3.5 ordered ....
#41
Suzuka Master
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Chicago Suburbs
Age: 43
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Originally posted by typeR
no not even close...315/260 but to put this in prospective at an 1/8th mile track a stock cl-S runs between 10.0 and 9.7 i run 9.5 to 9.4 the 3.5 has done a 9.1 with poor traction...i think my draggers might solve that problem and could bring a 8.9** this winter 8.9** is a given into the high 13's 1/4
so it's no miracle drug but ,it'll hange with some of the big boys
no not even close...315/260 but to put this in prospective at an 1/8th mile track a stock cl-S runs between 10.0 and 9.7 i run 9.5 to 9.4 the 3.5 has done a 9.1 with poor traction...i think my draggers might solve that problem and could bring a 8.9** this winter 8.9** is a given into the high 13's 1/4
so it's no miracle drug but ,it'll hange with some of the big boys
#43
Senior Moderator
Thread Starter
Originally posted by Maximized
How far is it to the nearest 1/4 track??? Take your car there and you will finally get some numbers of what your car really runs, instead of educated guessing.
How far is it to the nearest 1/4 track??? Take your car there and you will finally get some numbers of what your car really runs, instead of educated guessing.
#44
Originally posted by ThoroDredCLS
I say leave the 3.2 on the back. Ultimate sleeper for the idiots that lurke our boards. When you pull beside mustangs and shit, the look on their face will be priceless.
I say leave the 3.2 on the back. Ultimate sleeper for the idiots that lurke our boards. When you pull beside mustangs and shit, the look on their face will be priceless.
![Big Grin](https://acurazine.com/forums/images/smilies/biggrin.gif)
3.5 block = >$2K
Rental of GEO Metro for 3 days = $5
Look on the faces of 4.6 Foney car drivers = FKin PRICELESS
Juker008
#46
Originally posted by typeR
no not even close...315/260 but to put this in prospective at an 1/8th mile track a stock cl-S runs between 10.0 and 9.7 i run 9.5 to 9.4 the 3.5 has done a 9.1 with poor traction...i think my draggers might solve that problem and could bring a 8.9** this winter 8.9** is a given into the high 13's 1/4
so it's no miracle drug but ,it'll hange with some of the big boys
no not even close...315/260 but to put this in prospective at an 1/8th mile track a stock cl-S runs between 10.0 and 9.7 i run 9.5 to 9.4 the 3.5 has done a 9.1 with poor traction...i think my draggers might solve that problem and could bring a 8.9** this winter 8.9** is a given into the high 13's 1/4
so it's no miracle drug but ,it'll hange with some of the big boys
![Big Grin](https://acurazine.com/forums/images/smilies/biggrin.gif)
And if we ever take on RX-8s have that thumb on the button to spray on his ass just in case.
I can just imagine it. The anouncer on the PA. "Here we have a CL Type-S staging on the left and on the right we have a Z28. WOHOA Look at that Z28 do that burn out. Oh hoa, we I think we know the out come of this one. And there they go. Wha...Whats this the CLS is pulling HARDDD, what, what the CLS WON!!
Fkin PRICELESS
Juker008
#47
Woa woa woa....I just did the math and with the weight that I think that I was at last time at the track of 3450 with no passenger seat and 1 gal. of gas. So with 3450lbs. and jsut the 3.5 conversion we would only do "14.36 @ 96.06mph". So for us to smoke Z28 we need at least 310hp to do
"13.26 @ 104.04mph"
Juker008
"13.26 @ 104.04mph"
Juker008
#52
Team Owner
crazzay.. hahaha good shit TypeR....
3.5 + header+intake+exhausts+Pulleyz+Comptech Supercharger(tell Doug to make some Modifications to the SC to fit 3.5)+slicks+Racing gas+100 Shots and + some 20 inch Type R badge.
OMG....... u fuckers do the math.. HAHHAHAHAHA.. do we see a 11 sec CLS???? hahahhahahah
3.5 + header+intake+exhausts+Pulleyz+Comptech Supercharger(tell Doug to make some Modifications to the SC to fit 3.5)+slicks+Racing gas+100 Shots and + some 20 inch Type R badge.
