Jason

Dude if you offer me a loaded 330i or a TSX with nav, I go TSX. I have no use for BMW. That's just my opinion and I realize I may be in the minority.

1SICKLEX

Jason, u might want to read this article. The end has an Acura rep saying they are going after BMW.

http://www.acura-tsx.com/forums/show...&threadid=8195

Jason

Yeah that's the sad reality. I hope they don't become too BMW-like. I'm not saying BMW doesn't build good cars, but I don't like their image or history. I just could not live with a BMW. My father-in-law has a 325 (I know, not the 330) and I'm not all that impressed. I never really have been impressed by the 3-series.

Buff-Daddy

Just because you don't have a use for one doesn't mean it isn't the benchmark.

Jason

Just because you do doesn't mean it should be.

Buff-Daddy

I think it's the automotive industry that has been calling it the benchmark for at least the last 10 years, not me. You on the other hand are the only one calling the TSX the benchmark and there is a reason for that...

Jason

...which is...?

phile

I think a lot of people read that article and immediately think that Acura is targeting BMW with cars, but if you read closely, the guy said they're going after BMW's image, which is that of a hip brand coveted by the young (or young at heart) and affluent.

With that said, I don't think it's such a loaded comment...isn't everyone targeting BMW anyway?

Buff-Daddy

2 Words, Crack Pipe!

Jason

Then bring on the rock!

jiggaman

THis is the type of crack i like

EDIT: Sorry Jigga, not the thread for it. Dom

provench

Let me help you out a bit .... Jason never said the TSX was the benchmark.. He said he would choose the TSX (which he did). That's the good thing about industry opinions ... it is not a monopoly on opinions

By the way ... if I was keeping a car for 3 years (no more) and money was no object between the two cars ... truth be told the 330i would be in my driveway. But the problem is money IS an object for most people, so is RWD in snow/rain, so is long term reliability (BMW is not the worst, but Honda/Toyota just happen to be the best).

Peace

bob shiftright

Or maybe...

Mine (which I'm told bears an amazing resemblence to Dennis Franz's) is still sore from waaaaay too many encounters with Maximillian, the white coated service manager with the faux-German accent. The European marques built their reputation both on driving dynamics and on longevity. The superb dynamics may still be there in a BMW but not the durability or longevity or servicibility. Not eveybody can fix one of the Eurocars. But if an ASE-certified tech can't fix a Honda Accord he should hang up his wrench and go to work at Starbucks.

If I kept a car for 3 years, I'd buy a BMW. If I leased a car it would be a BMW. If it were on someone else's nickel (ie. a company car) it would be a BMW.

With my own money and for the long haul it has to be a Toyota or Honda now.

Mighty1

Hehe.... not me. I think I'm a bit of a Honda loyalist. BMW has that snob factor I'd just rather not be associated with (no offense to the bimmer drivers here, just past experience). But in the end it's really about what you like...

The BMW 3-series (which I could afford) just isn't really my taste. Looks/feels like a 40-something's car (IMHO) and that's not really what I was looking for. The TSX is not the best looking car on the market, but it has a bit more of a modern edge that I really liked. I've also been a real fan of the Honda 4-bangers, there's something fun about a rev-happy engine. It's fun to listen to, fun to drive, etc. Besides... BLUE PIMP LIGHT. Need I say more?

Like I said, you drive what you like. If everyone bought a car purely on their numbers then there would be very few cars out there.

Jason

Damn you have impeccable tastes in cars... I have the exact same TSX, had a Milano Red 1997 5MT Prelude. Also had a 1990 Accord DX.

Mighty1

Great minds think alike.

khannie112

Yo B Diddy, post up some pictures of your X5 & 3

gilboman

man..how could you've stand the prelude for so long?? that
sh!tbox on wheels was as agile as a tug boat and they managed to make the steering have no feel other than that of an elastic band and decent brakes but no brake feel so you coudnt feel the road. the lude was so detached from the road.. it felt like driving a boat everytime. even after coilovers, and pretty much everything done to the suspension, it cornered good but was still heavy and boatlike with a rough engine.

Jason

You just lost your final bit of cred with me with that post. You couldn't be further from the truth on the '97 Prelude. Perhaps you're confused because that was the first year of the redesign. I see them on the road today and they still look good. I don't see many BMWs from the late 90's though...

Mighty1

Wow, obviously something wrong with the Prelude you were driving.

