Ok Cl members.

We are one of the biggest body kit in canada.. but we offer customer service like any other in north america.... we visit group, forum, and we ask the customer what they want... We are not just a business.... we are alive and parts of your interet... im even so close I can barely sit in your car beside you

As you know we want to design this kit.... we are very active in all forum and directly with customer... But they need to understand how much it cost for each of you to arrive with a final product

First... our expense, from scratch, a full kit like this is approx $4000 Us. And no kit is made.. but only the mold!

The staff is paid, material used is paid.... but no money have been seen yet.... and we took 1 month to design this!... an $4000 expense with no gain!

Big company like wingwest can take designers and produce that kit... they make millions...! We are growing, but we CANNOT afford that type of expense.... its there where customer help us...


We have 2 way now to work....


1:

Like I asked you before, we can take deposit for less than half of the cost... I ask 10 customer who want that kit, to give us a deposit of $100, and we will invest the rest and go on this project.... the total gain would be $1000 and thats enough for us to help to support the cost of the mold.... each kit kit after will be sold between $799 to $899, we need to verify.

each deposit will be written on acura-cl.com and on our website, onderground-design.com in the main page. I will post here everyday, new picture of the kit.. all the progress and you should have your kit within 8-10 weeks



OPTION 2:

We take a Cl from a donor car.... we MAKE the kit... we INSTALL and we PAINT !..... all we ask is $1995 Us, witch cover the price of 1 kit.... install and paint... and it give us enough money to invest the rest to make the mold....

SO if there is ONE CUSTOMER HERE who want the sema body kit... the exactly replica.... the same quality, the oem fitement, please let me know.... we can start this project after christmas.

the kit will be sold for 799 to 899 after... , I need a donor car for 4 weeks maximum here.....

we are located in montreal, canada..... 6 hours north from N-Y

-------------

So those were the news....

thanks you... heres many way to reach us

email: sales@onderground-design.com
phone: 514-773-7783
ICQ: 5209886
MSN: onderground-design@hotmail.com
and on the onderground-design forum

 

Ah... I may visit you once in Montreal... I am from Brossard but now I live iin NH.

I can take my Sony DSC-F707 and make a tour of your shop and post a detailed tour on the site

 

Hey I tought there was SEMA enthousiast here ?????

You want that kit yes or no!!?? Make some effort and you could even put a reply

Im trying the best of I can to produce it for you!

 

I would if my car was in Canada, I am in Oregon

 

i'm will to put down $100 if it helps

 

i live in southern california if you can give me an idea of how to do this i am ready

 

onderground,

I'm sure a lot of would love to have that body kit. But people may need more then 4 hours to make decisions.

I'm not trying to flame you or anything. Just give it some time. I for one would like to see pics of how far you are.

 

I don't have the funds to be one of the inital investors... but I would definitely consider paying something under $1000 once you guys are making them.

Keep us posted.

 

Yea, wait till tomorrow. I'm on the east coast and I read this at 11pm, when most people should be sleeping instead of forum-going

 

which sema show kit are we planning on doing, the 1st one or the 2nd one? I personally would like rounded holes for the exhaust in the back, no squarish

Also, would these kits be painted our color for that price or no? If so, how much does it run to paint it, such as Aegean Blue or Silver. My father and I are interested in getting this for our cars.

Keep up the good work. Thanks again

Nick

 

ok, me and my several friends here in houston, TX are ready for the kit.... we have 3 CLs here, and we all are interested in getting the kit once its available.... and putting down is not really a problem, as long as we have backup if the project didnt go thru....

BTW, onderground.... this is my little comment... I appericate ur efforts to make this happen, it really will make a revolution of our cars..... BUT, seriously, thats not a good idea of a good business stragies...... cuz all the business were all started with risk, and chances taking..... to be honest with you, invest $4000 is really nothing in business world.... you have to take ur risk to make profit.... plus, if you were us, how can you trust a company without too much foundation to give them deposit.... good thing was, we were talking about $100, but when was the last time that you have to pay deposit first before the product came out.... cars? how often you dont get ur money back when you dont want it...... Wingswest, when they first started, they had thousands of kits just sat there for years without people buying it, but they believe as long as they keep trying, one day they will make into the mainstream.... which they did..... onderground, we in houston really hope this kit will come truth, and really, its hard to expect much without investing in risk, cuz you cant garantee same return.......