![Big Grin](https://acurazine.com/forums/images/smilies/biggrin.gif)
![Big Grin](https://acurazine.com/forums/images/smilies/biggrin.gif)
![Big Grin](https://acurazine.com/forums/images/smilies/biggrin.gif)
#53
Originally posted by oonowindoo
crazzay.. hahaha good shit TypeR....
3.5 + header+intake+exhausts+Pulleyz+Comptech Supercharger(tell Doug to make some Modifications to the SC to fit 3.5)+slicks+Racing gas+100 Shots and + some 20 inch Type R badge.
OMG....... u fuckers do the math.. HAHHAHAHAHA.. do we see a 11 sec CLS???? hahahhahahah
crazzay.. hahaha good shit TypeR....
3.5 + header+intake+exhausts+Pulleyz+Comptech Supercharger(tell Doug to make some Modifications to the SC to fit 3.5)+slicks+Racing gas+100 Shots and + some 20 inch Type R badge.
![Big Grin](https://acurazine.com/forums/images/smilies/biggrin.gif)
![Big Grin](https://acurazine.com/forums/images/smilies/biggrin.gif)
![Big Grin](https://acurazine.com/forums/images/smilies/biggrin.gif)
11 Secs. Yea I agree......but the SC won't fit the 3.5 conversion why????
Juker008
#56
Senior Moderator
Thread Starter
Originally posted by acuraboy
does the 3.5 require any type of mew fuel management strategy or does it come with one?
does the 3.5 require any type of mew fuel management strategy or does it come with one?
#57
Originally posted by acuraboy
does the 3.5 require any type of mew fuel management strategy or does it come with one?
does the 3.5 require any type of mew fuel management strategy or does it come with one?
Just curious as why u would think so. No not flaming u. Fuel management strategy, whay a whole new way of introducing fuel to the engine? Is it because u think that more power would require more fuel, is that it?
Juker008
#58
thanks for your effort in assuring that i didn't take your question as a flame. it was very appreciated considering the climate of some of the threads lately.
anyway, here's my reasoning: when i swapped in a 5.8 instead of my 5.0 in my bronk, it was so weak with the stock injectors (19#) and FMU. i then swapped in injectors from a Lightning (30# i believe) and the Lightning PCM and then i was lighting them up all over the place.
i realize that a 5.0 to 5.8 swap is much bigger jump in displacement that 3.2 to 3.5 but there's still a difference in displacement. was just wondering if the stock fuel system can support the increased displacement. i don't think more power neccessarily calls for more fuel. in the case of SC's some manufacturers actually call for less fuel if not retarded timing. but that's a whole other ball of wax.
by strategy i mean is there a sequential fire to bank fire conversion? do we keep the same firing order? do we need to retard or advance anything? do we need to get bigger fuel lines? bigger fuel injectors? different fuel regulator?
again i realize that we're only talking about .3L change here but i don't know much about these engines to assume one way or the other.
thanks,
mike
anyway, here's my reasoning: when i swapped in a 5.8 instead of my 5.0 in my bronk, it was so weak with the stock injectors (19#) and FMU. i then swapped in injectors from a Lightning (30# i believe) and the Lightning PCM and then i was lighting them up all over the place.
i realize that a 5.0 to 5.8 swap is much bigger jump in displacement that 3.2 to 3.5 but there's still a difference in displacement. was just wondering if the stock fuel system can support the increased displacement. i don't think more power neccessarily calls for more fuel. in the case of SC's some manufacturers actually call for less fuel if not retarded timing. but that's a whole other ball of wax.
by strategy i mean is there a sequential fire to bank fire conversion? do we keep the same firing order? do we need to retard or advance anything? do we need to get bigger fuel lines? bigger fuel injectors? different fuel regulator?
again i realize that we're only talking about .3L change here but i don't know much about these engines to assume one way or the other.
thanks,
mike
#59
Originally posted by acuraboy
in the case of SC's some manufacturers actually call for less fuel if not retarded timing. but that's a whole other ball of wax.
in the case of SC's some manufacturers actually call for less fuel if not retarded timing. but that's a whole other ball of wax.
