hooraysimpsons

Hello,
I hope this is the right sub-forum to ask this. If it has been asked before, I apologize, I tried to do some searching but I am also in a hurry for a response since I will be going to the dealership soon.

In short: Acura has refused to cover a repair under my warranty even though I'm pretty sure they should. When I got to the dealership later today, what do I need to say in order to try to get it covered? Also, what information/papers do I need to request in order to follow up on my request with Acura later?

The story: I was driving down the interstate and my '05 TSX stated to smoke heavily. After utilizing the Acura TLC towing etc the TSX made it back to the dealership. However, after inspection the dealer said the problem was the hose transferring coolant to the engine was disconnected and had sprayed engine coolant all over the engine. The problem was minor which is good but the dealership said Acura had refused to cover it under warranty. The dealership didn"t really give one specific reason why. They mentioned that I had been in an accident; however, that was a while ago and previous to my last maintenance during which they are suppossed to check the hoses (June). They also said "the hoses don't just pop off the car so someone must have messed with it". Well, I know no one messed with it. In short, I think they just don't want to pay but don't exactly have a great reason and I want them to pay. Therefore, any guidance would be appreciated.

Sorry for the long post.

Thanks again.

CGTSX07

what exactly are they repairing? It sounds like all they need to do is reconnect the line and refill the coolant?

Zyuan10

when dealerships become cheap and no way of convincing them, it's almost always better to just call Acura itself and explain your situation and they'll get their underlings to fix the problem. Acura usually cares... dealerships sometimes doesn't.

hooraysimpsons

^^ What they are fixing: I may not remember this word for word because I was half asleep by the time the called back (problem occured at ~4am). They have to reconnect the hose, replace clamp, refill, make sure there is not air in the coolant system, and wash out the engine bay of the coolant that 'leaked'. Total is about ~$130, which isn't a crazy amount but definitely something I don't want to pay just because.

^ At this point, I am assuming I will have to call Acura to get it worked out. However, I was wondering if there was any specific information or papers I should request at the dealership to facilitate the process when I contact Acura.

The dealership did say they contacted Acura and sent pictures but Acura refused to cover it...

curls

Since it's not a huge amout of money, I'd try going to Acura corporate and giving them your side of the story in a professional and firm tone. Do that ASAP before you go to the dealership today.

If they don't do anything, then go to the dealership and make it VERY VERY clear that you will never come back to this dealership for anything, and will never hesitate to give a negative review to anyone you meet about them, for being so chintzy about this.

If they try to play the whole "well if you don't come here to get work done, then your warranty is void" game with you, you can answer with two sentences: "First, I can go to an independant garage, keep my paperwork, and keep my warranty. Secondly, what good is your warranty, if you don't honor it anyhow!!!".

Good luck, let us know how it works out.

CGTSX07

so basically you are paying them $130 to reclamp a hose and refill the coolant??...these are all things you can do yourself and will take less than 5 minutes. I agree that it is pretty ridiculous. Try what Curls mentioned above. If they don't budge, have them tow it back to ur place and do it yourself.

It also sounds like that $130 is going into someone elses back pocket...shady business.

hyunk24a2

130 to clamp the hose back down and refill your coolant?!?!?

do you have an intake system in your car?

bhamsan

Definitely key, you don't want to start dropping f-bombs. Thats a sure-fire way to NOT get anything done.

And ditto on the DIY. Reconnect hose, clamp, and viola, you saved yourself $130, unless its a bit more complicated than that, which I can't tell because there aren't any pics and I'm just going by your word. Cleaning the engine shouldn't matter, and if you're concerned, just spray some Simple Green in there and spray it with a hose.

If it was a serious problem, they'd be charging you way more than $130.

hooraysimpsons

Thanks everyone for the responses thus far. Regarding the DIY it is too late for that unfortunately. On the fly I agreed to let them do the work before thinking about it. Also I am out of town and neededit done so that I didn't miss too much work. They asked permission to do the ork on a phone call that came in asI was sleeping after waking up early and waiting an hour and a half for the tow.

Thanks again.

Any more info on tactics with the dealer. Sorry for typing... on phone.

CGTSX07

do you have any mods? still wondering why they think you would've messed with the coolant lines.

