Mokos23

Is it possible that a Tsx 6 sp manual could beat the last generation 97-01 prelude 5 sp manual in a race? I know Tsx is a 4 dr and Prelude was a 2 dr, but just curious.

Arcticcl9

Tough call. They have similar engine and setup (FF). I think a race of the two will be close. The Prelude Type-SH might have an advantage in tight turns, but acceleration it's similar in both cars. I've been in that Prelude for a some time, and besides the styling and extra doors, the TSX reminds me of that car the most, in terms of handling. TSX has a bit more low/mid range torque though.

Saintor_RENAMED

No.

2004_Acura_TSX

The TSX can't really beat anything except maybe ricers in Civics.

illmeltxwithyou

I beaten alot of cars with my TSX, so I don't know why you think its slow. I admitt it's not as fast as alot of cars on the road but it suits me well.

bob shiftright

I disagree.

Whoever can pick the road and the driver should win. I'd pick Michael Schumacher in a TSX on the road of my choice over you (or me) in a Prelude.

sanremo

2 weeks ago I raced my buddy in his 2001 prelude (manual)
and my 6M TSX. We both had similar starts (lots of wheel spin) mainly do to the crappy road conditions--both on stock tires--both have an intake, him-AEM me-Injen.

Basically, he had just over 1/2 of a car length on me through 1st and 2nd gear. Then in 3rd I really started to pull on him. I got almost to where our front bumpers would be even, but had to shut it down because we were running out of road.

I was impressed at how the TSX gained in 3rd. I'm not sure how it would have done in 4th.

I used to race him in my 93 probe GT and could always hang close to him but Never gain any ground.

Overall the prelude is quicker and I would definitely not put money on the TSX. However, anything is possible.

cheers

Saintor_RENAMED

Come ON, stop dreaming. The Prelude (substantially lighter) is pratically 0.5s quicker on the 0-60mph.

miner

I HAVE A '99 AUTO pRELUDE (4SP SPORTSHIFT) with intake (AEM CAI) and can say 0-60 the auto Prelude is about the same but 60 -120 the TSX will pull hard on it.

vwong

Prelude might have a slight advantage being lighter. But I think it's all about the driver. I have both cars, and all I have to say is I feel both cars are running very strong.

Hmm...I remember I've been in similar discussion before, but it was Prelude vs. Integra. Wonder why???

larchmont

Nothing personal -- among other reasons because this seems to come up a lot of the time, with lots of people -- but when you get lots of wheel spin, doesn't it mean that you didn't handle the car in the best possible way for those conditions? And therefore that it didn't show the car at its best possible performance, even under those conditions?

I know that you can't always get the car's best possible performance. But, when we wonder about things like this, isn't that what we're wondering about?
Aren't we wondering about the car more than our own execution?

This goes also for all those 0-60 times that we see. Why do some testers get 7.2 and others get 8.9??

tsxer.ca

tsx and prelude are different kind of car..
no point to compare the speed..

fdl

Sainter...the prelude and TSX have almost identical 1/4 mile times. It would be a drivers race.

You can just compare 0-60 because the TSX suffers from bad tires and a horrible 1-2 geaar ratio difference which really hurts its 0-60.

Saintor_RENAMED

The TSX can't be as fast, thanks to its additional 360lbs (3318 vs 2954) or 12% for essentially the same power. Prelude have 8000rpm which helps too.

vwong

Where did you hear that? Yes, the tach in my Prelude has 8000 rpm printed on, but it redlines at around 7400 rpm. Although I had gone up to 8000 rpm before, but I can tell you that you don't gain any more hp pass 7600-7700 rpm.

fdl

saintor, you're really talking out of your ass .. or just trying to bash the TSX for whatever reason. You are comparing the curb weight of the MT prelude to the curb weight of the AT TSX. How stupid is that? The 6mt TSX is 3230 lbs ... so the difference is actually about a 100 lbs less than you are claiming.

And as for the 8000 thing, well thats even more ridiculous. Since when does higher RPM alone make you go faster?

The bottom line is both cars are being clocked at mid 15's through the1/4 mile by numerous mags, so as I said its a drivers race.

Saintor_RENAMED

I took the figures from Edmunds. Still close 300lbs according to yours. Never heard that the power-to-weight ratio is the make or break factor assuming everything else is similar? 10% difference is *A LOT*.

The TSX*CAN NOT* be as fast as the Prelude. Stop dreaming.

The 8000rpm redline (yes it is 8000) is also an important factor because overall, if you average the RPM while accelerating, it will be higher on the Prelude, allowing more power. That simple. Who's the dumbass?

dom

8000 RPM redline on the Prelude? I don't think so. The Type R's was 8400 and the GS-R's 8100, I'm pretty sure the Preludes was 7400 or so.

But I still think the Prelude with a good driver should be able to take a TSX. Then again, I've never seen a TSX race so who knows. I use to beat the majority of Ludes I used to race with my GS-R.

fdl

The difference is 276lbs...check your math. Of course power-to-weight is the biggest factor in determining acceleration, (there have been many threads where i have argued that same point) but its not the ONLY factor. Gearing can make HUGE difference so your simplified logic is very flawed. Do some research and look at the gear ratios for both cars, the TSX has the advantage here.

Quote:

The TSX*CAN NOT* be as fast as the Prelude. Stop dreaming.

C&D got a 15.5 1/4 mile for the 2000 prelude. They got a 15.6 for the TSX. Thats practically IDENTICAL. So tell me again whos dreaming? Don't be ignorant. These cars are close enough that the car with the better driver will win.