Plz explain more.
Originally posted by acuraboy
by strategy i mean is there a sequential fire to bank fire conversion?
by strategy i mean is there a sequential fire to bank fire conversion?
Originally posted by acuraboy
do we keep the same firing order? do we need to retard or advance anything? do we need to get bigger fuel lines? bigger fuel injectors? different fuel regulator?
again i realize that we're only talking about .3L change here but i don't know much about these engines to assume one way or the other.[/B]
do we keep the same firing order? do we need to retard or advance anything? do we need to get bigger fuel lines? bigger fuel injectors? different fuel regulator?
again i realize that we're only talking about .3L change here but i don't know much about these engines to assume one way or the other.[/B]
U know I thought of the same thing. After some point we are gonna need to upgrade our fuel delivery system, but at what hp point I don't know? If we do have to upgrade, we would have to go with Acura parts, right? The only solution that I can think of is to take NSX injectors and possibly the NSX ECU. But I would think that the NSX's ECU won't work do to the NSX being DOHC. So I would assume that a JET ECU upgrade would be in order. Fuel lines I would think would be easy, right? I mean all we would have to do is throw in a larger (inner diameter) fuel line, right? As for the regulator the AEM fuel pressure regualator that should do just fine for a high hp project, or does it have its limits? And as for the timing we would have to get our ECUs done to allow us to electronic-ly adjust our timing. So again a trip to JET with our ECUs is in order.
Here is a question that mabey u can answer for me:
http://www.acura-cl.com/forums/showt...threadid=79812
Juker008
#60
Does the 3.5 block bolt up to the stock 3.2 engine mounts? For the Tech. guru's here, do you think it would be worth getting both the 3.5L upgrade and the SC? Will the stock ecu be capable to deal with both upgrades?
#61
Originally posted by CL SLeePeR
Does the 3.5 block bolt up to the stock 3.2 engine mounts? For the Tech. guru's here, do you think it would be worth getting both the 3.5L upgrade and the SC? Will the stock ecu be capable to deal with both upgrades?
Does the 3.5 block bolt up to the stock 3.2 engine mounts? For the Tech. guru's here, do you think it would be worth getting both the 3.5L upgrade and the SC? Will the stock ecu be capable to deal with both upgrades?
I believe JET can take care of that.
Juker008
#62
typeR:
Only problem bro is with the compression ratio you're running...there's no way in hell you can boost or nitrous that thing...that's what kept me from buying it this summer...so I'll be going another route hopefully...but congrats! This Christmas when I'm down there we'll have to race![Smile](https://acurazine.com/forums/images/smilies/smile.gif)
Austin519
Only problem bro is with the compression ratio you're running...there's no way in hell you can boost or nitrous that thing...that's what kept me from buying it this summer...so I'll be going another route hopefully...but congrats! This Christmas when I'm down there we'll have to race
![Smile](https://acurazine.com/forums/images/smilies/smile.gif)
Austin519
#63
Senior Moderator
Thread Starter
Originally posted by Austin519
typeR:
Only problem bro is with the compression ratio you're running...there's no way in hell you can boost or nitrous that thing...that's what kept me from buying it this summer...so I'll be going another route hopefully...but congrats! This Christmas when I'm down there we'll have to race![Smile](https://acurazine.com/forums/images/smilies/smile.gif)
Austin519
typeR:
Only problem bro is with the compression ratio you're running...there's no way in hell you can boost or nitrous that thing...that's what kept me from buying it this summer...so I'll be going another route hopefully...but congrats! This Christmas when I'm down there we'll have to race
![Smile](https://acurazine.com/forums/images/smilies/smile.gif)
Austin519
#64
Senior Moderator
Thread Starter
Originally posted by CL SLeePeR
Does the 3.5 block bolt up to the stock 3.2 engine mounts? For the Tech. guru's here, do you think it would be worth getting both the 3.5L upgrade and the SC? Will the stock ecu be capable to deal with both upgrades?
