Bisimoto Cams
09-13-2011, 05:09 AM
#1
Bisimoto Cams
This is what I received from Bisimoto on their cams for the J32. I'm concerned about regrinding. Has anyone ever used them or have a better alternative?
Hello Jeff,
Thank-you for your interest in Bisimoto technology for your build! With Bisimoto camshaft regrind services our machine shop has state of the art specifically machinery designed and dedicated for grinding OEM camshafts with no adverse effects to quality or integrity of the material. After the service is done the lobes are then treated with a special coating that will allow the camshafts to break in properly with out causing scoring to either the rockers nor the camshafts and will have OEM life spans.
For more information or to place an order please check our web site at Bisimoto.com or call 888-922-6686 (9am-6pm Mon-Fri pacific time)
P.S. Link to Super Street Magazine article: Super Street Bisimoto CR-Z
Sincerely,
---------------
Bisimoto.com
Tech Department
Bisimoto Engineering
1916 S. Lynx Place
Ontario CA 91761
U.S.A.
Hello Jeff,
Thank-you for your interest in Bisimoto technology for your build! With Bisimoto camshaft regrind services our machine shop has state of the art specifically machinery designed and dedicated for grinding OEM camshafts with no adverse effects to quality or integrity of the material. After the service is done the lobes are then treated with a special coating that will allow the camshafts to break in properly with out causing scoring to either the rockers nor the camshafts and will have OEM life spans.
For more information or to place an order please check our web site at Bisimoto.com or call 888-922-6686 (9am-6pm Mon-Fri pacific time)
P.S. Link to Super Street Magazine article: Super Street Bisimoto CR-Z
Sincerely,
---------------
Bisimoto.com
Tech Department
Bisimoto Engineering
1916 S. Lynx Place
Ontario CA 91761
U.S.A.
Last edited by fsttyms1; 09-15-2011 at 12:34 PM.
09-13-2011, 10:51 AM
#3
http://www.j32a.com/showthread.php?p=12317#post12317
1 guy has them installed already on J32a.com -- see above
Based on discussion with NVA-AV6, we would be concerned with the heat treating process after the regrind. NVA-AV6 has some experience with regrinds in J series motors and they have had early failures.
Maybe Bisimoto got it right...we'll have to wait and see how they hold up on the J32a.com members car.
quoted from NVA-AV6:
most OE cams are oil hardened O2 grade after machining which is what allows the lobes to deal with the pressures from the rockers against the valves, whearas most regrinds seem to use flame hardening which does not allow for the carbon transfer of oil hardeneing and does not produce nearly the surface abrasion resistance needed.
1 guy has them installed already on J32a.com -- see above
Based on discussion with NVA-AV6, we would be concerned with the heat treating process after the regrind. NVA-AV6 has some experience with regrinds in J series motors and they have had early failures.
Maybe Bisimoto got it right...we'll have to wait and see how they hold up on the J32a.com members car.
quoted from NVA-AV6:
most OE cams are oil hardened O2 grade after machining which is what allows the lobes to deal with the pressures from the rockers against the valves, whearas most regrinds seem to use flame hardening which does not allow for the carbon transfer of oil hardeneing and does not produce nearly the surface abrasion resistance needed.
09-13-2011, 11:07 AM
#4
Whats up with RDX owners?
iTrader: (9)
Pauls issues were with Web regrinds IIRC, which is the company that does Bisi's regrinds. As far as I know, Bisi doesn't do any regrinds in house. It was also a pain in the ass getting a straight answer out of their techs when I called about the treatment process.
Last edited by civicdrivr; 09-13-2011 at 11:15 AM.
09-13-2011, 05:47 PM
#6
I did some Cryo with the spindles on my old vette which stopped them from breaking. Then the half shafts started breaking though. Technically not a hardening process but might add to the life span.
09-13-2011, 07:57 PM
#7
Thank-you for posting my email. Here at Bisimoto we have been doing camshaft design as well camshaft regrinding services for some time now for Honda and other manufacture camshafts.