Simba91102

Regardless of how this story plays out, you definitely need to find a new dealer for service. That said, although it may cost me money in the long run, concern over a situation like this is the big reason why I have my dealer do all the regularly scheduled maintenance on both of my TSX's. I've been able to build a good relationship with them and am pretty sure that they would accommodate me (warranty wise) with a problem such as the one you've described here (barring any obvious monkey business). Not knowing the service history, warranty status, and degree of "personalization" of your car, it's difficult to try and second guess the dealer here. Maybe they just suck. Maybe they feel there's good reason for them to deny any responsibility. It may even be a problem that has its' roots in your last service (they did check the hoses and belts, they just loosened one instead of tightened it)(by mistake of course). If all else fails, and assuming you really feel that there's no possibility that you may have a part in this, then keep your paperwork and write to Acura (call if you want, but I've always found the written word is stronger; maybe the recipient assumes you're really serious if you're willing to take the time and make the effort to write)(send it registered mail by the way) and make you're case. I've done it a couple of times (Honda and Ford actually, years ago) and prevailed both times.

dereksmalls

Keep an eye out for Check Engine Lights. I had a friend who had a 1999 Accord Coupe 4 cylinder that had the same problem with the coolant hose. After they fixed the coolant hose, he kept getting the CEL indicating an engine misfire every few weeks. After a long fight with Honda, he went to a dealership in another city (he moved from Quebec to Ontario) and they ended up swapping the engine under warranty. They figured that during the brief time the engine was without coolant, the engine block must have warped enough to cause an intermittent problem. He was pretty ticked off, but after his 6 month ordeal, they finally fixed it.

hooraysimpsons

Hello Everyone,
I will give a full update and explanation to all the questions probably tomorrow. Have plans tonight... I got the car back thought and so far it seems fine.

Thanks

hooraysimpsons

^^ Thanks for the heads up regarding the CEL.

I agree with everyone that a DIY would have been a better idea; however, it came to my mind too late in the process.

Alright so some background: I got into a wreck around last Nov ('06) and had some work done to my car. There wasn't any engine damage. I had my last service in June during which the hoses were all supposedly checked and found acceptable.

So, yesterday, the hose carrying the coolant to the engine came loose.
According to the service rep at the dealership:
When they requested Acura cover the work, Acura requested photos. The dealership sent Acura photos of the part and engine bay area. Acura refused to cover the work under warranty. They seem to want to say that the hose wouldn't just come off by itself and must have been improperly installed when I had work done on my car after the accident. However, I don't think much more than body work was done at that time. Also, even if that hose had to be reinstalled during those repairs, it was checked in June and according to the service rep it was "holding pressure and passed visual examination". So they can't blame it on improper installation by the repair service. But that seems to be what they are doing.

I didn't really get anywhere arguing with the service rep because he just kept going back to "well they asked for pictures and we sent them and they came back saying it wouldn't be covered". I mentioned that I already had a call into Acura at that point and he didn't seem to care and was very content with putting the blame on Acura.

I'm not sure whether to get mad at the dealership or not because according to them it was Acura that decided not to cover the repairs. It does annoy me because we have purchased two cars from that dealership...

hooraysimpsons

Hello again,
So I called Acura client services again just now. My case is still with the second level case manager and I am suppossed to get a call back from him. I did get his extension in case I don't hear from him soon.

From speaking to Acura client services: It sounded like it was the dealerships decision not to cover the work and client services doesn't have any information regarding why the repairs weren't covered.

The case manager is suppossed to call the dealership to determine why it wasn't covered and "will fight for me on it". We'll see...

CGTSX07

something tells me that you will get some good news.

bhamsan

Hopefully, but prepare to be disappointed.

curls

If it comes back that the dealership was in fact lying about Acura refusing to cover the repairs, then I'd fight tooth and nail with Acura AND the dealership for a lot of compensation. First and foremost, the entire cost of the repair plus at least some compensation for your time, aggravation, and gas to/from the dealership, etc. Secondly, file a report with the BBB in your area on this dealership and make sure you let the service manager and dealership operations manager know you've done this or are doing this.

Document everything.

LuvMyTSX

Ugh, stupid dealership. I hope you get some good news soon.

hooraysimpsons

So bad news. My rep at Acura client services called today and said they were declining my claim. Once again, they pretty much said 'Well this clamp doesn't just come off by itself so it must have been improperly installed after your wreck.'

When I asked why it wasn't caught by the check performed during my routine maintenance in July, he said something about since it looked ok and was holding pressure they didn't check further.

