Serious help needed!
#282
Burning Brakes
Thread Starter
#283
Moderator
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The J35 with 11:1 compression is the J35A8. The J32A2 is 10.5:1 & the J35A3 is 10:1.
2002 Acura MDX -- Powertrain -- Part 1 - Honda News
2002 Acura MDX -- Powertrain -- Part 1 - Honda News
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gnuts (02-19-2017)
#284
Suzuka Master
iTrader: (1)
^
Give that man a Cigar!
With the j32a2 cams and heads, that improves things even more?
Give that man a Cigar!
With the j32a2 cams and heads, that improves things even more?
Last edited by zeta; 02-18-2017 at 10:13 AM.
#286
Burning Brakes
Thread Starter
I don't know how I missed this but look at the piece missing from the piston. You can see the ring. Lol it looks nice and smooth which means the Piston melted, definitely detonation
#287
Suzuka Master
iTrader: (1)
^
2ndgentl, that's why I was inquiring about the #5 cylinder and the 'narrow pattern' your fuel injector guy wrote on his report above before he serviced them. Maybe #5 cylinder/piston was already on the way out before you installed the SC'er and the extra boost, with the blower, just exacerbated an already unknown existing problem at the time. If those are the original13+year old stock injectors, then who knows how long #5 injector was malfunctioning, before servicing, and contributed to your mishap now.
2ndgentl, that's why I was inquiring about the #5 cylinder and the 'narrow pattern' your fuel injector guy wrote on his report above before he serviced them. Maybe #5 cylinder/piston was already on the way out before you installed the SC'er and the extra boost, with the blower, just exacerbated an already unknown existing problem at the time. If those are the original13+year old stock injectors, then who knows how long #5 injector was malfunctioning, before servicing, and contributed to your mishap now.
Last edited by zeta; 02-19-2017 at 12:13 PM.
#288
Suzuka Master
iTrader: (1)
LOL, on second thought, I take that back. Because there is no way to positively know the #5 injector listed on his report, with the 'narrow pattern', was the #5 injector that fed the #5 piston cylinder before servicing. Unless you labeled them with a number before removing the injectors for servicing. Oh well, it got the critical thinking skills 'a flowing' anyway, hehe.
Last edited by zeta; 02-19-2017 at 12:54 PM.
#289
Burning Brakes
Thread Starter
LOL, on second thought, I take that back. Because there is no way to positively know the #5 injector listed on his report, with the 'narrow pattern', was the #5 injector that fed the #5 piston cylinder before servicing. Unless you labeled them with a number before removing the injectors for servicing. Oh well, it got the critical thinking skills 'a flowing' anyway, hehe.
#290
Suzuka Master
iTrader: (1)
Lol, yeah I didn't label them when I pulled them but I did do a compression check on my motor about 6 months ago and they were all at 230 psi. So, I know the S\C had everything to do with this, but it is kind of weird that only 1 piston got burnt. The other cylinder to the left is the one that had 70 psi, but I don't see any physical damage on the piston, cylinder, or valves.
Do you think it could all happen so fast, and all at once, on the night you went WOT in 4th gear? It's apparent something happened that night; however, it just seems to be such a broad erosion that occurred, one would think it may have happened over a period of time, perhaps. Maybe one of the other forum members with more knowledge can chime in on what they think.
So, which way are you leaning for an engine choice? j32a2 or j35a3. Maybe your friend with the car lots can locate a cheaper low mileage j35a3 with his connections at LKQ to capitalize on that 120 day warranty?
Last edited by zeta; 02-19-2017 at 07:25 PM.
#292
3.5 psi
iTrader: (1)
I was thinking about your plugs and looked up the info on them. You're using NGK IFR7G 11KS. They have a heat range of 7 and the comptech instructions call for Denso IK22 which have a heat range of 22. For NGK and Denso, the higher the number the colder the plug. Maybe this played a part?
