I've searched, I've read, I've looked at pictures abd it only goes so far. I'd like to put my needs into words and have those of you with Experience give me some feedback.

First, if anyone is near Chattanooga, TN please let me know as I'd like to see TSX's with different suspensoins.

I sold my Integra Type-R about a week ago and have owned a Type-R for the last 5 years. It was time to move on and the TSX is what the wife and I together were looking for. Sport Sedan pretty much sums it up. It's a 2005 6Spd which was my requirement and has 4 doors which was her requirements.

I am not dying to modify this like I did my Type-R (Had Zeal S6's, TEIN HA's, Zeal B6's on it through it's journey). I want something that one might say looks stock but doesn't look 4X4. By that I was very happy with the stock ride height of the Type-R which was 1" lower than a GSR (Pro kit on a GSR = Type-R Springs on a GSR). I am posting a pic of the Type-R on stock suspension on the bottom of the post for comparison.

All of that said I want something that rides as nice as possible that will give the car the "Honda designed this with minimal wheel gap" look. BMW does it best and I've even read some comparisions here about that too. I will be getting a Comptech swaybar as well (Unless there is a better option).

Based on the pictures and research I've narrowed if down to a few systems. please let me know your suggestions.

1) A-Spec- $599: Honda quality, but I am concerned the drop will be too mild.

2) Eibach Pro-System - $496: Still not available despite you guys waiting since March. Not willing to wait till September for an unknown system. Worried the ride will not be as nice.

3) Eibach Pro Kit (Stock shocks) - $250: Worried this drop is too low for what I want. I don't want clearance issues and don't want it to look dropped just low enough to look right. Still worried the ride will not be as nice.

4) H&R Sport Springs (Stock Shocks) - $250: This drop is between the A-Spec and the Pro-kit but no one seems to be using them.

5) Comptech Springs (Stock shocks) - $250: Seems to be the same as the Pro-kit although I can't figure out these 6 digit numbners you guys are throwing out. 155 vs 160? I have friends at Comptech from orgainizing the 2003/2004 Type-R Expo so there is a chance I could get a deal but worried these will drop too much too. Also worried that the ride will not be as nice.

I will most likely be putting an OEM body kit on the car as well. Thanks for the help guys!

 

Just to add more info, I have ruled out all of the TEIN setups some of you all are running as 10/6 is just too stiff for me in this car. I've run 14/12 on the street on the Type-R and it wasn't all that bad but the goal with this car is completely different and ride quality matters.

 

Forget about option 3, 4 and 5 with stock shocks, as you will not like the ride. Sounds like you need some coilovers with height and dampening adjustment to suit your needs.

 

I just got the A-spec installed. I love how the car rides. Its almost stock except it handles quite a bit better. My only beef is that the rear dropped almost perfectly for me (about 2 finger gap). While the front is still around a 3-4 finger gap. I wish the front and rear sat the same.

 

I don't really care to spend what coilovers will cost me and none of them have springs rates close to stock (And why should they.)

$599 was about the most I wanted to spend and that was on the A-Specs. THe uneven drop on the A-Spec concerns me.

I am willing to spend more than $599 if it maintins the ride quality but at this point not sure anything is worth it.

The more I look at the Pro-Kit the more I like it. The difficult part is all of the different level of drops that appear in pictures from the Pro-Kit.

 

You would be surprised how well the ride feels/handles with a set of properly matched coilovers, despite the listed higher spring rates. The suspension can't be simply compared by the spring rates alone, as the matching adjustable shocks are also an important factor. Then again, a nice set of coilovers also costs a little more...

 

I replaced just my springs with Comptech 110-155s and kept the OEM shocks. I would like a little more control over the shocks, so as soon as these go, I'll be getting Koni yellows. But if you total everything I did, might as well get coilovers. Sure I spent a little less, but then I'm pretty much set on ride height, which mine is between 1-1.5" drop. However, I have to deal with the shocks I have. It was a great mod and I'm pleased.. I now wish I had more adjustment. Coilovers are worth every penny.

 

I just installed Comptech 110-155 that sit on Neuspeed Konis. I am very satisfied with the drop and the ride quality. My main goal was to get as close to stock ride quality while eliminating wheel gap. I think I have succeeded!

$220.00 for Comptech 110-155 Springs
$569.00 for Neuspeed Koni Shocks
$130.00 for Ingalls Rear Camber Kit


Edit: I have heard many have adjusted their coilovers to ride close to stock.

