Cusco Type I Lower Strut Bar Install
04-30-2005, 07:11 AM
#41
Matell
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Long read....56k Caution
***Mods, to keep things clean I've posted within this earlier post. If it's important enough feel free to break it into it's own post.***
I finally have the Cusco Strut tower bar, and the Type II lower arm brace installed. Unfortunately I ordered both Type I and II brace, and indeed you must use one or the other. The Type I brace IS the forward member of the Type II brace. So now I have a Type I brace to sell.
Oh and remember when reading the following I have the Comptech Sway bar, stock suspension, and OEM wheels and rubber.
Strut Tower Bar
My impressions of the install:
First I didn't have the access to a hoist so I had to do it the hard way. Jacking up the car and sliding in and out from underneath it is a mega b****.
The strut tower bar is very simple to install. Remove the three bolts on each side, place the foot plates of the bar over the exposed threaded shafts, reinstall the bolts and torque down to 44N.m (32.5 lb.ft) and it's done. A word of caution needs to be made about the close proximity and contact that's made between the air-conditioning pipes and the drivers side mount. I placed some foam tape on the pipes to try to minimize and contact.
On-Road:
I went for a quick drive around some roundabouts and did a 60kmh slalom along a few clear and secluded roads. It felt slightly more neutral than without the bar and a little tighter. Previously when doing this type of thing I could sense a little body flex in the front, but now it's not that obvious at all. I can now sense the rear sway working more, or maybe that's just I sign I should give the rubber bushings a lube.
Lower Arm Brace Type II
My impressions of the install:
First and foremost if you have access to a vehicle hoist....USE IT!!!!!!. It's a bitch trying to jack the car up enough to slide underneath.
Aside from access it's very quick and easy to install the lower bar. If you've got a big long extension bar that you'd use to remove wheel nuts you'll make life a lot easier. Use this with a 17mm socket two removes the two large inner bolts, and then remove the four 12mm bolts (two on each chassis rails).
Next is the real pain in the *****. I'd been warned about it from another local Euro owners install, but figured it was a result of the modification he's had done to fit his CL7 header. And what's this problem???? The damn Catalytic Converter!!!!
The bar fits over it perfectly as it's bent in all the right places. So I torqued the big forward bolts to 103N.m (76 lb.ft) and the four rear bolts to 22N.m (16.2 lb.ft) dropped the car of the jack stands and prepared to go for a test drive. Start up the engine all sounds good.
However as soon as the air-con kicks in there's a rapid hollow metallic tapping. Continue on the drive and that's all I can hear. An incessant tapping whenever the engine is at low revs, and fairly laboured. It was blatantly obvious that the heat shield around the catalytic converter was striking the rear member of the bar as the engine and exhaust flexed and moved in their mounts.
I compared the instructions that came with it and it appears the dimensions of the JDM CL9 cat are shorter than the Australian CL9 Cat, and their cat is well clear of the aft brace. I've had a look at CCColtsicehockey pictures and you guys have the exact same size cat as us. So TSX's will also suffer this problem.
There's two fixes,
1st Remove the heat shield. Both top and bottom sections bolt together so if you remove one you have to remove the other. This is the easy fix which I decided against as I imagine the heat shield serves a number of purposes, first to retain sufficient heat in the Cat for the chemical reaction to properly take place, and second to keep dirt and other debris clear of it as the get very hot.
2nd Bash the crap out of that dam thing! (Or better still grind it down with grinding wheel)
This second one is one that really piffed me off. It took me about three lots of jacking the car up, farting around removing the brace, removing the lower shield, and then bashing the part of the shield that contacts the rear member of the brace with a hammer.
As a result of this, and not having a bench vice (or anything to stop the rest of the shield deforming) the screw holes on the shield become pushed out making it a mongrel to force the holes back into alignment so you can re-install the screws.
To remove the shield I just used a ratcheted 10mm ring spanner. To get the screws back in though I used a 12mm ring spanner to anchor the nut on upper heat shield (these can break free and move), and a small 1/4" drive "banjo" ratchet with a 2" extension and a 10mm socket. I found in the confined space this gave me enough mechanical advantage to push the bolt up hard and wiggle it while squeezing the lower heat shield until I could tighten it up. I finally managed to deform the shield in enough with my calibrated hammer so it no longer vibrates against the brace.
On-Road:
Each time I took it for a test drive my arms ached so much from hours of fiddling around under the car that I was too tired to really notice much difference. There probably is one but I can't feel it as noticeably as a rear sway. Or the marginal change from the strut tower bar.
Overall:
I feel the Strut tower bar and lower brace compliment each other. They provide a fine tuning effect on chassis stiffness with a rear sway installed. The improvement is probably more evident with the loose rear OEM sway.
