astro

Well I went to the dyno today, and had a professional tuner do the settings on my V-AFC controller...

it turns out that all I gained from it was 2hp and 3ft/lbs....

I would reccomend that nobody waste their money on it as our cars are already running at 95% efficiency in terms of fuel mapping...also, a fuel pressure regulator is useless on our car too...

here is the pic, the red line is my baseline run, before we tuned the V-AFC, and the blue line is after we tuned the V-AFC...pretty much all that we did was lean out the car a little bit at the top end...



this is pretty good though as the owner of the dyno shops GS400 only pulls 245 max HP...I think with the comptech exhaust and my headers re-torqued I can pull at least 235....



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Astroboy out...
2001 Acura CL Type S: Comptech: Headers, filter, sways, springs, koni shocks, Volk Racing SE37's in 18", goodridge braided brake lines, AEM CAI (blue), APEXi V-AFC, full kicker system, 13" Brembo's on the way with slotted discs for the rear
1996 Porsche 911 Twin Turbo: H&R Springs and sways, Bilstein shocks, ported and polished, crillo rods, new valvetrain
1995 VW Golf: 1999 VR6 Swap, H&R Coil Overs, neuspeed strut bars, neuspeed sway bars, 2.5" Stainless TT exhaust w/ Borla, 13" AP Racing big brakes

soopa

damn. glad i dont have that fugly thing.

id send that shit right back!

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2001 Acura 3.2 CL Type-S
San Marino Red (Navigation)
PIAA 19173 Ion Yellow Fog Lights
Aftermarket Black Wood Trim Kit

astro

too bad I had my stereo guys install it in the sunglass holder....it looks cool but totally does nothing in terms of performance...
it's kinda neat to set the VTEC early, but doesn't yeild any additional power...

what was beatyall and mikes dynos?



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Astroboy out...
2001 Acura CL Type S: Comptech: Headers, filter, sways, springs, koni shocks, Volk Racing SE37's in 18", goodridge braided brake lines, AEM CAI (blue), APEXi V-AFC, full kicker system, 13" Brembo's on the way with slotted discs for the rear
1996 Porsche 911 Twin Turbo: H&R Springs and sways, Bilstein shocks, ported and polished, crillo rods, new valvetrain
1995 VW Golf: 1999 VR6 Swap, H&R Coil Overs, neuspeed strut bars, neuspeed sway bars, 2.5" Stainless TT exhaust w/ Borla, 13" AP Racing big brakes

Achance

What is the dip at 3800? I thought vtec comes somewhere in the 4k range. But I might be getting my cars mixed up. There is a plus side to the vafc. You can lean it out when you're on the highway and get some awesome gas mileage.

soopa

I believe 3800rpm is exactly where the 2nd stage air induction system opens up.

Dunno why there would be a dip there though

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2001 Acura 3.2 CL Type-S
San Marino Red (Navigation)
PIAA 19173 Ion Yellow Fog Lights
Aftermarket Black Wood Trim Kit

Satin Slayer

I always thought the V-AFC was marginal for the SOHC and more effective on a DOHC??? Isn't that what it was designed for...DOHC VTEC???

Crippen

That's irrelevant. It is a tool for tuning your fuel map if you have the mods which warrant such tuning.
I figure it'd be much more useless if you were running forced induction and needed to change the engagement point to avoid that air pass-through effect. Also good if you want to make sure you're not leaning out under boost.

for our stock cars, i think the marginal improvement in air-flow doesn't warrant the use of the V-AFC, although 2hp *is* still 2hp

I would have thought an FPR would have helped a bit.

Satin Slayer

True, but that's an expensive 2hp gain

Crippen

My point exactly

Still, glad my bro Astro had the balzz to do it I couldn't afford to test out this theory

Still undecided on whether to get the Xephyr CAI or AEM .. hmmm.


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R.I.P Integra Type-R #932
Black 2001 CL-S
Comptech Headers

[This message has been edited by Crippen (edited 04-07-2001).]

Satin Slayer

AEM

WebToker

FYI, the V-AFC is only as good as your tuner is.


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2001 Acura 3.2 CL Type-S
Comptech Springs
Comptech Exhaust
Denso Spark Plugs
Apexi V-AFC
AEM CAI

H@mmerm@n

Mike's dyno showed Max HP of 236.5 and max torque of 198.7 with headers & AEM intake.