 

so is the ride really bumpy with the oem shocks....would like some info before i installed the shocks i have or should i just go ahead and buy the tein coilovers

 

i got a eibach pro-kits matched with the koni yellows.. i love the drop, and im loving the ride.

 

I've got brand new boxed Neuspeed Koni's in my garage. I just need to get springs. All this talk about the Tein c/o riding close to stock is making me want to dump the Koni's and go with a c/o setup.

 

I'm very familiar with the value of a well valved shock to spring relationship but can't immagine a Pro-kit or Comptech spring being much higher rates than a stock shock (Anyone know all the rates?).

Despite being matched a TEIN 10kg/mm spring is around 550 lb/in vs an average stock rate being in the low 200's. That woudl mean a TEIN is almost 3 times as stiff. I rode on 14 kg/mm springs in my Type-R and the ride wasn't bad but it wasn't stock either.

I've tracked and autocrossed plenty and that isn;t really where this car is headed, but I would like it to look less lifted.

I'm really in the air about A-spec vs Pro Kits.

 

Just my

I have a-spec and the drop is not to the floor, but it does show. Total drop of 1" both front and back. The ride is improved and still a good ride quality. A-spec (add a rsb also) is a good deal and is under warranty so I went that direction.

 

There are 2 Comptech springs for the TSX. The old version is part# 110-155. The rates of this spring are approximately 10% stiffer than stock front and essentially equal to the stock rates in the rear. This spring will give you approximately a 1-1.25" drop all around. Given that the spring rate is so close to stock, you could probably get away w/ using them w/ your stock shocks for a while. If you want to buy these springs, you need to order 04+ TL springs. These are the same part# 110-155 and will fit the TSX with no problems.

The current spring that Comptech advertises for the TSX right now is the 110-160 spring. This spring is made by Eibach and for all intents and purposes are Pro-kit springs. They have the same drop and, though no one has actually measured the spring rate, we have concluded that the spring rate is identical to the Pro-Kit. Afterall, why would Eibach go through the trouble of designing a spring for Comptech that lowers the car exactly the same as their own Pro-kit spring, yet has a different spring rate. I would not recommend using these springs on stock shocks as many on this forum have complained that the ride became bouncey after the stock shocks wore out.

There are also a couple of options from Mugen. You can get their non-adjustable suspension which comes w/ springs and shocks (similar to A-spec). They quote a 1" drop, but the few who have this set up claim it's more like 1.25" drop all around. The spring rates are 10% stiffer than stock all around. Unfortunately, this set up is about $1,000. This would be very similar to the A-spec set up, but at a cost of $400 more.

If you are really worried about the 10K/6K spring rates of the Tein coilovers, your other option is the Tanabe Sustec Pro S-OC Type II coilover which has spring rates of 8K F and 6K R. Bender Unit has these and claims that the ride is very comfortable. The price is about $700 - may be even a few bucks less. I would prefer this over the A-spec b/c you have height adjustability and still have relatively soft spring rates.

If you want to take even more of an edge off the bumps, you can go with the Tanabe Sustec Pro S-OC which is essentially the same as the S-OC Type II, but it adds a softer helper spring. Cost is about $850 or so. Although I have not tried this set up myself, I am pretty sure that the ride on these would be very comfortable. Here's the link to Tanabe's Sustec Pro S-OC:

http://www.tanabe-usa.com/coilovers/s-oc.asp

 

Thansk for the info about Tanabe. They sound like a compromise of sorts. 4 kg/mm isn't too bad just wish the 8 kg/mm was lower. If for no other reason that spread (8kg to 4 kg) is likely to cause understeer. Typically a closer match of spring rates help rotation.

Sounds like I need Comptech 110-155 or A-SPec or Ante up for some Tanabes.

 

I have the type II's and love them... just a note. The springs settle a good amount, so if you get them make sure to leave room for that. Not that it matters cause they are adjustable and all...

 

But if you use the spring perch to increase the height, you also increase the spring rate at the same time.

 

Yes. The difference in spring rate is fairly large, but Tanabe will provide custom spring rates if you so choose.

One thing you have to keep in mind - the more you lower the car, the stiffer your springs will need to be or you will bottom out on your suspension. If you go w/ springs that are too soft and lower your car too much (even as little as 1.5" may be too much lowering for relatively soft springs) then you will end up w/ worse ride quality b/c the car will bottom out.