We have not experienced any adverse effects with the process we have done with regrinds of OEM Honda/Acura cores. With many customers that have had years of driving in daily driven street cars as well serious race cars.
Honda/Acura camshafts heat treatment process from the OEM factory actually reaches many millimeters into the camshaft lobes and will not require to be re-treated after the our cam grinding service is done.
If further treatment is done to harden the camshaft it will cause extreme rocker arm wear which we have seen from experience during testing at our facility.
Bisimoto J-series camshafts were first developed for competitive off road buggy's with J32 swaped motors racing for hundreds of miles in the deserts that needed a competitive edge. We then decided to release this service for the general public.
We have not experienced any adverse effects with the process we have done with regrinds of OEM Honda/Acura cores. With many customers that have had years of driving in daily driven street cars as well serious race cars.
Honda/Acura camshafts heat treatment process from the OEM factory actually reaches many millimeters into the camshaft lobes and will not require to be re-treated after the our cam grinding service is done.
If further treatment is done to harden the camshaft it will cause extreme rocker arm wear which we have seen from experience during testing at our facility.
Bisimoto J-series camshafts were first developed for competitive off road buggy's with J32 swaped motors racing for hundreds of miles in the deserts that needed a competitive edge. We then decided to release this service for the general public.
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09-14-2011, 09:04 AM
#13
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09-14-2011, 09:46 AM
#15
Did you already bore your block ?
If not ,I would add a block gaurd before boring it to help handle it.
I did not install one in my block before boring it.And now I don't want to take a chance of tweeking the cylinders installing one.
I'm not sure how tight it is to fit the kms one's are but,the best time to install them is before you bore the block.
If your going to be boosting after it's bored I definitly recommend the block gaurds.
If not ,I would add a block gaurd before boring it to help handle it.
I did not install one in my block before boring it.And now I don't want to take a chance of tweeking the cylinders installing one.
I'm not sure how tight it is to fit the kms one's are but,the best time to install them is before you bore the block.
If your going to be boosting after it's bored I definitly recommend the block gaurds.
09-14-2011, 10:08 AM
#18
Following someone else's words is crazy KA.
Have you boosted a 3.7 till fail before ?
Do you know of anyone thats cracked cylinders with this configuration before ?
my guess is no to both.
I think if compression is brought down in a bored build with dished pistons you could definitly boost it.
The question is just : How much can it take ?
Have you boosted a 3.7 till fail before ?
Do you know of anyone thats cracked cylinders with this configuration before ?
my guess is no to both.
I think if compression is brought down in a bored build with dished pistons you could definitly boost it.
The question is just : How much can it take ?
09-14-2011, 11:08 AM
#19
Whats up with RDX owners?
iTrader: (9)
The issue with boost on a 3.7 is the sleeve thickness. Boring out to 90mm is close to the service limit of the stock sleeves. A block guard, low compression, or custom pistons isn't going to guard against that.
If you want to boost it on stock sleeves, go right ahead. Id like to see numbers, but don't bitch when you blow it up.
If you want to boost it on stock sleeves, go right ahead. Id like to see numbers, but don't bitch when you blow it up.
Last edited by civicdrivr; 09-14-2011 at 11:11 AM.
09-14-2011, 01:16 PM
#20
At this time we can not show the dyno numbers being that the racers that they were designed for wish not to share there results due to the competitive nature of their racing. All I can say is that they were very happy with the results.
09-14-2011, 11:39 PM
#21
Following someone else's words is crazy KA.
Have you boosted a 3.7 till fail before ?
Do you know of anyone thats cracked cylinders with this configuration before ?
my guess is no to both.
I think if compression is brought down in a bored build with dished pistons you could definitly boost it.
The question is just : How much can it take ?
Have you boosted a 3.7 till fail before ?
Do you know of anyone thats cracked cylinders with this configuration before ?
my guess is no to both.
I think if compression is brought down in a bored build with dished pistons you could definitly boost it.