------------------
Mike
2001 Satin Silver CL-S
Comptech headers, sways, PIAA 19169

"Never underestimate the power of a dark CLown!" - Darph Bobo

Type S Smokes All

that fuckin sux, 350 for 2hp! hahaha, i am so glad i am goin for the springs instead of that. But if i ever want shit to look cool i will definatly buy it.

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Nick
01' Cl-S Silver/ Black W/ Navi and Spoiler
V-1 Radar Hard Wired, Limo Tint all around
Comptech Headers, Sways, and AEM CAI
I've got one of the CLS's from the fast batch.
Lead Foot!

SD_surfer

Thanks ,dude

you just save me some money!

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2001 CL-S Black/Navi
*Polarg M-6 , 35% tint
*Audio system upgraded
AMP: Xtant 603x
FRONT: Focal 165W
SUBs: 2 Boston Pro 10LF

CO-CL-S

Bummer man..

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Eat Safe, Use Condiments
red CL-S, non-Nav, 35% tint, M6 driving lights, M4 map and door lights

astro

I'm gonna buy the comptech exhaust and get my headers re-torqued then I'm going back to the dyno again....

btw toker, the guy who tuned my car, is the BEST japanese tuner in all of Toronto....
he used his own equipment to measure the actual air and fuel flow on my motor and then set the V-AFC...we did 14 runs on the dyno for him to get it right...



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Astroboy out...
2001 Acura CL Type S: Comptech: Headers, filter, sways, springs, koni shocks, Volk Racing SE37's in 18", goodridge braided brake lines, AEM CAI (blue), APEXi V-AFC, full kicker system, 13" Brembo's on the way with slotted discs for the rear
1996 Porsche 911 Twin Turbo: H&R Springs and sways, Bilstein shocks, ported and polished, crillo rods, new valvetrain
1995 VW Golf: 1999 VR6 Swap, H&R Coil Overs, neuspeed strut bars, neuspeed sway bars, 2.5" Stainless TT exhaust w/ Borla, 13" AP Racing big brakes

Mike

Forget the CLS we want a Porsche dyno!

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2001 Satin Silver Cl Type S.
Comptech:Headers, Springs & Sways
AEM CAI
Toyo T1S Proxys 235/45/17
35% Llumar metallic tint
My Car

Jens H.

V-AFC ,I have been waiting to see how this device works however it seems it is not good from comments made here.However here is something to think about,The v-afc modifies various things the engine computer is doing.It is true that our engines are well thought out as are the electronics that run the show.In a recent test of the v-afc the magazine got similar results to what is written here.But here is the thing the v-afc will work but not on an otherwise stock car.Once you begin to modify the car then you can use the v-afc to assist the car's ecu in compensating for your mods.Our electronics are limited in what they are capable of compensating for.The addition of a free flowing exhaust cold air kits etc begins to to push the computers to the limit of what they can accomplish.Although I have not seen or heard of anyone having problems with their cars with these mods it is an area where a device like the v-afc can be made useful.Computers such as the ones in our cars select correct inputs to the engine for ignition timing,injector duration etc. based on engine load.However the maps that these values are selected from are limited to what can reasonably be expected from a stock car.Once you modify the car it is possible that the computer will run out of adjustment choices hence the v-afc.Jens

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1992 mazda Miata lowered with Eibach springs KYB AGX adjustable struts Sparco racing buckets 4 point safety harnesses Momo steering wheel lo profile headlite system with PIAA superwhite bulbs Custom audio system Custom gauges Jackson racing supercharger with header and Greddy cat back exhaust and a ton of other stuff 2000 Honda Civic on APEX coilovers Full Alpine Audio system factory fogs with Piaa bulbs Catz ZETA high beam headlamp system H.I.D. Xenon low beam tinted, custom taillites and on and on

so cal type s_RENAMED

astro, how many miles were on the car from the time you installed the CAI and v-afc to the trip to the dyno?

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'01 cl-s blk/blk :: comptech headers, comptech springs, comptech sway bars

astro

about 500 with the CAI and only 150 km's with the V-AFC...