#294
Suzuka Master
iTrader: (1)
That's a good attempt/point though gnuts! I had to walk back my postulation in post #287.
The large size of that missing part of piston area is impressive though. Some heavy, higher than normal temperature activity going on in that vicinity, for sure.
I would of thought that there would of been codes thrown as well; however, 2ndgentl stated that there were none.
The large size of that missing part of piston area is impressive though. Some heavy, higher than normal temperature activity going on in that vicinity, for sure.
I would of thought that there would of been codes thrown as well; however, 2ndgentl stated that there were none.
Last edited by zeta; 02-20-2017 at 11:00 AM.
#295
Burning Brakes
Thread Starter
The CE light never came on, and it might be too late to plug in my obd2 scanner now that every plug\sensor is off. Lol The next engine I get will most likely ask for the core, but if not I'll end up keeping the blown engine and rebuilding it. I'll let you guys know as soon as I get the other engine.
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zeta (02-20-2017)
#296
Burning Brakes
Thread Starter
Now im torn between a j32a2 and a j35a3. On the j35a3 does anyone know what is needed for the swap? Perhaps just an ECU? Harness? Also, I would think it's still tunable on the AEM EMS Stand alone. There are just sooo many more j35a3's out there. Cheaper too..
#297
Suzuka Master
iTrader: (1)
1) J32 timing gear, if it is newer than the salvage yard J35's, pulley side crank sensor & bracket.
2) J32 front cam gear, backing plate & sensors/harness.
3) Plumbing isle heater hose with connector and clamps.
4) If you want a J35A3 CL Type-S, swap over the J32A2 cams into the J35A3 heads.
Use the existing J32A2 ECU/harness'
Yes, because you are still using the original 6-speed ECU.
Indeed.
Keep in mind that the effect of the M62 SC'er's produced psi, if I understand correctly, will have a smaller boost result because of the higher displacement of the J35, though you pick-up more low end torque. If you put a smaller SC'er shaft pulley on to get it to spin faster/increase psi, that will only work up to a certain extent. The result will be more heat generation as you approach the ceiling of the M62 operational limits. However, as you know, with professional tuning on a standalone, it will still be possible to extract every last bit of available HP for you to use safely.
^
*If any of the above is in error, please someone clarify, correct, and/or expand upon for accuracy's sake.
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teh CL (02-22-2017)
#298
Suzuka Master
iTrader: (1)
To expand upon 3) above. This is an improvised heater hose connection/fix because the 01-02 MDX J35 Connecting Pipe; #11 and Water Passage; #8 are different then the same parts on the 02-03 CL-S J32. It appears the J35 MDX Connecting Pipe is missing a tube and the Water Passage is missing an outlet at the rear compared to the same parts on the CL-S J32:
MDX:
https://www.acuraoemparts.com/auto-p...-sensor-1-scat
a
CL-S:
https://www.acuraoemparts.com/auto-p...mp-sensor-scat
a
MDX:
https://www.acuraoemparts.com/auto-p...-sensor-1-scat
a
CL-S:
https://www.acuraoemparts.com/auto-p...mp-sensor-scat
a
#299
Burning Brakes
Thread Starter
Would the j35 out if an 07 Saturn Vue be the same as the j35 01-02 MDX? The reason I ask is because if I find a j35 out of an 07 Saturn it will have a lot less miles. And I already found some in the 60k range for under $450
#300
Suzuka Master
iTrader: (1)
^
Excellent question. One would think IF it is the same engine you would be 'good to go'; however, I don't think anyone on here has done that, so, I don't know.
'The VUE Red Line was released in 2004. V6 models received Honda's J35A3 engine and Honda transmission. This 3.5 liter engine and 5 speed transmission boosted performance over the prior V-6. It was an important selling point at the time. This V-6 engine was used in the Saturn VUE's 2004 to 2007 model years.' (Wiki)
BTW, if you found a low miles J32A2 from an automatic 02-03 CL-S/TL-S the above swap parts should still apply.