All these Cusco components are very good quality, and exceptionally light. I was annoyed when I saw that the heat shield had scratched mine, so I painted over it with some clear nail lacquer.
I think the Type I brace will probably be just as effective as the type II unless you really push your car hard. Not to mention that now having done the install I imagine you could install it in a matter of minutes without jacking the car.
You'd just lie prone on the ground, reach under, and remove the 17mm bolt place the brace under the car on the ground, go to the other side of your car and repeat. Then lift the brace up, install the bolts, torque and you're done. No need to worry about the cat knocking then.
I finally have the Cusco Strut tower bar, and the Type II lower arm brace installed. Unfortunately I ordered both Type I and II brace, and indeed you must use one or the other. The Type I brace IS the forward member of the Type II brace. So now I have a Type I brace to sell.
Oh and remember when reading the following I have the Comptech Sway bar, stock suspension, and OEM wheels and rubber.
Strut Tower Bar
My impressions of the install:
First I didn't have the access to a hoist so I had to do it the hard way. Jacking up the car and sliding in and out from underneath it is a mega b****.
The strut tower bar is very simple to install. Remove the three bolts on each side, place the foot plates of the bar over the exposed threaded shafts, reinstall the bolts and torque down to 44N.m (32.5 lb.ft) and it's done. A word of caution needs to be made about the close proximity and contact that's made between the air-conditioning pipes and the drivers side mount. I placed some foam tape on the pipes to try to minimize and contact.
On-Road:
I went for a quick drive around some roundabouts and did a 60kmh slalom along a few clear and secluded roads. It felt slightly more neutral than without the bar and a little tighter. Previously when doing this type of thing I could sense a little body flex in the front, but now it's not that obvious at all. I can now sense the rear sway working more, or maybe that's just I sign I should give the rubber bushings a lube.
Lower Arm Brace Type II
My impressions of the install:
First and foremost if you have access to a vehicle hoist....USE IT!!!!!!. It's a bitch trying to jack the car up enough to slide underneath.
Aside from access it's very quick and easy to install the lower bar. If you've got a big long extension bar that you'd use to remove wheel nuts you'll make life a lot easier. Use this with a 17mm socket two removes the two large inner bolts, and then remove the four 12mm bolts (two on each chassis rails).
Next is the real pain in the *****. I'd been warned about it from another local Euro owners install, but figured it was a result of the modification he's had done to fit his CL7 header. And what's this problem???? The damn Catalytic Converter!!!!
The bar fits over it perfectly as it's bent in all the right places. So I torqued the big forward bolts to 103N.m (76 lb.ft) and the four rear bolts to 22N.m (16.2 lb.ft) dropped the car of the jack stands and prepared to go for a test drive. Start up the engine all sounds good.
However as soon as the air-con kicks in there's a rapid hollow metallic tapping. Continue on the drive and that's all I can hear. An incessant tapping whenever the engine is at low revs, and fairly laboured. It was blatantly obvious that the heat shield around the catalytic converter was striking the rear member of the bar as the engine and exhaust flexed and moved in their mounts.
I compared the instructions that came with it and it appears the dimensions of the JDM CL9 cat are shorter than the Australian CL9 Cat, and their cat is well clear of the aft brace. I've had a look at CCColtsicehockey pictures and you guys have the exact same size cat as us. So TSX's will also suffer this problem.
There's two fixes,
1st Remove the heat shield. Both top and bottom sections bolt together so if you remove one you have to remove the other. This is the easy fix which I decided against as I imagine the heat shield serves a number of purposes, first to retain sufficient heat in the Cat for the chemical reaction to properly take place, and second to keep dirt and other debris clear of it as the get very hot.
2nd Bash the crap out of that dam thing! (Or better still grind it down with grinding wheel)
This second one is one that really piffed me off. It took me about three lots of jacking the car up, farting around removing the brace, removing the lower shield, and then bashing the part of the shield that contacts the rear member of the brace with a hammer.
As a result of this, and not having a bench vice (or anything to stop the rest of the shield deforming) the screw holes on the shield become pushed out making it a mongrel to force the holes back into alignment so you can re-install the screws.
To remove the shield I just used a ratcheted 10mm ring spanner. To get the screws back in though I used a 12mm ring spanner to anchor the nut on upper heat shield (these can break free and move), and a small 1/4" drive "banjo" ratchet with a 2" extension and a 10mm socket. I found in the confined space this gave me enough mechanical advantage to push the bolt up hard and wiggle it while squeezing the lower heat shield until I could tighten it up. I finally managed to deform the shield in enough with my calibrated hammer so it no longer vibrates against the brace.
On-Road:
Each time I took it for a test drive my arms ached so much from hours of fiddling around under the car that I was too tired to really notice much difference. There probably is one but I can't feel it as noticeably as a rear sway. Or the marginal change from the strut tower bar.
