A few days ago, I stopped by the local Acura dealership – it’s pretty much right on my commuting route – to make an appointment for an oil change. (I have all my oil changes done there, largely because I think there’s a potential benefit to being a familiar face. Other than warranty work, I haven’t given the service department any business besides the oil changes (every 3,500 miles or so) and replacement of the coolant, brake fluid and manual transmission fluid at 54,000 miles.)

Even though I’m not a regular spender of large amounts of money there, I’ve gotten to be friendly with the service manager, so while I was at the dealership I stuck my head in his office and got invited in to sit down and chat. When the subject turned to upcoming maintenance possibilities, he asked me how long it had been since I’d had an alignment done. My ’04, bought new, has a little over 87,000 miles on it, and I’ve never had the alignment touched. When he heard my answer, he gave me the “what?!?!” look. I got the look again when I told him that I never had my previous car, a 1990 Mazda RX-7, aligned in the 14 years I owned it. (And I put 199,000 miles on that car.)

Basically, I’ve always been of the mind that unless the car’s tracking and handling tells you that there might be a problem, and unless you see improper tire wear, there’s no reason to mess with the alignment. I do my own tire rotating and keep close tabs on how the tires are wearing, and I’ve never seen or felt anything at all worrisome – either with this car or the RX-7. Making me even less inclined to have an alignment done is the rear camber problem that many TSX owners have had to deal with. It’s the “if it ain’t broke, don’t fix it” way of looking at the situation.

Just when the service manager seemed to be about to strongly recommend having the car aligned, he said, “You know, you’ve waited so long, we might have a problem aligning it. Things may be pretty much frozen (by corrosion) under the car, and we might have to break or cut something before making any adjustments. I’ve seen that quite a few times.”

Even though I’ve never tried to unbolt anything under this car, I know how corroded things look. (I’m kicking myself for not painting the calipers years ago.) Thank you, road salt!

So, my question to you guys is: Taking everything into account, would you have an alignment done? And if you would, would you take it to an alignment shop rather than let the dealership do it?

P.S. I’ve gone about 33,000 miles since having the coolant, brake fluid and manual transmission fluid changed at 54,000 miles. (It’s been 28 months.) How much longer would you wait before changing those again? Feel free to make different recommendations for each.
Thanks.

 

I am of the same opinion about alignment. Unless something is wrong or indicating an alignment problem, leave it alone. They shouldn't be "unbolting" everything to check the alignment so the corrosion worry isn't a reason to do an alignment.

Years ago, I had a car with what appeared to be alignment problems. I had it aligned multiple times - each time a major mis-alignment was *discovered* and fixed. The problem never got fixed by an alignment - a new set of tires fixed the pulling problem.

I do the severe maintenance intervals a bit early...for example, if it says every 5 years, then I do it at 4 years....every 50,000 miles, then I do it at 40,000 miles...roughly 20% earlier in miles or time.

 

If your tire wear, handling, steering etc is normal and you have no excessive wear or issues then you don't need one. It is, however, highly recommended to get one done as during normal driving your car will eventually run out of spec leading to wear and tear of your tires prematurely, pour gas mileage etc. But if you see no issues and everything is fine then there would be no need for an alignment. I can understand his shock though as, tbh, you're the first person I've ever heard/read of doing this too lol.

I get my car aligned at least once every 6 months since I have free lifetime alignment at Firestone. I'm lowered if that matters, but usually am out of spec when I go in with all the potholes, bumps, drops etc in the road I have to deal with daily.

 

the only time I had an alignment done on my tsx was when I replaced the OEM tires at 74,000 miles.

 

I don't really have an opinion to share on the wisdom of getting an alignment. I've had it done regularly to my 05 (I have an Ingall's kit installed), but that's me. Of course you should know that the rear camber isn't adjustable, just the toe (and the camber really hasn't been an issue with the stock suspension). And your service manager friend was right on with his corrosion concerns. I'm in Mass. too, and since your car is an 04, I can pretty much assure you that there's no way they would be able to adjust the rear toe. I'll bet you that the concentric bolt and washer that are provided to change the adjustment are frozen (and actually it's the bushings inside the trailing arms that cause the problem. The bolt gets frozen to the bushing, and all the trailing arms are susceptible to it as I found out when I installed the Ingalls kit). I digress. I'd be really surprised if you didn't discover that the front alignment is out of spec, but...... if it ain't broke don't fix it probably covers it. As far as the other stuff goes, the change interval for the coolant and brake fluid is time dependent (not mileage), so depending on when you had it changed last, that should determine if you need to have it changed again. There seems to be some controversy over the transmission fluid change (from often to never), but since you'd had it done once already, I'd be inclined to not worry about it.