 

 

onderground,

Since you said that you probably won't be starting the project until after Christmas anyway, maybe we can discuss the money/investment options after that too.. because personally I would love to through down $100 for help the project get started, but for the month of December (I know I probably can't speak for everybody), my money situtation is going to be a little tighter than normal... gotta get those gifts you know..

IMO.

 

Thanks onderground.

When you initially posted this, i was interested, but then once i heard your "business strategy" i was a little skeptical. And now hearing it again, i say no way. You want business, invest the $4000, and about 75% of these goofballs on the forum will buy the damn thing. You get no creditability from anyone here when you want money up front for something we havent seen. You're willing to invest $3000 but not $4000? Something is fishy. Im passing.

 

Which brings up another point. . . I would consider the lower (front-side-rear) pieces but not the wing. I have the OEM one installed. I think that you'll have to seriously consider this option as many of us have the OEM wing installed.

(Hey I broke 500 miles yesterday on the way home!)

 

I agree with all thats been said.


I will gladly bring you my car... and leave you my car as the donar. Not a problem. I live 2.5 hours from you and I have a place to stay in Montreal.


BUT... this is never going to happen unless you guys are willing to put yourselves out. Thats just how business works.

This kit WILL sell... you know that... thats why you keep coming back. Every other thread in this forum is about that bodykit and/or that lip spoiler.


But... I do see that your willing to compromise.

if you people REALLY want this kit... you should put $100 deposit on it. its not alot of money and 10 people should definately be able to pull it together...

Including me, I count 6 people in this thread willing to put $100 down for this.

We need 4 more... Who else?

 

I am a CUSTOMER--not a business partner, I appreciate all your efforts--BUT c'mmon--It is not the customer's responsibility to take on the burden of production costs ( at least not up front like this)

Look at the thousands of us who have spent thousands of dollars for modifications--And there are probably dozens if not hundreds of us here and on other forums that would be interested in purchasing this product outright with no hitches ...What else do you want????You are lucky enough to have the large customer base right here....Take the $4k risk and it WILL pay off....Just my $.02

 

But I will still send you the 100 bucks-anyway,...Damn Im an asshole

Soopa - Make that 7

 

btw one thing... I assume those who put down the "$100 deposit" will get that $100 off the cost of their kit?

 

what these guys need to understand is that unless:

A. the kit looks like shit
B. the quality is shit
C. it doesnt fit right


they will NOT LOSE ANY MONEY...even if it cost them 10,000 for upfront costs, if they make a quality product that fits and looks good, IT WILL SELL....people here have been drooling for a SEMA kit for over a year now and they should just understand that there is no risk involved for them other than making something of poor quality.

 

My next question exactly!

 

put me down for $100.

 

your are absolutely right....and im one of those 75% who would buy the dam thing

 

i want to put the down, BUT...how would i be sure that the kit will be of the same quality or better? and how would i know if it really fits like OEM?? Im all the way in cali so i cant rely on pics that much...

ALSO, what about those rear exhaust tips? wont u need something similar? cuz my 03 tips wouldnt look right

 

i'm in i'
ll put 100

 

Laser1180,

I'm from houston and have been looking for a reputable shop to fit a kit onto my car, as I understand you and your friends are interested in a sema kit too right? Well i've just been rear-ended recently and got 1200 to spend to fix the car, i am willing to use my car as the prototype and put down what i got to have a local shop design the kit. That's where i will need yall's help in finding a good, insured, reputable shop to do the job, and help put down some design $$$ if needed.

tell me what u guys think

 

i'd suggest a moderator delete all threads (even this one!) that don't say a person will deposit

<<1st gen, no kits for us! :P

 

hey Eric where are you? speak up!!!!

 

Hello again!

