rb4580

Well I sold the TSX and now I need something to get me around for fairly cheap. Here's the deal. I think I've found a pretty good deal. I found a

2002 Chevy Malibu that has 13,000 miles on it that I can get for 7,500$. What do you guys think, I've never owned anything but Japanese. Is buying american just dumb or should I pay more for camry, accord, ect... what are your views on this?

CraZydudE

lol your in the US military, yet you never owned a American made car. Where's ur USA pride???

rb4580

I know man... I'm thinking of taking the plunge in that arena... I just here so many horror stories... But I was thinking that even if something breaks, no matter what it is, should be cheap... hopefully!

jcg878

That is an oft-overlooked benefit. My last car was GM - a saturn -and it was pretty reliable. I wouldn't rule something out just because it's american - some of them are decently reliable. Don't know about the malibu though.,

bob shiftright

Wife had a Buick years ago, it was a nightmare. Transmission replaced and rebuilt engine both before 100k miles, needed to remove the distributor to get to the thermostat, even an oil change was a major production. I'd NEVER buy anything from GM again!

There's a lot of interesting older iron in your price range. I might look for a nice E28 535is, it might be the most durable, reliable 6-cylinder BMW ever built.

If you feel the need to buy American, buy a Corolla, Camry, domestic Accord, Subaru, Nissan, there are so many made in America now that I can't keep track. The problem isn't the people building the cars, Americans do a fine job at that, the problem is the management at GM, Ford and DC.

briny319

I would get a civic over the malibu. The 96-2000 civic is rated as one of the best used cars to buy.

TinkySD

Depends on how long you want to drive the car. As you can see the malibu has already taken a huge depreciation hit that if you buy you won't have to suffer. Buying used cars with high depreciation is a sound financial decision if you aren't expecting it to last forever.

sauceman

Shame on you!
Nuff said.:shakehd:

zircon

I think you will notice a big difference. Too bad you're not buying the new Mailbu - it is a very competitive car. If you go for the used Malibu, make sure it has the V6 and not the 2.4L 4. The latter engine was junk.

gilboman

buicks are a lot more reliable now....moreso than accords, camrys, civics corollas etc.... GM reliability has come a long way, and the Malibu (not sure about the new one) is consistantly ahead of competition from Honda and toyota, whether i can stand their cheap interiors and styling is another matter, but reliability is not a concern at all when it is better than Honda and Toyota already.

Crazytree

civic

fdl

This is just not true. If it is, please back it up with a link please. I'll agree that GM has come a long way in realiability, but its still not above toyota and honda.

As for buying the malibu, or any domestic, you get to take advantage of that huge depreciation when buying used. $7500 for a 2002 with 16k sounds like a good deal to me.

bob shiftright

I have the latest Consumer Reports "New Car Preview 2004" guide in front of me; Their "Most Reliable" list includes 31 Japanese models and 1 GM model.

Their "Least Reliable" list includes 15 GM models, 15 European models and 2 Japanese models.

I'm not a lucky guy so I don't play the lottery, but the odds are waaaay in my favor buying a Japanese brand.

duugk

I saw an article a few years back about Ford not allowing cars to park in their lot unless they had a certain percentage of "American made parts". The joke was that you couldn't park a Crown Vic, but you could park a Honda Accord.

gilboman

2003 dependability awards
http://www.jdpower.com/cc/auto/relea...ID=749&CatID=1

this was all over the newspapers like a couple of weeks ago!!

2003 inital quality adwards
http://www.jdpower.com/cc/auto/relea...ID=736&CatID=1

when broken down by brands, Buick and Chevorlet are not high up as Toyota or Honda, but by models there are definitely ones competitive if not better than Honda/Toyota.

i'm not saying their overall brand is higher..but models such as Impala, Malibu and Buick's have consitantly done very well... its easy to beat the older accords who had tranny failures as a requirement pretty much.

bob shiftright

From JD Powers: "IQS is an acronym for Initial Quality Study. This study is the auto industry's quality benchmark and focuses on problems consumers report with their new vehicles during the first 3 months of ownership."

