CL-S progression 01

iTrader: (2)

so after lowering my car and getting an alignment I found my caster is off by 1 degree on the front right of the car (passenger side).

now if it was just off with no symptom i'd be fine but I think it's creating brake bias towards the right.

how do i fix my caster?? I know u can shim the radius rod using washers but that's only to MINUS caster, not inscrease caster.

Does anyone know how I can add caster?

all i can think of is removing the radius rod and grinding off metal to make the washer stopper closer towards the tire.

in other words remove the radius rod and taking off about a 1/2 inch of metal so the stopper ring can move further back which would in turn add caster when i tighten it back up.

any thoughts?

CL-S progression 01

iTrader: (2)

I cannot believe how hard it is to remove that damn radius rod bushing. like damn son.\


anyways I called my acura tech buddy and he's gonna re- and re it this weekend. and i'm going to personally grind down the radius rod 1/2 inch so the washer sits 1/2 inch further onto the rod and that will pull my caster properly.

thanks for the advice fellas lol

friesm2000

iTrader: (4)

actually you remove shims to add castor (which is severely lacking on lowered cars )

follow the lower suspension arm foward and you should see some spacers up towards the front (if you even have any, cause i don't think mine ever had any lol)

and basically you add a shim/washer to one side to equalize it from side to side (but before you make it perfectly even, you do want a LITTLE difference to compensate for road crown, but even then it should only be like half a degree at max)

CL-S progression 01

iTrader: (2)

if u read my first post i said i know u add shims to minus caster, which is why I don't have any other option than to modify my radius rod. and i do not wanna shim the good side to make lower caster overall on the front because spec is 2.48 and the front left is at 2.7. and I like positive caster because it makes the car more stable at high speed.

and no I don't want to have caster off at all i want it dead even. if possible. besides, road crown is not always slanted to the right. so when u drive on flat roads at high speed and possibly ones that slant to the left (for w/e reason) it'll have a tendency to lean when you brake to the side with least caster.

and that's pissing me off right about now.

if i can get that right side to 2.6-2.8 i will be happy and there'll be no bias.

From the reading I have done once you get to .4 of a variance and up, you will have symptoms. whether u notice it or not is a whole different issue. I tend to notice little things and it irritates the hell outta me.

OperationDarkie

iTrader: (1)

Maybe you should check your tire pressure before you start tearing things apart.

CL-S progression 01

iTrader: (2)

dude the passenger side is 1/2 inch sorter than the drivers side.

that's not tire pressure.

I measured from rim to rim

RooEng

The front beam, aka front crossmember, the part the front of the strut rods connect to, is adjustable. you'll need to loosen a bunch of bolts and use a hammer to move it forward in the correct position. You'll also see reference lines where the front beam connects to the rear beam, the part the rear motor mount attaches to. You might want to look at the mount bushings too.
This is commonly called cradle shift or cradle alignment. Most places don't do this because it's to labor intensive and like you said, if it's off it won't show any symptoms, so why pay for something if nobody's going to notice.

friesm2000

iTrader: (4)

also iirc you had hit that passenger side quite hard MAYBE it has something to do with that, and MAYBE they even put in the wrong arm, OR your cradle/crossmember might even pushed back from that incident IDK



also all we are trying to do is help you, you don't have to be a FUCKING ASSHOLE

civicdrivr

iTrader: (9)

Lulz

CL-S progression 01

iTrader: (2)

being an asshole how? by correcting you for saying that I dunno what i am talking about. Sorry captain Kurk... wow you most be one of those guys that throws a fit over nothing. like a post by a guy u don't know and will never meet. really.. why sweat it skip

you are right tho when you said you are trying to help. Key word is trying. dude take a hike, you have nothing positive to say, DON'T POST. i'm in no mood to have u bash me for correcting you. however i still have the courtesy to not increase my font size to get the point across.

they didn't put the wrong arm in, i would have noticed.