Excellent question. One would think IF it is the same engine you would be 'good to go'; however, I don't think anyone on here has done that, so, I don't know.
'The VUE Red Line was released in 2004. V6 models received Honda's J35A3 engine and Honda transmission. This 3.5 liter engine and 5 speed transmission boosted performance over the prior V-6. It was an important selling point at the time. This V-6 engine was used in the Saturn VUE's 2004 to 2007 model years.' (Wiki)
BTW, if you found a low miles J32A2 from an automatic 02-03 CL-S/TL-S the above swap parts should still apply.
Last edited by zeta; 02-22-2017 at 08:40 AM.
#301
Suzuka Master
iTrader: (1)
Doing a quick google search, I could not find as many different pictures of the J35A3 used in the Vue to get a good comparison to the J35A3 used in the MDX. If I had to guess, the only thing that may be different would, perhaps, be the electrical harness connections. However, it is possible that GM used the Honda connections because the engines were built by Honda.
#302
Burning Brakes
Thread Starter
My next door neighbor has a 2007 Saturn Vue V6 and the engine is a j35a3, although it looks the same as an MDX engine, I'm not sure if the wiring and the ecu would be the same. It should be, but I'm not for sure I'll do some more research
#303
Moderator
iTrader: (1)
From what I'm reading the motors are the same. For some reason though, I remember reading that the Vue's J35 didn't receive the factory forged crank that the MDX has but I can't find the info since I saved it a few years ago..
It's your call whether you want to go with the Vue motor.
As for converting the J35A3 to a 6 speed motor, what Zeta posted above is EXACTLY what needs to be done. My thread is linked earlier in this thread & has detailed pics of what needs to be done.
PS: J35A3 > *
It's your call whether you want to go with the Vue motor.
As for converting the J35A3 to a 6 speed motor, what Zeta posted above is EXACTLY what needs to be done. My thread is linked earlier in this thread & has detailed pics of what needs to be done.
PS: J35A3 > *
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zeta (02-22-2017)
#304
Suzuka Master
iTrader: (1)
http://www.saturnfans.com/forums/sho...d.php?t=137718
#305
Burning Brakes
Thread Starter
Picked up a J32a2 6-speed motor today 67k $800. Did a compression test on it when I got home: 240 psi on all cylinders. I bought it from Allen's Auto Parts in Tampa. When I got there they told me it would be about 30 minutes to pull the engine out from the Shelf. After waiting for over an hour, they said they pulled it, drained all the oil, and took the oil pan off to inspect the crank\bearings\rods ect. So they told me to come to the back and look at it before I buy it to see how good everything looks. I walk back there and hanging from the forklift was a V12 Mercedes engine. They pulled and inspected the wrong engine....:\ Completely wrong! Waited over an hour for nothing! They apologized and finally pulled out the right engine 20 minutes later. Now thinking about it I should have taken the V12 Mercedes engine instead for $800. I would have found a way to stuff it in my car.
#306
Burning Brakes
Thread Starter
Also, does anyone know anything about the AEM FIC? They make a harness that works for my engine to tune it. And actually, now that I just found out, that Accord was tuned with the AEM FIC. And that is why his engine ran and mine blew up. With the AEM FIC you can deliver accurate amounts of fuel to the injectors and also retard your timing.
#308
Suzuka Master
iTrader: (1)
Wow, there is plenty of cargo room in the Element.
2ndgentl, just curiuos, how do they verify to you, on-site, that the engine has the miles advertised on car-part.com? Needless to say, you got one of the two best/nearby CL-S 6 engines still available in the southeast.
.
#309
Burning Brakes
Thread Starter
Hahahaha! Trust me, when they pulled out the j32a2 engine I inspected the whole damn thing with a fine toothed comb. There wasn't a single oil drop\mark on the whole engine. Very clean. I'm just dreading the work now...
#310
Burning Brakes
Thread Starter
Nice pick-up!
Wow, there is plenty of cargo room in the Element.