Ok After reading all your precious comment, I will reply in multiple point..

for those who argue our business direction, why we dont invest in this projet.... first, YES we invest..... you invest 1000$ and we invest $3000......and I would reply that we cannot get 104 project at the same time.... What I mean, there is lots of group like you who have approched us, like escort, rsx, and other big club, and they asked us to design something for their car.... But we cannot start 104 design for all cars in the market... we would work 24hr per day designing product, and dont get the time to sell them.... Maybe I have some trouble explaining what I mean, Im french... and that not my fault

Ok what I clearly mean, I receive over 50 email per day..... people asking us to design this... design that..... WE CANNOT do everything that people ask us!!! thats impossible!! And all project worth the investment!!! If we do that, we will have over 40 molder and no gain.... cuz our marketing strategy will drop and sink... and close our door for too much payroll!

We did an MX-3 precidia front with the protege design... this project started the same way Im doing right now... people accepted how we business and now the mx-3 have the kit.... exactly HOW they asked us!

see the result

PICTURE PHOTOSHOP BEFORE project :
picture orange: photoshop on a mx-3
picture blue: original from protege


and final result after 3 weeks



So we are working with club... association.... forum... and people get what they need, for a fraction of the cost!....

For the price I told you, of 799 to 899.... After looking at clear picture, we have seen that the 2 sideskirt are using door filler.... door cap......a kind of wide body that clip on the door with rivets and body filler.... thats no joke! See near the edge of the door, near the hinge.... you will see an angle, that happen when the door open, this is the sign of a wide body car.....

Making a wide body kit mean 2 more parts on the kit... 2 door cap.... that was no in the price.... this mean, the best price for the kit 6 parts, we could go at $999...... and I credit the $100 for all the deposit received..... this mean, the 10 first will have a kit for 2 payment ... one of $100 and the other of $899 for a total of $999..... This is only $100 more than what suggested, even with 2 more parts included..

Here the list of all people interested in the kit with $100 deposit

SOOPA
mc222@aol.com
Spiroh
Mr. Big
Adfeek28
LASER1180 3 TIMES


So at least we almost have everyone....

Thanks you for all your effort in this buy...
For those who asked us by email,. we take visa mastercard, so there is no fraud possible and we are a business licenced

thanks

Eric Belec

 

i am in ONLY IF, there is some way to have the exhaust ports fit hks super dragers...

 

We will make the kit the way you need..... If you need a bigger exhaust hole we will do it...! We custom as you want...! Just send me some picture for the molder and that it!

 

Me and my father want a professional kit for our car, something sleek, conforms to the lines of the car, does not bottom out our cars, and great price. I believe you guys can do that, now I do not feel comfortable fronting 200 dollars.

Are these painted, or do we yet have to pay for this?

Believe me, when it is done, I will then send you a payment for one kit, if not 2 kits.

 

im in too...make the kit...you wil sell alot!

 

onderground, don't be put off by this email because I do offer up a suggestion that should be acceptable to your company's situation. You're probably being legit on this, but your approach is highly suspect. One sceptic should not be able to ruin the potential gains for the others more interested in this [admittedly sweet] body kit.

-- Nihil

You guys are welcome to flame the hell outta this post. I'm really not trying to damper someone putting together an awesome kit for the CL, but this is just plain odd business practice.

I can understand a small business wanting some sort of guaranteed return on investment for a new product... been there, done that. However, as others have pointed out, the risk is to be taken by the business, not the consumer. The business should be doing sound business practice like cost-benefit analysis, market analysis, etc... if the market is not there or the risk too great, then the product never gets beyond conceptualization.

Honestly, I don't buy the "we will finance $3000, but need potential buyers to finance the remaining $1000". I don't buy the "we have too many projects".

Sound business practice indicates a growing company should never over-extend itself. If you think about it, say they have even 10 designs they are positive would be excellent sellers (he said they have over 50 emails a day ~40 designs so this is conservative) that would be $30k investment from them, another $10k from first-buyers. If they took that same $30k they were going to finance anyway, they could still make the molds for 7 of those 10 without risking consumer's money. After those begin to sell, turn over the revenue and make the remaining 3 designs. Consider they would only need to sell 15 $1000 kits at a 20% margin (which is extremely LOW for any manufacturing/direct sales business) to make the remaining $3k to finance the remaining 3 kits... that's just ~2 kits for each design!!!

I won't even go into the rhetoric on how much a manufacturing facility start-up costs would be (but it would be trivial compared to $40k for 40 new designs)...

