keep with rubber bushings for noise isolation.

2) I'm thinking of doing bars after the struts / springs to experience that combo alone but don't want to pay for another alignment. When replacing the rear bar is alignment affected (wouldn't think so)? What about with the front bar?

3) Does either bar replacement require anything else to removed aside from the OEM bar and brackets?

My apology for all the text but need to paint the pic I'm dealing with.

fuzzy02CLS

iTrader: (2)

Search around many posts on sways. I have CT's front & rear.