3.2cl-s

I currently pay $560 a month on a 39 month lease for my cl and my residual is $15300 which is up February '05. I really want to have low payments when my lease is up, like around $200-$300 a month, so my options can be to buy my car and put like $1500 down and my payments can be in that range, or give back the car and buy something else around 15k - 17k.

I like my car, and yes i know buying a leased car at the end of the term will mean that i paid like 50k for the cl, but there isn't anything else that will be as nice as the Cl for 15k...........what would you do?

Shawn S

That car will probably only be worth about 10,000 dollars in Feb of 2005.
Why would you pay 15,300 for it?

chef chris

You will not be happy with a $15-17K car. I'd say set your sights a bit higher payment-wise...maybe $400...and you can lease again.

I've been in your position & always end up back in the higher-end car...Just can't go back once you have all the goodies...

mushutofu

You can never down grade

NSXNEXT

iTrader: (2)

Is the residual negotiable?
Is it based on current fair market value?

Since the CL has been discontinued, there has got be some kind of negotiation on the buyout.

zamo

There is no negotiation in the residual because it is what the bank states the car is worth at the end of the term.

If the residual is negotiated (for less), then his payments will be higher.

Pure Adrenaline

iTrader: (2)

HOLY HELL!! How in God's name did you end up with such a high payment for a 39-month lease?

Even if you didn't make any downpayments, you're still paying 21,840 over the course of 39 months. Considering the CL is expected to have 52% residual value after 5 years, you got RAPED.

Might as well buy it out, but make sure you negotiate well on the buy-out price.


FYI, I pay 353.99/month for 42-month lease, with 2,000 down. That's 4612.42 LESS than you, AND I get to keep my car longer.

zamo

You don't wanna have a lease buyout of the CL unless you really want to keep it long time.

In my opinion, in order to get low lease payments, you should consider a high residual model (eg. Mercedes C class, BMW 3 series, Acura TL), BUT getting one of those used.

So for instance, with a 3 year old BMW 325i (30k MSRP loaded - new), the price at that point might be around 24k. A 3 year lease with an estimated residual of 15k, will give you a aprox. of 9k of depreciation (in 3 years). That is translated to an aprox. 250/month + tax.

I am just giving an example. There is no way you can get a new car with 0 down and so low payments, unless its a 60-month lease of an 20k or less car (which i will never recommend).

BTW, never pay down payment for a lease. ITs a rent !!!

zamo

52% after 5 years is on the CL. Even 50% was considered after 4 years in the book when I got mine. Its a number calculated by the lease lienholder. The CL was dropping residual big time (because of the discounted price of the car).

chef chris

You guys are talking about lease numbers as if they were a straight buy. That is not the case, too many variables...

1) Lease residuals can be adjusted at purchase by adjusting the money factor(interest rate). Sounds like he got pounded on rate basically. Also, there are incentives & markups built into the lease figure, just like if you paid outright for the car, Holdback figures(buy downs), etc. *Note...banks usually use ALG to determine residuals & won't adjust them, but manufacturers captive financing will all day long, as they have less to lose.

2) Never lease a used car. Interest paid will be super-duper high. As far as money down goes...if it's a new car with a high residual, you may be able to get away with it(Audi for example...Big time high residual, even the A4), but it's usually good to pay your fees like tax & tags atleast.

3) Never-Ever lease past 36/39 months. Always check rates/payments on both terms...MAYBE 42 months if it's a high-dollar unit. Always ask the sales rep for the interest rate...if they give you money-factor mumbo-jumbo...tell them to convert it or go somewhere that will. Sometimes(and dealers don't usually volunteer this info) there are special residuals/interest rates on certain terms...so you have to be open-minded & ask for a few diff terms. But usually, your best bet is between 36-39 month lease.

My 02 was $415/month...rate was about 3.33%, 39 months also. Residual is $16,400. I put like $1,500 down with no trade...there are a bunch of variables to consider, as can be seen from just my numbers here.

3.2cl-s

O, i forgot to mention that i was upside down $4k on my trade-in because my GTS had a blown engine, thats why my price was so high.................and there is no way the cl will only be worth 10k in 1 year.

Pure Adrenaline

iTrader: (2)

chris --

Money factor and residual value are NOT negotiable. I made sure of this when I got my car.

I got my 42-month lease because it was an awesome deal. I only paid a couple of hundred bucks more altogether for 3 extra months, and only like 500 more altogether for extra 6 months, on top of 36 months.

chef chris

Let me guess, the dealer told you this? Whoever told you they don't adjust them lied through their teeth. They won't readily admit that information. It is essentially no different than the buy-rate on a retail purchase...or...the rate offered to the dealership from their bank/captive financing(Nissan/Honda/GMAC).

For instance: I sell our money to dealers at 3% for a new auto contract, they can in turn charge the customer up to 3% or more based on their credit score or 'tier'...or...they can "give the rate away" at cost & just make money on the car. 3% is our banks policy, some sub-prime finance/lease comanies have more liberal rate structures(10% or whatever, etc).

My Acura dealer changed the money factor to eliminate the security deposit charge...on an American Honda Lease...so, it can be done. Maybe your dealer chooses not to, etc.

Shawn S

I hate to say it, but someone here just traded one in a few days ago and got 12K.
The few new 6-Speeds left on the lots are selling in the 25-26 range and used ones are going for the low 20’s.

The CL is discontinued and your car will be 5-years old next February and I still say it will be worth only in the 9-11 range.
Especially if it’s close to the 100K “no Tranny warranty” age.