I don't buy the "we won't be able to pay our bills" if we go off and design all these kits for you... If you go to ANY lender with a list of customers who are willing to buy these kits and have signed an agreement/contract (see contracting solution below), they are going to loan you the additional capital to finance the design work, especially for an established company. ...Been there, done that.

Solution(s):

If it's assurance that they're going to make money on the design, why not draw up a contract with the initial buyers that states the consumer will pay fair and reasonable price (from $800-$1000) for the goods upon receipt from the manufacturer. Put in there a contingency that the contract is subject to cancellation by the manufacturer, for any reason, including having an initial group order numbering less than say 10. At least this way you are guaranteeing at least moderate success/break-even if you proceed, and your buyers are not at risk. A lot of goods/services are handled in this arrangement (including mechanics who give you a quote but you never know until they open it up).

Another way to handle it is to at least offer the initial group a discount on the product. You're asking them to take a risk/make an investment... they should have some potential for return on investment other than a final kit available for everyone else to buy (including those that didn't risk the venture capital). A $100 discount on the kit would be reasonable IMHO.

Finally, if you're asking each person to finance 1/40th of the kit's development ($100 downpayment/$4000 development cost). Find some investors who are willing to buy "stock" in the design and get dividends/royalties for each sale. Again, if it's a $1000 kit, each "investor" would receive $25... just as if someone were to buy company stock. Obviously, leave the option to allow the company to buy the stock back at some pricing schedule so you can make those margins back. Growth would suffer due to lower revenues, but it's workable.

There are just too many alternatives for a company to source financing... going to the consumer (not an investor) is not usually an appropriate one.

To you thinking about doing this, not saying you should/should not put a $100 downpayment toward the kit development... just have to weigh the potential risk/reward. I piss $100 away pretty damn fast, so I'd probably put in if I weren't leasing

Flame on...

 

EVERYONE READ:

If you are going to deposit into the fund for this kit please PAYPAL the money to bodykit@acura-cl.com


I will manage the fund and bring the money to ONDERGROUND personally.

With ACURA-CL.COM managing the funds you can rest assured our money will be taken care of.


Updates here: http://www.acura-cl.com/forums/showt...threadid=87821

 

holy shit!! I'm gone for a week and everything changes here!! Soop...as soon as i get back i am sending you the 100 bucks!! Lrsts get this thing goin...

 

done deal

 

ill have to see this before i descide but let me just add ,you cant apply all/any standard business practices to all situations like these ,look at RES...no funding fine just doesnt get made...or comptech headers ...ok no funding up front from the consumer no prob...3000% mark up...you guys do understand that the original sema car was about a 10K$ job...i believe that just because it's not common practice, doesnt make it wrong...if you use a credit card you CANNOT get hurt ....and really this is common practice its called investing ...you may not have been involved before but most companys in order to produce a product go out and find people willing to invest ,based soley on a plan and predictions,and they may not even want the final product...they just want a return...............

your return is the final product ...

 

This kit won't require us drilling in teh panels of the car will it? Like the door, etc? So if we ever wanted to take it off, there would be no holes.

Let me know.

 

For technik questions, For the sideskirt, you need to put A: screws or B: rivet or C: eurethane

.... the door cap doenst have any other way to stick there.... except eurthane...! there will have some insert in the door cap where to drill holes and put rivet ... but if yoour car is a lease I sugest eurethane.... door cap doenst have any other way to be stick there...

The rest of the kit will be bolted with normal screws and bolts and nuts

If you have experiance with eurethane thats fine you can stick the sideskirt with ease....

-----

Remember that all people that give an amount in deposit to Soopa, will receive the same amount in credit when he will buy the kit

We havent discussed about shipping....

Since we are in canada, we have 2 way for shipping

Once the kit ready to sell ....

1: fast shipping, $220, 4 weeks
2: slow shipping, $160, 8 weeks

This include box, shipping, freight, handling, duty, tax and packaging. We ship in 7 foots x 3 x 4 foot box, packaged in shredded paper and foam. You are fully insured on shipping.

This price include everything.... no other charges to pay from custom after.... duty are paid

Eric Belec