Overall:
I feel the Strut tower bar and lower brace compliment each other. They provide a fine tuning effect on chassis stiffness with a rear sway installed. The improvement is probably more evident with the loose rear OEM sway.
All these Cusco components are very good quality, and exceptionally light. I was annoyed when I saw that the heat shield had scratched mine, so I painted over it with some clear nail lacquer.
I think the Type I brace will probably be just as effective as the type II unless you really push your car hard. Not to mention that now having done the install I imagine you could install it in a matter of minutes without jacking the car.
You'd just lie prone on the ground, reach under, and remove the 17mm bolt place the brace under the car on the ground, go to the other side of your car and repeat. Then lift the brace up, install the bolts, torque and you're done. No need to worry about the cat knocking then.
04-30-2005, 01:44 PM
#43
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Originally Posted by JTso
Thanks for the heads up on the type 2 bar clearance problem. I wonder if I should use this as an excuse to fabricate a custom high flow cat. 
Sounds like a very valid reason to change to a high flow cat 
Very nice writeup Matell. Thanks for taking the time to take pics and write everything up. Looks like you had to do a lot of work get that damn type II brace on. It looks good though!
04-30-2005, 08:39 PM
#45
I've been doing some measurements and currently considering two models of CarSound cat. The 54000 series p/n: 54055 is kind of like the oem shape and slightly shorter in height, which will clear the bar. But it requires welding two extensions, one on each end plus flanges. The 94000 series p/n:94055 has a better OAL and only requires a 2" extension welded on one end plus flanges. It's slightly wider but should clear the bottom - width wise. It also has the same height of the 54055, which will clear the type 2 bar. The next step is to remove the cat and measure the flange size, bolt pattens and inside dia. I'd like to make the inside dia. slightly larger anticipating future exhaust upgrade, as most aftermarket catbacks are larger in dia. Once I have all the pieces, I will fire up my trusty Miller TIG welder and have me some fun.
04-30-2005, 08:52 PM
#46
Matell
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Originally Posted by JTso
Once I have all the pieces, I will fire up my trusty Miller TIG welder and have me some fun.
So can we expect replacing the OEM Cat to be your next very informative and helpful DIY guide and review?
04-30-2005, 09:15 PM
#47
Drives With Hands
Originally Posted by JTso
I've been doing some measurements and currently considering two models of CarSound cat. The 54000 series p/n: 54055 is kind of like the oem shape and slightly shorter in height, which will clear the bar. But it requires welding two extensions, one on each end plus flanges. The 94000 series p/n:94055 has a better OAL and only requires a 2" extension welded on one end plus flanges. It's slightly wider but should clear the bottom - width wise. It also has the same height of the 54055, which will clear the type 2 bar. The next step is to remove the cat and measure the flange size, bolt pattens and inside dia. I'd like to make the inside dia. slightly larger anticipating future exhaust upgrade, as most aftermarket catbacks are larger in dia. Once I have all the pieces, I will fire up my trusty Miller TIG welder and have me some fun.
Of course, if I do get a CEL, I'll probably put my education to work and build myself an O2 sensor simulator.
05-05-2005, 12:34 PM
#52
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Originally Posted by JTso
A little OT... anyone noticed the header in this pic? What kind is it?
05-05-2005, 02:44 PM
#54
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such a stupid place for AC lines honda could have done something better with them
05-05-2005, 05:08 PM
#57
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arnt ours in the same location though i havent looked recently so I could be wrong
05-05-2005, 05:53 PM
#58
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Yep, yep, yep. The headers are M-Bit (Maxim Works) fitted to Baboo's car. They're for the CL7 (Euro R), so he had to have a slight modification made so the CL7's two hole flange works with the standard cat.
I've driven his car a bit, and combined with his fujisturbo exhaust makes a nice hiss under acceleration.
Our AC lines are positioned differently to the US, and yeah we don't have a standard bar between the strut towers like the TSX. Just stiffening members from the strut tower to the firewall as JTso pointed out.
A quick update on the issue of the cat striking the rear member of the Type II lower arm bar....even after much bashing of the heat shield there was still some clanging coming from the Cat. I've since removed the lower heat shield and all is fine. The temperature of the bar without the lower heat shield now ranges anywhere from 68F-104F, but is still below 212F. I've checked my old metalurgical texts and that shouldn't be a problem.
Looking forward to when you swap out your cat with a high flow one JTso!
I've driven his car a bit, and combined with his fujisturbo exhaust makes a nice hiss under acceleration.
Our AC lines are positioned differently to the US, and yeah we don't have a standard bar between the strut towers like the TSX. Just stiffening members from the strut tower to the firewall as JTso pointed out.