With respect to the understeer, the Comptech rear sway bar will make your car more neutral and provide improved turn-in response. You can also get a rear camber kit and adjust for less rear negative camber.

Regardless of what you decide to do, I would highly recommend starting off w/ the Comptech rear sway bar. It's cheap at about $100-110, super easy to install and the handling benefits were more noticeable than when I installed springs/shocks alone.

 

??? explain??



*still learning

 

Honestly, my setup is a perfect mix between having less wheel gap, a nice progressive spring, and not being so hard hitting. I have less to worry about blowing a shock because my drop is only 1". caz1604 did a good job listing the costs. I paid much less for the springs because I bought them from joerocket unused. Even if you get the TEINs you'll need the camber kit. My guess is, if you have shocks already, go for the springs and camber kit. You'll only be sacrificing adjustability of the perch in the coilovers, but my ride is not harsh what-so-ever and assuming you have adjustable shocks, you have more control over the ride than I do.

 

well here's the thing i bought some coilovers that are sleeves that go over your oem shocks ..i wanted to drop the car about an 1.5" i have an spc rear camber adj...its just i was wondering..if my ride would be really noticeable? i'm also ordering a rear sway bar so that should help a little ...i just want to save a little $ and get the teins in like a year or two..

 

If you are going to drop 1.5", then I would definitely suggest getting new shocks. OEMs won't handle that much of a drop for long as others have experienced. They simply aren't made for that. At a drop of 1", I figure I'll get a bit more use out of them before having to replace them.

I'm not sure what the average amount of time the OEMs last, but I've seen less than a few months on few at a 1.5" drop. In the end, you never really save money by doing mods. :-)

 

well damn koni shocks are freaking $150 apiece ...wel i guess i'm just going to have to get the tein basic coilovers ...b/c if i buy shocks and springs and blah blah blah i would have spent the same amount of money

 

Well, look at it this way, you definitely won't be disappointed in the TEINs and you'll have the ability to fully adjust. Trust me, if I didn't have so much invested in family (i.e. a son), I would've done the TEINs too. I got lucky to find the Comptechs being sold on the forum and at the right price b/c I had other major repairs to do.

 

FYI, I found the Koni's for our car, full set, $582 at shox.com.

 

I am not sure how you are saying a linear spring will increase spring stiffness. I may have misunderstood and the springs may be progressive but otherwise height shoudl not affect a linear spring since the value is the same reardless. Progressive will get stiffer as the lighter coils are used.

Even with a rear swaybar a general rule of thumb is close spacing of the spring rates. It's not uncommon to run higher spring rates in the rear to help induce oversteer. This isn't something I would recommend to just anyone and not really on a street car but it is a common practice that should be considered before trying to correct mismatched spring rates with swaybars.

That said, I do agree the comptech swaybar is a must do mod and will be ordering one. I think I will be doing that with a Comptech Icebox soon. Just need o pick a suspension.

 

The coilovers come with a specific "preload" setting which is the initial tension and height setting. This preload also prevents the spring from coming off the spring seat when the car is lifted. If you use the spring perch to increase the height, what it does essentially is increasing the preload tension by compressing the spring. The tension increase depends on the manufacture and type of springs. Some coilovers come with a separate lower body height adjustment without altering the spring rates. You can essentially use the spring perch to alter the spring rate, then use the lower body adjustment to change the overall ride height for a more custom ride/handling setup.

 

I am really not getting what you guys are saying and I've owned all the different setups and tyles o coilovers being referenced. A linear spring rate doesn't change even when compressed it is a constant. Lowering a perch should actually take compression off the spring and then the weight of the car is on the spring it will be under the same amount of compression anyway.

Now if the lowering of the coilover is independent of the spring and you can effect preload it will alter the handling and feel but still doesn't change the stiffness of the spring.

I coudl be missing the boat all together but I don't think there is as much effect on things as you guys are making it out to be.

 

Hmm gotcha (I think)... so technically if I am feeling a stiffer suspension now, after the springs have settled, I could raise? the spring perch and lower using the body adjustment to make it a softer ride?

 

It depends on the type of coilovers you have. Not all coilovers come with the lower body height adjustment. My Tein Flex does. If you only have height adjustment via the spring perch, then it's not a whole lot you can do to soften the ride unless the coilovers come with dampening adjustment.

 

Awesome setup, very comfortable ride quality retained, plug and play, and a nice improvement in handling. But you're right, the front retains a somewhat lifted look.