He also said somethign along the lines of 'If it was a manufacturing defect this problem would have occured sooner.' However, I have put prolly around 20k miles on my car since the wreck and I only have just above 40k total on the car. Therefore, if the clamp can be improperly installed and work for 20k I dont see a reason why it can't be manufactured incorrectly and fail after 40k.

Any advice on how to continue this? I defintely think Acura should be paying for this one. Their arguments don't make sense to me logically and when I talk to people it seems like they just have a couple alternate theories instead of anything that confirms it wasn't something covered by the warranty.

I have contacted the repair shop to see if I can get a statement from them along the lines of 1)They didn't touch the clamp or 2)They reinstalled the clamp according to Acura specifications using either the original part or a new factory part.

CGTSX07

IMO, don't waste anymore of your time with this. Call the dealership and ask to speak with the manager, introduce yourself and remind him of your case, and then tell him you will never do business with that dealership ever again and that you will also warn everyone of your experience.

CGTSX2004

iTrader: (1)

If Acura can clearly document the fact that everything looks good, you next target should be your insurance company/the body shop that made the repairs to the car. Since Acura is claiming the body shop failed to install the part correctly, and the body shop probably has some kind of warranty or guarantee on the work it does, that is where I would be looking next. There is no way this kind of problem should result in any money coming out of your own pocket.

Though realistically, you need to decide if the price of the fight is worth the effort.

hooraysimpsons

^, yes pretty soon the cost will not be worth the hassle but it has been slow at work lately...

^^, the thing that sucks is I took my sister to this dealer when she was looking for her car and she eventually purchased from there as well less than a year ago.

Simba91102

Though realistically, you need to decide if the price of the fight is worth the effort.[/QUOTE]

I have to agree with this sentiment; probably time to bite the bullit and chock it up to experience (the bad kind). By all means take your business elsewhere in the future, and be sure to alert the offending dealership's management to this and why (in writing)(with copies to Acura Customer Service) (which may be an oxymoron in this case) and that you'll be sure to share your dissatisfaction with the way you were treated at every opportunity. Some days you get the bear; some days the bear gets you.

hooraysimpsons

So far I haven't really had to put much effort into the whole ordeal. About 10 minutes each on two phone calls with Acura Client Services.

Also, I spent a couple minutes writing an email to the repair shop that did my work after the accident. The guy at the shop just called me and asked for some information and now he is calling the dealership to get some more details. We'll see where that goes... I probably shouldn't have told him I had moved away from that area so that he would be more worried about future business with me... oh well.

hooraysimpsons

Ok, so the repair shop called and said they would refund me the repair costs. Kind of weird since I don't even think it is their fault.

I had avoided usign names thus far until I figured out how the whole thing played out, but now:
Bad review: Leith Acura in Cary, NC (near Raleigh). Refused warranty coverage.
Good review: Kenny Hawkins Automotive in Raleigh, NC. Covered repairs with very little prompting.

LuvMyTSX

That's good news. Nice that someone is taking responsibility.

curls

Nice work. Be sure to trumpet both the good and the bad reviews to fellow NC'ers. That's what makes businesses successful or not -- word of mouth.

cestmoi

Oh my god... you're going through all that trouble for $130+ of bill? Give me a break. I know it's probably some principle (of which I am unclear of) that you're doggedly stressing over, but from your posts, it really doesn't sound like it's Acura's problem. If the clamp was improperly clamped, it wouldn't take 5 mths for this to happen and if it were a defect, I'm sure there are many of us who would've reported this on this board already.

In my point of view, the object of your rage should just be the dealership as they were the ones who checked your car after the accident right?? You were unclear on this. You can claim that their mechanic was negligent, blah blah.

If not, I don't see why the dealership needs to be bothered with your whining.

IF I were the dealer, I'd just waive that $130 and be done with you. The time spent on your case is probably costing them more than that stupid $130 bill.

oldguytsxer

if it was thousands it is worth the battle.....130.00 is CHUMP CHANGE......get on with life.

JayRoam

the two previous posters seem to not mind getting screwed out of some $. so sad. if that's the case, I'd like to sell you a tornado for your intake. =P

to the OP: congrats to you. sounds like you got you wanted (some culpability), albeit not from who you intended to get it from. definitely pass the word about the good repair shop and the bad dealership.