YES i hit the other car really hard 60 km/h difference in speed and it was all on the wheel (which virtually exploded) it was a hair away from being a write-off. i had a thread about it and everything, they put 8 grand into the car YES 8 grand. the whole right side is all new, i means everything, including both subframes and the roof and the fender and some other stuff i don't remember

the frame must be bent and thus the new subframe(s) is not sitting properly.

if i were to cradle shift as you say i would thus move the other side caster and it would then be under spec tho right? which is 2.48 degrees and i want both sides to be more than that. 2.7 or 2.8 on both sides

I'm trying to add caster only to one side... not equal both out. I would just shim the drivers side if i wanted them to equalize.

so once again.... my only option is to add caster to the passenger side. and that can only be achieved by modifying the radius rod.

thanks for the advice guys but it seems i'm kinda SOL and i just gotta tackle this bad boy. I should count my lucky stars i ever got the car back on the road period. cause I called acura and caster was off the same amount when they gave the car back to me. and that's after doing everything they could to equalize it. so i can only imagine i'd make it worse by trying to do anything other than working on just the radius rod.

I will post pix and show you all what I am going to do and what the results are. I just find it really balz how u can only minus caster and not add it without doing a bunch of B.S.

RooEng

You can adjust one OR both sides of the front beam so yes you can just add caster to one side. Just loosen up the all the bolts and move one side forward. No muss no fuss no BS.

It's 2*48'+/- 1* so by 2.7, you mean 3*10' which is +0.36* You're getting your decimals and degrees mixed up. 0.36* is within the *1.00 tolerance but I won't argue about wanting it even.

Like I said, whoever put your car back together just got it close and called it good. If you want it within spec, take it back and have them do it right. 99.9% of the people wouldn't notice it, but you did, so make them do it right. You paid for it.

If you want it corrected why ghetto fix it when the correct way is easier. You do realize the strut rods are under extreme tension under severe braking? Slam on the brakes and +80% of the weight transferred to the front wheels, the body wants to keep moving forward, the only thing holding the body back is the two strut rods. If you happen to hit a bump or pothole while braking, now you have many times the weight of the car trying to pull the strut rods apart and you want to start grinding on them?

CL-S progression 01

iTrader: (2)

^^ ok now that sounds like a solution hopefully..

yea I don't understand that 2*48' lol.. i just want it virtually even and the front passenger side is exactly 1/2 inch shorter of a wheelbase. which is a lot IMHO. so i think

just by putting your fingers in the wheel well you can tell it's pinky closer the the rear of the fender. and that really pisses me off, since i'm just super picky.... unfortunately.

when u say the front beam... do you mean the beam which the radius rod bushing attaches to?

i thought that is one long beam? what do i do, loosen the bolts on one side of the long beam, push it forward a half inch and then re-tighten?

it sounds promising and i really appreciate the explanation and everything. I just cannot visualize what needs to be done. if you could please shed a little more light on this matter. that would be just awesome man. thanks

CL-S progression 01

iTrader: (2)

well i just talked my 2 acura techs and they said yes it can be done but it will only get .2 degrees and I need 1 full degree. so looks like i will do it the old fashion way.

grind time

thanks tho for the info bud. wish it would of been a full fix

RooEng

#10
http://www.hondaoriginalparts.com/ho...0&block_03=151

Loosen the body mounts, loosen the bolts that attach the front beam to the rear beam. Hammer away. It'll be easier if you can take the weight of the engine off the mounts and you'll need jack stands behind the front wheels. When you take a good look under the car, you should be able to figure it out. You'll even see reference marks where the front beam meets the rear, where you can tell it's made to be adjusted.

RooEng

Sorry. if you are not even going to try, nobody can help you. Ghetto time.

CL-S progression 01

iTrader: (2)

no worries.. i'll post the pix of the bar once it's done. it'll fine really. i just have to grind it perfectly. which i'll be able to do

friesm2000

iTrader: (4)

so your measurement was by measuring with your fingers, and not even a tape measure on the strut rods themselves, or even again using a tape measure to measure from the center of the hub, to the back of the wheel well (like people do with ride height)


also maybe you should try putting new strut rod bushings in the non-hit side if not done so already, because the "spring rate" of those bushings will be different between both sides, and old and new (and they are going to be pushed to the limit with, especially under heavier braking, and any difference is going to show up)

friesm2000

iTrader: (4)

some leeway there, but not very much generally though

CL-S progression 01

iTrader: (2)

that's a good thought about putting a new one in on the other side, but I checked with acura and when they gave me the car back it had both the original bushings in there and it was off by the exact same amount, unfortunately. so i highly doubt i would yield a result.

