Do your know Mr. ICE?
09-15-2002, 04:10 PM
#1
Happy CL-S Pilot
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Do your know Mr. ICE?
Okay.. Have you seen Arnold's ICE man in Batman movie....?
I woould like to be Mr. ICE
I am thinking about making CAI Intake Tubes' Sleeve that would Deep Cool ( Linearly of course as to avoid cracks ) the CAI tube...
How about using Liquid Nitrogen? Any fear of Explosion with that liquid Stuff? ...
I woould like to be Mr. ICE
I am thinking about making CAI Intake Tubes' Sleeve that would Deep Cool ( Linearly of course as to avoid cracks ) the CAI tube...
How about using Liquid Nitrogen? Any fear of Explosion with that liquid Stuff? ...
09-15-2002, 04:35 PM
#3
Happy CL-S Pilot
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I like the peltier idea... I saw a lot of applications in cooling CPUs...
But does it have the thermal capacity to cool well for the CAI application? What about the Battery drain? Is it fast cooling or does it take too much time?
Can you say some REAL ICEY Cold Air Intake system?
How about 0 degree F as working temp for the induction air ...
Any one can compute the estimated power gains from such setup ( 0 degree F)
But does it have the thermal capacity to cool well for the CAI application? What about the Battery drain? Is it fast cooling or does it take too much time?
Can you say some REAL ICEY Cold Air Intake system?
How about 0 degree F as working temp for the induction air ...
Any one can compute the estimated power gains from such setup ( 0 degree F)
09-15-2002, 04:45 PM
#6
MR O'NEAL
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what if someone made a sleeve over a short ram system and put like a bag or something like that with water filled in it... so that the heat of the pipe would be distributed throughout the water (water holds a lot of heat!!) and the system then would remain cool...
AND you could take out the bag.. FREEZE IT and then put it back for REAL COLD INTAKE!! woohoo!!
how unrealistic is this??? you tell me.. someone else do it and tell me if it works! :P
AND you could take out the bag.. FREEZE IT and then put it back for REAL COLD INTAKE!! woohoo!!
how unrealistic is this??? you tell me.. someone else do it and tell me if it works! :P
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09-15-2002, 04:46 PM
#8
Happy CL-S Pilot
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09-15-2002, 04:55 PM
#9
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I dunno buddie, Its a nice gain overall but considering that the humidity and temp were adjusted for in the SAE correction the toal gain is somewhat dissapointing... 
??
??
09-15-2002, 04:59 PM
#10
Happy CL-S Pilot
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hmmmm... The actual readings of Humidity were all screwed up...by the dyno .... Weather.com says 85%-90% Humidity and the dyno sensor says 45%-55%.... Temp around 76.
I will try dyno in Jan when Temp is around 10 degrees
I will try dyno in Jan when Temp is around 10 degrees
09-15-2002, 05:14 PM
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well ... generally both are bad conditions...
Low temp + High humidity = Snow (traction problems )
High temp + Low Humidity = Low Air density (poor combustion charge)
Low temp + High humidity = Snow (traction problems )
High temp + Low Humidity = Low Air density (poor combustion charge)
09-15-2002, 05:20 PM
#14
Cost Drivers!!!!
I worked out the logistics of liquid nitrogen a while back. You'll have a few issues depending on the design. First and formost large amounts condensation depending on the humidity. This condensing will happen within the CAI and then be sucked into the engine. Other designs would help reduce condensation but the pipe wouldn't be as cold as you want. Then you nneed to worry about lugging around the tank (added weight).
09-15-2002, 05:26 PM
#15
4dr & I like it that way
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zapata - wouldnt the water thats condensing just be the water vapor thats always sucked into the engine regardless? Does hydro lock only occur with liquid water and not water vapor? Something I've always wondered about but neven been sure
09-15-2002, 05:38 PM
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This seems like a relatively simple design ... but believe be powerhouses like porshe/ferrari/lambo would have done this years ago and most probably in a hybrid intercooler design.. LOL
If you were hell bent on reaping the benifit of supercooling w/liquid nitrogen you'd be better off pursuing a superconductor/supercooled rotary electrical engine application
If you were hell bent on reaping the benifit of supercooling w/liquid nitrogen you'd be better off pursuing a superconductor/supercooled rotary electrical engine application
09-16-2002, 07:56 AM
#17
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Liquid nitrogn is just crazy. The second you move the car and shake it up you are going to be venting gases from the pressure release valve and driving down the road sounding like a hissing cobra. Aside from that, to have any apprciable amount of LN that would last for more than a day in ambient temperatures you would need one big ass tank of LN!
I would probably suggest looking to another solution.
I would probably suggest looking to another solution.
09-16-2002, 08:02 AM
#18
Cost Drivers!!!!
Originally posted by Davediego
zapata - wouldnt the water thats condensing just be the water vapor thats always sucked into the engine regardless? Does hydro lock only occur with liquid water and not water vapor? Something I've always wondered about but neven been sure
zapata - wouldnt the water thats condensing just be the water vapor thats always sucked into the engine regardless? Does hydro lock only occur with liquid water and not water vapor? Something I've always wondered about but neven been sure
It would be the same. It happens more with CAI's than in the stock airbox. Depending on the climate, if you take apart your CAI and rub your hands on the inside it may or may not be damp. However, the amount of condesation(depending on the humidity) that would occur in a pipe that is super cooled by liquid Nitrogen would be MUCH more. "wet" air will degrade performance to a point that the "cooling" gains might be negligable.
I believe with hydrolock you need a good amount of liquid and not just vapor.