Quote:

The 8000rpm redline (yes it is 8000) is also an important factor because overall, if you average the RPM while accelerating, it will be higher on the Prelude, allowing more power. That simple. Who's the dumbass?

LOL..this last statement makes no sense. I dont even know what you are trying to say. Higher rpms mean faster ? Since when? You think that 200 hp at 8000 rpms is somehow better or "faster" than 200 hp at 7100 rpms?. And if you were somehow trying to say..in some convoluted way ..that the gearing in the prelude is better, ...well its not.

I'll be nice and I wont answer the dumbass question, although its become pretty clear. But its true what they say..ignorance is bliss. So if it makes you happy to beleive that its IMPOSSIBLE for the TSX to ever beat the prelude in a race ... then so be it.

fdl

I just did a quick search and it turns out the prelude doesnt even redline at 8000 anyways ..lol. it redlines at like 7000 (or 7400 for 2002)! Saintor...please try and keep your verbal diarrhea off this thread.

CDR

I drive a TSX/6MT, and my spouse has a 99 Prelude SH/5MT which I drive frequently.

While I haven't raced or timed either of them, my sense is the Prelude is just a touch faster, handles a little quicker, and definitely has less body roll. However, the TSX is smoother, much quieter, and the steering feels crisper (to me). And the TSX has better, more consistent torque and power (i.e. less need to drive it as hard to get performance).

Absolute performance? My guess: with similar driver skill, the Prelude by a nose ... but the TSX driver will enjoy the ride a lot more!

larchmont

Hmmmm. I think of mods as not just enforcers, but also sort of "hosts." (BTW why aren't there any "hostesses"? )

What I mean is, shouldn't y'all be nicer to members even when they're full of it? I know, there has to be a limit, but it doesn't seem like Saintor exceeded it. I would think there are ways for the hosts to flame the guests that need to be flamed without saying intestinal crap.

I got an idea: Make him a deal. Tell him you'll be nice to him if he tells us why he calls himself Saint....... uh, Saintor.

fdl

Well considering he already asked me to "resign" in another thread, in addition to basically calling me a dumbass here ... why exactly should I be so nice? Anyways, just because I am a mod doesnt mean I am not also a user...and as a user I sometimes enjoy flaming people for their ignorance.

Getting back on topic ... CDR..i agree 100% that the prelude is a "touch" faster. But its close enough that the race could go either way. To say that the TSX could never beat a prelude in a race is absurd.

larchmont

(Sorry to digress again for a second.....)

Good points, FDL, and I think just about everybody who saw either or both of those things thought he was out of line. But I would tend to think mods should try to be above that, even when it's hard.

I never thought I was from the "old school," but it sure sounds like I am, don't it?

Saintor_RENAMED

8000rpm is the Prelude cut-off.

Don't believe C&D numbers so much. They reported 6.1s for the RSX-S. No way.

The best 0-60 number I have seen so far for the Prelude is 6.7s and 7.2s for the TSX. Very representative.



Higher AVERAGE rpms *mean more available HP* mean faster. This is the very first principle of GEARING. Perhaps you never heard about power-to-weight ratio, but gearing you should know what it is, right? :'(

Saintor_RENAMED

Sounds like


But I am really


Actually it is more simple that that. "Sainto" are the first 6 letters of my lastname and "R" is the very first letter of my first name. This is how the IS guys registered me on the computers network initially.

dabuda

even though my prelude is 6 years old it still feels faster than my tsx, it feels lighter and pulls a lot quicker in 1st and 2nd gear then my tsx. i've only achieved post-redline(engine cutoff) on my lude once in the last 3 years but I've post-redlined my tsx thrice in the first 3 months...this is because i rely on the the sound of the rev and speed when i drive, basically in first gear in the tsx it's not at the speed i'm accustomed to in the lude so i just keep flooring it...nowadays i pay more attention to my tach in my tsx but it still feels slighty slower then my lude

fdl

Ya ... no doubt, 0-60 the prelude appears to have a larger edge. But through the 1/4 mile the gap seems to narrow. I've looked at other mags too..and both cars are in the mid 15,s 1/4 mile. So ya the prelude has a slight edge but when its that close ( a couple tenths of a second) I think the driver will make or break the race. get the better launch, better shifts and you will win, no matter which car you are in.

fdl

Ya, we've all noted though that the TSX is slower than it "feels". But your lude is faster .. especially 1st and 2nd ....but once into 3rd the TSX seems to make up some ground. Overall though the 2 cars appear to be very close in acceleration through the 1/4 mile and seeing a TSX beat a prelude in a race is very possible with the right driver.

Now put some lighter wheels on the TSX, fix that shitty 1-2 gear ratio ... and the TSX could pull so much harder. oh well.

sauceman

Saintor is right when he says the Prelude is quicker on the 0-60, and fdl is also right when he says the gap is much narrower on the ¼.

This is because the first 2 gears are very slightly longer on the TSX than on the Prelude, but the Prelude has slightly more revs, so even with the shorter gearing, it can do 60 at the top of 2nd.

But it is true that the TSX is quicker from 3rd up, and this is because 3rd gearing is very short, shorter than the Lude, 4th, even shorter, and same with 5th. This, combined to the cd factor that starts playing seriously above speeds of 60mph, and you get, yes, a slightly better acceleration with the TSX, enabling it to catch up on the Lude in the second half of the ¼.

I will try and race against Ludes at the track this spring, and be sure that I will post the results, good or bad.

fdl

If you are still driving a TSX!

EDIT: also...when looking at the gearing between the 2 cars, dont forget to account for the final drive ratio, which is much higher in the TSX.