Even if a Honda transmission fails, it's unlikely to do so in the first three months. Jaguar won a bunch of these JD Powers awards, and for the first three months most Jaguar owners still think that the acrid smell is the leather seats and not the main wiring harness burning! I also have my doubts that most Buick LeSabre owners can remember what year it is or what the name of the President is, never mind if their car has had any problems. The JD Powers awards remind me of the kindergarten contests where everyone came home with a prize! Thanks, but I'll weigh a large sample over a long time (like Consumer Reports does) much higher!

KC 2004 TSX

I'm with you. JD Powers is a tool for the dealers to manipulate.

Brad

It's Russian roulette when you buy a used car. It's Russian roulette when you buy new cars from certain manufacturers.

GM is all over the map from very reliable to very unreliable cars. Yes, they have all markets covered for reliability issues.

Some of the Chevies--although plain and unrefined--have been at least average in reliability. That's better than some vaunted European makes and better than some Japanese ones too.

But then, consider why the car has very very very low resale value. The Malibu is the current rental fleet "darling". In that trade, the "darling" is the car model that car makers heavily push upon car rental agencies at heavy discounts.

I bet the Malibu has low insurance rates.

How many miles are on the Malibu? How long do you plan to keep it? The newest Malibu--a 2004 model--is built on a much better platform, the same one that the Saab 9-3 uses.

gilboman

i posted two links..one is IQS...the other is DEPENDABILITY which measures problems after 3 years of ownership..here incase your are the suxor at the internet

"The 2003 study, which measures problems reported by original owners of 2000 model-year"

"The 2003 Vehicle Dependability Study is based on responses from more than 55,000 original owners of 2000 model-year cars and light trucks. The study covers 147 specific problem symptoms grouped into nine major vehicle systems. For the first time, the study reviews models at three years of ownership instead of the historical four- to five-year period in order to better support manufacturer product improvement efforts in next-generation replacement models."

if you can figure out how to click a link you can see the corporate standings and Honda is ranked 3rd behind Porsche and Toyota

and way to go Dissing LeSabre and Jag owners...i hope most TSX owners don't have your mentality or the TSX will turn into the Civic and be the butt of jokes.

Spud

Malibu:

bob shiftright

I remember being TOLD how to respond to the JD Powers survey by my Volvo salesman. I also can tell you that the guy in the next office had his Saab salesman call and yell at him because he didn't respond to the survey "correctly".

#1 is PORSCHE? I have a Porsche. I LOVE the car! I'll probably buy another Porsche in the future. Pleasing it is. Reliable it's not. If it were even close to reliable I'd drive it - or a new one - daily instead of a Honda.

BrutusBuckeye

Here is the JD Power Long-Term Dependability ratings. Those of you who said there is no way a Buick is more reliable than a Honda or a Toyota, read it and weep! I'm no Buick fan, but the facts are the facts.

http://www.jdpower.com/awards/indust...ID=749&CatID=1

By the way, Chevrolet (as in Malibu) is about average.

BrutusBuckeye

Also, notice that the Malibu is the highest ranked entry midsize car -- believe it or not!

zircon

GM electronics suck. It may take some time to show up, but eventually ALL of their stereos breakdown. The best thing they could do is sell Delco and purchase brand name units from a reliable source.

sauceman

Based on your history of posts here, I don't think you are in a position to give anyone here a lesson.

Iceman

If you want reliability data that will match your actual experience with a car, there is no substitute for Consumer Reports. According to them, the 2002 Malibu is "better than average overall reliability" and gets a rare (for GM cars) positive rating. The 2001 gets an average rating, and all earlier model years get a below-average rating. What this tells me is, if you get the Malibu, you'll regret it in a couple of years as the repair costs mount.

In the $12k - $14k price range, Consumer Reports recommends the following sedans:
'98 Acura 3.5RL
'02 Honda Accord
'02 Infiniti G20
'95-'96 Lexus LS400
'00 Lincoln Continental
'01 Mazda Millenia
'02 Nissan Maxima
'00-'02 Subaru Legacy, Outback
'00 Toyota Avalon

All Japanese except for the Lincoln. My recommendation is, if you like Hondas, get the Accord. I am sure you will only be able to get the 4 cyl. '02 Accord for that price. If you really want a V6, get the Maxima. Maximas depreciate fast and last forever, which is an ideal combination when you are buying used.