Probably not even September...............

Forget this if you are concerned with ride quality. The factory struts are not designed to be running around all the time compressed an extra 1.25" to 1.5". The seals will leak, the strut will lose pressure, and then your already incorrectly damped springs will not be damped at all. Then you will join the dozens of other people out there looking to replace their stock struts. On the TSX, this is not a maybe, it's only a question of how long......

You were running Zeals on a Type R-that obviously means that you know how to do things the right way.

What you really should do is get a ride in a Tein equipped TSX, wether it be Basics, SS or FLEX. I know the spring rates are scary, but it's all in the valving of the strut. A coworker of mine was running Eibach Sportlines on his RSX on stock struts. The ride was unbearable. My rates on my FLEX are 14k F and 8k R, and the car is still very compliant. My wife does not even realize I changed the suspension. And being able to change the height so that you get the drop that YOU want, and have adjustability (on the SS and FLEX) for the ride that YOU want, is worth the price of admission.

Another great choice is the 110-155 Comptech spring with the Neuspeed Koni strut. The Neuspeed version is an upgraded Koni Yellow with more spring perch settings and a shorter strut rod. You can get a set for under $600. What makes this setup nice is close to factory spring rates (stock is 280f/175r, 110-155 is 315f/170r) and a great damper, well matched to the mostly linear 110-155 spring, damper adjustability, and a little bit of height adjustment in the Koni as well.

 

ok yeah, i knew that, I was just giving a hypothetical to try to understand. Thanks man

 

Great info to chew on Lanny. Any thoughts on the Tanabes vs the TEINs?

 

There's only like, maybe two members that have the Tanabe's; I'm not really sure why because it's a well known name, a good price, and offers an adjustable drop along with the the softest rates out there.

One reason may be that they don't offer damper adjustability, so for less $$ you could get Tein Basics, which are basically identical in feature. And for not too much more, you can get damper adjustability with the Tein SS.

Still, many people come in looking for a drop, with minimal impact on ride quality, and the Tanabe's seem to fit that bill better than anything out there, at least on paper. Assuming they did the dampers right, they should ride great.

But, I'm with you on the imbalance between the front and rear spring rates; like AZ said, talk to Tanabe about spec'ing out a little more rate for the rear.......

 

I know of three of us that have Tanabes. I do, BenderUnit, and Chill (although I'm not sure if he ever posts). I think we all love the ride quality. They arn't much more then the tein basics (hopupracing.com has them for $775 with free shipping) and they have softer spring rates. To tell you the truth, the ride quality is so good I might think later about switching them for some Tein SS, as I was willing to give up some ride quality and these basically didn't give any.

 

Not having ridden in a Tanabe equipped TSX and basing this solely on what I've read and the specs, I would think the Tanabes are a good choice if ride quality is #1, and the Teins with their stiffer rates and more aggressive valving if handling is #1......but both appear to be great choices with little sacrifice on either front.

 

I think you're in a catch 22. Coilover sleeves would be OK on the stock shocks as long as you choose a soft spring rate - say maybe about 10-20% stiffer than stock.

However, the problem is, when you drop the car 1.5" and only increase spring rate 10-20%, the springs are not stiff enough to prevent the car from bottoming out. So, while you might not blow out your stock shocks given the relatively mild increase in spring rate, you will greatly increase your chances of bottoming out b/c of the 1.5" drop.

If you get springs that are 2X stiffer than stock to prevent bottoming out, your stock shocks could not cope w/ the high spring rate for long. In either case, you will have crappy ride quality.

To answer your question, yes, the poor ride quality will be very noticeable.

Save up your money and buy your suspension once. Don't try to get away with spending less up front because you will eventually end up spending more in the end.

 

I apologize for not being clear. My only point was that the more a car is lowered, the stiffer the spring is needed to prevent the suspension from bottoming out.

I agree that it is better to get the spring rates you want rather than to attempt to adjust handling balance by other means. Contact Tanabe and they can tell you what spring rates they offer for the TSX. Maybe you can get 6K F and 4K R springs that would be only about 20% stiffer than stock F and 30% stiffer R. Might as well check w/ Tein too to see if they offer custom spring rates.

 

thanks bro it helped me out alot..i think i am just going to order the tein basic's ...is there any noticeable benefits/problems with me getting those and going 1.5" - 2 " drop??

 

just make sure you get the camber kit as well...