2ndgentl, just curiuos, how do they verify to you, on-site, that the engine has the miles advertised on car-part.com? Needless to say, you got one of the two best/nearby CL-S 6 engines still available in the southeast.
.
Wow, there is plenty of cargo room in the Element.
2ndgentl, just curiuos, how do they verify to you, on-site, that the engine has the miles advertised on car-part.com? Needless to say, you got one of the two best/nearby CL-S 6 engines still available in the southeast.
.
#311
Suzuka Master
iTrader: (1)
Also, does anyone know anything about the AEM FIC? They make a harness that works for my engine to tune it. And actually, now that I just found out, that Accord was tuned with the AEM FIC. And that is why his engine ran and mine blew up. With the AEM FIC you can deliver accurate amounts of fuel to the injectors and also retard your timing.
BF12085 - Boomslang Plug n Play Harness - AEM F/IC - Dezod Motorsports Inc - Home of the automotive performance enthusiast since 2002.
#313
Burning Brakes
Thread Starter
Nice. I figured they would have something, just did not know what/how they would verify. So, what made you go for the CL-S 6 engine over the J35A3? Was it the combination of one being available locally and 'plug n play' versus the availability of a comparable J35 with the same miles? I observed your old core J32 in the pictures above. Will that turn into a 'rebuild' project when all the dust settles and you are back on the road?
Sorry, don't know anything about the AEM FIC. Is the harness you are talking about like the one below:
BF12085 - Boomslang Plug n Play Harness - AEM F/IC - Dezod Motorsports Inc - Home of the automotive performance enthusiast since 2002.
Sorry, don't know anything about the AEM FIC. Is the harness you are talking about like the one below:
BF12085 - Boomslang Plug n Play Harness - AEM F/IC - Dezod Motorsports Inc - Home of the automotive performance enthusiast since 2002.
#314
Burning Brakes
Thread Starter
Yes, that plug n' play harness is for the j32a2 engine. I talked to the owner of RPM Systems in N.Y. and all he does is j swaps. Don is his name, and he seems to be the "rainman" for j series engines. I will talk to him more about that AEM FIC he recommends me getting this week
#315
Suzuka Master
iTrader: (1)
They still want the core ( I had to pay an extra $200 until I give them my core ), but I'm thinking maybe sell it piece by piece and I'll get more than $200 at the end for it. It's just that I hate keeping it in the garage because it will just take up space until I sell it all piece by piece. As far as rebuilding it, I don't have the time so I know it would be sitting in the garage collecting dust. But I know how hard these motors are to come by. And a built one would always be good to have on the side for a project
By chance, did the 'accident report' they showed you to verify miles happen to have a date written on it? If so, than that would help determine how long the engine sat either in the car or on the shelf.
#317
Suzuka Master
iTrader: (1)
Yes, that plug n' play harness is for the j32a2 engine. I talked to the owner of RPM Systems in N.Y. and all he does is j swaps. Don is his name, and he seems to be the "rainman" for j series engines. I will talk to him more about that AEM FIC he recommends me getting this week
Ok, I need to find some info out, looks like I don't know whyat tuner to believe. I had one guy from RPM systems who was supposed to be really good and familliar with the j32 tune my car. long story short, the belt was slipping and he tuned it with a mechanically incorrect boost level reading of 4.5 lbs instead of 6.
So I took the car to T & R racing, a place in queens who seem like they know their shit, they fixed the belt, installed the pulley, even changed the alternator belt and pulled the blower then put it back with no problem. nice people and gave me confidence. They dynoed the car and tuned it with the FIC to put down 280 hp at the wheels. Everything was great. Drove the car and it was much faster, I was on cloud nine for a day.
Next day I threw a CEL and the wideband numbers were all over the place. I thought I heard a little detonation too. Almost liek the car's tune completely went haywire on it's own. So I asked RPM Systems about the ESM that was in the car from before his tune and he said he left it in there with the FIC. I was confused why he would do that, really confused since there are two systems in the car, the ESM and the FIC-6. How could this be and is this what was causing the second tune by T & R racing to go haywire the next day?