 

I referred to it as a rear camber problem because of the TSB, which labels it "right rear camber out of specification"
http://www.in.honda.com/Rjanisis/pubs/SB/b06-007.pdf

 

I have an 04 as well. I never had an alignment until a few weeks ago when I started to have a tough time controlling my car on the highway. It seemed to have gone out of alignment very quickly, or it could also be I just didn't notice it because up until last month, I didn't do much highway driving. Either way, I just had my first alignment on this car done. It was extremely out of spec on all 4 corners and it turned out it was because of the TSB mentioned above.

The first alignment a few weeks ago fixed the front toe, but not the rear camber. I discovered the TSB and took it back to another dealer to have the service done. They did not mention any problem getting it back into spec once the new control arm was installed. The new arm did pull the front toe out of spec again, but another alignment (and balance) was performed and all is well again.

You can see my thread here:
https://acurazine.com/forums/1g-tsx-problems-fixes-128/alignment-problem-767652/

I probably would not have done an alignment in first place if it hadn't been for the terrible handling I was experiencing. However, since rusting of parts has been mentioned, maybe it would be advisable to do an alignment every 3 years or so?

 

True, but that was a TSB for the 04's and some 05's. And, since it wasn't a recall and you had to call Honda to see if your car was effected (it was a VIN range on the 05's), I'll bet you that many of the cars were never refit. Whatever....... like I said, if you feel your car is OK, then why bother?

 

Right. I don't think they would do the service if your car was not exhibiting the camber out of spec. I only just had mine done because I was having a problem. Up till now, the car was fine.

 

If you're not having a problem with tire wear or handling, things are likely fine. I like to get an alignment when I replace the tires just so I know. As for the severe condition fluid intervals, the manual says:

brake fluid is 3 years regardless of mileage

MTF is 60K miles or every 3 years (whichever comes first)

coolant is 120K or 10 years (whichever comes first) for the first change then 60K or 5 years thereafter

 

As it turns out, my car has about 1 degree difference in cross-caster from an accident that happened before I bought the car - this causes a slight left pull that is practically impossible to fix. I had to put in an Ingalls rear camber kit, as well as adjustable Skunk2 a-arms in the front to get the camber back into spec, but caster is a whole different animal.

Because of my car's unique problems (I won't sell it, its paid off!), I get an alignment whenever I switch from summer to winter tires. I have a relationship with a local Midas manager who races his M3 on the weekend, and does alignments all day. He gives me a good deal, and I keep coming back.

 

Speaking of this, why is it that this problem is only seen on the right-rear? I assume there has to be a TSB for the left rear, the suspension setup seems to be symmetrical left to right...

 

The release of the TSB for the right upper control arm was I assume because it's either too short or too long, which resulted in the out of spec camber issue. It's a one piece unit that's not adjustable. The left side links must all be the correct size. The rear camber on the TSX is not adjustable (with the OE suspension), and the toe adjustment is actually pretty rudimentary (just a bolt with a concentric washer that allows some movement of the hub). All of the rear suspension links themselves (I forget... 4 or 5 on each side) are one piece and non-adjustable. Hence.... the Ingall's kit (and others) that provide camber and more toe adjustment of the rear suspension that are helpful when the car is lowered (which by virtue of the suspension design, automatically results in more negative camber). If the lowering isn't too drastic, there's evidently enough adjustment in the front suspension to be able to get the four wheels in spec (or close enough) without changing out pieces in the front. I don't recall much discussion here about front alignment problems other than accident related ones. I've had the Ingall's kit installed for almost 3 years with no complaints. It's a quality, durable kit that serves the purpose and has allowed me to run the factory recommended alignment specs even though I'm dropped about an inch.

 

Yes, I understand - I have the ingalls kit as well. The thing I DON'T understand is that my right rear camber went out of spec 5 years after the car was made, but I'm sure if I took it into a dealer, they would have replaced a link. This means that for 5 years, the camber was IN spec, meaning that the link was the correct length. This leads me to believe that it had something to do with bushing wear or something of that nature.