09-16-2002, 09:45 AM
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i'm not too wise in the ways of chemistry, but the element in air that is responsible to combustion in oxygen. and normal coniditions, it only consits of 20% of the total compostion of air we and our cars breath. Some time in the Navy, i remember them saying something that if the amount of oxygen in the air were to be higher, it would be very explosive. So, instead of inducing the engine with nitrous, what would the effect of an increase in the amount of O2 have?
what about hooking a vent from our AC duct to the intake... brrrr... and it's already microfiltered...
what about hooking a vent from our AC duct to the intake... brrrr... and it's already microfiltered...
09-16-2002, 01:39 PM
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ok, pure O2 i can see it exploding. But what about just adding a small amount of consentrated O2 into the intake. so the overall % would go from 20% to 25%, or whatever.
Is the difference between a 2.75" CAI and a 3" intake just less cold air, or less O2? If O2, then we can just get that O2 from somewhere else. (And i would bet we could push a little more in too) So, the volumn of air would be less, but the amount of O2 would be the same just at a higher ratio.
Is the difference between a 2.75" CAI and a 3" intake just less cold air, or less O2? If O2, then we can just get that O2 from somewhere else. (And i would bet we could push a little more in too) So, the volumn of air would be less, but the amount of O2 would be the same just at a higher ratio.
09-16-2002, 01:49 PM
#22
Cost Drivers!!!!
Originally posted by beerknurd
ok, pure O2 i can see it exploding. But what about just adding a small amount of consentrated O2 into the intake. so the overall % would go from 20% to 25%, or whatever.
Is the difference between a 2.75" CAI and a 3" intake just less cold air, or less O2? If O2, then we can just get that O2 from somewhere else. (And i would bet we could push a little more in too) So, the volumn of air would be less, but the amount of O2 would be the same just at a higher ratio.
ok, pure O2 i can see it exploding. But what about just adding a small amount of consentrated O2 into the intake. so the overall % would go from 20% to 25%, or whatever.
Is the difference between a 2.75" CAI and a 3" intake just less cold air, or less O2? If O2, then we can just get that O2 from somewhere else. (And i would bet we could push a little more in too) So, the volumn of air would be less, but the amount of O2 would be the same just at a higher ratio.
09-16-2002, 02:17 PM
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have the O2 constantly on. imagine having the same amout of O2 hitting the intake at 1k rpm then we currently see at 2k rpm.
and we can have the air tank int he trunk with 40lbs of ice cooling it.
and we can have the air tank int he trunk with 40lbs of ice cooling it.
09-16-2002, 02:18 PM
#24
Cost Drivers!!!!
Originally posted by beerknurd
have the O2 constantly on. imagine having the same amout of O2 hitting the intake at 1k rpm then we currently see at 2k rpm.
and we can have the air tank int he trunk with 40lbs of ice cooling it.
have the O2 constantly on. imagine having the same amout of O2 hitting the intake at 1k rpm then we currently see at 2k rpm.
and we can have the air tank int he trunk with 40lbs of ice cooling it.
09-16-2002, 04:15 PM
#25
4dr & I like it that way
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yea dont forget wat "nawz" really is personally i think that some sort of cooling system that wouldnt require a tank that needs refilling (and therefore costs lots of $$ to use frequently) would be really cool. i know some of the porsches are "watercooled" but wat exactly is being cooled in them? anyone know?
personally i think that some sort of cooling system that wouldnt require a tank that needs refilling (and therefore costs lots of $$ to use frequently) would be really cool. i know some of the porsches are "watercooled" but wat exactly is being cooled in them? anyone know?
09-16-2002, 04:20 PM
#26
Cost Drivers!!!!
Originally posted by Zapata
Water cooled refers to the type of cooling system that is used to cool the air from the turbo charger(s). There are air-cooled, water-cooled and i believe that fancy racing cars might even have oil-cooled
Water cooled refers to the type of cooling system that is used to cool the air from the turbo charger(s). There are air-cooled, water-cooled and i believe that fancy racing cars might even have oil-cooled
09-16-2002, 04:31 PM
#28
Cost Drivers!!!!
Originally posted by Davediego
i see, so its to cool down the air after being turbocharged, thanks
i see, so its to cool down the air after being turbocharged, thanks
No problem. Here's nice write-up from turbonation.com
http://www.turbonation.com/intrcool.htm
First we will try to explain what an intercooler is and what it does. When the air drawn into the turbo charger is compressed a great deal of heat is added to the air. When the air is heated it becomes less dense and carrys less oxygen, therefore packing less of the all important oxygen rich air into the intake manifold. The intercooler is added to cool the air and make it denser so more oxygen rich air can be packed into the intake and from there into the cylinders. When adding an intercooler to a non intercooler car the fuel requirements may increase. Be sure to monitor your fuel delivery after adding an intercooler. Check out the Gauge Upgrades page for information on the types of gauges required.
Most intercoolers are of the air to air variety, which means they transfer heat from the compressed air in the intake plumbing to the cooler outside air. All air to air intercooler work in the same manner, air is pulled in through the air filter to the turbo charger, compressed then routed to the intercooler. Once inside the intercooler it passes through a series of small tubes that have many thin fins attached. The heated compressed air flowing through the intercooler heats
Most intercoolers are of the air to air variety, which means they transfer heat from the compressed air in the intake plumbing to the cooler outside air. All air to air intercooler work in the same manner, air is pulled in through the air filter to the turbo charger, compressed then routed to the intercooler. Once inside the intercooler it passes through a series of small tubes that have many thin fins attached. The heated compressed air flowing through the intercooler heats
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