Mine handled perfectly, the suspension was very sharp (you could feel every nuance of the road), only the slightest hint of body roll when pushed hard (90mph +) around the turns, steering feel was excellent, absolutely one of the most precise cars I have driven (the Type-SH and the S2000 are definitely sharper though), brakes were flawless (perfect feel with almost zero nose dive)... I will say that off-the-line acceleration was lacking, that was definitely sluggish. Could have done with a bit more torque on the low end and a 6-speed manual would have been nice.

Overall I would not have traded it in at all except I was starting to look at some repairs (timing belt, brakes, normal wear stuff) and I wanted something with a backseat that was worth a damn.

1SICKLEX

http://forum.e46fanatics.com/forumdisplay.php?f=12

These cars are for 40 something year olds????

gilboman

steering feel was non existant..if you havent done so, go drive a new Celica, the difference is day and nite. and i did say it cornered good and there was very little body roll..but the numb steering, numb brakes gives a detachment to the road.

Iceman

Acura's car line is all over the place. No question the RSX is targeting young people, but not competing with BMW. I still claim the TSX is an Audi A4 built by Acura. Not competing with BMW (no 6 cyl. engine), but surely going after the Yuppie market. Now the TL, no question, is going after BMW and the Yuppie market. All it needs is the RL's performance-oriented AWD system and it will succeed. The RL is too conservatively styled to be competitive with anything. The word "hip" is not in the RL's vocabulary. Aaarrgh! How can they build a state of the art car like the RL and put THAT body on it??? Come to think of it, that's what people have been saying about BMW since Bangle got there. So OK, the RL is targeting BMW also.

Mokos23

Just say M3 and all of this debating will be over, it will kill both the 330i and TSX.

Mighty1

Yep, I heard you. And as I said, something wrong with the Prelude you were driving. I have not met one person who had driven one that would agree with you. Sorry buddy, I think you're out-voted.

Can't say on the new Celica for myself, was a passenger in one once but haven't driven it yet, and if riding in it is any clue I don't think I want to drive one. What a POS!

ilitig8

gilboman though you have a good icon to support in the end you need to take your blinders off, the Prelude was an excellent (one of the best) handling FWD cars.

On another note it is interesting to see the perception of BMW owners. I have owned 5 different BMWs, all M cars, since I am extremely performance oriented and its nice to have a daily driver that I can track when I decide to. The site has got me thinking about how I am perceived, do I add to the BMW haters or do I break the perceived mold. I dunno, I think I am a courteous driver and only call upon the extra performance when I need to (when others are present anyway). Did I buy the car because it was a BMW, well yes, if it had been only an issue of performance my 60k would have been better spent on a Z06 but I suppose it has its image issues as well. Hmmm, it is all something to think about.

As for the person that mentioned not liking the history of BMW, could you clarify, I am interested in what you don't like.

Vandy (who lives in the city in the US where the BMW has the LEAST cache, where it is not unusual to see a new 3 and 5 series parked in from of a manufactured home, possibly with the wheels still attached to the house... but despite this is probably still a badge whore)

Jason

I don't like their history as it pertains to WWII. They are known to have manufactured rockets and engines for military use (probably not unlike some Japanese firms) and they are known to have used prisoners as slave laborers. What else they created for the German government and for what purpose makes me shudder.

sauceman

Same for the Lufthanza and just about every German industry during war-time. They had all been requisitionned by Hitler to serve in the war effort.

Actually, it was the same over here, many industries have been requisitionned to manufacture parts to build tanks weaponnery, etc.

Does it mean that BMW was at fault? Hell, if they had refused, they were in the hands of the SS, and finally, their factories would have ended up producing for the war effort anyways.

ClutchPerformer

I think you "break the mold". Your nod to the Prelude alone shows that you can appreciate the merits of a car other than your own. Our problem with Gilbo (and sometimes Buff Daddy) is his blind faith in BMW and RWD. You don't seem to share the same bias, so I for one would like it if you stuck around.

Clutch, who hopes his next car will be an M3

gilboman

some people just dont notice those things a GT-S will take my lude any day.. driven both extensively including other modded ludes..not even close.

but for its time (in 97) the lude was probably the best choice as a FWD coupe.. but later on when much lighter, more nimble cars came along but the lude was just left there on its deathbed...

ilitig8

There would be fewer haters IF you fully articulated your opinions when you first post them. You kinda HAVE to make car comparisons using similarly aged cars OR you have to give credit to the older car for being just that. I.E. the E30's and E36's have many laudable points but as a whole the E46 is a better car.

Then again you may be attempting to cultivate haters, in that case carry on, as you do an excellent job!

Vandy