I hope you’re right, but I bet I am.
I really don’t care myself because my car will be run into the ground before I sell, but you’ve got to be realistic about it.

Shawn S

dallison

you would hate the car you were in compared with the cl

zamo

Thats why they are offering horrible lease plans for the remaining CLs lately. I got mine with a pretty good deal on Jan 2003, but I believe on Feb and March 2003 they got even better deals (if negotiated appropiately). After that, with the notice of the CL being discontinued, dealers wanted all CLs to be sold (rather than leased). I remember something like $319 for CL Type S with 7 grand down x 48 months.

Crazy !!

Chaptorial

Buy out the CL in the end.

Chopsie

, if you don't get rid of it before hand.

Pure Adrenaline

iTrader: (2)

Don't remember where, but when I was doing research before getting the car, I remember reading somewhere that it was set by the company and isn't negotiable. I negotiated on everything else, though. The other dealership (45 minutes away, closest one) didn't even bother trying to match the price, so I guess it was pretty good.

If the money factor really is negotiable, though, then I feel cheated. That sucks. I know APR in a purchase depends on your credit. But what is the money factor based upon? And what can you use as tools to bring it down?

Shawn S

Couldn’t you turn the car back after the lease is up and then repurchase from the dealer at an agreed-upon price that’s lower then the 15,200 number.

He might agree to do it so he doesn’t have to put the car back on the used car lot.

Shawn S

EricL

Shawn:

I'd really wonder about:

What kind of shape the car was in? (driven hard, easy)

Any dings, scratches, etc? (is it perfect, good, fair)

Is the paint perfect? (wax-maniac, Zaino-manaic, or left to rot in the sun and scrubbed with Brillo pads)

What's the mileage? (Garage Queen, 10K, 20K, 30K, 100K?)

Does it have Navi?


The prices seem to vary a lot depending on mileage and condition. If the car had very, very low miles and looked brand new, 15K might not be that bad.


I look in the local paper and ads. Depending on mileage, condition, and other factors, the asking (NOT TRADE-IN) price of '01/'02 CL Type-S NAVI can go from: 12K to 22K...

chef chris

Yeah, I had 2 dealers do the same thing...one wanted to deal, one didn't budge. My 03 was dealer-traded from the one that wouldn't budge...HA!!! Now, they do all the service, but didn't make shiit on the car.

Anyhow, money factor can be tied to credit score...but most lease companies won't even let you lease unless you're a good risk off the bat...so there's room to negotiate. Basically, you just have to ask a lot of questions & act like you know what you're talking about with the dealer

3.2cl-s

I dont really plan on leasing my next car, only because there is really no way to get my payments under $300 with a lease (im trying to pay off my bills, settle in my career and then buy a nice car).

My car right now has 30k miles and probably 45k next february.

So the final verdict is that you can NOT negotiate the buy out price?

thholr

okay , first off I do believe 100% that you can negotiate the terms for buying the car afterwards. It is the same thing as buying a used car because in essence that is what you are doing. You have the right to offer them whatever you like, and negotiate with them. I helped a friend do this on a yukon he leased for 2 years and then bought. They wanted 19,700 to buy it out and we ended up settling for around 17000, because that is what I could buy one the same age and options for elsewhere . They will tell you then cant budge, but what will they do if they dont sell it to you , they will put it on their used car lot . So they would much rather just sell it . If they dont negotiate then go find another used cl and save yourself about 4 grand since by next year it will only be worth about 10 maybe 11 at best.

chef chris

Bottom Line:

Negotiation is not something that a dealer has/doesn't have to do.

That being said, American Honda has a nasty habit of NOT negotiating lease-end buy-outs...BUT...if you have a good relationship with your dealer...like a family history with them...then maybe they will help you out.

Another factor is if the car has had 'lead brick' depreciation...which, contrary to popular belief, the CL has not. For instance, if you were lucky enough to buy one of those Isuzu/Acura SUV's...you'd be in the negotiating strong-seat...because they didn't hold value for SQUAT. BUT this is a RARE occurence with Acura products.

IT IS NOT like buying a used car, because the dealer has to "technically" buy the car from Honda to sell to you...so, someone somewhere has to take the hit for any built-up depreciation. Your remedy to that is to just walk away & buy a niced used one privately.

So, it's hard to guess what you're going to encounter...a full year ahead of schedule...Cl prices could hold steady, increase or drop to the floor(doubt it, but it could always happen).

King of the Road

I absolutely, totally against you buying the car on your own when your lease is up, unless you are with someone really knowledgeble The reason is simple:you really got shafted on your lease term, what makes you think you can negotiate better when buying? Plus the dealer already knew you were an easy one so they won't give in easily. No flame intended, just a suggestion. I suggest that you walk away from it after the lease is up and treat it as a learning lesson, and lease another car now that you have learned a lot from other members' input in this thread

chef chris

Good point King...

Maybe it's time to change dealers & be a tought guy/play hardball, etc.

Wouldn't hurt, right?

GEB

It's a little early to worry about this, isn't it? You've got another year to go ... I mean, it is Jan of 2004, isn't it? Enjoy your car for now and worry about the buy out later.

If your thinking about getting rid of it now, that's a different question!

3.2cl-s

How did i get shafted? My trade in had a blown engine that toyota would not warranty out so i was upside down $4k on my trade in.

Since buying this car I have already learned a lot from before and I have taken a couple of finance classes along with a financial calculator, so i know exactly how much my lease payment should be.