So I took the car to T & R racing, a place in queens who seem like they know their shit, they fixed the belt, installed the pulley, even changed the alternator belt and pulled the blower then put it back with no problem. nice people and gave me confidence. They dynoed the car and tuned it with the FIC to put down 280 hp at the wheels. Everything was great. Drove the car and it was much faster, I was on cloud nine for a day.
Next day I threw a CEL and the wideband numbers were all over the place. I thought I heard a little detonation too. Almost liek the car's tune completely went haywire on it's own. So I asked RPM Systems about the ESM that was in the car from before his tune and he said he left it in there with the FIC. I was confused why he would do that, really confused since there are two systems in the car, the ESM and the FIC-6. How could this be and is this what was causing the second tune by T & R racing to go haywire the next day?
Had the AEM FIC-6 to tne the 6 lbs of boost, ended up tuning it to the dyno graph shown below at 300hp top the wheels, car was fucking faster than ever. only thing was that after 3 days or 1 drive cycle, the O2 numbers were all whacky and the cars own ECU retuned everything and messed it all up. So we couldn't figure out how to tune the J32 ECU and ended up just adjusting the FPR and monitoring the wideband numbers which to this day have been perfect and steady.
Last edited by zeta; 02-26-2017 at 10:23 AM.
#318
Burning Brakes
Thread Starter
2ndgentl, be careful and do your due diligence. IIRC, RPM Systems in N.Y. was one of the tuners that rondog used when he had his blown CL tuned back in 2010-2011 with the AEM FIC. They (RPM Systems) may have worked out the bugs since it has been 6+ years so just be aware.
https://acurazine.com/forums/second-...st-fic-774963/
https://acurazine.com/forums/2g-cl-d...wheels-806492/
https://acurazine.com/forums/second-...st-fic-774963/
https://acurazine.com/forums/2g-cl-d...wheels-806492/
#319
Suzuka Master
iTrader: (1)
Hey guys, the build is looking good so far! Just be careful not to go too far trying to get power from the CL, you might end up doing something you will regret. Keep her at 3 lbs of boost and dos NOT try to tune the J32 with AEM FIC or anything else. Ive never met anyone who could pull it off. I blew my motor trying to get 6 lbs of boost, 2 of my cylinders ceased, no compression.
You may be balking at the expense for going to the standalone from Dezod with tuning from Kings, which is understandable. Tuning and its related equipment/dyno time is not cheap. However, if Don is saying this 'piggyback' can do the job, then why not ask Sergio if he can corroborate said information on your quest to save a few bucks? Get what I'm saying?
#320
Burning Brakes
Thread Starter
Here is his post from your thread; #152; pg. 4:
All I'm saying is, if you talk to this 'Don' at RPM Systems, ask your questions, get his answers, then get a 'second opinion' from Sergio at Kings Performance in regards to considering an AEM-FIC as YOUR tuning solution.
You may be balking at the expense for going to the standalone from Dezod with tuning from Kings, which is understandable. Tuning and its related equipment/dyno time is not cheap. However, if Don is saying this 'piggyback' can do the job, then why not ask Sergio if he can corroborate said information on your quest to save a few bucks? Get what I'm saying?
All I'm saying is, if you talk to this 'Don' at RPM Systems, ask your questions, get his answers, then get a 'second opinion' from Sergio at Kings Performance in regards to considering an AEM-FIC as YOUR tuning solution.
You may be balking at the expense for going to the standalone from Dezod with tuning from Kings, which is understandable. Tuning and its related equipment/dyno time is not cheap. However, if Don is saying this 'piggyback' can do the job, then why not ask Sergio if he can corroborate said information on your quest to save a few bucks? Get what I'm saying?
Last edited by 2ndgentl; 02-26-2017 at 12:19 PM.