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Astroboy out...
2001 Acura CL Type S: Comptech: Headers, filter, sways, springs, koni shocks, Volk Racing SE37's in 18", goodridge braided brake lines, AEM CAI (blue), APEXi V-AFC, full kicker system, 13" Brembo's on the way with slotted discs for the rear
1996 Porsche 911 Twin Turbo: H&R Springs and sways, Bilstein shocks, ported and polished, crillo rods, new valvetrain
1995 VW Golf: 1999 VR6 Swap, H&R Coil Overs, neuspeed strut bars, neuspeed sway bars, 2.5" Stainless TT exhaust w/ Borla, 13" AP Racing big brakes

deadlyCL-S

i am gonna be brave and ask this, despite the fact it will probably make me look stupid.. what is a re-torque? what does that do? and do you have to do it when you get headers? how much does it cost how often do you have to do it? you know the whole deal about it. thanks

Nashua_Night_Hawk

re-torquing is retightening the headers' nuts/bolts to the speced torque numbers by acura.

You need to use a torque rench with correct torque numbers.

Deoes it help?

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Black, Ebony, 3.2 CL Type-S.
- Acura NAV.
- 3M clear bra (full front bumper, and side mirros)
- Wheels locks
- Mooonroof visor
- Splash guards
- Winter mats
- Trunk liner
- Acura Spoiler
- Valentine V1 Radar Locator
- HELMS Service Manual
- PIAA 19169 road lamps
- 03/19/01: Injen Polished CAI
- As of 04/10/01:
- 235/40/18 NITTO 555
- 18x7.5 Koing Imagine in Silver

Nashua_Night_Hawk

Astro,

What are you gaining from the CAI?

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Black, Ebony, 3.2 CL Type-S.
- Acura NAV.
- 3M clear bra (full front bumper, and side mirros)
- Wheels locks
- Mooonroof visor
- Splash guards
- Winter mats
- Trunk liner
- Acura Spoiler
- Valentine V1 Radar Locator
- HELMS Service Manual
- PIAA 19169 road lamps
- 03/19/01: Injen Polished CAI
- As of 04/10/01:
- 235/40/18 NITTO 555
- 18x7.5 Koing Imagine in Silver

so cal type s_RENAMED

hmm, did you reset the ecu after the cai?

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'01 cl-s blk/blk :: comptech headers, comptech springs, comptech sway bars

oonowindoo

haha when i installed my CAI.. my friend was telling me if i reset the ECU then i will gain like 2 HP.. i was like.. WHAT?? that s not even logical... someppl think it s bullshit... some people said it worked.. well FUCK that shit... i will put some more acura-cl.com sticker to get my HP .. save me some time too.

CLTypeR

Man no one believed me that the V-AFC is not worth the money and actually doesn't help much. If your lucky and ur good at tuning that thing... u might be able to extract 1-2 more on each spec... maybe... I dunno the Type-S

Geez... gotta get a dyno chart to prove that.
Don't believe the hype.

The only thing I knew about that thing for sure... was that it looks really neat and pretty and cute....

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1997 Acura 2.2 CL (5spd)

-Mod list too long to load
-If you ask me if I have that mod... my reply would be probably yes.
-Have any questions about the car... I'll try to help.
-Is my car fast? ... comon be real, even with a Prelude motor it still wouldn't be.

astro

I figure I'm gaining about 8hp at the wheels due to the CAI...I still think that maybe there is something wrong with my car since Mike was able to pull numbers that are SO much higher than mine without the V-AFC



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Astroboy out...
2001 Acura CL Type S: Comptech: Headers, filter, sways, springs, koni shocks, Volk Racing SE37's in 18", goodridge braided brake lines, AEM CAI (blue), APEXi V-AFC, full kicker system, 13" Brembo's on the way with slotted discs for the rear
1996 Porsche 911 Twin Turbo: H&R Springs and sways, Bilstein shocks, ported and polished, crillo rods, new valvetrain
1995 VW Golf: 1999 VR6 Swap, H&R Coil Overs, neuspeed strut bars, neuspeed sway bars, 2.5" Stainless TT exhaust w/ Borla, 13" AP Racing big brakes

syncivic

I seem to remember this conversation with a guy from Tampa who's VAFC and a bone stock -S runs 14.1's @ 99 MPH, you guys decide....I think that 2HP doesn't justify a .7-1.0 sec improvement in the 1/4, do you??? Our work at the propulsion laboratory has revealed that a VAFC is "useless" on a stock motor, which headers and an intake still qualify as stock.