A quick update on the issue of the cat striking the rear member of the Type II lower arm bar....even after much bashing of the heat shield there was still some clanging coming from the Cat. I've since removed the lower heat shield and all is fine. The temperature of the bar without the lower heat shield now ranges anywhere from 68F-104F, but is still below 212F. I've checked my old metalurgical texts and that shouldn't be a problem.
Looking forward to when you swap out your cat with a high flow one JTso!
05-05-2005, 06:14 PM
#59
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how hard was it to make the modification to the header and how much is the header
05-05-2005, 06:41 PM
#60
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Originally Posted by CCColtsicehockey
how hard was it to make the modification to the header and how much is the header
05-05-2005, 08:14 PM
#61
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Originally Posted by CCColtsicehockey
arnt ours in the same location though i havent looked recently so I could be wrong
05-05-2005, 09:39 PM
#62
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Originally Posted by xizor
yeah, they are in the same place b/c I had to bend them to fit the spoon front strut in
05-05-2005, 09:44 PM
#63
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Originally Posted by CCColtsicehockey
how hard is it to bend them. i wander if you could have some place custom fab new tubes
11-18-2005, 08:29 AM
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Originally Posted by goowakjai
So it's better to go with the type I if you don't want any fitment issues such as the type II?
11-18-2005, 02:12 PM
#66
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Originally Posted by xizor
i think the fitment issues were with the front upper strut bar, I have the type 2 (whichever makes the X) and it fit perfectly
but according to this thread, the typeII hits the heat shield?
xizor...no fitment problems with the type II? It's not hitting anything or rubbing against anything?
11-18-2005, 02:22 PM
#67
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Originally Posted by goowakjai
but according to this thread, the typeII hits the heat shield?
xizor...no fitment problems with the type II? It's not hitting anything or rubbing against anything?
xizor...no fitment problems with the type II? It's not hitting anything or rubbing against anything?
11-19-2005, 12:31 AM
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JTso change your avatar back to the picture of your car it looked better even though I like the car in there now yours looked better
11-20-2005, 09:22 PM
#74
Originally Posted by NewbieCL9
So will the type 2 fit on a TSX or will it scratch the cat? Is there a really big difference on Type 1 and Type 2?
https://acurazine.com/forums/showthread.php?t=23392
11-20-2005, 09:32 PM
#75
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Originally Posted by JTso
If you install the type 2 bar, you need to remove the lower heat shield on the stock cat or make sure your aftermarket cat clears the bar. The type 1 has two mounting points to the lower sub frame, whereas the type 2 has the same 2 mounting points to the lower sub frame plus two additional mounting points to the lower frame rails. Check out the tread below for pics...
https://acurazine.com/forums/showthread.php?t=23392
https://acurazine.com/forums/showthread.php?t=23392
11-20-2005, 09:42 PM
#76
Originally Posted by NewbieCL9
JTso, will there be any problem if u remove the ower heat shield? Also, does Cusco make RSB?
11-21-2005, 01:05 AM
#77
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I installed the front lower bar yesterday. Didn't even use a jack. Just breaker bar and torque wrench. Let me tell you the challenge of tightening a bolt to 76 lb/ft while on your back with no clearance haha. I installed the front tower bar too. Seems like my steering is alot tighter and the car goes exactly where you point it. I picked these as my first mods since I've never installed anything on a car before.
11-21-2005, 08:08 AM
#78
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Originally Posted by rtlltj
I installed the front lower bar yesterday. Didn't even use a jack. Just breaker bar and torque wrench. Let me tell you the challenge of tightening a bolt to 76 lb/ft while on your back with no clearance haha. I installed the front tower bar too. Seems like my steering is alot tighter and the car goes exactly where you point it. I picked these as my first mods since I've never installed anything on a car before.
the front bar does tighten up the steering, but how did you fit under your car without jacking it up 
I guess since mine's been lowered so long, I can't even fathom
11-21-2005, 11:21 AM
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Originally Posted by xizor
the front bar does tighten up the steering, but how did you fit under your car without jacking it up I guess since mine's been lowered so long, I can't even fathomI read in someone elses install thread that you could probably lie down on the ground and reach each bolt. I'm 6'3 so I have pretty long arms so I just tested the reach before I got the part. I figured if I could easily access the bolt without a jack why bother since I would have to buy one. I basically lied on my back right up against the car and it worked out fine. I would recommend a jack or ramps if you have one already but I made due with what I had at the time.
12-12-2005, 02:32 PM
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I need the torque Values immediately for the Type 1 bar, checked two of the other subframe bolts with a torque wrench and they didnt move untill i had 130 ft lbs on them, so i tightened these up the same, Driving me nuts though, car feels tight but im not sure if its the bar of it i fucked up and over tightened the damn thing, please let me know the proper values...
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