Iceman

Oops I see I took your Malibu with 13000 miles and translated that to $13k price. OK, in the $6k-$8k price range it's the same basic idea. Pick any Japanese used car you can find in that price range, and also consider the following:
'95 BMW 3-series
'01 Buick Century
'98-99 Ford Crown Victoria
'99-00 Ford Escort
'96 Lincoln Continental
'95-97 Lincoln Town Car

gilboman

so 3 years later when you got your survey you asked your volvo salesman how to fill it out ....and JD power surveys are not shared with dealers....i think you are confused with the manufacture's own satisfaction survery or the dealer one... what year porsche do you have? and if people are to base an entire brand's reliabiltiy on one response that would be pretty stupid would it now? your one experience outweighs that of tens of thousands of others or maybe all the dealers called all their customers 3 years later and asked if they got their surveys and yelled them directions on how to fill it out? when not all owners get the survey since it is randomly selected?

larchmont

Postscript, especially to Gilbo:

For the thousandth time, JD Power's "dependability" index has very, very little to do with what most of us regard as "reliability." I guess everybody's definition might be a little different, but I doubt that anybody's (even Gilbo's) gets even a tickle from JD Power's formula. CR's formula, on the other hand, is probably very close to most people's ideas of what "reliability" means.

binabink

all i have to say is that the state police here are replacing their crown vics w/the malibu. take that for what you will.

on another note, was at the car dealer w/ex and a sales guy was commenting how my from the back my tsx looked a lot like the malibu from the back....i just kept nodding my head and saying yeah.

bob shiftright

I don't think the greater reliability of Chevies vs. Fords is the issue here.



http://www.azcentral.com/arizonarepu...icecars22.html

majormojo

Re: GM dependability. Before I bought my Suburban, I used to really have it in for GM. Their exterior designs have been lackluster at best, sometimes downright awful (Aztek anyone?) and their interiors and ergonomics are terrible across the board. However, I have to say my truck has been very reliable and solid. I have almost 300,000km on it with no major mishaps. I'm a stickler for regular maintenance and at 10 yrs of age, I'd rate the the 'Burbie at about 97% as good as new. The only thing not working now that I can think of is the vanity light on the driver side visor. Honestly, it's in a lot better shape overall than my previous Accord was at the same age. Heresy, I know. I never would have believed it myself.

EURO_R

my teacher designed the new chevy malibu, and the monte carlo

Iceman

Your teacher lives in Sweden or Germany? The new Malibu is an Americanized version of the Saab 9-3 and the Opel ___.

sauceman

Tell your teacher he designe a car that's ugly as sin. I can't believe something monstrous like that design would come through. Only at GM...

EURO_R

u know nothing about the design process, nor the assembly and production of the vehicle, not to mention when u design ur own car then we can talk, not to mention ur opinion obviously doesnt agree with the thousands of others that have bought the car and liked it.
game on

EURO_R

Your teacher lives in Sweden or Germany? The new Malibu is an Americanized version of the Saab 9-3 and the Opel ___.


my teacher lives in royal oak,mi and please explain the design language and relation of those two companies to the design of the new malibu.....isnt opel owned/maintained by GM...

sauceman

Of course I know nothing about design, foo, but I damn well know what an ugly car is and the Malibu is one to be put in the same class as the Aztec. GM seem to particularly excel when it comes to building ugly cars. You can't call the Malibu a graceful car!

sauceman

Each car gets the driver it deserves, and each driver gets the car it deserves; now it's up to you to observe how GM drivers behave / drive on the road, Malibu drivers included. I can tell you a lot about it, I have to deal with 50,000 miles a year of GM drivers.

Bass Mechanic

funny im not suprised to see that about a ford product. the thing i really dont understand is how ford stays in business and howcome so many people dont see what a POS product they make.

my wife and i have a little game we play on the last few road trips we have taken.
we keep a pad of paper in the car and record the make and model of each disabled car we pass along the highway. ford and chevy along with dodge are always the most common cars left along the roadside.
there have been a few hondas, nissans, toyotas and other imports but the number of the domestics especially fords is usually 3-4 times the number of any other car.

Found On Road Dead or FORD is not just a joke people say about their products its a fact!