Does the 3.5 block bolt up to the stock 3.2 engine mounts? For the Tech. guru's here, do you think it would be worth getting both the 3.5L upgrade and the SC? Will the stock ecu be capable to deal with both upgrades?
#65
in an SC application ur stuffing more oxygen under pressure into a closed system relative to the naturally aspirated volume of oxygen. the combined factors of the combustion chamber having more oxygen AND being under pressure makes the environment that much more volatile = prone to detonation. some people have taken the approach of reducing the volume of fuel = sticking with stock fuel system with a SC to reduce the air fuel ratio. i think this approach, or any approach used to reducing detonation or other rich fuel conditions is really sensitive to the application.
as for what we'd actually have to change, that answer sorta ties into the link u included to ur other question (which i think the other folks addessed nicely). yes, FI engines typically run higher fuel pressures but u must also consdier the pulse width of the injector itself. in other words, how long is the injector open under the 40+ psi condition? there are many variables to manipulate more fuel into the chamber. you can increase the pressure so that in the same windo of time for which the injector is open, more fuel is pushed through. you can increase the window of time for which the injector is open so that even with stock pressure more fuel passes though. you can also increase the physical opening of the injector so that with the same pressure and the same pulse width but a bigger less-restrictive injector you can pass more fuel.
as was mentioned, carb'ed motors do run on vacuum. much of the engine is controlled by vacuum, including their timing. in this respect, those engines are so much more forgiving to power adders. there's a reason why it's so easy to pull mor ethat 1 horsepower per cubic inch of displacement from them. the tradeoff is that they are not the cleanest and most efficient of motors. those engines were also under-engineerded because the climate of the day was such that people did not want to buy a car whose motor was maxed out. muscle car purchasers weren't buying muscle so much as they were buying potential for it. yes there were the Yenko's of the era where u can go from showroom to racetrack and blow everyone away but those were very limited production #s and not the norm.
oh yeah...bank firing is when (in a v-block motor) the computer fires an entire bank of injectors at one time. this is pretty old and sloppy technology but it was cheap. the more recent and efficient strategy is called sequential fire - essential the injector is fired in sequence with the spark plug assuring that the fuel is still atomized appropriately.
hope this made some kinda sense
as for what we'd actually have to change, that answer sorta ties into the link u included to ur other question (which i think the other folks addessed nicely). yes, FI engines typically run higher fuel pressures but u must also consdier the pulse width of the injector itself. in other words, how long is the injector open under the 40+ psi condition? there are many variables to manipulate more fuel into the chamber. you can increase the pressure so that in the same windo of time for which the injector is open, more fuel is pushed through. you can increase the window of time for which the injector is open so that even with stock pressure more fuel passes though. you can also increase the physical opening of the injector so that with the same pressure and the same pulse width but a bigger less-restrictive injector you can pass more fuel.
as was mentioned, carb'ed motors do run on vacuum. much of the engine is controlled by vacuum, including their timing. in this respect, those engines are so much more forgiving to power adders. there's a reason why it's so easy to pull mor ethat 1 horsepower per cubic inch of displacement from them. the tradeoff is that they are not the cleanest and most efficient of motors. those engines were also under-engineerded because the climate of the day was such that people did not want to buy a car whose motor was maxed out. muscle car purchasers weren't buying muscle so much as they were buying potential for it. yes there were the Yenko's of the era where u can go from showroom to racetrack and blow everyone away but those were very limited production #s and not the norm.
oh yeah...bank firing is when (in a v-block motor) the computer fires an entire bank of injectors at one time. this is pretty old and sloppy technology but it was cheap. the more recent and efficient strategy is called sequential fire - essential the injector is fired in sequence with the spark plug assuring that the fuel is still atomized appropriately.
hope this made some kinda sense
#66
Originally posted by typeR
yes and probablly..there' is someone doing this now...doug said to expect him on the board...
yes and probablly..there' is someone doing this now...doug said to expect him on the board...
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