Mike

he had a custom intake. he has the timeslips to back up his claim. imo, the contributing factor to his low ETs is the fact that he removed his left side fog light. cold air was rushing directly into his intake.

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2001 Satin Silver Cl Type S.
Comptech:Headers, Springs & Sways
AEM CAI
Toyo T1S Proxys 235/45/17
35% Llumar metallic tint
My Car

blxmjx

Everyone knows that shit is useless with a bonestock motor, it still looks pretty cute when it is lit up though.

syncivic

Mike, I hope that was some moderator sarcasim....you couldn't possibly believe that a "RAM EFFECT" contributed to that type of reduction. Maybe if that Ram Air had a bit of NOS mixed in.

Mike

Yes, I'm skeptical. I'd have to see it to believe it.

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2001 Satin Silver Cl Type S.
Comptech:Headers, Springs & Sways
AEM CAI
Toyo T1S Proxys 235/45/17
35% Llumar metallic tint
My Car

BIGNASTY

Well since it's myself and my car you were speaking of I feel obligated to comment. I will not get in a little bitch fight though. Here is my comment. I have state this B4. I did not gain any more than 3 HP above 5000 RPM. A good tuner knows were to look for power as well as how to extract it.

syncivic

I have a job opening for a good tuner, top pay and benefits, must have proven credentials. If he's better than mine, he's hired...

EricL

To AstroBoy:

Do you have the weight on those Volks in the 18". 22 lbs should equal the stock wheels (but I am making a lot of assumptions). for example, the inner "disk" of the stock vs Volks wheels are similar in weight. I did some rough calcs and it turned out that 18" wheels with enough weight would show up as a loss on a DynoJet type dyno.

Then there is the issue of DynoJets being great for dynamic operation, but lousy for point-to-point calibrations. It would take a good tuner a lot of time to get any gains right. The 02 sensors would always try to put the fuel-air back into a center band, but there is a little fudging room (especially if the car starts getting far enough off the map with given mods that it can use a little trim back to rich to get max power).

BeatYaAll had a dyno here of his V-AFC before and after. Here it is:

http://www.gpvisa.com/TLstuff/Image_Fr.pdf

He only got 4HP, but gained a bit of torque over a large area.

If you going for every last pony, well maybe, but until someone makes an extender cable to eliminate ripping up the factory wiring, this mod is kinda suspect (IMO)



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Silver 2001 CL-S with NAVI

• Mud guards
• Wheel locks
• Toyo T1S 235/45ZR17-93W* Proxies on 17x8" SSR Competition wheels (48lbs less than stock)
• Kevlar/SS Brake lines ordered
• Comptech headers & sways ordered
• Silver AEM CAI ready
• 6 coats of Zaino magic

Vampyre

Actually, i wouldn't doubt it contributed for at least .1 to .2. a very common practice in the GP community is to remove the drivers side headlight for increased airflow. It does produce a ram-air effect, but not like the ram-air known from the old carburated engine days. in current cars, ram-air is good only for an extra source of fast flowing cool air. The fact that the air is being forced through the intake, decreases the amount the air is heated before being sucked into the engine. By opening the intake via removing the foglight will provide a benefit for the CL-S.


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Andrew S.
2000 Dark Forest Green GTP/GTX
14.413@95.03
My Mod Page

2001 San Marino Red Acura 3.2 CL Type S
* No Mods Yet, though planned *

WebToker

I have had my fog lights out for the last few days and I can tell the difference. Especially once I get above 30mph. Last time I went to the track I was running a 14.6 with only a intake. I am going up this Friday and I am going to take off the fog light on that side for my runs and we will see how much it helps. With the addition of new exhaust and the Denso plugs I hope to be running a 14.4 but we will see come this Friday.

98ITR461

That makes perfect sense to me. Simply feeding more air and running a better header isn't going to require much diff from stock as far as fuel/air maps go. Only if you use FI or cams will you find real value in a tool like the V-FAC. Then, given different durations, timings, etc, the controller is pretty much required (as an option anyway).

It's kinda like buying an air wrench w/o a compressor.....maybe!?