i did measure each side and my wheelbase on the passenger side is 1/2 inch shorter than the drivers side. both radius rod bushings are in virtually new condition. i used my fingers to verify the wheel is out of place in the wheel well in comparison to the other side. (just to make sure it's not the entire frame of the car that got shortened by 1/2 inch LOL) and it's clearly a finger further back in the wheel well :-(

my last thought tho is I may be able to swap the bushings around since the RR bushing is shorter than the front bushing, so in theory if i were to put the front one in the rear then technically it'd push the the arm position backwards. how much.. i am not sure.

but that may F up something else since the bushings are designed to be a certain way. I will ask my acura tech tomorrow. i'm going to his house at 1 so he can bust this rod out of the car. I'll ask which of my 2 ideas are a better choice.

but if i grind down that rod, i'll snap a few pix for everyone to see so they know it's not jimmyrigging. just gotta take ur time and grind a bit of metal then check it and so forth.

fsttyms1

I would adjust the Cradle first. I had a similar issue and that pretty much fixed it. (didnt have it aligned right after the 6 speed swap) Also in the accident, did you replace the lower arm? If not that may be slightly bent causing it too.

CL-S progression 01

iTrader: (2)

every single thing on the right side was replaced after the accident. and still it was 1 degree off which is eqivalent to 1/2 inch. when I did a high speed brake yesterday the car pulled HARD to the right. like POS car hard lol.. so i had to do something about it. Just so happened my buddy had all the tools I didn't have to get the job done.

but today I finally got the chance to tackle this beast. sorry I didn't take pictures since I just wanted to geter done.

tools i used were:
- 1/2 inch drive breaker bar and ratchet and extension(s)
- 3/8 ratchet
- 10mm(abs line holder nut), 12mm (brake line holder), 14mm (top strut U connection), 17mm shorty and extended (for the ball joint crown nut, and for the strut U connection where it ties into the lower control arm, and for the radius rod bolt located under the splashguard in the subframe), 19mm extended is easier to get on the radius rod bolts that tie into the lower control arm it since it will be rubbing the drive axle, due to very little clearance (half inch drive) and u'll need to use a 6 inch extension or so or else u'll have very little room.

If u can get an impact gun in there then u'll just need the 19mm long socket.

I believe that is it. I apologize if I left anything out, but I don't think i did.

Impact gun helps a lot i must say. I used the mastercraft electric one and it's pretty damn good if i may say so myself (thanks mom! :-)

for w/e it's worth in order to remove the radius rod you'll need to:

1- remove the upper control arm ball joint nut (so you can move the knuckle around) just smash it with a mini sludge with the bolt still on 4-5 threads
2- remove abs wire holder, and brake line holder
3- remove the strut U-bracket(i dunno its correct name) then push down on the knuckle assembly and u'll be able to slide it down off the strut body.. then remove it.
4- you will need to remove the strut entirely or else you'll have almost no clearance 2, 12mm bolts and 3, 14 mm bolts
5- then crack the 2, 19mm bolts, but do not fully remove or else when u go to the next step the rod will just turn in circles (they are on TIGHT, very tight, so be prepared)
6- remove 17mm bolt in the subframe going in the radius rod
7- now u can remove the 2 19mm bolts and the arm is all yours.

took me about 1 hour and a half to take it out, bring it inside, grind it down a 1/2 inch then reinstall everything.

hopefully this will help someone cause i attempted this once in my driveway at home without all the tools listed and could do the friggin job.

cheers :-)

OperationDarkie

iTrader: (1)

So basically you just fixed a problem the body shop should have done???

Least that is what your post says to me.

CL-S progression 01

iTrader: (2)

a body shop wouldn't so what I did to fix the caster.

I physically grinded down the new radius rod a half inch..

I highly highly doubt anyone would have done that for me... and it was free since I did it so I wouldn't want someone else touching my car anyways.