The question is just : How much can it take ?
09-15-2011, 08:10 AM
#22
He or anyone never even boosted a 3.7 to my knowledge.I've done heavy looking.
So without fail no one knows where the limits are. blocks are plentiful and alot of times if a cylinder gets cracked thats it as long as a ring does not break too.
So without fail no one knows where the limits are. blocks are plentiful and alot of times if a cylinder gets cracked thats it as long as a ring does not break too.
09-15-2011, 11:14 AM
#23
Rich,
You don't always need testing on an exact sample to know if your intended desire will work/fail. All engines have a service limit due to the composition of the metals and their behavior under extreme pressure. Stroke comes into play as well, a bigger crank also adds stress on cylinder walls because at some point in the stroke you will be getting more of a horizontal push on the piston than a vertical push. Just because it hasn't been done doesn't mean that no one knows what they are talking about.
You don't always need testing on an exact sample to know if your intended desire will work/fail. All engines have a service limit due to the composition of the metals and their behavior under extreme pressure. Stroke comes into play as well, a bigger crank also adds stress on cylinder walls because at some point in the stroke you will be getting more of a horizontal push on the piston than a vertical push. Just because it hasn't been done doesn't mean that no one knows what they are talking about.
09-15-2011, 11:55 AM
#24
I understand but it has yet been attempted.
So I will stick to
"I think if compression is brought down in a bored build with dished pistons you could definitly boost it.
The question is just : How much can it take ?"
Till someone destroys a engine
So I will stick to
"I think if compression is brought down in a bored build with dished pistons you could definitly boost it.
The question is just : How much can it take ?"
Till someone destroys a engine
09-15-2011, 12:07 PM
#25
Whats up with RDX owners?
iTrader: (9)
I nominate you to find out.
09-15-2011, 12:33 PM
#26
I only need a few hundred more dollars to get my build rolling.
will I boost ? I dought it.
If nobody picks up my nitrous kit before it's built I will probablly end up trying to sooner or later.
I don't mind taking wedding gifts if you want to get the show rolling.
I Just signed a marriage licence today with our hands on the bible and all. It just hit me today that I'm really getting married.
will I boost ? I dought it.
If nobody picks up my nitrous kit before it's built I will probablly end up trying to sooner or later.
I don't mind taking wedding gifts if you want to get the show rolling.
I Just signed a marriage licence today with our hands on the bible and all. It just hit me today that I'm really getting married.
09-15-2011, 04:06 PM
#27
Whats up with RDX owners?
iTrader: (9)
Sorry to hear that.
09-15-2011, 05:12 PM
#30
But going with dished pistons or enlarging the combustion cambers would have nothing to do with the stroke. just lower compression
I will be going higher with the compression.As high as possible on premium.
I want all motor. no turbo,no super charger,no nitrous.
All that is just extra expensive stuff to have problems.
09-15-2011, 06:54 PM
#31
I Drive Like A Dick 8≈
+1
:ROFL:
I'm no scientist but isn't it simply a matter of physics for when the block will fail? I'm sure with some digging and someone with the right knowledge it wouldn't take much to figure out how much pressure a 3.7 could handle before failure.
But then again I'm no scientist
:ROFL:
I'm no scientist but isn't it simply a matter of physics for when the block will fail? I'm sure with some digging and someone with the right knowledge it wouldn't take much to figure out how much pressure a 3.7 could handle before failure.
But then again I'm no scientist
09-16-2011, 12:23 PM
#32
Senior Moderator
+1
:ROFL:
I'm no scientist but isn't it simply a matter of physics for when the block will fail? I'm sure with some digging and someone with the right knowledge it wouldn't take much to figure out how much pressure a 3.7 could handle before failure.
But then again I'm no scientist
:ROFL:
I'm no scientist but isn't it simply a matter of physics for when the block will fail? I'm sure with some digging and someone with the right knowledge it wouldn't take much to figure out how much pressure a 3.7 could handle before failure.
But then again I'm no scientist
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